discflicker
discflicker
Joined: Jan 1, 2011
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April 2nd, 2018 at 9:02:58 PM permalink
Quote: beachbumbabs


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I'm convinced some hands are rigged, sometimes in my favor. Like I have junk in good positi
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I knew it! Ya think they do this to decrease cycle-time in tournaments and to assure bigger pots (for max ante) in sit-down play, like I suggested above? Now the important question... do you think they would do this in a real-money game?

Thanks for your input.
The difference between zero and the smallest possible number? It doesn't matter; once you cross that edge, it might as well be the difference between zero and 1. The difference between infinity and reality? They are mutually exclusive.
smoothgrh
smoothgrh
Joined: Oct 26, 2011
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April 2nd, 2018 at 10:41:52 PM permalink
I really don't think the games are rigged. I think that with online poker, you just see vastly more hands that you could possibly see in hand-dealt poker games. So it just *seems* like aces are appearing more often.

I've played with play money on pokerstars/fulltilt for a long time, and when I'm all in with a "race" situation, it seems to have evened out. Half the time my pocket pair holds up and half the time the player with the high cards pair the board. And same thing when I'm the one trailing.

The visits to the casino are fun because you occasionally see some long-odds luck. I've been dealt a pocket pair and made quads only once in a casino (and won a high-hand bonus!), whereas online I've made quads so many times, it almost feels common.
beachbumbabs
Administrator
beachbumbabs
Joined: May 21, 2013
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April 5th, 2018 at 4:26:57 AM permalink
Quote: discflicker

I knew it! Ya think they do this to decrease cycle-time in tournaments and to assure bigger pots (for max ante) in sit-down play, like I suggested above? Now the important question... do you think they would do this in a real-money game?

Thanks for your input.



I think they don't rig the real-money games, because they would be out of business fast if it ever came to light. Play money, why not let the users have fun, make interesting things happen.

However, I have ZERO experience playing on PS for real money, so JMHO.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
Romes
Romes
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April 5th, 2018 at 7:59:01 AM permalink
The free play tables at any site is a waste of time. Most people just stuff all in and if you just fold until you have a made hand you'll have a large advantage. It's definitely NOT a good skills check, in my opinion. Hell, online poker in general isn't a good skills check at any snapshot really. I'd say the only good skills check is for average to okay stakes ($25 buy in up to $500 buy in) and to prove you can beat the game over time. Like any other game there's variance and one could run good or bad for a little while.
Playing it correctly means you've already won.
onenickelmiracle
onenickelmiracle
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April 5th, 2018 at 12:38:31 PM permalink
Your opponent plays differently using fake money, as do you, so no.
In the land of the blind, the man with one eye is the care taker. Hold my beer.
gordonm888
gordonm888
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April 5th, 2018 at 3:09:44 PM permalink
As a hobby, I occasionally play WSOP Circuit poker tournaments at moderate stakes ($250 - 400 buy-ins). Some of these events are loaded with professional players and I have made a point of trying to understand the moves that professionals tend to use against amateurs.

1. The number one move of professionals in either cash games or tournaments, is based on the fact that most amateurs 'play scared' when faced with a very large bet. Pros make actions like these:
- aggressively raising or re-raising your opening bet
- in tourneys, aggressive play when everyone is close to the money bubble
- making large post-flop and turn bets to drive you out

to take advantage of the risk-aversion of less experienced players.

And that is exactly what you cannot learn in social (non-cash) poker games on the internet - you cannot simulate the emotional reaction you will feel when you bet $10 and your opponent raises you to $80. When you pay $300 to enter a tournament and the guy on your left keeps re-raising you 3X every time you put chips in the pot.

2. Another thing you cannot simulate by playing poker on-line (or by watching it on TV) is the art of "reading your opponent" in live poker games and of masking your own "tells."

3. There are some logistical issues with live-action poker that don't exist on-line and take some experience
- keeping track of the pot size - which is necessary for bet sizing
- ability to estimate your opponent's stack
- visibility issues, i.e., when you sit next to the dealer, and cannot see the player who is sitting on the other side of the dealer
- dealing with (and exploiting) mental fatigue in long tournaments
So many better men, a few of them friends, are dead. And a thousand thousand slimy things live on, and so do I.
discflicker
discflicker
Joined: Jan 1, 2011
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April 11th, 2018 at 1:38:44 PM permalink
Conclusions:

-They might rig the free on-line games
-Opponents play differently in free-play games
-Real live and for-money tournaments are different from free-play on-line play
-Doing well in free-play on-line does NOT make me a good tournament player
The difference between zero and the smallest possible number? It doesn't matter; once you cross that edge, it might as well be the difference between zero and 1. The difference between infinity and reality? They are mutually exclusive.
BadAtPoker
BadAtPoker
Joined: Oct 5, 2018
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October 5th, 2018 at 8:22:32 AM permalink
I found this thread interesting because of how I learned to play poker. I had actually learned Texas Hold’em when I was about 11 years old, but it was from age 16-18 that I really learned how to play the game. I played for play money on various sites (mostly pokerstars, but also partypoker, ultimate bet and absolute poker), wherever I could find freerolls that offered a small real money prize for top winners. My experience was this:

The play money ring games are a complete waste of time in terms of learning the game. If you find them entertaining then by all means log on and have some fun, but don’t expect to gain any real experience. The majority of players either shove all in every hand or call every hand, so there is no realism to it.

The tournaments, however, are a bit better. While you won’t typically run into great players (or ever good players), it seemed like most of the players were playing with an actual desire to win. Even though their strategies are basic, inconsistent, or downright bad, the fact that they really do want to end up as the winner creates a much more realistic environment than the ring games. Like someone else already said, the deeper you get into the multi-table tournaments the more realistic it becomes. I was able to begin to get a feel for things like: when should I use my chips for aggression and when should I sit back for a bit, how should I adjust my play as the blinds increase, etc. You WILL NOT BECOME A PRO by doing this, but I really do believe it helped me to get a feel for tournament poker without having to make any actual investment into the game. Eventually I turned 18 and it became legal for me to play with real money, and just after I turned 20 I won the Sunday Million tournament on pokerstars. So I have no regrets about all the time I spent playing freerolls to learn the game :)

One thing extra: while playing with free money I always had a couple real tables open (usually ring games). I payed very close attention to them, trying to figure out who won and who lost consistently (online poker was very new at the time, so the highest stakes ring games always had the same regular players. Btw at that time the biggest no-limit games were $3-6 blinds). Once I knew who were winners and losers I started to pay more attention to what cards they played and how they played them. Because you can open hand histories on any table you have open, whenever a hand went to showdown I could look at the history and see how the hand got played. For me this was a great opportunity to learn a bit of how to (and how not to!) play certain types of hands. I hope this helps!

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