Thread Rating:

Poll

11 votes (47.82%)
5 votes (21.73%)
2 votes (8.69%)
5 votes (21.73%)

23 members have voted

allinriverking
allinriverking
Joined: Feb 3, 2010
  • Threads: 29
  • Posts: 333
August 28th, 2014 at 9:26:10 AM permalink
* bet hardway
* hit hardway, get paid as regular
* bet hardway(up to amount of a true parlay), bonus triggered
* hit hardway, get paid true-odds payout
* bet hardway converts back to regular hardway(except any amount that was bet over a true parlay, that amount of bet the bonus is triggered)
petroglyph
petroglyph
Joined: Jan 3, 2013
  • Threads: 19
  • Posts: 3360
August 28th, 2014 at 9:27:42 AM permalink
Quote: allinriverking

You don't have to parlay. A true parlay is the max a player can press their winning bet to receive the true odds payout. Any amount over a true parlay is treated as a normal hardway... This stops the house from not taking in as much on the hardways. It's like limiting the number of true odds you can take on a pass/come bet..




Well, at least its not confusing.[sarc]
Ahigh
Ahigh
Joined: May 19, 2010
  • Threads: 88
  • Posts: 5161
August 28th, 2014 at 9:33:55 AM permalink
You can already improve on the hardway parlay bet on a craps felt if you know you always parlay.

First bet you make on the rail and is free. After that bet wins, you take the winnings from the rail and go to the hardway.

First hit is free, second hit is 2.78% edge per roll or 9.09% on the 6/8 and 11.11% on the 4/10.

The key to lowering your edge per resolution is to make the first bet with yourself.

My way:

1->11->110 and down 11/121 = 9.09% edge

Your bet:

1->10->110 and down 11/121 = 9.09% edge

My bet: already available in the casino

Your bet: not

Both bets: require parlay to work

This goes back to the point of being able to create bets that are not on the felt. My way only works if you take the first bet with yourself. Most people don't understand how to do this.

It does save you money compared to having the house book your first bet. But all of this assume that you know you're going to lose and just want to save money.

Most people think in terms of "house money" and will never understand.
allinriverking
allinriverking
Joined: Feb 3, 2010
  • Threads: 29
  • Posts: 333
August 28th, 2014 at 9:40:44 AM permalink
Quote: petroglyph

Well, at least its not confusing.


it's not confusing, no more confusing than changing come bet amounts. The true odds bet can only be made when you are being paid for already hitting hardway..

*player bets $1 hard 6, dealer places their bet in proper location
*hard 6 hits
*player wins $9, if player is going to press they must do so now to receive true odds on next win
*player presses $11, dealer places $10 in proper location and places the "TRUE" lammer on top of that bet, dealer places remaining $2 on top of the "TRUE" lammer
*hard 6 hits
*player wins $100 and $18(cut out separate)
*player leaves bet alone
*dealer swaps the $2 bet with the $10 bet
*hard 6 hits
*player wins $20 and $90(cut out separate)

Anything bet below "TRUE" lammer when hardway hits moves to above "TRUE" lammer for next roll, anything bet above "TRUE" lammer when hardway hits moves to below "TRUE" lammer for next roll.
allinriverking
allinriverking
Joined: Feb 3, 2010
  • Threads: 29
  • Posts: 333
August 28th, 2014 at 9:43:23 AM permalink
Quote: Ahigh

You can already improve on the hardway parlay bet on a craps felt if you know you always parlay.

First bet you make on the rail and is free. After that bet wins, you take the winnings from the rail and go to the hardway.

First hit is free, second hit is 2.78% edge per roll or 9.09% on the 6/8 and 11.11% on the 4/10.

The key to lowering your edge per resolution is to make the first bet with yourself.

My way:

1->11->110 and down 11/121 = 9.09% edge

Your bet:

1->10->110 and down 11/121 = 9.09% edge

My bet: already available in the casino

Your bet: not

Both bets: require parlay to work

This goes back to the point of being able to create bets that are not on the felt. My way only works if you take the first bet with yourself. Most people don't understand how to do this.

It does save you money compared to having the house book your first bet. But all of this assume that you know you're going to lose and just want to save money.

Most people think in terms of "house money" and will never understand.



your numbers don't make sense
mustangsally
mustangsally
Joined: Mar 29, 2011
  • Threads: 25
  • Posts: 2463
August 28th, 2014 at 10:16:51 AM permalink
Quote: allinriverking

your numbers don't make sense

hehe
neither does his words, in my opinion as his opinion is just that
another Ahigh opinion!

but what does one expect from a non-craps expert that says a $6 place 8
and a $6 place 6 is only one bet

he also says the WORD *house advantage* is one word

I think he likes things in ones, Is (eyes) mean one

maybe his post is more readable an easier to understand like so (added a shuffle for entertainment)
Quote: Ahigh


this.
to
After
But
money
if
all
bets:
that
My
4/10.
first
11/121
or
resolution
The
think
second
compared
from
hardway.
roll
hardway
are
wins,
Most
do
edge
people
down
know
to
to
already
take
parlay.
edge
hit
never
know
terms
bet:
=
does
First
My
only
the
edge
understand
lowering
9.09%
is
and
rail
bet
on
the
not
and
people
per
It
11/121
you
you
back
going
already
works
make
bet
and
money.
having
that
and
bet.
save
yourself.
of
"house
on
bet:
is
hit
make
first
to
the
the
assume
key
way:
edge
down
Most
improve
the
available
to
of
the
the
goes
bets
with
9.09%
being
11.11%
not
Both
how
a
don't
require
to
go
and
save
this
rail
2.78%
parlay
in
to
1->10->110
point
will
to
always
craps
want
bet
felt
9.09%
the
the
lose
understand.
take
felt.
=
Your
is
house
bet
parlay
per
to
first
can
free,
you
the
work
and
book
you
in
1->11->110
the
create
First
money"
on
you're
Your
on
that
My
6/8
casino
your
on
This
the
able
winnings
You
is
of
you
free.
bet:
yourself.
bet
on
your
with
to
way
if
just
and
the
you
you

has a nice rhythm to it


as to the OP bet, again I still do not get it.

what is the big deal if one bet pays 9 to 1 or 10 to 1.

it does nothing to increase the chances of winning.
Now make a bet that does that and in my opinion I think more would play them

Sally
I Heart Vi Hart
allinriverking
allinriverking
Joined: Feb 3, 2010
  • Threads: 29
  • Posts: 333
August 28th, 2014 at 10:24:03 AM permalink
Quote: mustangsally




as to the OP bet, again I still do not get it.

what is the big deal if one bet pays 9 to 1 or 10 to 1.

it does nothing to increase the chances of winning.
Now make a bet that does that and in my opinion I think more would play them

Sally



If you increased the chance of winning then the payout would most likely go down. I guess compare it to, if the house didn't pay true-odds on the odds for a pass/come bet, then someone comes out and says we are going to give you true-odds on the odds now. To die hard craps players that is the only way to play is using max odds to reduce overall house edge. That's what my bets do for the hardways, it gives players a chance to take true-odds on a hardway, but only after the hardway has hit so that the house earns something for the free odds on the hardway for the next hit..
Buzzard
Buzzard
Joined: Oct 28, 2012
  • Threads: 90
  • Posts: 6814
August 28th, 2014 at 10:26:08 AM permalink
Sorta like making no money on the parlay, but increasing your profit due to volume.
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
mustangsally
mustangsally
Joined: Mar 29, 2011
  • Threads: 25
  • Posts: 2463
August 28th, 2014 at 10:43:33 AM permalink
Quote: allinriverking

If you increased the chance of winning then the payout would most likely go down.

yes I agree the
Teeter Totter effect

Quote: allinriverking

To die hard craps players that is the only way to play is using max odds to reduce overall house edge.

that is your opinion and thank you for sharing
I really disagree with this.
I have been told by experienced craps players (die hard craps players) and Dealers too(I am neither)
that the only way to win at craps is pass with odds, place bets - that is where you win your money - and hardway bets.
the only way

no die hard craps players even cares about house edge in my opinion
and many craps dealers and boxman opinions too. I have asked.
increasing ones win rate is the answer to more fun and winning playing craps
just tossing out more opinions
Quote: allinriverking

That's what my bets do for the hardways,
it gives players a chance to take true-odds on a hardway, but only after the hardway has hit so that the house earns something for the free odds on the hardway for the next hit..

I get what you say buts again,
I see no real difference in 9 to 1 against 10 to 1 for a bet that only wins about 10% of the time

and
I know you have seen many times when a shooter throws the dice and they (or one die) hits a few hardways bets and they scatter.
do you have some protection so this does not happen?
especially on a full table

Sally
I Heart Vi Hart
wudged
wudged
Joined: Aug 7, 2013
  • Threads: 2
  • Posts: 998
August 28th, 2014 at 11:21:22 AM permalink
Quote: allinriverking

You don't have to parlay



Quote: allinriverking

*player wins $9, if player is going to press they must do so now to receive true odds on next win



And exactly how does this not require a parlay?

Also, you really think hiding lammers between stacks of chips is not going to be confusing?

  • Jump to: