Good News for Charity Gaming
May 7th, 2015 at 9:14:23 AM
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Here in Michigan, the State limits the amount of chips that can be sold at a charitable gaming event at $15,000 per day. Plus, it limits the number of days an organization can conduct an event under one license to 4 consecutive days.
This has always been an albatross for my organization because on most nights when we sponsor an event, we sell out of chips very early in the evening. As a result, new people won't pay to enter the event (because they can't purchase chips), current players exit if they can't replenish their stack and, beer and pizza sales suffer because there are fewer people in the room. All because the per-day wager limit has been reached.
The State is on record as saying they do not want to "grow" charitable game any bigger than it currently is. And, arbitrarily increasing the wager limit is seen as "growing" charitable gaming. Many contend that the state succumbing to pressure from the big casinos.
In any event, an organization can sell up to $60,000 worth of chips over 4 days under its license (they can buy 4 licenses per year)
Which provokes the question...If an organization can sell up to $60,000 over 4 days, why shouldn't it be allowed to sell it over fewer days? Say, over 1 day, or 2 days or 3 days? After all, it's the same $60,000! Nobody, so far, has an answer to that question
Yesterday, a committee in the Michigan Senate approved changing the law to provide just that: Allowing an organization to sell as many chips it wants (or can) on any given day, just so long as it does not occur over more than the 4 days a license allows and, it does not exceed $60,000. So technically, I could have a 1-day event and sell $60,000 worth of chips, but, I forfeit the other 3 days under the license. I'd gladly take that deal, even though I would lose admission/gate revenue and beer and pizza sales on the forfeited days! More realistically, for our 4-day event, we would ration it based on our biggest nights, Friday and Saturday.
However, not all organizations will qualify for this provision otherwise, every poker room in the state would convert to 1-day $60,000 events. And, the State hates the poker rooms (so does the big casinos).
So, here's the criteria an organization must meet in order to enjoy this monetary flexibility...
- The event must occur at the physical location that the organization owns or leases (we meet this criteria)
- The organization must own its own tables and equipment--no renting (we meet this criteria)
- The people working the event must consist 100% of non-paid volunteers (we'll meet that criteria going forward).
There are probably less than 25 organizations in the State that meet this criteria and fortunately, we're one of them. This is absolutely HUGE for us if it is finally signed into law.
This has always been an albatross for my organization because on most nights when we sponsor an event, we sell out of chips very early in the evening. As a result, new people won't pay to enter the event (because they can't purchase chips), current players exit if they can't replenish their stack and, beer and pizza sales suffer because there are fewer people in the room. All because the per-day wager limit has been reached.
The State is on record as saying they do not want to "grow" charitable game any bigger than it currently is. And, arbitrarily increasing the wager limit is seen as "growing" charitable gaming. Many contend that the state succumbing to pressure from the big casinos.
In any event, an organization can sell up to $60,000 worth of chips over 4 days under its license (they can buy 4 licenses per year)
Which provokes the question...If an organization can sell up to $60,000 over 4 days, why shouldn't it be allowed to sell it over fewer days? Say, over 1 day, or 2 days or 3 days? After all, it's the same $60,000! Nobody, so far, has an answer to that question
Yesterday, a committee in the Michigan Senate approved changing the law to provide just that: Allowing an organization to sell as many chips it wants (or can) on any given day, just so long as it does not occur over more than the 4 days a license allows and, it does not exceed $60,000. So technically, I could have a 1-day event and sell $60,000 worth of chips, but, I forfeit the other 3 days under the license. I'd gladly take that deal, even though I would lose admission/gate revenue and beer and pizza sales on the forfeited days! More realistically, for our 4-day event, we would ration it based on our biggest nights, Friday and Saturday.
However, not all organizations will qualify for this provision otherwise, every poker room in the state would convert to 1-day $60,000 events. And, the State hates the poker rooms (so does the big casinos).
So, here's the criteria an organization must meet in order to enjoy this monetary flexibility...
- The event must occur at the physical location that the organization owns or leases (we meet this criteria)
- The organization must own its own tables and equipment--no renting (we meet this criteria)
- The people working the event must consist 100% of non-paid volunteers (we'll meet that criteria going forward).
There are probably less than 25 organizations in the State that meet this criteria and fortunately, we're one of them. This is absolutely HUGE for us if it is finally signed into law.
May 7th, 2015 at 11:41:31 AM
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Mazel Tov!
You've been bitching about that for so long, I'm glad to see that you're finally making progress.
So you're gonna lose out on a day of beer and pizza sales? Look at the bright side: On the open nights, you'll sell more and have less to throw away at the end of the night.
You've been bitching about that for so long, I'm glad to see that you're finally making progress.
So you're gonna lose out on a day of beer and pizza sales? Look at the bright side: On the open nights, you'll sell more and have less to throw away at the end of the night.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
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Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
May 7th, 2015 at 11:54:26 AM
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Quote: DJTeddyBearMazel Tov!
You've been bitching about that for so long, I'm glad to see that you're finally making progress.
So you're gonna lose out on a day of beer and pizza sales? Look at the bright side: On the open nights, you'll sell more and have less to throw away at the end of the night.
Hitting the $15,000 limit early in the night was a pain in the a$$. Happened to us many times in the poker room I dealt at.
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
May 7th, 2015 at 5:14:25 PM
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Quote: IbeatyouracesHitting the $15,000 limit early in the night was a pain in the a$$. Happened to us many times in the poker room I dealt at.
Without raising our table (wager) limits and, keeping our payouts exactly where they are now, this will not increase our win percentage one iota. It will, however, increase our overall take 300%, simply because we'll have more money in action.
Regrettably, it might mean that I have to put in only 3, 18-hour days over the Memorial Day weekend, versus 4. Darn!
Now, here's the $64,000 question....
For those familiar with the situation...does this regulation spell doom for the Michigan poker rooms...and why?
May 7th, 2015 at 5:19:45 PM
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Quote: Riva..Now, here's the $64,000 question....
For those familiar with the situation...does this regulation spell doom for the Michigan poker rooms...and why?
I've been outta the loop on term for a few years now, but I doubt it'll impact them at all. If anything, they'll be able to have larger stakes game which will attract more players. When the casinos in Detroit got poker rooms, the popular games were 5/10 & 10/20 limit. You can't even find a limit game now except maybe GT's 3/6. Most now are 1/2 or 2/5 NL.
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
May 7th, 2015 at 5:45:34 PM
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Quote: IbeatyouracesI've been outta the loop on term for a few years now, but I doubt it'll impact them at all. If anything, they'll be able to have larger stakes game which will attract more players. When the casinos in Detroit got poker rooms, the popular games were 5/10 & 10/20 limit. You can't even find a limit game now except maybe GT's 3/6. Most now are 1/2 or 2/5 NL.
Illbeatyouraces....the poker rooms will not have this monetary discretion/advantage. It only extends to non-profits that (1) conduct the event at their own physical location, (2) own their own tables (no rent) and, (3) 100% of the staff, including dealers managers and otherwise, are volunteers. Now, your thoughts?
May 7th, 2015 at 6:12:26 PM
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Quote: RivaIllbeatyouraces....the poker rooms will not have this monetary discretion/advantage. It only extends to non-profits that (1) conduct the event at their own physical location, (2) own their own tables (no rent) and, (3) 100% of the staff, including dealers managers and otherwise, are volunteers. Now, your thoughts?
Ok gotcha. I still don't think it'll matter. Most poker players don't play other games, especially with crappy charity payoffs.
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
May 10th, 2015 at 11:55:01 AM
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You're right. Most stay just with poker.
You'll recall that many of the (now closed) poker rooms put out a few traditional games like blackjack, craps and roulette, in addition to the poker games. The trouble came because they went from a zero risk game(poker) to an "at risk" game for the house. Exasperating the situation even worse is that they offered the same wagers, odds and payouts as a regular casino. When bad swings occurred, there was not enough time in the day to recover the losses, wiping out the entire day's earnings, and then some.
I know of one charity that lost $75,000 on BJ in a poker room when the dealer allowed crazy wagering and the they experience a huge bad swing. The poker room covered the losses but, the charity had to pay them back.
And then there was the recent case where a local bar put in a gaming room with only traditional games (no poker). I'm told he spent over $1 million on the room and equipment. All top-of-the-line stuff. He was padlocked by the Gaming Control Board within 1 month of opening the doors. Why? Because he set up as if he were an actual casino. And, in order to get his investment back, the bar allowed crazy bets that, far-and-away, greatly exceeded the per-day wager limit.
You'll recall that many of the (now closed) poker rooms put out a few traditional games like blackjack, craps and roulette, in addition to the poker games. The trouble came because they went from a zero risk game(poker) to an "at risk" game for the house. Exasperating the situation even worse is that they offered the same wagers, odds and payouts as a regular casino. When bad swings occurred, there was not enough time in the day to recover the losses, wiping out the entire day's earnings, and then some.
I know of one charity that lost $75,000 on BJ in a poker room when the dealer allowed crazy wagering and the they experience a huge bad swing. The poker room covered the losses but, the charity had to pay them back.
And then there was the recent case where a local bar put in a gaming room with only traditional games (no poker). I'm told he spent over $1 million on the room and equipment. All top-of-the-line stuff. He was padlocked by the Gaming Control Board within 1 month of opening the doors. Why? Because he set up as if he were an actual casino. And, in order to get his investment back, the bar allowed crazy bets that, far-and-away, greatly exceeded the per-day wager limit.
