MattUK
MattUK
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April 23rd, 2020 at 3:26:41 AM permalink
Quote: Gialmere

Apart from craps, why do you think dice games do so poorly in US casinos? Is there a dice game you've seen that you wish would become a Vegas standard?


Not that I am a Wizard, but I may have a suggestion. Dice games are my favourite because they are very easy to analyze. Every high school student should be able to do it. The best dice game I have ever seen is called Koobix. It's offered by some Italian online casinos. There are great many bets available and it's a good home work for highschoolers to calculate their house edge and find the winner. Overall the RTP ranges from 95.00% to 98.56%, thus beating Sic Bo hands down and simplifying Pass Line in Craps. For example they have 3.9x payout on 10 or 11 on rolling 3 dice. It really begs to go to 4x as a promotion on some days. Even better fun would be to enhance payout on one bet every week to over 99% but only listing payouts in help. That's my Baccaratkiller!
Last edited by: MattUK on Apr 23, 2020
Wizard
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April 23rd, 2020 at 10:30:19 AM permalink
Quote: MattUK

Not that I am a Wizard, but I may have a suggestion. Dice games are my favourite because they are very easy to analyze. Every high school student should be able to do it. The best dice game I have ever seen is called Koobix. It's offered by some Italian online casinos. There are great many bets available and it's a good home work for highschoolers to calculate their house edge and find the winner. Overall the RTP ranges from 95.00% to 98.56%, thus beating Sic Bo hands down and simplifying Pass Line in Craps. For example they have 3.9x payout on 10 or 11 on rolling 3 dice. It really begs to go to 4x as a promotion on some days. Even better fun would be to enhance payout on one bet every week to over 99% but only listing payouts in help. That's my Baccaratkiller!



I had a look for this game and all I could find was this video, evidently in Italian.



Can I trouble you to give me the rules in English, including the pays?

Thank you.

p.s. Questions closed for today's show.
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
MattUK
MattUK
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April 23rd, 2020 at 12:50:24 PM permalink
Happy to oblige! Koobix is a game created by Tuko Productions, a game developer from Italy. http://www.tukopro.com/en/about-2/ For any business, grab the nearest Italian and ask him to call on (+39) 0828 1776468. I have found them by learning the rules of Trente et Quarante which they also have, albeit without the insurance.
Fortunately Koobix is available on their website in English: https://tinyurl.com/yb8lml46
I had used your page on https://wizardofodds.com/gambling/dice/2/ to check the return on some of the bets. It proved to be extremely useful.
The best bet is on the sum of 6 dice to be 20 to 22. The return is (4221+4332+4221)*3.6/46656 = 45986.4/46656 = 2129/2160 = 0.985648148. I find it much nicer and adventurous than only 0.02% better Pass Line in Craps (through they don't have Odds).
Let me add that the game is reap for enhanced payouts during promotions or as a mistery weekly enhancement, as they can use virtually any payout they want (they choose to use up to 1 decimal point, eg. 3.6x above).
Last edited by: MattUK on Apr 23, 2020
Wizard
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April 24th, 2020 at 6:09:38 AM permalink
Quote: MattUK

Happy to oblige! Koobix is a game created by Tuko Productions, a game developer from Italy. http://www.tukopro.com/en/about-2/ For any business, grab the nearest Italian and ask him to call on (+39) 0828 1776468. I have found them by learning the rules of Trente et Quarante which they also have, albeit without the insurance.
Fortunately Koobix is available on their website in English: https://tinyurl.com/yb8lml46



Thanks. Here is a demo game.
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
Wizard
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April 24th, 2020 at 2:14:14 PM permalink
I just split off these posts from the Livestream thread, as I think this is worthy of its own thread.

As background, this is an Italian dice game with a whole host of bets. I linked to a demo game in the previous post. There are also some very badly-worded rules here.

I'll start this by asking about the three of a kind? Wins pay 2.6 for 1. The rules say it wins if there are three of the same dice face. However, what about 4, 5, or 6 of a kind? What about two three of a kinds? I assume these all win.

Assuming this is allowed, I get winning combinations of 6*COMBIN(6,3)*5^3+6*COMBIN(6,4)*5^2+6-COMBIN(6,2)*COMBIN(6,3) = 16956.

This would lead to a probability of 16956/6^6 = 0.363425926. Multiply that by 2.6 and you get an RTP of 94.49%.

However, the game help file say it is 95.49%. This implies 180 more winning combinations than I get.

What we clearly need is a third opinion. Can any of the big brains of the forum be that third opinion?

Here are some bets I did work out until I got stuck on the three of a kind.

Bet Pays Combinations Probability Return
Odd 1.95 23328 0.500000 0.975000
Even 1.95 23328 0.500000 0.975000
Total of 6 to 19 2.7 16941 0.363104 0.980382
Total of 20 to 22 3.6 12774 0.273791 0.985648
Total of 23 to 36 2.7 16941 0.363104 0.980382
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
MattUK
MattUK
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April 24th, 2020 at 2:39:08 PM permalink
To make things worse there is an emphasis on different "Tris". This may be indicative.

– Tris: three dice with the same face value
– Consecutive Tris: three dice with the same face value in adjacent positions
– Real Tris: three dice with the same face value and the same color.
– Consecutive real Tris: three dice with the same face value and the same color in adjacent positions

PS: I am sorry Wiz, but you seem to use wrong payout for Odd and Even sum of 6 dice! They use 1.9 for 95% return as they clearly show. They only use payouts up to 1 decimal point to avoid rounding 1 eurocent.
charliepatrick
charliepatrick
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Thanks for this post from:
MattUK
April 24th, 2020 at 2:50:46 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

...However, the game help file say it is 95.49%. This implies 180 more winning combinations than I get...


6 of a kind
6
6
5 of a kind
6x5x6
180
4 of a kind
6x5x5x15
2250
3 of a kind - twice
6x5/2 x 20
300
3 of a kind - once
6 x (5x5x5-5) x 20
14400

Total = 17136
Payout for all perms = 17136 * 2.6 = 44553.6
RTP = 95.494%
Wizard
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April 24th, 2020 at 3:12:06 PM permalink
Thanks Charlie. I forgot to include combinations for the five of a kind. Correcting that and the pay for even and odd, here is up my updated table.

Bet Pays Combinations Probability Return
Odd 1.9 23328 0.500000 0.950000
Even 1.9 23328 0.500000 0.950000
Total of 6 to 19 2.7 16941 0.363104 0.980382
Total of 20 to 22 3.6 12774 0.273791 0.985648
Total of 23 to 36 2.7 16941 0.363104 0.980382
Three of a kind 2.6 17136 0.367284 0.954938


Regarding the bets where color matters, let me first quote the rules, "The game is about the launch of 6 randomly chosen dice in 5 different colors:red, green, yellow, blue, white. The white die is a wildcard and replaces any other color. There are 6 dice for each colors (red, yellow,green, blue) and 1 white dice."

Where shall I start? Are the colors chosen with or without replacement? Does the wild nature of the white die apply to color only? For the royal three of a kind, would this win:

Blue 3
Blue 4
White 5
Red 1
Red 5
Yellow 6
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
MattUK
MattUK
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April 24th, 2020 at 4:45:43 PM permalink
It may be helpful to look on the claimed RTP for these bets, which are called RAINBOW and COMBO.

RAINBOW bet
The bet is to predict the total number of dice of a certain color extracted (remember that the white die is a wildcard).
At the top of the main window the player chooses the desired number. The selection in this area is mutually exclusive.
At the bottom of the page the player chooses the desired color. The selection in this area is mutually exclusive.

Dice Return RTP
0 6.30 96.52
1 2.10 92.89
2 2.20 95.03
3 5.30 94.63
4 30.30 96.24
5 444.00 96.27
6 24300.00 96.05

COMBO bet
The bet is to predict some characteristics of one of the six dice.
The player chooses the desired die in the left column. The selection in this area is mutually exclusive.
In the main window he chooses the feature to bet on:
– Value: the face value of the die is the one chosen.
– Color: the chosen die will be of the selected color. The bet on the white color is winning only if the selected die is white; the bet on the other colors is winning if the selected die is of the chosen color or white.
– Even / Odd: : the face value of the die is odd or even.
– Low / High: the face value of the die is low (1, 2, 3) or high (4, 5, 6).
Even / Odd, Low / High, Value selections are mutually exclusive.
Color selection is not binding and can be single or combined with one of the others.
All the following bets are therefore possible (as an example):
– The dice 3 is odd.
– The dice 3 is red.
– The dice 3 is green and it value is 6.
– The dice 3 is yellow and its value is low.

Bet Return RTP
One of the colors 3.40 95.20
White 23.80 95.20
Value 5.80 96.67
Value + Color 20.40 95.20
Value + White 142.80 95.20

Even / Odd 1.90 95.00
Low / High 1.90 95.00

E/O + Color 6.80 95.20
L/H + Color 6.80 95.20

L/H + White 47.60 95.20
E/O + White 47.60 95.20

PS: Ups, spaces are gone. :-( Sorry guys. I tried.
miplet
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April 25th, 2020 at 12:08:20 PM permalink
Here is my analysis of the Rainbow bet. I assume dice without replacement and White benefits the player. A roll of GBRRRW will pay for each of the following: 0Y 1Y 1G 2G 1B 2B 3R 4R

DicePaysCombosProbabilityReturn
06.3271320.1532015810.96516996
12.1783360.4423263690.928885375
22.2765000.4319593450.950310559
35.3316200.1785431960.946278938
430.356250.0317617170.962380011
54443840.0021682670.962710333
62430073.95257E-050.960474308
“Man Babes” #AxelFabulous

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