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MonkeyMonkey
MonkeyMonkey
Joined: May 1, 2012
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September 9th, 2012 at 3:17:40 PM permalink
I have some questions regarding a new table game that I thought of.

As I understand it, if one were to invent craps today and want to show it to a vendor like SHFL, DEQ, Galaxy, etc all you'd need would be a layout, dice, and some chips. But in the case of my game idea there would be a lot more involved in actually demoing the game.

- Is it possible to "show" the game by describing it, or must an actual live demo take place?

On the same subject, it would be fairly easy to give a basic demonstration, but the full blown concept would probably cost me several thousand to develop into a true working demo, and some aspects of the development are probably over my head (i.e. I'd need to hire an expert to work out these fine details).

- Is it possible to show a basic version of the game and describe the more elaborate "bells & whistles"? For example, if you had a game with a progressive, you wouldn't need an actual blinking light that ties into a computer and raises the jackpot, right? You could just say, "and the progressive bet goes here..."

The basic premise of the game is very obvious, therefore I'm not sure how patentable it is at that level. Imagine if poker had been around for years and then suddenly someone said, "Hey, let's play for money!" the poker idea seems to be pretty much in the public domain, my idea is somewhat similar in that it's been around for a while but I've yet to find a casino game based on it.

- Can anyone give me some guidance on how to approach patenting something for gaming purposes that outside of the gaming would seem fairly ordinary?

Lastly,

- Can anyone describe for me, or is there another source, where I can learn about the game development life cycle. What order the steps need to be done in (idea, patent, math, present... idea, patent, present, math?)


I know answering some of these questions will be difficult without knowing the nature of the game, and I'm just busting to talk about it, because it has me very excited, but after some of the things I've read about making an idea public I'm reluctant to discuss the details without an NDA.
MangoJ
MangoJ
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September 9th, 2012 at 3:38:20 PM permalink
I would probably go with a live demo. If you can't put up a prototype it's the best proof that your game won't work.
If it releis on i.e. complex mechanics or is difficult to manufacture - how do you maintain it ? How do you deal a game you never have dealt ?
If you don't have funds for a prototype, who is funding your patent ?
MonkeyMonkey
MonkeyMonkey
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September 9th, 2012 at 3:57:42 PM permalink
Quote: MangoJ

I would probably go with a live demo. If you can't put up a prototype it's the best proof that your game won't work.
If it releis on i.e. complex mechanics or is difficult to manufacture - how do you maintain it ? How do you deal a game you never have dealt ?
If you don't have funds for a prototype, who is funding your patent ?



It's difficult to answer your questions without going into detail that I'm trying to avoid at this point.

Perhaps a fair comparison would be if you had an idea for a slot machine variant. It would be quite costly to make the demo just like it would appear in a casino, but running it on a laptop should get the basic point across.

Dealing the game would be pretty simple. So much so that I would imagine even someone without previous dealing experience could do so competently with perhaps 5 minutes of instruction and a basic understanding of the game.

I'm lucky in that getting the money for a patent shouldn't be that difficult IF I can prove the idea can be monetized. But that of course leads to a chicken and egg sort of situation because the game vendors don't want to see an idea until it's patented. I'm estimating approximately $10k in development costs (for a complete, ready to rock with all the bells and whistles, version) which for me is a substantial sum. Of course it can be done incrementally, but it will still probably take me a year or more to get it done, and I'll have no place to keep it (about the size of a craps table) in the meantime.
Paradigm
Paradigm
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September 9th, 2012 at 4:10:21 PM permalink
It is pretty much summed up here:

Contemporary_Casino_Table_Game_Design

I would read this book before posting anything else about your game or asking any additional questions.....this is you starting point
MangoJ
MangoJ
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September 9th, 2012 at 4:27:58 PM permalink
A prototype is not the complete game, its a proof of concept - it should contain everything your game relies on. You won't need fancy artwork and all blinky stuff. If your prototype can run on a laptop and is convincing enough that it could be run physically on the table (or whatever you envision), that should be enough.
If your potential investors want a patent first, then you should obviously get a patent beforehand. If you don't have funds for the patent .... well get some savings or find a loan.
teliot
teliot
Joined: Oct 19, 2009
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September 9th, 2012 at 5:16:43 PM permalink
Quote: Paradigm

It is pretty much summed up here

Thanks for the plug. I think these charts sum it up as well. For me, one of the keys is the overall decline in proprietary tables since 2007.


Proprietary tables in Nevada: 1990 to 2012




Traditional tables in Nevada: 1990 to 2012




Blackjack tables in Nevada: 1990 to 2012


End of the world website: www.climatecasino.net
buzzpaff
buzzpaff
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September 9th, 2012 at 6:11:43 PM permalink
Blackjack tables in Nevada: 1990 to 2012

Can I safely assume this includes 6/5, 3/2. Super Fun & Spanish 21 ?
teliot
teliot
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September 9th, 2012 at 6:38:30 PM permalink
Quote: buzzpaff

Can I safely assume this includes 6/5, 3/2. Super Fun & Spanish 21 ?

6/5 and 3/2 only. SF21 and SP21 are proprietary games (Tech Art & Masque Publishing).
End of the world website: www.climatecasino.net
Paradigm
Paradigm
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September 9th, 2012 at 6:56:33 PM permalink
With updated information including 2012, it is not encouraging to see the continued encroachment of slots on the table game numbers. It is consistent with what I am being told and observe from table game managers.

However, I will say there has been a recent turn in that I have heard several table game managers tell me of table game pit expansion plans to be completed over the 12 to 18 months....it used to always be a story of trying to hold on to tables, not adding tables!
Paradigm
Paradigm
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September 9th, 2012 at 7:01:14 PM permalink
There is also this video from the Wiz interviewing PaigowDan that is also full of good information and insights.

Wiz_Interviews_PaigowDan

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