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billryan
billryan
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
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September 8th, 2021 at 11:26:51 AM permalink
Quote: DJTeddyBear

Quote: Mission146

Aside from a few weird outliers (Fee/Ante Blackjack) poker is the one game where the casino takes some amount of all monies bet regardless of the result.

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    Parimutuel racing is another example where the house always wins.

    A poker tourney with a guarantee that fails to meet its minimum is the reverse - the house losing regardless of the final outcome.


    But that Paul Newman quote does say it all.

    A dollar won IS twice as sweet …
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    I guess it depends on what you call winning. Yonkers had pari-mutual betting for years but couldn't cover its weekly nut. Only after it got permission to operate a racino was it profitable
    Last edited by: unnamed administrator on Sep 8, 2021
    Mission146
    Mission146 
    Joined: May 15, 2012
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    September 8th, 2021 at 1:00:14 PM permalink
    Quote: TDVegas

    Quote: Mission146

    Quote: TDVegas

    Unless you are a poker sharp or have somehow been able to count cards for blackjack under the radar…everyone gambles for entertainment. They may not want to admit that, but that’s simply ego. No one wants to be thought of as one of the schnooks in the casino…even though they are.

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    What? Are you saying that there are only two forms of advantage play? Poker or card counting blackjack?
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    Generally speaking, yes.
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    Extremely generally speaking.
    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
    lilredrooster
    lilredrooster
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    September 8th, 2021 at 2:01:05 PM permalink
    __________


    "Dopamine is a type of neurotransmitter. Your body makes it, and your nervous system uses it to send messages between nerve cells. That's why it's sometimes called a chemical messenger. Dopamine plays a role in how we feel pleasure

    Often the most common releases of dopamine come from food and sex, which are evolutionary mechanisms that keep the species going by inspiring our desire to eat and to procreate

    But dopamine also comes from other activities, gambling being one of them

    The dopamine high works in that it is released when something pleasurable happens unexpectedly. This can be a caused by some intense sex or winning at a casino game

    The degree of excitement to winning at the roulette wheel and in a game of craps might release the necessary dopamine and endorphin to beat the best sex you’ve ever had

    One of the risks of the dopamine high, is that you keep looking for the next thrill, hence why thrill seekers are looking for the next extreme experience to satisfy their addiction"



    this quote, I believe, applies most directly to compulsive gamblers
    but I believe it also can apply to gamblers who are not ruining their lives gambling but have managed to control their thrill seeking
    many, I believe, are not primarily motivated by winning money, but are motivated by getting a chance to get a thrill
    winning money can be thrilling because whether we win or lose is so closely tied in to our egos and our self esteem
    for many very experienced gamblers - and likely for APs - this does not apply
    but APs are humans too - if they experience a very large win - an outlier - it likely applies to them too

    and it applies to me
    I gamble but there's no way I'm going make bets large enough to have a dramatic impact on my financials - whaling is not for me
    but when I do win I get enjoyment - probably not a large amount of dopamine is released, but some is, I would presume




    .
    Last edited by: lilredrooster on Sep 8, 2021
    "𝘣𝘦𝘭𝘪𝘦𝘷𝘦 𝘩𝘢𝘭𝘧 𝘰𝘧 𝘸𝘩𝘢𝘵 𝘺𝘰𝘶 𝘴𝘦𝘦 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘯𝘰𝘯𝘦 𝘰𝘧 𝘸𝘩𝘢𝘵 𝘺𝘰𝘶 𝘩𝘦𝘢𝘳"______Edgar Allan Poe
    DRich
    DRich
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    Thanks for this post from:
    Mission146
    September 8th, 2021 at 2:27:37 PM permalink
    Quote: Mission146

    My one goal in a casino is to win. I also enjoy figuring out the different potential advantages that might be had as well as the conditions for playing certain things. In my opinion, figuring it all out is more fun than the actual playing.



    I concur 100%. Playing is not fun, solving is fun when you have solved for an advantage.
    Order from chaos
    FastEddie
    FastEddie
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    September 8th, 2021 at 2:33:34 PM permalink
    Quote: billryan

    Quote: DJTeddyBear

    Quote: Mission146

    Aside from a few weird outliers (Fee/Ante Blackjack) poker is the one game where the casino takes some amount of all monies bet regardless of the result.

  • link to original post

    Parimutuel racing is another example where the house always wins.

    A poker tourney with a guarantee that fails to meet its minimum is the reverse - the house losing regardless of the final outcome.


    But that Paul Newman quote does say it all.

    A dollar won IS twice as sweet …
  • link to original post






    I guess it depends on what you call winning. Yonkers had pari-mutual betting for years but couldn't cover its weekly nut. Only after it got permission to operate a racino was it profitable
  • link to original post




    The think the losses were only on paper. Yonkers survived since 1899. An example of accounting Magic goes like this. MGM CASINOS. buys Yonkers fot $850 million fron the Rooney family in 2019. Then they sold it to REIT MGM growth properties fot $625 million. An immediate paper loss $225 million. Oh
    Then MGM leased property back for $50 million a year.
    I remember when The Maryland Racing commision forced Pimlico to spend $12 million from breakage that Pimlico was pocketing the interest from instead of using that money for track improvements. So Pimlico bought 6 houses on Rogers Ave and tore them down for a parking lot to charge race goers to park then at $10 per car.
    Last edited by: unnamed administrator on Sep 8, 2021
    lilredrooster
    lilredrooster
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    September 8th, 2021 at 3:02:46 PM permalink
    Quote: DJTeddyBear

    Parimutuel racing is another example where the house always wins.




    not quite always
    if there is a monster horse and enough is bet on him it can create a minus pool
    this is because the track is required by its regulations to pay out a minimum 5% profit (in WVA it's 10%) on any bet

    if they didn't have this requirement the bettor could win his bet but still lose money

    because of this, in some few races, at least in the show or place pools, the track literally gets creamed

    but I wouldn't recommend having any sympathy for racetracks and their Execs and investors

    in the scheme of things, the above is a tiny thing


    .
    "𝘣𝘦𝘭𝘪𝘦𝘷𝘦 𝘩𝘢𝘭𝘧 𝘰𝘧 𝘸𝘩𝘢𝘵 𝘺𝘰𝘶 𝘴𝘦𝘦 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘯𝘰𝘯𝘦 𝘰𝘧 𝘸𝘩𝘢𝘵 𝘺𝘰𝘶 𝘩𝘦𝘢𝘳"______Edgar Allan Poe
    billryan
    billryan
    Joined: Nov 2, 2009
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    September 8th, 2021 at 3:37:10 PM permalink
    Quote: FastEddie

    Quote: billryan

    Quote: DJTeddyBear

    Quote: Mission146

    Aside from a few weird outliers (Fee/Ante Blackjack) poker is the one game where the casino takes some amount of all monies bet regardless of the result.

  • link to original post

    Parimutuel racing is another example where the house always wins.

    A poker tourney with a guarantee that fails to meet its minimum is the reverse - the house losing regardless of the final outcome.


    But that Paul Newman quote does say it all.

    A dollar won IS twice as sweet …
  • link to original post






    I guess it depends on what you call winning. Yonkers had pari-mutual betting for years but couldn't cover its weekly nut. Only after it got permission to operate a racino was it profitable
  • link to original post




    The think the losses were only on paper. Yonkers survived since 1899. An example of accounting Magic goes like this. MGM CASINOS. buys Yonkers fot $850 million fron the Rooney family in 2019. Then they sold it to REIT MGM growth properties fot $625 million. An immediate paper loss $225 million. Oh
    Then MGM leased property back for $50 million a year.
    I remember when The Maryland Racing commision forced Pimlico to spend $12 million from breakage that Pimlico was pocketing the interest from instead of using that money for track improvements. So Pimlico bought 6 houses on Rogers Ave and tore them down for a parking lot to charge race goers to park then at $10 per car.
  • link to original post



    Yonkers was closed for several years. It came very close to being sold to developers for housing but the community was against it and the Rooneys didn't need the money. They would have preferred opening the casino without resuming racing, as I was told. Roosevelt Raceway and Parr Meadows are two local tracks that went belly up.
    DJTeddyBear
    DJTeddyBear
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    September 8th, 2021 at 3:50:11 PM permalink
    Quote: billryan

    I guess it depends on what you call winning. Yonkers had pari-mutual betting for years but couldn't cover its weekly nut. Only after it got permission to operate a racino was it profitable

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    Yeah, I was talking about the initial win. I’m well aware that many racetracks are struggling with the bottom line.
    I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ ————————————————————————————————————— Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
    FastEddie
    FastEddie
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    September 8th, 2021 at 4:47:01 PM permalink
    Like I said in another thread I love a good con. Like racrtracks never giving a bettor and even break. Charging for parking and admission. Every food item and cigarettes overpriced. Etc. And then after doing that for 100 years or more a casino opens in thier territory. So then they get the state legislature to share the
    Taxes on casinos with them. Because Horse Racing must be protected at all times. Until the property the race track sets on becomes too valuable. Or use the track to become a racino then close the tack track. A sweet con indeed ! !!
    billryan
    billryan
    Joined: Nov 2, 2009
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    September 8th, 2021 at 6:55:21 PM permalink
    NYC Off Track Betting was shut down after losing money for thirty years or more. They even had a 5% surcharge but couldn't generate revenue to cover rents and payroll.
    The City got tired of subsidizing betting parlors while schools were using gyms and restrooms for classes.

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