Any Decent VP at any Harrah's properties in LV ?
Or should I say which property has the least worst
paytable ?
I mostly play JoB or DW.
thanks...
Quote: JohnnyQDo any Harrah's properties in LV have decent VP ?
Or should I say which property has the least worst
paytable ?
I mostly play JoB or DW.
thanks...
I don't play DW, but JoB is 6-5 pretty much everywhere at the Harrah's properties. I think Caesars has a small bank of slots by the Forum shops that's 7-5 in quarters, because I played that to get a drink, but otherwise, it's all lousy.
Quote: TiltpoulJoB is 6-5 pretty much everywhere at the Harrah's properties.
Isn't that worse than the airport ? !
I'll go check VPFREE2...
Quote: JohnnyQIsn't that worse than the airport ? !
I'll go check VPFREE2...
Yeah, it is. They really got stingy with VP. I might be mistaken, but I'll play 8-5 or better on JoB if it gets me time on the machines in Vegas, and I have NEVER found a machine at .25 and .50 that I could play, meaning it's either 7-5 or 6-5.
(be warned, there are also a lot of 25c 7/5 machines too, but 8/5 is there, just look for them.)
same goes for Planet Hollywood. a lot of JoB are at 8/5, even at the 25c level.
both are harrah's properties. sorry, didn't notice paytable for dueces wild.
There are two "high limit" slot areas at Caesars.
Under the "small dome" in the Palace Casino there is a semi circle kiosk of VP machines. on the "outside machines" with your back to the craps tables you will find 7/5 bonus and 8/5 jacks. But on the other side are the 8/5 bonus.
For 9/6 jacks go into the "palace court" slots area which is the "private room" to the right of the main entrance. There you will find a strange mix.
There are 9/6 jacks games on both the $100 and the $25 games. And there are 9/5 jacks on both the $100 and $25 games. In other words you have to check each machine carefully. There are also 8/5 bonus and 7/5 bonus on both the $25 and $100 machines.
There is only ONE $5 VP machine in the Palace Court with 8/5 Bonus.
In all I found a grand total of FOUR 8/5 Bonus machines in Caesars at the $5 level, 2 at the $25 level and 2 at the $100 level. That's SIX in all.
I'm not a 9/6 jacks player so I didnt bother to count but I think there are slightly fewer than six.
This is a reason why I like to play VP in California. Both Harrahs Rincon and Pechanga (independent) in San Diego County have a full assortment of full pay games.
Quote: AlanMendelson
This is a reason why I like to play VP in California. Both Harrahs Rincon and Pechanga (independent) in San Diego County have a full assortment of full pay games.
Where are the good games at Rincon? I can never find any.
Quote: brindleI just got back from C/P in Jan 2012 and almost all the 1$ JoB is 8/5 and there are a lot of 25c JoB 8/5 machines (in the back near the exit to the forum shops).
(be warned, there are also a lot of 25c 7/5 machines too, but 8/5 is there, just look for them.)
same goes for Planet Hollywood. a lot of JoB are at 8/5, even at the 25c level.
both are harrah's properties. sorry, didn't notice paytable for dueces wild.
Wait... is 8/5 JoB an acceptable amount? That's the minimum I will play, and I am playing it to either earn points or a free drink. 8/6 or 9/5 is acceptable and I will play those games if they are offered. Same for 7/5 BP.
Quote: bigfoot66Where are the good games at Rincon? I can never find any.
About a year ago, Rincon added a new side room which is exclusively video poker, and it is loaded with full pay games even at the 25-cent level. This video poker area used to be the "live poker" area, and the live poker area was moved to the second floor of the hotel.
In the high limit area there are some full pay games, but there are also pay schedules that are less than full pay. You have to check.
When I gamble, I just want to break even.
Alan, is there such a thing a full pay dueces wild on a 50 or 100 hand machine? I have nearly zero VP experience. so forgive me if my question smacks of inexperience. I figure with 50-100 hands at once, I am more likely to realize the positive EV of full pay dueces wild, since the natural royal is an important part of the return percentage. I can afford the volatility, I just can't stand the wait.
BTW, years ago, when I lived in SoCal, there was a consumer reports type guy on TV, kinda like a Clark Howard type, named Alan Mendelson. Are you the same Alan Mendelson? I really liked your segments.
I must admit I don't play deuces so I am clueless. Rincon does have both 50 play and 100 play machines starting at one-cent and going up to $2 per coin, and Im sure they have some kind of deuces game on them but I dont know the paytables.
there is a progressive deuces game that gets a lot of action and I am told that the pay table is very good. but again, I dont know.
Good games an Rincon, decent games in LV... perhaps we have to define decency more clearly. Some people want a Video Poker machine to act more like an ATM which is fine but the casinos don't really think that way. If you want to sit there and shovel coins in while doing lightning fast calculations at minimal comp rates thats fine, but agree on decency first.Quote: bigfoot66Where are the good games at Rincon? I can never find any.
some other notes about Rincon's video poker: It is clearly superior to anything you will find in Vegas with the Caesars properties and you earn the same tier score points, and reward points, and great gift wrap up points at Rincon that you earn in Vegas. The comp points you earn at Rincon can be used in Vegas. Rincon also gives bounce back money and they have quarterly "bonus gifts" (value about $200 each), plus regular monthly free play offers. From a gambling standpoint it makes absolutely no sense to play Video Poker in Vegas.
I sent you a PM through this site. Feel free to phone me anytime.
Quote: WizardThe Rio has 9-6 Jacks. However, I hear they only accumulate base reward credits at a fraction of the normal rate, and no bonus reward credits. I may not be exactly right on that, but I've heard if that you would be wasting your time playing them for rating purposes.
I don't believe that those machines accrue at a different rate, as Caesars is pretty standard on how RC's and Tier Score is earned. However, I'm sure you get no Bonus RC's except on multiplier days, and even then, VP is sometimes excluded or offered at a lower rate than the slots. Extra play also doesn't get you the room offers, so it probably isn't worth your time for the play.
Quote: TIMSPEEDI will concur that Rincon is the best CET property for vP...i was there over the weekend playing fullpay jacks, and bonus poker for QUARTERS!! how's THAT for a CET property!!
Horseshoe Southern Indiana offers fullpay JoB, Bonus and a few other games at .25, mostly throughout the casino and even at the bars occasionally.
Quote: TiltpoulI don't believe that those machines accrue at a different rate, as Caesars is pretty standard on how RC's and Tier Score is earned. However, I'm sure you get no Bonus RC's except on multiplier days, and even then, VP is sometimes excluded or offered at a lower rate than the slots. Extra play also doesn't get you the room offers, so it probably isn't worth your time for the play.
Let me clarify this:
the base reward credits, which is the "tier score" accumulates based on "coin in" and it is the same for video poker at any property.
the "bonus reward credits" will vary according to the property and the VP game you are playing.
For example, at Rincon there are NO bonus reward credits because Rincon gives you cash back, free play, other incentives.
bonus reward credits will also vary depending on if you are playing 9/6 jacks or 6/5 jacks, and if you are playing 8/5 or 9/5 DDB. Games with the poorer pay tables have the better bonus reward credits.
Basically, you have to watch the read-out meter on each game you play to figure what you are getting on the bonus reward credits.
For base reward credits or tier score go to Caesars.com and you will see this: "You'll earn 1 Base Reward Credit for every $5 coin-in on reel slots, or for every $10 coin-in on video poker."
For table games its a big mystery -- really. Table games are also subject to human error -- are you being tracked properly and at what rate.
Quote: drussell0208I hate to revive a post this old, but I am needing some updated information. I will be spending 5 days in Vegas this June, staying at Bally's then Rio. My goal for VP play is to get some tier credits and free drinks while spending time with my sisters who won't play table games. I also don't want to lose a lot of money. SO... I hear a lot of talk now about aces and faces, where are these machines located at the Rio? I am hoping for some decent $.25-$1 machines, lookjng at VPree2 has not given me a lot of information. I do have JoB and DW strategy down pretty good, but I can learn whatever games will pay best at CET properties.
To be honest CET properties = high denoms for full pay JoB for highest return, so you're going to have to settle for the "lesser" machines. I would pick a game with high variance (DDB) and hope for the best. I was quite dissapointed when I couldn't find anything decent on the quarter level, mostly 8/6 JoB down to 6/5. Deuces are quite gimped as well.
Quote: djatcTo be honest CET properties = high denoms for full pay JoB for highest return, so you're going to have to settle for the "lesser" machines. I would pick a game with high variance (DDB) and hope for the best. I was quite dissapointed when I couldn't find anything decent on the quarter level, mostly 8/6 JoB down to 6/5. Deuces are quite gimped as well.
What CET property had 8/6 JoB for quarters? Did you mean 8/5?
drussell, the reason why VPFree2 isn't much help is because VP at CET in Vegas sucks for the most part; it may be the worst video poker selection of all properties nationwide (Metropolis may be an exception). But VPFree2 says that they have 8/5 Bonus (99.17%) at Rio for dollars, so that would likely be your best bet. Otherwise, you'll have to settle for 7/5 Bonus (98.01% base) with a Progressive for quarters, which are available at both Bally's and Rio. These are all listed in VPFree2. One bit of good news is that JoB and Bonus strategy is virtually identical. If you want to pick up the comped drinking pace, the best paying game at most CET bars is 7/5 Triple Bonus Plus (97.67%).
While at Rio, I would strongly recommend trying to drag your sisters next door to Gold Coast for awhile, which has 9/6 JoB with Super Times Pay (STP) for quarters (99.82% w/STP). It's a multiline game, but you are not forced to play all lines to play max credits per line. A little further down the way at Palms, they have full-pay Deuces Wild (100.76%).
If you are willing to stray from Bally's, both Planet Hollywood and Quad have 7/5 Bonus w/STP for nickels, dimes, or quarters (98.29% with STP). At Quad, they are on "All Star Poker" machines, and at Planet Hollywood (not currently listed on VPFree2) they are a bank of four slant-top machines labeled Super Times Pay next to the poker room. PH also offers 9/5 DDB on these machines (98.14% w/STP). VPFree also says that 9/5 JoB (98.45%) exists in the high limit room for dollars.
Also walking one semi-sketchy block away from Bally's, 9/6 JoB (99.54%) exists at Ellis Island right by the front door (see VPFree2 for details) along with NSUD (99.73%).
In the video poker area by the entrance to the Forum shops in the Forum Casino there are 25 cent progressives, all with reduced pay tables. There is also a kiosk of $1 progressives all with reduced pay tables.
You will find single line machines in the video poker area with what you could call the "Caesars Usual" 8/5 Jacks, 7/5 Bonus, 9/5 double double bonus. I don't play any of the deuces games so I cant tell you what the pays are but you can imagine theyre not good.
If you want any of the full pay games you have to play $5 and up. Even the $2 games have the reduced pays.
Now be careful with the $5 games. There are only FIVE 8/5 Bonus games on the entire property at $5. There are also $5 Bonus games with the 7/5 paytable so look carefully.
Even at the $25 and $100 levels you will find some 8/5 Bonus and some 7/5 Bonus. Yes, that's how crazy Caesars is.
I "snuck into town" late Sunday night to play a little (sorry I couldnt hook up with the WOV Con folks, but I just couldn't) and I played my favorite $5 8/5 Bonus game in the Palace Court high limit room. Its the only $5 game in that high limit room and that's where you find $100 and $25 video poker. There is also a $10 option on this one machine. I wrote about it on my website with pictures here: http://forum.alanbestbuys.com/showthread.php?1317-Crazy-Memorial-Weekend-Casino-Trip-Report
the pictures are of two straight flushes, one dealt, one had four cards dealt which filled in. Finished up $3400 after a few hours of play including a little craps and then high-tailed it home. Didn't even stay over WOV Con folks, so forgive me.
Let me add that the same machines with 8/5 Bonus at $5 and up also have 9/6 Jacks. I dont think there is anything but 9/5 DDB there. But I think there is 9/6 Triple Double Bonus but as you know you get even money for two pair and a reduced pay for three of a kind.
Quote: tringlomaneWhat CET property had 8/6 JoB for quarters? Did you mean 8/5?
I have no idea what the paytable was and I could be wrong, but it's against my being to play a -EV VP machine, so I don't have the exact figures.
If you're comp-whoring I suggest what tring said. Play at Boyd properties such as Gold Coast, or Palms if you want FPDW. There is one machine out of the FPDW row that has the setting on very fast..... I won't tell you which one.
Caesers is hell for VP players, as well as BJ last time I played. They are definitely for a different type of crowd from myself. When you see table max amounts of $20,000 on a regular table it starts to get pretty real lol. I remember having to turn off their double up feature, I bet that's taken out now too with the whole scandal.
If you want good VP with good access to the casino closest to the strip from shuttles definitely look into Gold Coast. You can shuttle from Boyd properties, or CET properties and get dropped off at the Rio. Hell you can even take the Palms shuttle from Forum Shops if you need to get there bad.
Oh and Alan nice tr! Must be awesome to be in driving distance to vegas. I'm attempting to run up my free play on the job machine at ceasers. Hope to break even, and hit a royal. Would be a nice bankroll boost. ADT will plummet but I don't play that high anyway.
Two months ago, the same weekend I hit my $20K royal in the "small dome room" there was a young man playing two machines next to me simultaneously. I mean he was like a piano player with both hands, all fingers, working the buttons like the keys on a piano.
He told me he was a computer software designer. He played lightning fast $10 9/6 Jacks or Better. After about eight hours of non stop play (except when he hit quads which was a $1250 W2G at $10) he finally got his $40,000 royal. And after they handled him two big blocks of $100 bills (all cash payout) which he put into his backpack, he told me he was still down about $120-thousand on the year.
I don't understand the guy playing JoB neither. Playing more hands of -EV = -EV. This is similar to people playing 2 bases on BJ, unless they are counting. Getting to 7 Star might be one reason but I heard it's invite only and VP players don't give enough "juice" to get there anyway. If a player has that much knowledge and skill he would stay as far away from any -EV VP.
Quote: WizardThe Rio has 9-6 Jacks. However, I hear they only accumulate base reward credits at a fraction of the normal rate
Fwiw, in AC, I believe the accumulation at 9/6 is exactly half of other VP.
Quote: djatcThe reason why I don't understand that is the reason why I am single lol. Sometimes the ends justify the means, more so when money's involved.
I don't understand the guy playing JoB neither. Playing more hands of -EV = -EV. This is similar to people playing 2 bases on BJ, unless they are counting. Getting to 7 Star might be one reason but I heard it's invite only and VP players don't give enough "juice" to get there anyway. If a player has that much knowledge and skill he would stay as far away from any -EV VP.
I think he did it because he could. He had the physical ability, the mental ability and the financial ability. Did he make mistakes playing two games at once? I dont know, I was busy playing my own single machine to watch his play. He certainly was 7Stars and I saw his cards in the machines. The comp points can be converted to free play or "value cards" such as gas cards or department store gift cards.
video poker is a great way to rack up tier points and comp points because you have a chance to make your money stretch and as I wrote about in my TR when you play table games you are at the mercy of the floorman. Look what happened to me -- he had me down for a $39 average bet and I had $250 or more on the table.
And there is no mystique in getting 7stars. If you have the play, and you pay your markers, and you don't pick fights with dealers, you'll be 7stars.
edited to add: All total rewards casinos use the SAME formula for tier scores: $10 of any video poker gets one tier point. $5 of any slot gets one tier point. Now, there might be different values assigned to comps but not for tier scores and tier scores get you 7stars, diamond, etc.
Quote: ahiromuFwiw, in AC, I believe the accumulation at 9/6 is exactly half of other VP.
I get 1 point per $10 in 9/6 job even the progresive @ czr ac
Quote: whatmeI get 1 point per $10 in 9/6 job even the progresive @ czr ac
It seems that any non-Vegas CET property is more competitive in retaining customers. You can get yourself into an almost break even machine in AC or other areas.
Quote: AlanMendelsonI think he did it because he could. He had the physical ability, the mental ability and the financial ability. Did he make mistakes playing two games at once? I dont know, I was busy playing my own single machine to watch his play. He certainly was 7Stars and I saw his cards in the machines. The comp points can be converted to free play or "value cards" such as gas cards or department store gift cards.
video poker is a great way to rack up tier points and comp points because you have a chance to make your money stretch and as I wrote about in my TR when you play table games you are at the mercy of the floorman. Look what happened to me -- he had me down for a $39 average bet and I had $250 or more on the table.
And there is no mystique in getting 7stars. If you have the play, and you pay your markers, and you don't pick fights with dealers, you'll be 7stars.
edited to add: All total rewards casinos use the SAME formula for tier scores: $10 of any video poker gets one tier point. $5 of any slot gets one tier point. Now, there might be different values assigned to comps but not for tier scores and tier scores get you 7stars, diamond, etc.
I guess there is EV in the bonuses you get as a 7star if you can afford it. $1.5m coin sounds like a lot in theory but on a 99.54% machine theoretically only costs $6,900, and that's not including the tier bonuses. Going off of the bonus table on TR you can earn 6,125 points extra per 2,500 points (If I'm interpreting this right, it could be 500 + 1000 + 2500 instead of 2,500 altogether) in a day. That's $25,000 coin-in a day for about 180 days. Sounds like a lot but only an hour on a $5 machine playing 1000 hands/hr.
If you're getting decent freeplay and RFB offers it would even out. If you can pull this off in AC or other cities you can get this for much cheaper on a 99.96% APDW or DDB. It is interesting to see the +EV play of high VP play, as I'm stuck to quarters for a very long time for now.
Quote: djatcIt seems that any non-Vegas CET property is more competitive in retaining customers. You can get yourself into an almost break even machine in AC or other areas.
Consider the average gambler on the Strip. I really can't say I blame CET here.
Quote: JIMMYFOCKERGet to Tahoe
Does Harrah's/Harvey's Lake Tahoe have anything better than full pay JOB? I just consulted VPFree2.com in case something had changed, as I haven't been over the hill (from CC) since the Fall... To my knowledge, that's the best you're gonna get outside of a high progressive... What do you like there?
Play the triple-play $1 JOB there, one of the easiest ways for anyone who isn't yet a Diamond member to reach such status, as two back-to-back 70 minute sessions on separate days will earn one Diamond status.Quote: camaplDoes Harrah's/Harvey's Lake Tahoe have anything better than full pay JOB? I just consulted VPFree2.com in case something had changed, as I haven't been over the hill (from CC) since the Fall... To my knowledge, that's the best you're gonna get outside of a high progressive... What do you like there?
Do you think it's worth going for Seven Stars?Quote: JIMMYFOCKERPlay the triple-play $1 JOB there, one of the easiest ways for anyone who isn't yet a Diamond member to reach such status, as two back-to-back 70 minute sessions on separate days will earn one Diamond status.
No, not there.Quote: teddysDo you think it's worth going for Seven Stars?
Okay, let me rephrase that. Do you think it's worth going for Seven Stars anywhere?Quote: JIMMYFOCKERNo, not there.
Yes, of course.Quote: teddysOkay, let me rephrase that. Do you think it's worth going for Seven Stars anywhere?
Quote: JIMMYFOCKERYes, of course.
I don't think 7 stars itself is worth more than $2500. If you can do it at a place where you can get a huge ADT, that ADT is worth much more than 7 stars.
This of course leaves out the great perks of 7*.
Good answerQuote: ClarkWGriswoldOver the course of 12 months, if you received $200 a month free play, it wouldnt be a terrible play, as you're EV is only 1/2 percent.
This of course leaves out the great perks of 7*.
Quote: ClarkWGriswoldOver the course of 12 months, if you received $200 a month free play, it wouldnt be a terrible play, as you're EV is only 1/2 percent.
This of course leaves out the great perks of 7*.
The important thing to remember is that you can get $200 mailers without being 7 Stars. One Harrah's sends me $800 a month free play and I am only diamond. The amount sent does don correlate to card level, just to ADT.
Without being a 7 star member, would have never won $10,000 drawing in Council Bluffs.Quote: DRichThe important thing to remember is that you can get $200 mailers without being 7 Stars. One Harrah's sends me $800 a month free play and I am only diamond. The amount sent does don correlate to card level, just to ADT.
Quote: JIMMYFOCKERWithout being a 7 star member, would have never won $10,000 drawing in Council Bluffs.
That's definitely what would sway it for me if I had the time and money to go for 7 stars: all the events and promotions that are 7 stars only. Plus, the discounted point-to-cash conversion rate...
