Money$uit 31 set to go live in Northern Michigan
Quote: mrsuit31The official Hold% for the first 40 days of play is 19.26%. Quite happy with this...
Congrats! Unless it's dealing as fast as blackjack, that hold number is probably going to have to climb, but it sounds like it may if you had a few large payouts early on.
I don't even look at hold percentage until 90 days.
ZCore13
Quote: Zcore13Congrats! Unless it's dealing as fast as blackjack, that hold number is probably going to have to climb, but it sounds like it may if you had a few large payouts early on.
I don't even look at hold percentage until 90 days.
ZCore13
Thanks Z,
I will fill you in tomorrow with the new number. It has already increased a bit since then. And yes without a few of those notable wins week one the hold would be right around 24-25%. But it's creeping up there already. Last I checked we were at 21.21%. But like you said, until we double this sample and maintain the same level of play (which is only increasing, which is surprising based on the weather conditions up there), then the hold will really express the true play. It's designed to be in that 24 - 27% range.
It plays virtually as fast as three card. The dice shake is really the only additional step. The draw flip after the natural bonus wager resolution leaves the sequence virtually unchanged... This is actually something the dealers liked very much.
Most importantly right now is the popularity. That combined with the existing 31 player base is really helping me prove the 31 market to a few skeptics of its existence along the way... So fingers crossed it keeps on trucking along.
Quote: mrsuit31But like you said, until we double this sample and maintain the same level of play (which is only increasing, which is surprising based on the weather condintions up there)
Yoopers are a hardy bunch. It takes a special kind of person to live in an area in which it snows an average of 200 inches a year. I have family that went to NMU in Marquette and Michigan Tech in Houghton (Ho-tuhn) and they always said you would get a freshman from the South that would drop out solely due to the weather every year.
Quote: Gabes22Yoopers are a hardy bunch. It takes a special kind of person to live in an area in which it snows an average of 200 inches a year. I have family that went to NMU in Marquette and Michigan Tech in Houghton (Ho-tuhn) and they always said you would get a freshman from the South that would drop out solely due to the weather every year.
It has been brutal up there for a few weeks. At times the manager told me it was -32 when he would get in to work... Tooo cold for me!
-Craps (two tables on the floor, mini craps and full size)- Money$uit 31 is dropping 41% of the total drop of both tables combined, while maintaining 226% of the Hold percentage.
-Roulette/one single table - Money$uit 31 is dropping 71% in comparison, while maintaining a 92.29% hold in comparison.
-Three way action/only a single table (the lowest dropping carni game on the floor)- Money$uit 31 is dropping 664%, Hold comparison is unnecessary as the hold on this game is outrageous at the moment.
-The highest and formally most popular carnival game on the floor Phil'em up poker/ one single table- Money$uit 31 is dropping 155%, while maintaining 155% hold in comparison to this game.
- BJ shoe dealt/ two live tables- Money$uit 31 is dropping 18.1% compared to both combined while maintaining a 180% hold in comparison of the overall hold of both tables.
-BJ pitch dealt/ two live tables- Money$uit 31 is dropping 18.6% compared to both combined while maintaining a 169% hold in comparison of the overall hold of both table.
I am VERY happy with these!
Quote: UCivanVERY IMPRESSIVE, ALL CAPS. CONGRA.
Thanks UCivan!
= hold. Who cares. Win pays the bill.... Dividing the little number by the big number is dumb. If a game holds tpo much,
players stop playing. Holdtoo littleand DC thewin suffers. Micro managing by thesame supervisors
who have $25minimum on empty tablebecause it is Friday night .
Quote: dummyWay to go Brent. If you see the guy who invented the term hold, shoot him. Dividing Win by drop
= hold. Who cares. Win pays the bill.... Dividing the little number by the big number is dumb. If a game holds tpo much,
players stop playing. Hold too little and DC thewin suffers. Micro managing by thesame supervisors
who have $25minimum on empty tablebecause it is Friday night .
Thank you Dummy!
Hopefully I will have other good news to supply soon. A few things in the works, in some big places. To be continued.............
Quote: dummyWay to go Brent. If you see the guy who invented the term hold, shoot him. Dividing Win by drop
= hold. Who cares. Win pays the bill.... .
THANK YOU, dummy. So true. I'll take a huge drop with a low-to-moderate hold any day over a small drop with a huge hold %. Maximizing the win on the table is the objective. I've never understood why such a large emphasis has been placed on the 'hold' metric, especially when it takes the 'eye off the ball.'
This aside, congratulations Brent! Looks like you're gaining a popular following in Michigan. Keep up the good work.
Quote: LuckyTHANK YOU, dummy. So true. I'll take a huge drop with a low-to-moderate hold any day over a small drop with a huge hold %. Maximizing the win on the table is the objective. I've never understood why such a large emphasis has been placed on the 'hold' metric, especially when it takes the 'eye off the ball.'
This aside, congratulations Brent! Looks like you're gaining a popular following in Michigan. Keep up the good work.
Thank you Harry!
On the hold % topic...
Ill be honest. I'm starting to see the worth in the hold% metric in a few different areas.
Security wise, it can alert staff to possible breaches in game security. It can direct management/surveillance to look/observe a specific game/table for potential scams causing a slight or major continuous decrease in hold. And yes this seemingly has nothing to do with us, but at the same time it can express potential vulnerability. So perhaps it does.........
Also, I can certainly understand the curiosity into the hold of a game, as it truly does express the "feel" of the game to players in some way. The hold viewed in conjunction with the event probabilities can, in my opinion, express how a game feels, without placing the game on the floor. Remember, the issue with installing a new game is it can bomb and perhaps leave a sour taste in a patron's mouths, damaging the casinos reputation, and perhaps even hurt retention overall. The hold is really the only obtainable live performance statistic that expresses this, at least in some way. Although, of course it isn't perfect.
Focusing on win alone, in my opinion, is only appropriate in non-competitive markets, where players don't have a choice of facilities to choose and games to play.
Quote: mrsuit31Thank you Harry!
On the hold % topic...
Ill be honest. I'm starting to see the worth in the hold% metric in a few different areas.
Security wise, it can alert staff to possible breaches in game security. It can alert management to look/observe a specific game/table for potential scams causing a slight or major continuous decrease in hold. And yes this seemingly has nothing to do with us, but at the same time it can express potential vulnerability. So perhaps it does.........
However, I can certainly understand the curiosity into the hold of a game, as it truly does express the "feel" of the game to players in some way. The hold viewed in conjunction with the event probabilities can, in my opinion, express how a game feels, without placing the game on the floor. Remember, the issue with installing a new game is it can bomb and perhaps leave a sour taste in a patron's mouths, damaging the casinos reputation, and perhaps even hurt retention overall. The hold is really the only obtainable live performance statistic that expresses this, at least in some way, as of course it isn't perfect.
focusing on win alone, in my opinion, is only appropriate in non-competitive markets, where players don't have a choice of facilities to choose and games to play.
Brent, I guess my remarks on hold were mainly in connection with management using it as a key performance metric. While perhaps a useful stat, I do think it is much 'over-used' for those purposes. Just ask yourself why the first game open and last game closed in a property might be a double-deck BJ game with an average hold % of 10-12% ... when there are poker and other games on the floor that average 2+ that number?
And for security, alert floor observation and surveillance, coupled with the standard deviation as applied to the win/loss, should provide the needed constraints and red flags.
Agreed that the hold % might be one indicator of the "feel" of the game ... that over time it 'may' signal whether a game is too strong or too loose ... and also agreed that there does seem to be a 'sweet' spot for various types of games. But as a performance measure, IMO it's a poor substitute for the table win because, standing alone, it completely ignores how much play the game is getting. All I'm saying is that comparing this game to that game, the metric to use is the win/per comparable period - hour, day, shift, etc.
Quote: LuckyBrent, I guess my remarks on hold were mainly in connection with management using it as a key performance metric. While perhaps a useful stat, I do think it is much 'over-used' for those purposes. Just ask yourself why the first game open and last game closed in a property might be a double-deck BJ game with an average hold % of 10-12% ... when there are poker and other games on the floor that average 2+ that number?
And for security, alert floor observation and surveillance, coupled with the standard deviation as applied to the win/loss, should provide the needed constraints and red flags.
Agreed that the hold % might be one indicator of the "feel" of the game ... that over time it 'may' signal whether a game is too strong or too loose ... and also agreed that there does seem to be a 'sweet' spot for various types of games. But as a performance measure, IMO it's a poor substitute for the table win because, standing alone, it completely ignores how much play the game is getting. All I'm saying is that comparing this game to that game, the metric to use is the win/per comparable period - hour, day, shift, etc.
I agree it's overused. I just said I understand its value. I didn't say it should stand alone ;-). Everything should be considered...
Quote: Zcore13Congrats! Unless it's dealing as fast as blackjack, that hold number is probably going to have to climb, but it sounds like it may if you had a few large payouts early on.
I don't even look at hold percentage until 90 days.
ZCore13
After 60 days, we are still maintaining the same level of play and have generated a 26.31% hold to date.
Quote: mrsuit31After 60 days, we are still maintaining the same level of play and have generated a 26.31% hold to date.
That's a nice number.
On the Hold subject. Hold is a very important statistic for internal comparisons. I really can't compare my hold numbers to numbers from other casinos in other Cities/States. Everyplace is different. Different customers, different play habits, different average buy-ins, etc. But when comparing to other games in my own Pit, it does provide important information to compare.
Is it the only number to look at? Of course not. I'll take a higher drop, lower hold, higher win any day. But when comparing space on your floor it is a key statistic to compare against previous and current installations.
ZCore13
Quote: mrsuit31After 60 days, we are still maintaining the same level of play and have generated a 26.31% hold to date.
Nice!!
Money$uit 31 has officially passed it initial trial and will be remaining on the floor. We are now hoping to expand to the surrounding area as well as enter a number of new jurisdictions.
The game has maintained its high level of play throughout the initial 3 months and the casino could not be happier with its performance.
Hopefully we will continue to expand so all of you who have followed it to this point can get to play it in the near future.
For all those that have helped along the way, Thank You!
Still a long way to go but certainly on the right track.
Quote: mrsuit31
Money$uit 31 has officially passed it initial trial and will be remaining on the floor. We are now hoping to expand to the surrounding area as well as enter a number of new jurisdictions.
Mazel Tov!
Quote: mrsuit31Thanks guys. I will hopefully have some good news to share this week...
I know you can't hear me but I'm cheering you on!
Bravo, that's how it's done!!!Quote: beachbumbabsYour singularity is about to be cardinalized!
Quote: LuckyCongrats, Brent, and best wishes for the continued success of Moneysuit31!
Thank you Harry.
Quote: mrsuit31Hi All,
Money$uit 31 has officially passed it initial trial and will be remaining on the floor. We are now hoping to expand to the surrounding area as well as enter a number of new jurisdictions.
The game has maintained its high level of play throughout the initial 3 months and the casino could not be happier with its performance.
Hopefully we will continue to expand so all of you who have followed it to this point can get to play it in the near future.
For all those that have helped along the way, Thank You!
Still a long way to go but certainly on the right track.
Congrats for certain on the successful trial. There's your cornerstone, now build the mansion =). Good luck moving forward. Be sure that if it comes available near us my dad and brother will have to have some fun and play it!
Quote: RomesCongrats for certain on the successful trial. There's your cornerstone, now build the mansion =). Good luck moving forward. Be sure that if it comes available near us my dad and brother will have to have some fun and play it!
Thanks romes, I will certainly do my best!
Quote: mrsuit31Five full months in and Money$uit 31 is still the highest dropping carnival game on the floor at the Lac Vieux Desert Casino. The game to date has maintained a 16.28% hold. The game is outdropping the next best carnival game by 40%.
Brent, the hold seems to be the draw - the game "feels good" because you don't get creamed.
So many card rooms demand a 38% hold, but to get action on a game, there has to be give-back to get a following.
Quote: PaigowdanBrent, the hold seems to be the draw - the game "feels good" because you don't get creamed.
So many card rooms demand a 38% hold, but to get action on a game, there has to be give-back to get a following.
Players are definitely enjoying the game experience. We have seen a 25% increase in drop since starting off. We also see the Hold fluctuating between 16-26%. However, this is obviously from a small sample set, so that Hold will/should level off around 23-24% at years end...
I couldn't be happier with the drop totals.
But I recall this is a relatively small property so you are going to need more like 9-12 months of data/dollar volume "through the mechanism" to get a true sense of how the game will perform long term from a hold perspective.
Good work Brent.......keep it pluggin' along!!!
Quote: ParadigmI think the low 20%'s is where the game will settle in at as well. With a 2.24% HE on the base game and a slightly higher HE on the side bet, the game should be holding north of 20%......5 months will definitely give you a sense of how the players like the game based on the drop totals, which appear to be growing and that's good!
But I recall this is a relatively small property so you are going to need more like 9-12 months of data/dollar volume "through the mechanism" to get a true sense of how the game will perform long term from a hold perspective.
Good work Brent.......keep it pluggin' along!!!
Thanks Mike! I agree we definitely need some more time to see where the hold ends up.
As long as the Drop keeps increasing, I'm happy!
Quote: beachbumbabsFantastic that the drop is increasing, Brent! Really glad to hear it's going well.
Thank you Babs!
