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jsantee97
jsantee97
Joined: Mar 25, 2011
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July 18th, 2011 at 7:52:10 AM permalink
I have a question related to cash game poker and the casino chips used at the table. While observing some cash games (mostly 1-2 NL, 3-6 Limit and 2-5 NL) I noticed that dealers had $2, $3 and $4 poker chips in the trays at the various levels. I was curious to what the significances of these chips and what they are used for. It did not appear that the players had these chips in any significant quantity or really at all, so my best guess it that they are used for rake purposes. I was just curious and couldn't find any information via Google so you input is appreciated.
DJTeddyBear
DJTeddyBear
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July 18th, 2011 at 8:44:53 AM permalink
Some casinos use $2 chips at the $2/$4 limit games. It just makes things easier / quicker than having lots of $1 chips, or to have to constantly make change for $5 chips. Similarly, they'll use $20 chips at the $20 / $40 game. Some casinos also use $20 chips at Pai Gow tables, and set the minimum at $20.

When the poker room at Sands first opened, players could not re-buy at the table, so they devoted part of the rack to $2 chips which would be used for the rake. This was just to prevent the rake bucket from filling up with $1 chips too quickly. The $2 chips were marked "Rake only". However, they have since allowed people to re-buy out of the rack, so the $2 chips are gone. Turns out that most pots yield the max $5 rake anyway, so it's not that big an issue.
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? Note that the same could be said for Religion. I.E. Religion is nothing more than organized superstition.
Ayecarumba
Ayecarumba
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July 18th, 2011 at 10:24:46 AM permalink
Quote: jsantee97

I have a question related to cash game poker and the casino chips used at the table. While observing some cash games (mostly 1-2 NL, 3-6 Limit and 2-5 NL) I noticed that dealers had $2, $3 and $4 poker chips in the trays at the various levels. I was curious to what the significances of these chips and what they are used for. It did not appear that the players had these chips in any significant quantity or really at all, so my best guess it that they are used for rake purposes. I was just curious and couldn't find any information via Google so you input is appreciated.



You are correct. They are used mainly to color up before dropping the rake and bonus.
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NowTheSerpent
NowTheSerpent
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January 19th, 2012 at 4:15:57 AM permalink
Quote: jsantee97

I have a question related to cash game poker and the casino chips used at the table. While observing some cash games (mostly 1-2 NL, 3-6 Limit and 2-5 NL) I noticed that dealers had $2, $3 and $4 poker chips in the trays at the various levels.



I'd heard of $2 and $3 denoms, but isn't $4 overdoing it just a little? Would the bucket really fill that fast?
DJTeddyBear
DJTeddyBear
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January 19th, 2012 at 4:59:53 AM permalink
Quote: NowTheSerpent

I'd heard of $2 and $3 denoms, but isn't $4 overdoing it just a little? Would the bucket really fill that fast?

That might be for a $4/$8 game.

For the record, casinos sometimes make chips in all sorts of weird denominations. The $8 chip for Chinese New Year is pretty popular among Asian chip collectors, to the point where they generally aren't even circulated. I.E. You purchase them at the cage for face value.

Also, you can use ANY value chip at any game, provided it can be divided by what's in the dealer's rack. I.E. You can use a $20 chip at any game, but you can't use a $2.50 chip unless the dealer has other $2.50 chips or quarters in the rack.

Of course, every rule has an exception.

I recently saw a stack of $2.50 chips on a craps table. I was told that they can be used for half-unit betting - but only for toke bets.
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? Note that the same could be said for Religion. I.E. Religion is nothing more than organized superstition.
Tiltpoul
Tiltpoul
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January 20th, 2012 at 1:25:26 PM permalink
Quote: NowTheSerpent

I'd heard of $2 and $3 denoms, but isn't $4 overdoing it just a little? Would the bucket really fill that fast?



I think there could also be a slight issue of game protection in that area. It's easier for players to clearly see one chip being dropped for a rake, as opposed to multiple chips. I can't tell you how many times late in the evening I've seen an old table need a knife and supervisor to knock chips down in the drop box.

Atlantic City has it right (about the only thing they get right). They drop the rake into the tray, and it prevents continuous fills. I used to have a cool $2 chip from Hollywood Tunica that I used for a chip protector, but I lost it... :(
"One out of every four people are [morons]"- Kyle, South Park
DJTeddyBear
DJTeddyBear
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January 20th, 2012 at 1:36:52 PM permalink
Quote: Tiltpoul

Quote: NowTheSerpent

I'd heard of $2 and $3 denoms, but isn't $4 overdoing it just a little? Would the bucket really fill that fast?

I think there could also be a slight issue of game protection in that area. It's easier for players to clearly see one chip being dropped for a rake, as opposed to multiple chips. I can't tell you how many times late in the evening I've seen an old table need a knife and supervisor to knock chips down in the drop box.

Game protection / watching the rake isn't a problem.

The chips to be raked remain on the table, on top of the rake drop box, or in a circle, where they can easily be seen and counted. After the hand is over, and after the pot has been shipped to the winner, THEN the chips are dropped into the rake drop box.

Quote: Tiltpoul

Atlantic City has it right (about the only thing they get right). They drop the rake into the tray, and it prevents continuous fills.

Connecticut does it that way too.

In fact, Foxwoods goes one step further.

When the pull the extra $1 for the bad beat, the slip a "bad beat coupon" under the raked chips. When the hand is over, all the raked chips go into the dealer's tray, and the coupon goes into the cash drop.

These coupons are such a non-security risk that one time, when our table had only 2 coupons left and I was out of the hand, I went to the floor person for more. Instead of bringing them to the dealer, he just handed them to me.
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? Note that the same could be said for Religion. I.E. Religion is nothing more than organized superstition.
Tiltpoul
Tiltpoul
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January 20th, 2012 at 1:44:26 PM permalink
Quote: DJTeddyBear

Game protection / watching the rake isn't a problem.

The chips to be raked remain on the table, on top of the rake drop box, or in a circle, where they can easily be seen and counted. After the hand is over, and after the pot has been shipped to the winner, THEN the chips are dropped into the rake drop box.



Yeah, I should have clarified those two thoughts. I meant to add that game protection was only a slight issue. I don't think that's the reason at all... the MAIN reason is to keep the drop box from loading too much, so the floor doesn't have to be called over all the time to knock chips out of the way.

I will say that there are a LOT of dealers who drop before shipping the pot. I know there's a training issue there, but let's face it; poker dealers can get away with a lot more than general table game dealers. There's a guy at a casino I rarely play at who doesn't rake before a flop, like every other dealer does (and is supposed to). He has NEVER been corrected, and when I casually pointed it out to him during a tournament one time, he said 1) he wasn't aware he was supposed to, and 2) he wouldn't do it until corrected by staff. Right or wrong, OBVIOUSLY the cameras aren't too concerned with this, or else he would have known the FIRST time he did it.


Quote: DJTeddyBear

When the pull the extra $1 for the bad beat, the slip a "bad beat coupon" under the raked chips. When the hand is over, all the raked chips go into the dealer's tray, and the coupon goes into the cash drop.

These coupons are such a non-security risk that one time, when our table had only 2 coupons left and I was out of the hand, I went to the floor person for more. Instead of bringing them to the dealer, he just handed them to me.



I'm not sure how I feel about this. It's probably a good thing, since a dealer could "accidentally" send two down the chute easily. Again, I don't think it would happen a lot, but it could happen.
"One out of every four people are [morons]"- Kyle, South Park
zippyboy
zippyboy
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January 20th, 2012 at 5:36:43 PM permalink
I know the Strat drops in gray $4 chips. And I know at the opening of Aria they had $3 chips in circulation at their 1/3NL tables, but they were removed shortly afterwards, although they remained in use in their 9/18 limit games. $2 chips stay in regular use at Rio and Red Rock poker rooms.
"Poker sure is an easy game to beat if you have the roll to keep rebuying."

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