New Hold 'em casino game, Texas Hold 'em Plus Deluxe
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The game is standard Hold 'em, but with a good catch: if the player feels one of his two hole cards is a dog, he can discard it to the dealer and receive a new card, else if his hole cards are good, he waves a "stay with my hole cards" signal (taps the table of waves off like in BJ).
Casino version (at the Golden Nugget):
Player makes ANTE bet and an optional Bonus bet.
Players may fold or make a flop bet.
Players may raise going into the Turn or River
Dealer compares hands
very straightforward
Poker room version (at the Mirage) is:
Players may buy and exchange one hole card or stay with the two hole cards dealt
Play resumes as in Regular Texas Hold 'em (fold, check, raise...)
Share your opinion and vote....
see:
Casino Version info
Poker Room version here
I also have a game Base on my US Patents: 6,206,373 & 6,637,747 (Texas Hold'em Poker play against the Casino)
Call: Casino Draw® Hold'em Poker™ (Texas Hold'em against the Casino, Were Each player has the option of changing one of his poket card.)
1. Play begins with each player making an Enter bet. The player may also place an optional bet on AA-Max Bonus™.
2. The dealer deals two cards face down to each player and two cards face down to himself.
3. Each player examines his cards and has the option of standing or change one card.
If the player wants to change either card he must make a Draw bet which is equal to his Enter bet
4. The dealer collects all discards and deals in turn the replacement cards.
5. The dealer exposes his cards, standing with the two cards or changing one card according to the Dealers Draw-Card Rules.
7. The dealer deals five community cards face up.
8. Both player and dealer will make the best five card poker hand using any combination of their respective personal cards and the five community cards.
9. If the player beats the dealer then the Enter bet pays 1 to 1 and the Draw bet will pay according to the DrawWin™ Pay Table.
Dealers Draw-Card Rules
1. Keep a pair.
2. Keep two cards if both cards are 10 or higher.
Otherwise change the lower card, retaining the higher card.
Interesting. Some differences between the casino version of these two games.
Texas Hold 'em plus: no charge to swap. Dealer keeps his cards.
Did you get any installs here in the U.S.?
anyone who could assist him in pacing a game here. Does anyone know if this is true or not? I admire Stephen's determination
and that fact that he took your constructive as such. Stephen still occasionally post self promoting post, but they are now
balanced with post that are both informative and enlightening to many viewers. Nothing wrong with self promotion, no one
else likely to do it, right Dan !
Quote: PaigowdanStephen,
Interesting. Some differences between the casino version of these two games.
Texas Hold 'em plus: no charge to swap. Dealer keeps his cards.
Did you get any installs here in the U.S.?
No, As buzzpaff said I have none of my games installs in the US.
My biggest market now is:
with TCS live tables in South Africa, EU, UK, now getting into Australia and Asia.
Also the internet with 10+ Internet software providers (500+ Online Casinos).
Quote: s2dbakerI wish I had seen this before leaving for vacation. I would have started a simulation.
Hi s2dbake,
My game Casino Draw® Hold'em Poker with the DrawWin™ Pay-Table below.
The House Edge = 2%. Let me know if it is wrong.
DrawWin™ Pay-Table
Royal Flush 50 to 1
Straight Flush 20 to 1
4 of A Kind 8 to 1
Pair to Full House 1 to 1
Ace High or less Push
Otherwise, I like this idea. Interesting detail that the Ante bet only pays if both cards are used, borrowing a gimmick from poker rooms' high-hand and bad-beat bonuses.
One detail that I'd like clarified is: "What happens on a really good hand where the player only uses one card to make the hand?" An Example: {Ah,7s} {Qh, Jh, Th, 3s, Kh}. The player flops draws to a straight (3 outs), flush (8 outs) and to the royal (1 out) and hits his big out on the river. His hand is a royal flush (and I expect the Bonus Bet paytable to pay off 250:1 in that case). But, he doesn't qualify to have the Ante bet paid because only one of his cards helped make the high-hand. Does he at least get paid 1:1 on his ante bet? Or is that a push to the ante bet?
If it's 1:1, I really like this game! It's similar to the Texas Hold'Em game, but it should naturally stack the deck to bigger cards in the hole. I'd imagine you'll have more kicker-resolved hands.
If it's push, I'll play the existing Ultimate Texas Hold'em table game, as I don't see the tradeoff between paying the ante bet 1:1 on any made straight (or flush in some jurisdictions) and being able to trade a hole-card (with the dealer having the same ability) at the expense of only being paid on hands where both hole cards play as a valuable one. My thoughts are the value of the hole-card switch is 0, based that the dealer can do the same thing. So I'm comparing 1:1 ante payouts on all hands greater than straight with hands only paid when both hole cards are used. And odds only get paid out at quads or better. I'm not running math on this. Just working through my own (humble, potentially flat-out mathematically wrong) thoughts on the matter.
Also, since I had this conversation for 20 minutes in the Nugget poker room: Do both cards need to play to make odds or do they need to be a part of the principal hand? This is only relevant to quads in your paytable. An example:
{As,Ts} {Th, Td, Tc, 9s, 2h} = Quad tens, ace kicker. Both cards play. Only one card is part of the principal hand.
{Ts,Th} {Td, Tc, As, 9s, 2h} = Quad tens, Ace kicker. Both cards play. Both cards are part of the principal hand.
When was this put into the Nugget? Either way the ante question is answered, my wife would have played this for hours.
Quote: PaigowdanTexas Hold 'em Plus Deluxe is a new game by Sam Sehadeh, who's a poker dealer with Stations.
The game is standard Hold 'em, but with a good catch: if the player feels one of his two hole cards is a dog, he can discard it to the dealer and receive a new card, else if his hole cards are good, he waves a "stay with my hole cards" signal (taps the table of waves off like in BJ).
Casino version (at the Golden Nugget):
Player makes ANTE bet and an optional Bonus bet.
Players may fold or make a flop bet.
Players may raise going into the Turn or River
Dealer compares hands
very straightforward
Poker room version (at the Mirage) is:
Players may buy and exchange one hole card or stay with the two hole cards dealt
Play resumes as in Regular Texas Hold 'em (fold, check, raise...)
Share your opinion and vote....
see:
Casino Version info
Poker Room version here
To me this game (Texas Hold 'em Plus Deluxe) Casino version, is just like the game taxes Hold'em bonus but with Each player has the option of changing one of his poket card.
To me this game is lack of speed, just like the taxes Hold'em bonus, but now you'll have to take time for the player to exchange cards too.
So it will not surprise me this game will take three to five minutes per round (the slowest Texas Hold'em against the dealer, table game).
as it is . Any idea average hands dealt per hour here versus other $3=6 games ?? Talking about poker room version.
Did you actually read the two patents you listed (#6,206,373 and #6,637,747) and find where the hole card switching feature is described? This patent is by a man from Nevada City, CA ten years ago, not you. Just concerned.
Quote: MrCasinoGamesQuote: PaigowdanTexas Hold 'em Plus Deluxe is a new game by Sam Sehadeh, who's a poker dealer with Stations.
The game is standard Hold 'em, but with a good catch: if the player feels one of his two hole cards is a dog, he can discard it to the dealer and receive a new card, else if his hole cards are good, he waves a "stay with my hole cards" signal (taps the table of waves off like in BJ).
Casino version (at the Golden Nugget):
Player makes ANTE bet and an optional Bonus bet.
Players may fold or make a flop bet.
Players may raise going into the Turn or River
Dealer compares hands
very straightforward
Poker room version (at the Mirage) is:
Players may buy and exchange one hole card or stay with the two hole cards dealt
Play resumes as in Regular Texas Hold 'em (fold, check, raise...)
Share your opinion and vote....
see:
Casino Version info
Poker Room version here
To me this game (Texas Hold 'em Plus Deluxe) Casino version, is just like the game taxes Hold'em bonus but with Each player has the option of changing one of his poket card.
To me this game is lack of speed, just like the taxes Hold'em bonus, but now you'll have to take time for the player to exchange cards too.
So it will not surprise me this game will take three to five minutes per round (the slowest Texas Hold'em against the dealer, table game).
This game is like Texas Hold'em Bonus only in the fact that it is a hold'em game. The TWO pay tables are different. The play is different, as you do not make decisions on your bet until after the cards are dealt. In Texas Bonus you are forced to place 2x your ante to see the flop. In Plus Deluxe this is not the case.
Now the speed issue... This game is much faster than Texas Bonus Hold'em due to the fact that there is no check option in the game, you either play or fold. And since your only playing heads up against the dealer there are only 9 to 7s with a 2 to 3 or 4 that you would fold. This is only after you have exchanged a card for free!. The discard comes out really fast and only adds maybe 2 to 3 seconds to any one round that it is found in for the whole table. Players know right away if they want another card. I have played this game a lot, over 500 hands, and it is a better version of the Texas Hold'em Casino Banked games that are currently out there. If you don't believe me go play it yourself(if you can find a seat) at the golden nugget. This game is GOLD! (no pun intended) and the players agree. The table has been packed ever day since it open and the old Texas Bonus sitting next to it is empty, while there are crowds standing around Deluxe waiting to play.
Quote: s2dbakerThe big glaring problem with this game, is that you have to bet 3 units to win anything and no chance of raising your bet.
Not really, you know after only the ante if you have odds to beat the dealer. And since the dealer cant not exchange a card your odds are locked in. I would make that bet ever time! If they gave me 10 betting spots after that kind of advantage I would play all ten! So.. I fold with no odds to beat the dealer or am ALL IN! its Texas Hold'em!
Quote: PerpetualNewbie7 people at a standard-sized casino table? Wouldn't that get a bit crowded?
Otherwise, I like this idea. Interesting detail that the Ante bet only pays if both cards are used, borrowing a gimmick from poker rooms' high-hand and bad-beat bonuses.
One detail that I'd like clarified is: "What happens on a really good hand where the player only uses one card to make the hand?" An Example: {Ah,7s} {Qh, Jh, Th, 3s, Kh}. The player flops draws to a straight (3 outs), flush (8 outs) and to the royal (1 out) and hits his big out on the river. His hand is a royal flush (and I expect the Bonus Bet paytable to pay off 250:1 in that case). But, he doesn't qualify to have the Ante bet paid because only one of his cards helped make the high-hand. Does he at least get paid 1:1 on his ante bet? Or is that a push to the ante bet?
If it's 1:1, I really like this game! It's similar to the Texas Hold'Em game, but it should naturally stack the deck to bigger cards in the hole. I'd imagine you'll have more kicker-resolved hands.
If it's push, I'll play the existing Ultimate Texas Hold'em table game, as I don't see the tradeoff between paying the ante bet 1:1 on any made straight (or flush in some jurisdictions) and being able to trade a hole-card (with the dealer having the same ability) at the expense of only being paid on hands where both hole cards play as a valuable one. My thoughts are the value of the hole-card switch is 0, based that the dealer can do the same thing. So I'm comparing 1:1 ante payouts on all hands greater than straight with hands only paid when both hole cards are used. And odds only get paid out at quads or better. I'm not running math on this. Just working through my own (humble, potentially flat-out mathematically wrong) thoughts on the matter.
Also, since I had this conversation for 20 minutes in the Nugget poker room: Do both cards need to play to make odds or do they need to be a part of the principal hand? This is only relevant to quads in your paytable. An example:
{As,Ts} {Th, Td, Tc, 9s, 2h} = Quad tens, ace kicker. Both cards play. Only one card is part of the principal hand.
{Ts,Th} {Td, Tc, As, 9s, 2h} = Quad tens, Ace kicker. Both cards play. Both cards are part of the principal hand.
When was this put into the Nugget? Either way the ante question is answered, my wife would have played this for hours.
The dealer cannot exchange a card. The ante stays up until you have both cards and win or you lose. So the cost to play the game is the ante only when you lose. And no it’s not principal hand. If you have ace king and 3 aces on the flop you would win. But a king and 4 aces on the board you would not win unless the dealer has less then a king. And then the ante pay table would not pay, as you do not have both cards in your hand. On the issue of ante pay... I will take another CARD! Cost value is a huge player edge. With the dealer not getting this option. It locks in my odds BEFORE any cards are dealt. Think about it! You’re playing heads up Hold'em and you playing 3 hold cards to two. You will crush the other player over time. The offset? One unit does not get paid unless you can use both cards in your hand on a straight or better. But looses ever time you lose.
It went live July 3rd 2011.
Quote: PaigowdanSteph,
Did you actually read the two patents you listed (#6,206,373 and #6,637,747) and find where the hole card switching feature is described? This patent is by a man from Nevada City, CA ten years ago, not you. Just concerned.
You didn't look enough. They were assigned in 2004.
Quote: PaigowdanSteph,
Did you actually read the two patents you listed (#6,206,373 and #6,637,747) and find where the hole card switching feature is described? This patent is by a man from Nevada City, CA ten years ago, not you. Just concerned.
Paigowdan,
The two patents (#6,206,373 and #6,637,747) Was assigned to me in 2004.
It basically covers Texas hold them against the dealer.
with Different variations can apply to the concept (Texas hold them against the dealer).
PS. I have also applied for a patent were player can exchange cards with an added bet.
Quote: MrCasinoGamesPaigowdan,
The two patents (#6,206,373 and #6,637,747) Was assigned to me in 2004.
It basically covers Texas hold them against the dealer.
with Different variations can apply to the concept (Texas hold them against the dealer).
Stephen, - You have to make sure, 100% sure.
There is currently another patent with the same "card exchange mechanism" for your game - on the same type of Casino Texas Hold 'em - that is installed in two big casinos, the Mirage and the Golden Nuggent. That game's patent had been submitted with a thorough check that the other patents, including your two patents, does not cover this mechanism, or is invalid for this mechanism, in their opinion.
Quote: MrCasinoGamesPS. I have also applied for a patent were player can exchange cards with an added bet.
Applying for a patent doesn't mean you will get to have the I.P. rights if someone else beat you to it.
If you apply for a new U.S. patent for this Hold 'em "card swap" mechanism, you and your lawyer will have to review patents that came before you and are active, else you will be infringing their patents under U.S. patent law. If a casino game has arguably the same exact type of mechanism, and both claim IP rights to that mechanism, one party may be in a position to admit that they were not the first to come up with the idea under a valid U.S. Patent, that indicates this is to be the case for one of the two parties.
Submitting patents is NOT about writing a document and just sending it to the patent office. It is about a thorough search to see if someone else had come up with the mechanism you wish to use, and owns the I.P. rights to it in the U.S. If someone else already has the same type of game active in U.S. casinos, you have to track down their patent and product information to see if you are blocked from marketing your game, or if they had made a mistake in their I.P. work.
Quote: PaigowdanStephen, - You have to make sure, 100% sure.
There is currently another patent with the same "card exchange mechanism" for your game - on the same type of Casino Texas Hold 'em - that is installed in two big casinos, the Mirage and the Golden Nuggent. That game's patent had been submitted with a thorough check that the other patents, including your two patents, does not cover this mechanism, or is invalid for this mechanism, in their opinion.
Applying for a patent doesn't mean you will get to have the I.P. rights if someone else beat you to it.
If you apply for a new U.S. patent for this Hold 'em "card swap" mechanism, you and your lawyer will have to review patents that came before you and are active, else you will be infringing their patents under U.S. patent law. If a casino game has arguably the same exact type of mechanism, and both claim IP rights to that mechanism, one party may be in a position to admit that they were not the first to come up with the idea under a valid U.S. Patent, that indicates this is to be the case for one of the two parties.
Submitting patents is NOT about writing a document and just sending it to the patent office. It is about a thorough search to see if someone else had come up with the mechanism you wish to use, and owns the I.P. rights to it in the U.S. If someone else already has the same type of game active in U.S. casinos, you have to track down their patent and product information to see if you are blocked from marketing your game, or if they had made a mistake in their I.P. work.
Thanks Paigowdan,
As I say before, I am not an expert on this.
I am just stating the facts: What patent I have and What patent I am applying for.
But I am very sure that I can use (Texas Hold'em against the casino), and who ever use (Texas Hold'em against the casino) is infringing my patents (It does not matter what mechanism they use).
Maybe MathExtremist can give us his opinion on this.
Experts are there for us. We do not say, when we have a health problem, "I should talk to a neighbor or co-worker," we say, "I should find a good doctor for this." Do it yourself medicine is like do it yourself law.
If you want to enter the U.S. market, Get the Patent situation resolved, 100% sure of things.
If you find out that the patent situation is in your favor, and you can lock it in for yourself, then you can go forward.
If you find out that the game mechanism or design is someone else's, you save money by not wasting money going forward.
You go to another game. You have a million games.
My first game that I worked so hard on was patented by someone else 9 months before I had patented it. I saw he owned that game idea, and I shook his hand, and I moved onto EZ Pai Gow, my second game.
If I had continued on with it, I would have lost the money I needed to make EZ Pai Gow a success.
Quote: MrCasinoGamesBut I am very sure that I can use (Texas Hold'em against the casino), and who ever use (Texas Hold'em against the casino) is infringing my paintings.
Maybe MathExtremist can give us his opinion on this.
Yes, he is very fine.
But in the end, have a real lawyer make the call, Jon Muskin or Rich Newman level of Gaming Law expertise.
I think you're EZ Pai Gow is a very good concept.
Hope you get more tables out there.
Quote: MrCasinoGamesBut I am very sure that I can use (Texas Hold'em against the casino), and whoever uses (Texas Hold'em against the casino) is infringing my patents.
Cannot be. There a many, many Casino Hold 'em Games running in U.S. Casinos.
Texas Hold 'em is a public domain (or "free" game), and a Casino Version of Texas Hold 'em can use a commission charge or other "free casino mechanism" - with no license fee to any person or company, if Casinos wanted to.
But most Texas Hold 'em games use a special change for a proprietary (or "private company mechanism") - to make a new version of the game proprietary, or only owned by one person or company. Many companies have done this:
Shufflemaster has Texas Hold 'em Bonus and Ultimate Texas Hold 'em, hundreds of games installed in Casinos.
Gaming Network has Texas Hold 'em Plus, the game we're talking about with the "Hold card Change" option.
All are doing very well.
Quote: MrCasinoGamesThanks again Paigowdan,
I think you're EZ Pai Gow is a very good concept.
Hope you get more tables out there.
Thank you! And Good luck to you! And you can make your luck by making sure that certain things are in your favor!
Quote: PaigowdanQuote: MrCasinoGamesBut I am very sure that I can use (Texas Hold'em against the casino), and whoever uses (Texas Hold'em against the casino) is infringing my patents.
Cannot be. There a many, many Casino Hold 'em Games running in U.S. Casinos.
Texas Hold 'em is a public domain (or "free" game), and a Casino Version of Texas Hold 'em can use a commission charge or other "free casino mechanism" - with no license fee to any person or company, if Casinos wanted to.
But most Texas Hold 'em games use a special change for a proprietary (or "private company mechanism") - to make a new version of the game proprietary, or only owned by one person or company. Many companies have done this:
Shufflemaster has Texas Hold 'em Bonus and Ultimate Texas Hold 'em, hundreds of games installed in Casinos.
Gaming Network has Texas Hold 'em Plus, the game we're talking about with the "Hold card Change" option.
All are doing very well.
Paigowdan.
You are wrong on these
There was no such Game/Games (Texas Hold'em against the Casino) until the patents (US 6,206,373 and US 6,637,747) started 1998.
And the first successful (Texas Hold'em against the Casino) was Casino Hold'em® (my Game) started 2000.
And that is why I buy the 2 patents (US 6,206,373 and US 6,637,747).
Later on there was: WPT- All-in Hold'em, WSOP- Texas Hold'em Bonus, Shufflemaster- Ultimate Texas Hold'em and so on...
I know all the variations of (Texas Hold'em against the dealer) out there and there is a lot of them.
Anyway the fact is, I have the US patents for (Texas Hold'em against the dealer) (US 6,206,373 and US 6,637,747).
As I say before, I don't have the money and time to go after all of them who is infringing my patents (Especially the bigger companies).
Quote: MrCasinoGames
Paigowdan:
You are wrong on these
There was no such Game/Games (Texas Hold'em against the Casino) until the patents (US 6,206,373 and US 6,637,747) started 1998.
I didn't say that there was Texas Hold 'em house-banked in casinos before those games. I'm saying interest wasn't generated before proprietary Hold 'em games were introduced. Look:
1. The basic game of Texas Hold 'em is in the public domain ("free") - no one can have ownership rights to the game, and;
2. The use of a commission to generate a house edge is also public domain - free.
If a Casino offered Texas Hold 'em against the dealer, AND charged a commission to guarantee the casino's house edge, then no one can either claim IP rights to that, or demand a licensing fee. Now, house generating methods that avoid the commission (Full pay on Straight or better player win, for example) is patented, and so are some side bets. Maybe some of the betting spot betting patterns are also patented, but Texas Hold 'em and commission usage are public domain.You are in this group
Know that some casinos do this with basic Pai Gow Poker:
1. The basic game of Pai Gow poker is in the public domain, and
2. The commission method of generating house edge is also in the public domain, and
3. Some casinos have One betting spot Pai Gow poker games with a 5% commission with NO licensing fees to any one, - just like one-spot blackjack - and some people play them. Not many, they have no real features and charge a commission, but are there.
It's the "add on mechanisms" that are patented, copy righted, and trademarked: The Bonus bets, the commission-free mechanisms, the progressive jackpots, etc. I am in this group
Quote: MrCasinoGamesAnd the first successful (Texas Hold'em against the Casino) was Casino Hold'em (my Game) started 2000.
And that is why I buy the 2 patents (US 6,206,373 and US 6,637,747).
I know all the variations of (Texas Hold'em against the dealer) out there and you have miss some of them.
I wasn't going to list them all...I listed some examples...
Quote: Mr. Casino GamesAnyway the fact is I have the US patents for (Texas Hold'em against the dealer) (US 6,206,373 and US 6,637,747).
Then how did Texas Hold 'em Bonus and Ultimate Texas Hold 'em, and now the new game Texas Hold 'em Plus get into casinos without paying you a dollar?
Quote: Mr. Casino GamesAs I say before, I don't have the money and time to go after all of them who is infringing my patents (Especially the bigger companies).
Your casino game is played in Casinos in 12 countries, and is online on many sites, and this is just the Casino Texas Hold 'em. You have clout, and should have some money from it.
You don't have to go after them in the court room. You can approach the companies with an attorney about your right of ownership, and ask them for a licesing fee to continue using the products.
Now, If what you say is true, and you did sue and win, you'd own a huge amount of the U.S. Carnival Games Market.
Certainly, you wouldn't sue a poor man who couldn't give you anything, though you can make him stop, - but if you'd sue a rich company, and had a good case and a good lawyer, you'd be paid off.
The inventor of Three Card Poker did this and got a settlement in the millions in order to use his game.
Also, the case of Bob Kearns - who invented the intermittent windshield wiper system that all cars use today, was a poor electrical engineering teacher who sued the Major Automotive companies - bigger and richer than all other companies at the time except for General Electric, U.S. Steel, and Exxon - for patent infringement and he won. He solved a problem, created something new, and he knew he owned it 100%. He only took them to court after he refused settlements for the kind of money that he could have retired on, albeit more modestly, too. Kearn's legal case
Nowadays, these patents can be brought up and read by anyone on the U.S.P.T.O. site www.usgov.gov, for review. Bob Kearns did not have this advantage. If you have a case, it would be hard to deny, by reading the patents of the products. Also, you have a track record as a game designer with many games, you are not a man off the street.
With a good lawyer and a truly solid patent, you'd be tough to fight if your position is strong.
If you want to enter the U.S. market, you make sure of the patents you have, and what games they actually do enable (or can make possible), and that the patents are strong in the U.S.
Quote: PaigowdanI didn't say that there was Texas Hold 'em house-banked in casinos before those games. I'm saying interest wasn't generated before proprietary Hold 'em games were introduced. Look:
1. The basic game of Texas Hold 'em is in the public domain ("free") - no one can have ownership rights to the game, and;
2. The use of a commission to generate a house edge is also public domain - free.
If a Casino offered Texas Hold 'em against the dealer, AND charged a commission to guarantee the casino's house edge, then no one can either claim IP rights to that, or demand a licensing fee. Now, house generating methods that avoid the commission (Full pay on Straight or better player win, for example) is patented, and so are some side bets. Maybe some of the betting spot betting patterns are also patented, but Texas Hold 'em and commission usage are public domain.You are in this group
Know that some casinos do this with basic Pai Gow Poker:
1. The basic game of Pai Gow poker is in the public domain, and
2. The commission method of generating house edge is also in the public domain, and
3. Some casinos have One betting spot Pai Gow poker games with a 5% commission with NO licensing fees to any one, - just like one-spot blackjack - and some people play them. Not many, they have no real features and charge a commission, but are there.
It's the "add on mechanisms" that are patented, copy righted, and trademarked: The Bonus bets, the commission-free mechanisms, the progressive jackpots, etc. I am in this group
I wasn't going to list them all...I listed some examples...
Then how did Texas Hold 'em Bonus and Ultimate Texas Hold 'em, and now the new game Texas Hold 'em Plus get into casinos without paying you a dollar?
Your casino game is played in Casinos in 12 countries, and is online on many sites, and this is just the Casino Texas Hold 'em. You have clout, and should have some money from it.
You don't have to go after them in the court room. You can approach the companies with an attorney about your right of ownership, and ask them for a licesing fee to continue using the products.
Now, If what you say is true, and you did sue and win, you'd own a huge amount of the U.S. Carnival Games Market.
Certainly, you wouldn't sue a poor man who couldn't give you anything, though you can make him stop, - but if you'd sue a rich company, and had a good case and a good lawyer, you'd be paid off.
The inventor of Three Card Poker did this and got a settlement in the millions in order to use his game.
Also, the case of Bob Kearns - who invented the intermittent windshield wiper system that all cars use today, was a poor electrical engineering teacher who sued the Major Automotive companies - bigger and richer than all other companies at the time except for General Electric, U.S. Steel, and Exxon - for patent infringement and he won. He solved a problem, created something new, and he knew he owned it 100%. He only took them to court after he refused settlements for the kind of money that he could have retired on, albeit more modestly, too. Kearn's legal case
Nowadays, these patents can be brought up and read by anyone on the U.S.P.T.O. site www.usgov.gov, for review. Bob Kearns did not have this advantage. If you have a case, it would be hard to deny, by reading the patents of the products. Also, you have a track record as a game designer with many games, you are not a man off the street.
With a good lawyer and a truly solid patent, you'd be tough to fight if your position is strong.
If you want to enter the U.S. market, you make sure of the patents you have, and what games they actually do enable (or can make possible), and that the patents are strong in the U.S.
Thanks Paigowdan,
I wll approach the companies with an attorney about my right of ownership, and ask them for a licesing fee to continue using the products.
The basic game of Pai Gow poker is now in the public domain, because the inventorid did not patent the idea (he believe that the idea was not patentable, as it happens it was patentable), if I remember it right, you mentioned it in one of your post.
Quote: clubflush
The dealer cannot exchange a card. The ante stays up until you have both cards and win or you lose. So the cost to play the game is the ante only when you lose. And no it’s not principal hand. If you have ace king and 3 aces on the flop you would win. But a king and 4 aces on the board you would not win unless the dealer has less then a king. And then the ante pay table would not pay, as you do not have both cards in your hand. On the issue of ante pay... I will take another CARD! Cost value is a huge player edge. With the dealer not getting this option. It locks in my odds BEFORE any cards are dealt. Think about it! You’re playing heads up Hold'em and you playing 3 hold cards to two. You will crush the other player over time. The offset? One unit does not get paid unless you can use both cards in your hand on a straight or better. But looses ever time you lose.
It went live July 3rd 2011.
Thanks for the clarifications clubflush - I was conflating the first two posts in this thread as if they were describing the same game. That said, I'll probably give this a whirl, alongside my wife if it's still in place when we get back in town.
We let the day before the game went live. Boo. :-).
I actually think this is a good methodology and one that has been used by low-denomination slots for a long time - Let the player win more often than he loses. Take your edge by ensuring that he loses more than he wins on any given event. People have hard time valuing wins and losses as anything but binary events ("I win :)" versus "I lose :(") and I could see this catching on.
Quote: MrCasinoGamesThanks Paigowdan,
I wll approach the companies with an attorney about my right of ownership, and ask them for a licesing fee to continue using the products.
The basic game of Pai Gow poker is now in the public domain, because the inventorid did not patent the idea (he believe that the idea was not patentable, as it happens it was patentable), if I remember it right, you mentioned it in one of your post.
Yes, that is correct about the base game (the one core bet) of Pai Gow Poker.
If you own the Intellectual Property to certain games - you should ask for compensation (a licensing fee), and to protect it from people who take it from you without compensation.
But If the patent is weak, you need to know this also. This is because a game designer should only spend his effort - his time and money - on things he can achieve, can get done for himself. Then you'll know what games you should spend time and money on.
Quote: clubflushQuote: MrCasinoGamesQuote: PaigowdanTexas Hold 'em Plus Deluxe is a new game by Sam Sehadeh, who's a poker dealer with Stations.
The game is standard Hold 'em, but with a good catch: if the player feels one of his two hole cards is a dog, he can discard it to the dealer and receive a new card, else if his hole cards are good, he waves a "stay with my hole cards" signal (taps the table of waves off like in BJ).
Casino version (at the Golden Nugget):
Player makes ANTE bet and an optional Bonus bet.
Players may fold or make a flop bet.
Players may raise going into the Turn or River
Dealer compares hands
very straightforward
Poker room version (at the Mirage) is:
Players may buy and exchange one hole card or stay with the two hole cards dealt
Play resumes as in Regular Texas Hold 'em (fold, check, raise...)
Share your opinion and vote....
see:
Casino Version info
Poker Room version here
To me this game (Texas Hold 'em Plus Deluxe) Casino version, is just like the game taxes Hold'em bonus but with Each player has the option of changing one of his poket card.
To me this game is lack of speed, just like the taxes Hold'em bonus, but now you'll have to take time for the player to exchange cards too.
So it will not surprise me this game will take three to five minutes per round (the slowest Texas Hold'em against the dealer, table game).
This game is like Texas Hold'em Bonus only in the fact that it is a hold'em game. The TWO pay tables are different. The play is different, as you do not make decisions on your bet until after the cards are dealt. In Texas Bonus you are forced to place 2x your ante to see the flop. In Plus Deluxe this is not the case.
Now the speed issue... This game is much faster than Texas Bonus Hold'em due to the fact that there is no check option in the game, you either play or fold. And since your only playing heads up against the dealer there are only 9 to 7s with a 2 to 3 or 4 that you would fold. This is only after you have exchanged a card for free!. The discard comes out really fast and only adds maybe 2 to 3 seconds to any one round that it is found in for the whole table. Players know right away if they want another card. I have played this game a lot, over 500 hands, and it is a better version of the Texas Hold'em Casino Banked games that are currently out there. If you don't believe me go play it yourself(if you can find a seat) at the golden nugget. This game is GOLD! (no pun intended) and the players agree. The table has been packed ever day since it open and the old Texas Bonus sitting next to it is empty, while there are crowds standing around Deluxe waiting to play.
Hi clubflush,
Don't get me wrong, this game is better then Texas Hold'em Bonus, I will player it.
At the same time, would you get 20 round per hour on his game?
Quote: MrCasinoGamesMaybe MathExtremist can give us his opinion on this.
Two things:
1) I'm not an attorney and I cannot dispense legal advice. Doing so without a license is actually against the law.
2) I can and do advise clients, typically attorneys in gaming disputes, by analyzing infringement and validity issues. I always counsel my non-attorney clients to seek legal representation before doing anything else -- especially if you're contemplating moving against another party -- but if you're interested in a formal infringement opinion please contact me off the forum. PM me here if you don't already know how to reach me.
Quote: MathExtremistTwo things:
1) I'm not an attorney and I cannot dispense legal advice. Doing so without a license is actually against the law.
2) I can and do advise clients, typically attorneys in gaming disputes, by analyzing infringement and validity issues. I always counsel my non-attorney clients to seek legal representation before doing anything else -- especially if you're contemplating moving against another party -- but if you're interested in a formal infringement opinion please contact me off the forum. PM me here if you don't already know how to reach me.
Thanks MathExtremist,
I will keep that in mind.
