Wishuponacomet
Wishuponacomet
Joined: Apr 30, 2020
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May 6th, 2020 at 6:35:34 PM permalink
There have been reports that Las Vegas Casinos will implement Thermal Sensors at Casino Entrances when they are reopened. Basically people who have a body temperature of over 100 will be denied admittance. I don't think this idea will fly too well as the majority of people will not feel comfortable with Thermal Sensor checks and the fact is that Las Vegas Weather can be 105 degrees. Just being in the Las Vegas Weather can cause a reading of over 100 degrees causing No Admittance to the Casino.
Last edited by: Wishuponacomet on May 6, 2020
redietz
redietz
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May 7th, 2020 at 6:30:32 AM permalink
The key problems here, which were discussed when the Wynn started taking temps before the shutdown (as foreign banks were doing):

1) The virus appears to be most contagious in the couple of days before symptoms actually show up.
2) A good chunk of those infected and transmitting the disease are completely asymptomatic.

Thermal scans are better than nothing, but possibly not much better. I don't think anyone has any idea if they'll have a significant impact, as in reducing virus load inside by a third or half, or whether they'll simply be window dressing with minimal effect.

And yeah, I'm curious as to what your temp measures when you step inside after wearing a hat in 110 degrees and you take off the hat. Or you're a person with long black hair walking outside without a hat. Should be a nightmare.
"You can't breathe dead hippo waking, sleeping, and eating, and at the same time keep your precarious grip on existence."
SOOPOO
SOOPOO
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May 7th, 2020 at 6:35:51 AM permalink
Quote: Wishuponacomet

There have been reports that Las Vegas Casinos will implement Thermal Sensors at Casino Entrances when they are reopened. Basically people who have a body temperature of over 100 will be denied admittance. I don't think this idea will fly too well as the majority of people will not feel comfortable with Thermal Sensor checks and the fact is that Las Vegas Weather can be 105 degrees. Just being in the Las Vegas Weather can cause a reading of over 100 degrees causing No Admittance to the Casino.



A few points. Lets say you are able to identify 100 COVID-19 positive people. Maybe 5 are very sick and just wouldn't even feel like going to a casino. Maybe 2 are pretty sick and still want to go to a casino. The other 93 are either asymptomatic, or so mildly symptomatic that they have a temperature of below 100.4. So the casino will let in 93 out of the 95 that if they actually had COVID-19 testing at the door they would be able to ban. It will not be worth the effort.

As far as hot weather altering body temperature, our bodies are supposed to do a great job of maintaining the magic 98.6. A 'normal' person in 100 degree Vegas heat will sweat enough that evaporative heat loss will keep your core temperature at 98.6, or at least very close to it. You are in serious trouble if your body can't keep your temperature below 100.4.

And it is well known that the elderly have normal 'starting' temperatures well below 98.6. They will be significantly febrile at 99, but will glide into the casino.

Right before the pandemic lockdown took hold in the US, we went on a cruise. The cruise assured us they did strict screening to make sure we were at low risk. Before boarding, we were asked if we had been to China recently, or had a high fever, or lots of coughing. I'm sure that no one lied......
darkoz
darkoz
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May 7th, 2020 at 6:38:13 AM permalink
Quote: redietz

The key problems here, which were discussed when the Wynn started taking temps before the shutdown (as foreign banks were doing):

1) The virus appears to be most contagious in the couple of days before symptoms actually show up.
2) A good chunk of those infected and transmitting the disease are completely asymptomatic.

Thermal scans are better than nothing, but possibly not much better. I don't think anyone has any idea if they'll have a significant impact, as in reducing virus load inside by a third or half, or whether they'll simply be window dressing with minimal effect.

And yeah, I'm curious as to what your temp measures when you step inside after wearing a hat in 110 degrees and you take off the hat. Or you're a person with long black hair walking outside without a hat. Should be a nightmare.



I don't know the thermal answer myself but shouldn't it work like any body temp thermometer?

The human body adjusts to maintain body temp. The outside may be burning but the inside remains 98.6.

An old fashioned under the tongue thermometer would get it right in measuring body temp even if you just jogged in 100" weather?

Or am I wrong on that?
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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May 7th, 2020 at 7:05:15 AM permalink
Quote: SOOPOO

A few points. Lets say you are able to identify 100 COVID-19 positive people. Maybe 5 are very sick and just wouldn't even feel like going to a casino. Maybe 2 are pretty sick and still want to go to a casino. The other 93 are either asymptomatic, or so mildly symptomatic that they have a temperature of below 100.4. So the casino will let in 93 out of the 95 that if they actually had COVID-19 testing at the door they would be able to ban. It will not be worth the effort.

As far as hot weather altering body temperature, our bodies are supposed to do a great job of maintaining the magic 98.6. A 'normal' person in 100 degree Vegas heat will sweat enough that evaporative heat loss will keep your core temperature at 98.6, or at least very close to it. You are in serious trouble if your body can't keep your temperature below 100.4.

And it is well known that the elderly have normal 'starting' temperatures well below 98.6. They will be significantly febrile at 99, but will glide into the casino.

Right before the pandemic lockdown took hold in the US, we went on a cruise. The cruise assured us they did strict screening to make sure we were at low risk. Before boarding, we were asked if we had been to China recently, or had a high fever, or lots of coughing. I'm sure that no one lied......

does it actually read your core body temperature? From my understanding they look at the corner of your on your tear duct. I have no idea how the outside temperature can or can't affect that. How accurate are these things in the first place? I really have no clue how strip casinos are going to make money at a much lower capacity in the first place.

People usually go to the strip casinos to have fun. With the restrictive conditions they want to implement, it doesn't sound like it will be too much fun to me.

A new tool in the card counters arsenal should be a Sharpie for drawing an extra circle on the table when they want to spread to multiple hands in their contained area.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
redietz
redietz
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May 7th, 2020 at 7:30:47 AM permalink
I took the thermal scan to be an imaging system with temps as colors on screen. I didn't think "thermal scan" was a fancy way to say thermometer under the tongue or glided across a forehead. So yeah, if it's person to person temp-taking, then that should be fine. If it's an actual thermal scan with imaging, then somebody with long black hair who was outside for half an hour is going to have a really confusing signature. Imaging would enable security or whoever to scan many people as they enter simultaneously as opposed to individual temp checks. I may be very wrong on this. If they're using "thermal scan" to mean temp check, then it's labor intensive but obviously accurate. Previously the Wynn was taking temps individually, but I don't think they were calling it "thermal scanning."

Also, I agree with posters who said "it won't be worth the effort." It'll be mainly window dressing, something to separate Wynn from some other places in patrons' minds, but probably not very useful.

And I don't think Americans will do the mask-wearing and social-distancing necessary in casino environments. Everything becomes a reminder of the stress and danger. That's not why people go to casinos.
"You can't breathe dead hippo waking, sleeping, and eating, and at the same time keep your precarious grip on existence."
SOOPOO
SOOPOO
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Thanks for this post from:
beachbumbabs
May 7th, 2020 at 8:37:58 AM permalink
I do NOT believe in the accuracy of non invasive temperature readings. Not making this up.... towards the end of my career, Medicare decided to punish anesthesiologists that had too many patients come out of the OR colder than they 'should' be. I forget the exact penalty level or exact temperature, but I think if more than 5% of post op patients were below 36 Centigrade, you were penalized a percentage of your Medicare collections. There were many exceptions, like trauma patients, CABG patients, patients that had a low pre op temperature, etc....
But for the 'regular' patients the hospital added an order to 'immediately notify anesthesia for any temperature below 36." We would then do an oral temperature, or in some cases if the patient had a indwelling urinary catheter, do a "Foley temp" which is considered more accurate. In most cases, the final temperature from one of the 'invasive' methods was higher than the 'run the thermometer near your face' method.

Thanks for reminding me of another reason I hate government run insurance... the absolute waste in having doctors and nurses spending time on useless temperature verifications.
standbymyman
standbymyman
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May 7th, 2020 at 9:00:52 AM permalink
Quote: Wishuponacomet

There have been reports that Las Vegas Casinos will implement Thermal Sensors at Casino Entrances when they are reopened. Basically people who have a body temperature of over 100 will be denied admittance. I don't think this idea will fly too well as the majority of people will not feel comfortable with Thermal Sensor checks and the fact is that Las Vegas Weather can be 105 degrees. Just being in the Las Vegas Weather can cause a reading of over 100 degrees causing No Admittance to the Casino.




And just think of all the people with the virus who will visit their deep freeze just before going thru the sensors.
TomG
TomG
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May 7th, 2020 at 9:03:35 AM permalink
The other problems, in addition to the effectiveness, is what happens when someone is turned away, due to body temperature? I have chips or slot ticket I want to cash, how am I supposed to get my money? Do I have to have it leave my possession first, then get paid outside without the same camera angles? What if I paid for a room, do I have to sleep on the streets? Of if I paid for two nights and went out for breakfast the first morning and then get a high reading going back to my room?
racquet
racquet
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May 7th, 2020 at 9:04:55 AM permalink
As I've mentioned before in other threads, casinos are a major, MAJOR source of state revenue, everywhere. All of the restrictions placed on casinos, from temperature checks and plastic barriers, whether they work or not as far as the virus is concerned, are irrelevant. The controlling factor, in casinos at least, the ONLY determinant, will be if it restricts STATE REVENUE.

To the extent that any of these "guidelines" impact business, both the casinos and the state regulators will want them to go away.

Health has nothing to do with it. Self-imposed temperature checks at the door serve no valid medical purpose. The responses above point this out. Window-dressing.

When the restrictions are relaxed at casinos so as to improve state tax revenue, they can no longer be imposed on the non-gambling public. Casinos will be the first place where these silly restrictions will be reduced.

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