Trip Report May 23 - 27

I received an invitation to the Harrah's Desert Drivers Golf Tournament. It was a superball event, with the teams being randomly built based on USGA handicaps. Tournament was on Tues., 25th, so I flew out on Sunday. My youngest daughter, 24, went with me and we stayed at the RIO. I have stayed at the RIO before, and have been very happy, but not so much this time.
We arrived Sunday about 11:00 AM. One of the roughest final approaches I have been on. It was very windy, and we were getting tossed around pretty good. Went to Diamond Registration. It only took about 5 minutes, and we were on our way to the 32nd floor, Masquarade Tower. I was expecting the big suite experience again, with the separate double bowl sink sitting area and large bathroom. Not what we got. It was a very small bathroom, the kind where the door hits your knees when you are sitting on the commode. It was nice enough, but SMALL, and not at all what I was expecting. The air handler was very loud. When the air conditioning would kick in, the blower would go into high speed. This woke me up every @#$$%*&^(*& time. I tried setting the system to have the blower on LOW speed all the time to create constant white noise, but the damn thing would still kick into high speed when the air came on, and then go back into Auto mode. (This turned out to be a bigger deal than I realized, as it was directly responsible for me getting less than 10 hours of sleep over the 5 days we were there.) Also, the Show in the Sky was on hiatus all week :-(, so my daughter did not get to experience that either.

It was very windy Sunday, so we decided to wait until Monday to do the SkyJump at the Stratosphere. Walked around RIO, played some $10 craps (+500) and played some slots. We ate at VooDoo Steakhouse Sunday night, and then tried to go out on the 51st deck Lounge, but it was seriously cold out there. Ended up back at the $10 craps table where I gave some of the 500 back to them. They raised the min to $15, and everyone had to play the new minimum. BOO! About 1:00 AM (been up for 23 hours due to time change) tried to go to bed, but by 4:30 AM had enough of not being able to sleep more than 15 minutes between interruptions, and went down to play $10 craps (Since this will be a recurring item, I will assign the acronym, TGDACUNIT, to shorten this post.)
Lost about 700 in an hour, so went back to room and got my daughter up to help me at the table. She came down, and helped me get back to even for the trip. Good daughter!

It was 9:00 AM when we decided to head for strip, but the shuttle doesn't start until 10:00, so we decided to try the walk through the parking lot and into the back side of Ceasar's. It wasn't a bad walk, but it was really confusing trying to get into Ceasar's. We ended up coming in by the aquarium way in the back of the Forum shops. Daughter got 1/2 price TIX to LOVE, the Beatles. We walked to Mirage so she could get her assigned seat. I played $10 craps while she did her ticket, and ended plus 125 after 20 min. We used the new kiosks to purchase a 3 day ACE/DEUCE pass ($15), and rode the ACE to the Stratosphere. (The ACE was weird, in that no one ever asks to see your ticket. Seems like they are going to use some sort of automated system that may not be installed yet? )
Purchased our SkyJumps, but had to wait until 12:30 to make the jump, so headed to the craps table to kill the hour.
Daughter and I were only 2 on the table initially, and after making a couple of dealer bets, the box asked me if I had a player card. I replied I did not, but would only be playing for a short time as we were killing time before our jumps. I hit a couple of nice dealer payouts, ended up putting about $60 in the box for them, and when we cashed out, I was up $10, so I gave it to the dealers.( I was playing $5 PL/10X odds, with 1 CB/10x odds, and betting $32 to $85 inside.) We made our jumps, and IT WAS AWESOME!!!! I do not have any fear on this ride. You are so strapped and tethered that there is very little that can go wrong. The ride that shoots you over the edge? That scares the hell out of me. I will say that standing on the platform, and looking down at the itty bitty dot below you that you know is 20' across, is disconcerting. You also know there is a guy standing in that dot, and you cannot see him! Best $99 I have EVER spent in Vegas. I will do it again in Sept.
After the jump went back to the craps table. Again it was empty until we started playing. This time nothing was working. No dealer bets were getting paid, and I was bleeding money. After 20 minutes a lady comes up to me and introduces herself as a player host, and asks me if I am sure I wouldn't like a player's card. She tells me that the box says you are playing high enough to get some nice comps, and said she would comp us for any meals we cared to eat.
I got the card, but we did not eat there. Ended up losing 700 there. Love their 10x odds, and the field was 3X on the 12, but the 4/10 vig is paid up front. I don't care for those numbers, so it wasn't that big a deal to me. I will go back to the Stratosphere to play craps next trip, and will plan for dinner at Top of The World, which should be comp'd.
So we get back to RIO late afternoon, and Beatles show is 9:30 PM I think. We pigged out at the Seafood Buffet and then laid down for a nap. TGDACUNIT keeps me awake. Play some craps and slots. I am at the craps table about 6:30 PM when I notice that I must checkin, IN PERSON, at the Imperial Palace by 7:00PM for the golf tournament. Run out to the Taxi stand and get a ride to IP, get checked in, and because they gave me a gym bag gift, I need to catch a shuttle back to RIO to drop it in room. By the time I get ready, it is too close to show time for us to shuttle back to strip, so we head back to Taxi stand. Guy at the stand looks at my bright orange Hawaiian shirt and says, "That must be a popular shirt. A guy with one just like it came through an hour ago." That was too funny. We take a Taxi to Mirage. I must give props to the Taxi drivers. I asked them to keep us off the strip, and they all did a great job at bringing us in through back streets. The tips more than made up for their lost fares.
We kill time at Mirage, but once she goes to show, I start playing $10 craps. They raise the table to $15 after an hour, but I get to stay at the $10 min. Nicely done MGM/Mirage! Played in a range from -200 to +150 for over 2 hours, but a bad run in the last 20 minutes before the show ended, left me down 225.

So after 2 days, I am about 1000 down, due mostly to two bad sessions. I have had more winning sessions, but all less than 200. Tuesday was golf at RIO SECCO. I won $200 in a driving contest. We did some more strip wandering Tues night and took in the Bellagio water show. I wanted to see Carrot Top, but he was dark on Tuesday. My daughter had a college friend who is working at ARIA, so we decided to do that on Wed., instead of going to Freemont St. We spent most of Wed at the RIO pool, and playing craps and slots. Was up about 800 in the morning, but gave it back by the time we headed to ARIA. ARIA has some eye catching design work, but man is it confusing to move around in. Circular rooms confuse me. Played $10 craps for an hour, and lost about 500. Went to the club with my daughter and her friend. About 1:00 AM left them and went back to craps table. Still $10. Girl on the other end of the table was on a roll. New player, and you never knew if she would keep her throw on our table or the one 40' from us, but man did she hit some points. I think she made 4 points for me, and I know she had made at least 3 points before I got in on it. Got my 500 back, but alas, ended up leaving at 2:30 AM down $250. Took a taxi back to RIO.
Tried to play some craps at RIO, but MORONS were out in force. One guy would press his place bets up twice, then take them back to min, then take them down, then put them back up. The other guy would place 3 bets, and then after every roll, he would have the dealer move the bets to different numbers. EVERY FREAKING ROLL! It would not have been so bad if he had known when he needed to add the extra $2 for the 6/8, but you know he had no clue. So the game got wicked choppy, and hands were always in the tub.
Decided to get some sleep, but TGDACUNIT had other ideas. I've had less than 4 hours of shuteye in 4 days at this point, with the best sleep I have gotten at the pool.
I played more craps on Thursday and then headed home. There were a couple of decent rolls, but none was good enough to get me back to square. I did come home with some of my BR, but it was not pretty. To make it worse, I came down with a cold, and spent 5 hours on the plane hacking up a lung. Got in at midnight east coast time, and slept like a baby until 10:00 AM. Got caught up on some of my work I had missed all week, only to see my HD crash at the end of the day, costing me about 3 months worth of work. UGGGGGHH. So I spent my holiday weekend with a nasty cold, and fretting over all the work I am going to have to do to rebuild my workstation and recreate the lost data this coming week.

Quote: RaleighCraps

I played more craps on Thursday and then headed home. There were a couple of decent rolls, but none was good enough to get me back to square. I did come home with some of my BR, but it was not pretty. To make it worse, I came down with a cold, and spent 5 hours on the plane hacking up a lung. Got in at midnight east coast time, and slept like a baby until 10:00 AM. Got caught up on some of my work I had missed all week, only to see my HD crash at the end of the day, costing me about 3 months worth of work. UGGGGGHH. So I spent my holiday weekend with a nasty cold, and fretting over all the work I am going to have to do to rebuild my workstation and recreate the lost data this coming week.

Nice TR. Thanks for the read.

That sucks big time about the lost files. I'd like to make a suggestion for the future though, using something like Jungle Disk to backup your files to the cloud for a couple bucks a month is well worth it!

Thanks man, it's always nice to live vicariously through someone else. On your hard drive... you could bring it into someone. I mean three month's worth of work? Someone, somewhere, should be able to get you something back.

I was wondering if you were off on a trip. That's some kind of hitting the Craps tables, must have been fun.

And I don't need to chime in too, but I have learned not to store everything on the C drive. Gotta have that somewhere else too. I just upload to a great deal I have on some online storage.

Good report.

I travel a lot for work (6-10 days a month) and when I get into a room I immediately check out the A/C unit to make sure it works and is not too noisy (I also check out shower to see if it leaks). I would have asked for a different room or to at least have maintenance come up.


Sorry to hear about your hard drive. I agree that a local computer wiz should be able to recover some/all of it. I use Mozy to back up my work on my home pc. It's like $5/month and cheaper if you pay in advance. Totally automatic and easy to use.

Roghaltz

A few other random thoughts on the trip....

During the last night session at the RIO after the MORONS left, there were only 4 or so of us at the table. One guy was betting something in the center of the table (maybe the horn) and the stick finally told him the better bet would be to bet the C/E. The stick took the time to show him the correct amounts to bet on the C/E and then walked him through how the same amount wagered would result in a better payout ($2 better I think). I don't ever make any of those bets, so I wasn't really paying attention to the details. My point being the stick was helping a player make a better bet.

Also, on Wed. morning I was at the table, and one of the dealers asked me if I was staying at the RIO. I replied I was, but was not that pleased with my room, that it was by far the worst room I had had at RIO. Conversation then went off in another direction. Two minutes later the boxman is at my side, asking me about the room problems, and if I had made a service request. He seemed genuinely interested in helping to resolve the problems and even called to arrange a maintenance visit (they found nothing wrong, which I knew would happen, since it was really more of a design issue).

|| I have been remiss in not making it clear the room issues are really my fault. I have every reason to believe if I had gone to the desk with my issues and requested a new room, I would have been given a new room. I did not do that for two reasons. The first was we were already unpacked and settled in, and I did not think the noise was really all that bad. It wasn't until the third day that I realized I was not going to get used to it, and by then, there is no point in changing rooms for another 1.5 days.

I had 2 sessions where I felt the box was not paying close attention to my betting. In both sessions, I had started out just placing the 6/8 for $24. At times I would play the inside,and sometimes I would get to the $25-$50 range on each number. On the second session a good run by a few shooters had me at $120 on each number when the roll ended.

After both of those sessions, I asked the box what they had for my average bet. The first session they had me at a $42 avg bet. I stated I felt that was overly low, and mentioned that while I had started low, for the past hour or more I was consistently higher than that, especially when you factored in the presses. After some discussion the box went back into the system and said he corrected me to a $114 avg. I saw him entering data on the box, but as to what exactly he entered, I have no idea.
For the second session, I was concerned because there had been a shift change about an hour prior, and just before I left he asked if my name was Richard. Since that is not me, I had reason to believe my rating may be incorrect. They had me for a $189 avg bet for that last session which was about right, but they had me for a 4 hour session, which meant they gave me credit for an hour that I was gone from the table.

If comp or rating is important to you, it ALWAYS pays to check when you exit a session.

Finally, I again was paying much closer attention to my payouts, and again, I found at least one incorrect payout at many of my sessions. Most of the errors were against me. I don't think this is anything other than skew at work, but it does seem like the number of errors is on the rise. However, I will admit that I never used to pay that much attention before, so I could have been receiving bad payouts in the past and just didn't notice it.
Here is the first error I found:
Point was 5, I had $10 PL and $40 odds. Point was made and I reached down to pick up my winnings. While doing so, I was calculating my win amount to be $60 + $10. My hand froze above the winnings when I saw only 1 green chip. I counted $45 in winnings, and I was redoing the math in my head when the dealer asked me if there was a problem. I don't want to say anything and be wrong so I said "I am redoing my math, but I think the payout is wrong". At that point the box jumps in with "He gets $70, not $45. You owe him a green." Problem easily corrected.

I had one other problem that was a bit stickier. This was at the RIO. I made a $10 come bet, point was 5, and I placed $30 in odds on top of the Come Bet prior to the dealer picking the bet up and putting it on the 5. (This was important to my recollection later on). Dealer change occurs, and the shooter messes up the place bets a few times. PL point is made, and I recall seeing my 5 CB point with $25 odds on it (I neglected to notice the missing $5). The shooter rolls a come out 7 winner. I lose my 5 CB, and the $25 odds are returned to me. Suddenly it hits me that I would not have had $25 in odds on a 5/9, and I recall having laid the $30 odds on the CB when it was still on the Come layout. However, this guy was not the dealer at the time, so he has no way of knowing. I explain to him why I know I had $30 in odds, and I agree with him, that yes, there was only $25 on the 5 when he pulled it down, but I KNOW the tape will show I had $5 more on that number. He explains the issue to the box, who tells him to give me the $5. Issue resolved in less than 30 seconds. When it comes to problems like this, I'm not sure if being a tipper helps, or just the fact that you obviously know the game, and know the right bet amounts, but it is nice to get quick resolutions.

Quote: RaleighCraps

A few other random thoughts on the trip....

During the last night session at the RIO after the MORONS left, there were only 4 or so of us at the table. One guy was betting something in the center of the table (maybe the horn) and the stick finally told him the better bet would be to bet the C/E. The stick took the time to show him the correct amounts to bet on the C/E and then walked him through how the same amount wagered would result in a better payout ($2 better I think). I don't ever make any of those bets, so I wasn't really paying attention to the details. My point being the stick was helping a player make a better bet.

What is the difference between C&E and the horn? I thought they were the same bet.

Isn't the payout different between the C&E v. Horn. C will pay 7 to 1 and E will pay 15 to 1, but the Horn you have a mix of 30 to 1, and 15 to 1. Plus The horn requires you bet 4 units, whereas the C&E bet requires 2 units. You can bet a $10 action on the C&E for a nickel each, but you can't bet the Horn for $10.

I noticed the same flaw witht he A/C at the Rio when I stayed there May 9/15, but it didn't bother me. I usually turn the A/C very low an hour or so before bedtime, then I turn it off (otherwise I get too cold).

Anyway, you may want to carry foam ear plugs around when you travel. They're usually sold at airports. I wear them when I want to sleep on the plane, but they're useful for other places with persistent noise, even with loud noises.

Regarding C&E vs Horn, the Horn's downside has to do with the fact that you lose on 3/4 of your bet when you win on 1. Whereas the C&E, you will lose on 2/4 of your bet when you win on 1. Of course, either way you have an 83.3% chance of losing all 4 bets, so you should just probably let it go.

As someone noted, the C&E bet only has to be made in 2-unit increments. But assuming that you are betting 4 units anyway, the C&E is generally divided between your bets. Thus 2 units are bet on C and 2 units are bet on E, unless you tell the dealers otherwise. Thus when a C is rolled, you lose your 2 units on E, and when an E is rolled, you lose your 2 units on C. With the Horn, there is 1 unit bet on each of the 2,3,11,12. Thus when a 2 is rolled, you lose the 3 other units.

Mathematically:
Betting 4 units on C&E (2 units each)
C = (7*2)-2 = 12
E = (15*2)-2 = 28

Betting 4 units on Horn (1 unit each)
2 = (30*1)-3 = 27
3 = (15*1)-3 = 12
11 = (15*1)-3 = 12
12 = (30*1)-3 = 27

Knowing that a 2 is rolled 1/36 of the time, 12 = 1/36, 3 = 2/36, 11 = 2/36, and losing everything is 30/36, you can multiply out and figure that your expected loss is 0.44 on the C&E and 0.50 on the Horn, thus making the C&E a very slightly better bet.

I know that most people play the Horn as a 5-unit bet, going high on one of the numbers. Depending on which number you choose, your expected loss becomes either 0.64 or 0.61. Making the same 5-unit bet on the C&E results in an expected loss of 0.56.

(All numbers are assuming a 30-1 payout on 2&12, 15-1 payout on 3&11, 7-1 payout on any craps.)

Someone please check my math. And if I'm right, I bring about the question of why the Horn bet is so popular given this information?

Quote: konceptum

Regarding C&E vs Horn, the Horn's downside has to do with the fact that you lose on 3/4 of your bet when you win on 1. Whereas the C&E, you will lose on 2/4 of your bet when you win on 1. Of course, either way you have an 83.3% chance of losing all 4 bets, so you should just probably let it go.

As someone noted, the C&E bet only has to be made in 2-unit increments. But assuming that you are betting 4 units anyway, the C&E is generally divided between your bets. Thus 2 units are bet on C and 2 units are bet on E, unless you tell the dealers otherwise. Thus when a C is rolled, you lose your 2 units on E, and when an E is rolled, you lose your 2 units on C. With the Horn, there is 1 unit bet on each of the 2,3,11,12. Thus when a 2 is rolled, you lose the 3 other units.

Mathematically:
Betting 4 units on C&E (2 units each)
C = (7*2)-2 = 12
E = (15*2)-2 = 28

Betting 4 units on Horn (1 unit each)
2 = (30*1)-3 = 27
3 = (15*1)-3 = 12
11 = (15*1)-3 = 12
12 = (30*1)-3 = 27

Knowing that a 2 is rolled 1/36 of the time, 12 = 1/36, 3 = 2/36, 11 = 2/36, and losing everything is 30/36, you can multiply out and figure that your expected loss is 0.44 on the C&E and 0.50 on the Horn, thus making the C&E a very slightly better bet.

I know that most people play the Horn as a 5-unit bet, going high on one of the numbers. Depending on which number you choose, your expected loss becomes either 0.64 or 0.61. Making the same 5-unit bet on the C&E results in an expected loss of 0.56.

(All numbers are assuming a 30-1 payout on 2&12, 15-1 payout on 3&11, 7-1 payout on any craps.)

Someone please check my math. And if I'm right, I bring about the question of why the Horn bet is so popular given this information?

Your math is correct. The lure of these bets is their relatively high variance, the standard deviations of both bets being more than double the bet amount. High variance means you require less luck to overcome the edge. If you tack on a "high 12" or "high 2", the SD is 2.39 times the amount of the bet, and you net $57 if it wins (on a $5 bet).

Of course, if you really want some high variance, the bet on 12 or 2 has an SD over five times the bet amount. However, betting a single number in double-zero roulette has an SD of 5.76 times the amount of the bet, along with a much lower HA.
Cheers,
Alan Shank

Quote: Nareed

I noticed the same flaw witht he A/C at the Rio when I stayed there May 9/15, but it didn't bother me. I usually turn the A/C very low an hour or so before bedtime, then I turn it off (otherwise I get too cold).

Anyway, you may want to carry foam ear plugs around when you travel. They're usually sold at airports. I wear them when I want to sleep on the plane, but they're useful for other places with persistent noise, even with loud noises.

That is a good suggestion Nareed. I have traveled a fair amount, and while I have had noisy air units before, I've never been affected to this extent. In the past I have been able to set the fan to one speed, and then not have to worry about it, as the consistent white noise eventually gets ignored.
That may have been my mistake. Instead of trying to set the fan to low speed, I should have set it to high speed. It would have been noisier, but perhaps it would have stayed at that same speed all night, and therefore would have become consistent white noise...... I also suspect I was coming down with this cold and so my body was out of sorts without my really knowing it at the time...

Hey RaleighCraps, quick question. When you were playing at the Stratosphere, did you ask them if they factored in your odds bet into your comp status? Back about a year ago, they told me that they rated up to 2x the odds. I wanted to know if they still do that.

Quote: konceptum

Someone please check my math. And if I'm right, I bring about the question of why the Horn bet is so popular given this information?

Check your math? Your fingers are as good as mine!
Popularity of the Horn bet? I've heard it described as The ability to make four bad bets at the same time.
In some areas of the country Center Bet action is big, really big. At most tables I've been at its rather modest and often non-existent.

Quote: FleaStiff

At most tables I've been at [Center Bet action is] rather modest and often non-existent.

Now that would be new for me to see. The lack of that action for a casino has to be as disappointing as it would be for people to quit playing slot machines. Not on the same level as far as total dollars maybe, but as far as wanting to offer Craps at all.

[edited]

Quote: gambler

Hey RaleighCraps, quick question. When you were playing at the Stratosphere, did you ask them if they factored in your odds bet into your comp status? Back about a year ago, they told me that they rated up to 2x the odds. I wanted to know if they still do that.

I did not ask them, but a player at the RIO told me they counted the odds in your rating, for what it's worth.
I'm going back in Sept., and I will try and find out then.

A/C problems? I'm surprised you didn't ask for a new room after the first night.

For what it's worth, I always travel with earplugs. Pick them up at CVS rather cheaply.

Quote: RaleighCraps

(The ACE was weird, in that no one ever asks to see your ticket. Seems like they are going to use some sort of automated system that may not be installed yet? )

It was reported in another thread that the ACE is on the honor system. And that makes sense since that makes it as fast as possible for boarding.

They occasionally have inspectors on board checking for tickets., and there are hefty fines for fare jumpers.

Quote: konceptum

...I bring about the question of why the Horn bet is so popular given this information?

Good question. Possibly because at $5 increments, the Horn High becomes a quick, easy bet. Also, having more stuff on the layout, provides more options, and more ways to lose. Casinos certaily want that!

You'll note that many on-line craps tables don't have the horn. Heck, Wiz' simulator doesn't even have C/E!

Quote: RaleighCraps

That is a good suggestion Nareed. I have traveled a fair amount, and while I have had noisy air units before, I've never been affected to this extent. In the past I have been able to set the fan to one speed, and then not have to worry about it, as the consistent white noise eventually gets ignored.

As you say there may have been other factors. But the foam plugs are still worth a try.

At a hotel in Reynosa my room faced a very loud night club which didn't let anyone sleep til 1 am (thank God for provincial laws that close things down too early). Since then I always carry plugs in my luggage.