sakonmao
sakonmao
Joined: Jun 9, 2013
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June 9th, 2013 at 6:05:26 PM permalink
I wanted to know if anyone can help me with some information.


1) I learned that virtual table games are considered slots... so do they have a RNG and have a payback % like other slots?

2) What is a payback %? Is that when a slot machine is due and pays out a certain amount for the next player who sits?

3) Video poker has a return %/ payback %, which I don't quite understand. With optimal strategy, the video poker can get as much as over 100% however, I see some people lose money in these machine... so I don't understand how accurate that payback % is....?
DJTeddyBear
DJTeddyBear
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June 9th, 2013 at 7:10:15 PM permalink
1. They are considered slots primarily for taxation and reporting purposes. Often, jurisdictions that don't allow table games will allow these. Yes, they have an RNG. But all it's used for is to shuffle the deck of cards.

2. Payback % is similar to house hold but in reverse. No slot machine is ever "due".

3. The payback % is the amount paid back on average, and as you surmised, requires and is based upon perfect play.
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Asswhoopermcdaddy
Asswhoopermcdaddy
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June 9th, 2013 at 7:23:03 PM permalink
DJTeddy, is it true that the rating on virtual table games is worse than real table games? My experience at various casinos would suggest that the comp % is total CRAP on virtual tables.
sakonmao
sakonmao
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June 9th, 2013 at 7:41:09 PM permalink
Actually I think its the opposite the rating on virtual table games are much better since they are considered slots.

So my next question is how are slots regulated? If say a state law requires that slots cannot earn more than 20% from slots, does that mean the casinos can "set" a percentage of when to collect and when to payout?

For example, a virtual roulette wheel spits numbers via RNG. But the machine has paid out too much. It has paid out more than it has taken in. So to make up for it, the machine was set to earn 20% for the casino, therefore, any new players playing on the machine WILL lose at the virtual machine until the 20% has been reached.
cclub79
cclub79
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June 9th, 2013 at 8:04:11 PM permalink
Quote: sakonmao


For example, a virtual roulette wheel spits numbers via RNG. But the machine has paid out too much. It has paid out more than it has taken in. So to make up for it, the machine was set to earn 20% for the casino, therefore, any new players playing on the machine WILL lose at the virtual machine until the 20% has been reached.




Not if it's a fair RNG. It will just play out and eventually will get back to making money because of the HE.
Mission146
Mission146
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June 10th, 2013 at 6:53:29 AM permalink
Quote: sakonmao

I wanted to know if anyone can help me with some information.


1) I learned that virtual table games are considered slots... so do they have a RNG and have a payback % like other slots?



They effectively have a payback percentage, but in my understanding of Nevada law (at least) any virtual game that uses visual components that are meant to simulate actual physical implements (ex. cards, dice) must have the odds reflect the odds of the physical game. IOW, if you are playing Double-00 Roulette, the expected loss is 5.26%.

Quote:

2) What is a payback %? Is that when a slot machine is due and pays out a certain amount for the next player who sits?



I just checked my Thesaurus, the word, "Due," is still not synonymous with, "Myth," but it should be.

Quote:

3) Video poker has a return %/ payback %, which I don't quite understand. With optimal strategy, the video poker can get as much as over 100% however, I see some people lose money in these machine... so I don't understand how accurate that payback % is....?



It's still Video Poker, not Video ATM, with optimal strategy, even someone with an EV of over 100% can still suffer staggering short-run losses....and that's with perfect strategy. The slight mathematical advantage that those who play perfectly will enjoy is expected to approach the mean, over time.
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sakonmao
sakonmao
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June 10th, 2013 at 2:39:33 PM permalink
I don't kind understand the word "loose" slots. What does that mean? Is the payout/payback % better? Is that a change in the computer program of a particular slot to start issuing out better payback?
tringlomane
tringlomane
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June 10th, 2013 at 3:24:43 PM permalink
Quote: sakonmao

I don't kind understand the word "loose" slots. What does that mean? Is the payout/payback % better? Is that a change in the computer program of a particular slot to start issuing out better payback?



"loose" when referred to slots means the payout/payback %age is better than average. Most slot games have several payback settings that can be set at the casino's disposal. For things like penny slots, these will typically range between 85% and 95% payback. Slots truthfully quoted to be "loose" will be those set near the highest payback settings available for that machine. In the short term though, slots can do anything. You aren't guaranteed to win more money on a "looser" slot in any given gaming session.
djatc
djatc
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June 10th, 2013 at 3:25:55 PM permalink
Quote: Mission146

It's still Video Poker, not Video ATM, with optimal strategy, even someone with an EV of over 100% can still suffer staggering short-run losses....and that's with perfect strategy. The slight mathematical advantage that those who play perfectly will enjoy is expected to approach the mean, over time.



I remember playing on a FPDW machine and walking away $300 bucks out the hole and saying "WTF this is not full pay! My money!"
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sakonmao
sakonmao
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June 10th, 2013 at 4:16:49 PM permalink
I think that is what is confusing me.

I don't understand the purpose of a slot being set at an 85% or 95% range when in fact the slot can pay out whatever. Just as Mission stated earlier, even with perfect strategy you can still lose in the short run and it supposed to reflect an average. And as you said tringlomane there isn't a guarantee that in any given session that any one person can win and that "range" isn't reflected by the ending of the gaming day, week, or month.

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