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billryan
billryan
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March 3rd, 2020 at 6:54:51 AM permalink
Quote: TDVegas

No one is changing anything. It’s merely an observation backed up with sound data. Gambling does not provide a bump up to the population on the standard of living scale. It provides an overall bump down.



Tell that to the people of Las Vegas.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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March 4th, 2020 at 4:25:18 AM permalink
Quote: billryan

Tell that to the people of Las Vegas.

I WILL. I believe the Las Vegas average income is $58k a year, I believe that is ranked about 28th. A large percentage of those Casino employees gamble frequently many do it daily, especially bartenders from cocktail waitresses and what I've noticed. There isn't a jackpot Joanie's, Dotty's, bar and all the other places you can gamble at on every corner for the tourists and I certainly wouldn't call it entertainment.

While playing many promos in the bars I noticed it's almost like clockwork, an employee shift ends and they sit down and start plugging away at video poker and video Keno, $20 after $20 after $20. The strange thing many of those bartenders have a computer screen that lets them know exactly how much everyone's losing. Unfortunately, they only seem to remember when somebody wins.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
DRich
DRich
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March 4th, 2020 at 7:12:40 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf


While playing many promos in the bars I noticed it's almost like clockwork, an employee shift ends and they sit down and start plugging away at video poker and video Keno, $20 after $20 after $20. The strange thing many of those bartenders have a computer screen that lets them know exactly how much everyone's losing. Unfortunately, they only seem to remember when somebody wins.



You are forgetting an important fact. When the machines are losing, losing, losing, they are now due to hit. Most bartenders and recreational gamblers believe that.

I deal with bartenders daily and they truly believe that.
Living longer does not always infer +EV
TDVegas
TDVegas
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March 4th, 2020 at 8:35:10 AM permalink
Quote: DRich

You are forgetting an important fact. When the machines are losing, losing, losing, they are now due to hit. Most bartenders and recreational gamblers believe that.

I deal with bartenders daily and they truly believe that.


Vegas, in a general sense...is a dumb population. One look at the daily, local commercials on tv....you can see where everything is geared toward. If it’s not the car dealerships carnival barking “low credit, no credit” or the PI attorneys carnival barking “in a wreck, need a check”, then it’s the payday loans, dollar loan center clowns “selling their wares” or a local casino inviting you in for “crappy gift” Monday’s.

High school graduation rate is around 70%. The real number of those actually applying themselves for something better is probably around 20-30%. It shows in all aspects.

If I had a $1 for everytime some local told me he can beat some new game...whether bubble craps, stadium style roulette or just about any other game....lets just say I'd have a lot of $1's.

Unless it’s an AP player....gambling at the local level is not meant to be a way of life. The locals business owners went for that jugular. It worked like a charm for Frank Fertitta and Sam Boyd in 1976 and 1979.
Last edited by: TDVegas on Mar 4, 2020
AZDuffman
AZDuffman
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March 5th, 2020 at 4:38:48 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf


While playing many promos in the bars I noticed it's almost like clockwork, an employee shift ends and they sit down and start plugging away at video poker and video Keno, $20 after $20 after $20. The strange thing many of those bartenders have a computer screen that lets them know exactly how much everyone's losing. Unfortunately, they only seem to remember when somebody wins.



I used to think gambling dealers fell under "the shoemaker's kids go barefoot" but it is deeper. Even less intelligent dealers will see people keep losing. Sharper ones will limit play to not play, an exception being poker dealers who can learn from all that play they watch. But to be a bartender and watch VP or table top slots drain people then play after their shift ends?

What I really think it is about is what I call a "serf class." Being a class of people who think their lot will never, can never improve so try to make a small score and have a nice few days. From the dealer who had a big tip night to the salesman who had a big commission check to the gangster who made a big score. You live high off the hog for a few days or weeks, then back to hand to mouth.

Don't think it is just the low income quint. All those upper middle class places in Vegas and elsewhere. Lots have leased cars, maxed credit cards, and every few years they refi the equity right out of the house.

It has gone on forever. It will go on forever. Many livelyhoods depend on this behavior. From mortgage refis to the Payday Loan Store to Rick Harris. Getting rid of casinos will not change it.
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
Wizard
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Wizard
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March 5th, 2020 at 5:58:47 AM permalink
I applaud the hotel in question for offering an incentive to not clean the room. I've seen this before, mainly in Europe. It is wasteful to clean a room that isn't very dirty and the occupant doesn't need the service. If an agreement is made to not clean the room for $20 in comps, then that is a win-win situation. As to the maid, making less money, there are plenty of jobs out there. I would argue the unemployment rate is too low for a healthy economy. Everyone in casino and hotel management I know sing that blues about how hard it is to fill jobs.

Even if I were in Costa Rica, I would still applaud the hotel out of respect of a free market. If the hotel let go some housekeepers because some percentage of guests were declining room cleaning, then they could be out there doing some service people want done. I am never one to support jobs just for the sake of giving someone a paycheck. The service done should be the purpose of a job.

As an example, in Baltimore there is a toll booth in BOTH directions of the Key Bridge. I've been asking the question for 30 years and still nobody has ever been able to explain to me an argument against doubling the toll in one direction and making it free the other. You reduce total waiting time at the bridge, less carbon footprint, and revenue remains the same. However, knowing Maryland politics, somebody will say the J word whenever the topic gets suggested.
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
Doc
Doc
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March 5th, 2020 at 6:50:47 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

As an example, in Baltimore there is a toll booth in BOTH directions of the Key Bridge. I've been asking the question for 30 years and still nobody has ever been able to explain to me an argument against doubling the toll in one direction and making it free the other. You reduce total waiting time at the bridge, less carbon footprint, and revenue remains the same. However, knowing Maryland politics, somebody will say the J word whenever the topic gets suggested.


Just for my own amusement, I will offer a counter-example. Due to possibly-failing memory, I might possibly have this backwards, but I don't think so, and the concept should hold.

My wife and I have made several driving trips to the Atlantic Provinces of Canada, visiting New Brunswick, Nova Scotia, and Prince Edward Island -- some beautiful country. It is rather easy to drive between New Brunswick and Nova Scotia, as the land mass is basically continuous. However, Prince Edward Island is, naturally, an island. There is the Confederation Bridge (a long one) connecting New Brunswick to the island, and Northumberland Ferries provides an automobile ferry between Prince Edward Island and Nova Scotia.

In accordance with the logic presented by the Wizard, both the bridge and the ferry charge one-direction tolls. The bridge only collects the toll for travel from New Brunswick to Prince Edward Island and not on the return. Similarly, the ferry only charges the toll for travel from Prince Edward Island to Nova Scotia and not for the return sailing.

Do you see where this counter-example is heading? My wife's cheapskate husband likes to visit these places by driving the loop counter-clockwise from New Brunswick to Nova Scotia to Prince Edward Island to New Brunswick for the return trip home. That way, I see all three provinces without paying a toll for either the bridge or the ferry. If I were to drive the loop in the clockwise direction, I would have to pay both tolls.

;-)
Wizard
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Wizard
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March 5th, 2020 at 7:39:07 AM permalink
Quote: Doc

In accordance with the logic presented by the Wizard, both the bridge and the ferry charge one-direction tolls. The bridge only collects the toll for travel from New Brunswick to Prince Edward Island and not on the return. Similarly, the ferry only charges the toll for travel from Prince Edward Island to Nova Scotia and not for the return sailing.



I would submit for consideration to the appropriate government agencies in Canada that they charge a toll the say way in both places, either leaving the island or going to it. For example, if memory serves me right, one must pay to take the ferry to Mackinaw Island but it's free to leave.
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
darkoz
darkoz
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March 5th, 2020 at 7:59:19 AM permalink
Most of NY has eliminated toll booths (and their workers AND the police sentinels and enforcers AND the cleaning crews and upkeep.

In place they have installed digital "poles" which either scan your EZpass or send you (much higher) toll bill in the mail.

BTW failure to pay is high. I have a friend who left town for a few weeks so didn't see the mail until his return. I think he was penalized $150 each unpaid toll regardless of original amount
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
AZDuffman
AZDuffman
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March 5th, 2020 at 8:52:44 AM permalink
At the PA/OH border they charge one way for the PA turnpike. It’s like $8! I took a side road when I was doing courier work and sometimes still do. But it makes sense if I am just going home.
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others

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