Poll

29 votes (70.73%)
1 vote (2.43%)
11 votes (26.82%)

41 members have voted

buzzpaff
buzzpaff
Joined: Mar 8, 2011
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July 7th, 2011 at 8:55:19 PM permalink
One final thought. Would penny slots be in any casino if max bet was 5 cents ? Last I read average penny bet was 73 cents .
That was last year, probably surpassed 75 cents now, Making penny slots the equivalent of a 3 quarter slot, except with a higher
HE and higher entertainment level for most player,
$ 5 SD BJ will need a similar breakthrough and be impermeable to counters. And have jackpots to boot. Wish me luck !
buzzpaff
buzzpaff
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July 8th, 2011 at 7:32:18 AM permalink
Poll sure looks like 6-5 BJ is here to stay Any dissenters ??
ThatDonGuy
ThatDonGuy 
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July 8th, 2011 at 8:02:05 AM permalink
As long as people think they can count cards well enough to beat a 6-5 game, it's not going anywhere.

What I can see happening is, somebody "breaks ranks" by offering 3-2 if it includes - wait for it - a black Jack. The only problem is, dealers would have to be on the lookout for it. (An alternative could be, say, a 2-1 payout for a 2-card 21 when the dealer's up card is the Jack of spades or clubs; this one is much easier to spot.)
iwannaiguana
iwannaiguana
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July 8th, 2011 at 8:29:06 AM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

As long as people think they can count cards well enough to beat a 6-5 game, it's not going anywhere.

What I can see happening is, somebody "breaks ranks" by offering 3-2 if it includes - wait for it - a black Jack. The only problem is, dealers would have to be on the lookout for it. (An alternative could be, say, a 2-1 payout for a 2-card 21 when the dealer's up card is the Jack of spades or clubs; this one is much easier to spot.)



Trust me card counters are the last people who would ever consider stepping onto a 6-5 game (admittedly, with a big enough spread it is countable). 6-5 caters to the casual gamer who is just looking to have some fun and has no real concept of house edge. This is probably 90% of LV clientele. I have witnessed on many occasions 6-5 tables right next to 3-2 tables and the 3-2 tables are empty. Why would casinos ever consider taking away one of their biggest moneymakers when people still choose to play at them?

Even pay BJ is looking a lot more likely than bringing back 3-2.
FleaStiff
FleaStiff
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July 8th, 2011 at 9:00:32 AM permalink
There are some indications that a price war may be starting vis a vis disclosure of slot machine payout rates right there on the machine.

If this escalates in the slot machine area then blackjack will soon follow with disclosure information and "No 6:5 here" stuff.

The trouble is, this scenario is a long way off.

A half drunk fanny pack wearing gambler doesn't know or care about 6:5. Until more gamblers are sharpies, the casinos won't have to be honest. The margquees have letters a foot high trumpeting the 6:5 blackjack, why should they change any too soon.
Alan
Alan
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July 8th, 2011 at 9:06:59 AM permalink
I think a lot of people(majority) that visit Vegas are not gamblers per se, so they don't know any better(ignorant).
ThatDonGuy
ThatDonGuy 
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July 8th, 2011 at 12:24:41 PM permalink
Quote: iwannaiguana

Quote: ThatDonGuy

As long as people think they can count cards well enough to beat a 6-5 game, it's not going anywhere.


Trust me card counters are the last people who would ever consider stepping onto a 6-5 game


Exactly - people who know what they are doing wouldn't touch 6-5 with a 10-foot pole (any more than they would play, say, 7/5 Jacks or Better Video Poker). I am talking about the average Joe Lunchpail and Sally Soapopera who sees the movie "21" and thinks he/she can count.

The last time I was in Vegas, the single-deck games at New York New York were on the upper level, almost right next to the elevated walkway (from Excalibur and MGM Grand) entrance. Something tells me that is neither a coincidence nor aimed at anybody even remotely serious about gambling.
Tiltpoul
Tiltpoul
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July 8th, 2011 at 12:48:13 PM permalink
Quote: Alan

I think a lot of people(majority) that visit Vegas are not gamblers per se, so they don't know any better(ignorant).



Which is why I maintain that eventually, Ceasars will go to 1:1 BJ. They'll still offer 6:5, but those will be higher limits. Only in extremely high limits (100+) will you get to a 3:2 payout.

The new Caesars caters to the slot player. I can't tell you how often table game players get snubbed with RCs and other things, while slot play is looked at very highly. Every once in a while, I play a slot machine, as a way to kill time. It seems that gets me more attention than my $2.50 JoB (9/6) play, or my $25 a hand BJ.
"One out of every four people are [morons]"- Kyle, South Park
buzzpaff
buzzpaff
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July 8th, 2011 at 1:58:07 PM permalink
" I have witnessed on many occasions 6-5 tables right next to 3-2 tables and the 3-2 tables are empty. "

I have seen a carousel with 12 identical VP games except 6 paid 8-6 and 6 paid 7-5. 7-5 all filled up, 5 empty seats at 8-6.
Worse I have seen side by side identical $5 slots and one had a jackpot of $73,000 and the other was $27,000. I was at BJ table

6 hours and 80-90% play was at lower jackpot game.
seviay
seviay
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July 8th, 2011 at 6:58:01 PM permalink
Quote: buzzpaff

Poll sure looks like 6-5 BJ is here to stay Any dissenters ??


"What the American public doesn't know is what makes them the American public." As long as drunks and suckers (not necessarily mutually exclusive, btw) pervade in casinos, the casinos will continue to gouge them/us.

I constantly wonder what would happen if someone decided to build a "nice" but not extravagant strip property with reasonably-priced food and reasonable games -- i.e., full pay VP tables, single and double deck 3:2 BJ, etc. Couldn't a place like this theoretically build some loyalty among both strip-dwellers and those who currently prefer downtown? Design a decent rewards program, keep everything clean and nice, but cut all the superfluous Vegas-y things, and see if you can steal some of the middle tier players. Not everyone coming to Vegas wants to play $10k blackjack or baccarat in back rooms or have a $400 breakfast, nor do these people expect insane comps.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Vegas built on the concept of getting people to your casino with cheap (or affordable) food and reasonable payouts? Why wouldn't an updated version of this concept be successful today?

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