Game wheel donated: Need Info

I've shared before that i help manage a charitable gaming operation at a local school. You folks have been very helpful in helping answer gaming questions form time to time.

Recently, a person donated a used game wheel to the school. It's not a "Big six" or a dice wheel, as I am familiar with those. Rather, this is a whheel that has a series of numbers in each slot. Each slot has 5 numbers and they appear as say: 3 3 8 8 8, or 55511, or 66622 or, 99999. There are also 3 diamonds slots that pay 10 to 1 and 3 figure (/ sots that also pay 10 to one.)

Does anybody know the name of this game? I want to do some research on it to see what the odds and risks are before I put it in use. I have a picture if anybody wants it.


Thanks

Are the pays openly displayed on the wheel? It'd be easy enough to figure out if you want to post up a picture. If the pays aren't openly posted on the wheel, and you think the wheel is unbiased, just make your own pays for it and then you control the risk.

I have come to discover that the name of the game is called "The Big Nine Wheel". Anyone familiar?

Quote: DRich

Yepper, that is the wheel.

I am figuring the game works this way....Please jump in if you think I'm wrong.

There is a layout containing the numbers 1-9. The layout also has a spot for the diamond, the eagle and the star. If the wheel stops at say the star, the payout would be ten times whatever the wager is. So, if the player puts $5 on the star, and the star appeared on the wheel, he/she would be payed $50.

Likewise, with the numbers however, the payout would be determined by how many times the winning number appeared in the slot times the amount of the player's wager. For example, let's say a player put $5 wager on the #6 and, the slot containing the combination 6 6 6 8 8 appeared on the spin, the player would be paid $5 for each "six" in the slot or, $15.

Does that make sense?

Yes, that is exactly how I would assume it is played.

Quote: DRich

Yes, that is exactly how I would assume it is played.

Interesting...this game is not "random"

One would think all the numbers are equal. They are not!

1 = 23

2 = 25

3 = 24

4 = 25

5 = 25

6 = 26

7 = 25

8 = 28

9 = 24

Quote: Riva

Interesting...this game is not "random"

One would think all the numbers are equal. They are not!

1 = 23

2 = 25

3 = 24

4 = 25

5 = 28

6 = 26

7 = 22

8 = 28

9 = 24

With all due respect, a few of your counts are incorrect.

I'm not sure if the base game for this is intended to be a, "Totals," game or if it is to be based upon the number of numbers matched for a numbers bet. For now, I'm going to go with a numbers bet, and I may do the alternative tomorrow.

There are 45 slots that I will term, "Regular," slots meaning no 10-1 payout. There are 9 slots that I will term, "Side Bet Slots," with a 10-1 payout consisting of Three Diamonds, Three Eagles and Three Stars.

The distribution of the other slots, by number of matches, is as follows:

Two Matches

Three 1's
Four 2's
Five 3's
Four 4's
Four 5's
Three 6's
Four 7's
Four 8's
Five 9's

Three Matches

Four 1's
Four 2's
Three 3's
Four 4's
Four 5's
Five 6's
Four 7's
Five 8's
Three 9's

Five Matches

One for Each Number.

Proposed House Edges

Side Bets

If the player chooses wither the Eagle, Diamond or Star, the player will be paid 10-to-1, so the player may either lose one or come ahead ten.

The probability of success is 3/54 for any particular one, while the probability of failure is 51/54, thus:

(3/54 * 10) - (51/54) = -0.38888888888888884 for a House Edge of 38.89% YIKES!!!

Numbers

For the Hell of it, let's say that it pays on a To One basis predicated upon how many of a certain number show up.

In this case, the one bet would pay:

(1/54 * 5) + (4/54 * 3) + (3/54 * 2) - (46/54) = -0.42592592592592593 for a House Edge of 42.5925%

The two bet would pay:

(1/54 * 5) + (4/54 * 2) + (4/54 * 3) - (45/54) = -0.37037037037037046 for a House Edge of 37.037%

The three bet would pay:

(1/54 * 5) + (3/54 * 3) + (5/54 * 2) - (45/54) = -0.3888888888888889 or 38.89% HE

The four bet would pay:

(1/54 * 5) + (4/54 * 2) + (4/54 * 3) - (45/54) = -0.37037037037037046 or 37.037% HE

The five bet would pay:

(1/54 * 5) + (4/54 * 2) + (4/54 * 3) - (45/54) = -0.37037037037037046 or 37.037% HE

The Six Bet would pay:

(1/54 * 5) + (5/54 * 3) + (3/54 * 2) - (45/54) = -0.35185185185185197 or 35.185% HE

The Seven bet would pay:

(1/54 * 5) + (4/54 * 2) + (4/54 * 3) - (45/54) = -0.37037037037037046 or 37.037% HE

The Eight bet would pay:

(1/54 * 5) + (5/54 * 3) + (4/54 * 2) - (44/54) = -0.2962962962962963 or 29.63% HE

The Nine bet would pay:

(1/54 * 5) + (5/54 *2) + (3/54 * 3) - (45/54) = -0.38888888888888895 or 38.89% HE

Conclusion

You had better tighten up that six, and especially that eight, or you might have something to worry about!!! j/k

I'm going to look at it for totals tomorrow, if you like, maybe that's supposed to be the base game. Over/Under a certain total with special symbols losing on a totals bet. If there were an equal chance of over/under the specified amount, then the only thing working against the player would be the Big symbols, causing a House Edge of 16.67%.***

***For example purposes only, there cannot be the same over/under a specific amount (absent ties) because there are an odd number of number slots.

Considering the house edges on the 10 to 1 bets, I think you have the right idea on how the other bets function. Harsh game, but also more appropriate for a "charity casino".

Quote: tringlomane

Considering the house edges on the 10 to 1 bets, I think you have the right idea on how the other bets function. Harsh game, but also more appropriate for a "charity casino".

In my opinion, it's more likely that a travelling Carnival/Fair was the first place this wheel saw action.

Quote: Mission146

In my opinion, it's more likely that a travelling Carnival/Fair was the first place this wheel saw action.

Very possible. But with 10 to 1 etched on those portions of the wheel, its hard to offer much better. To lower the edge on most of the wheel a bit, he could make all quints pay more (like 10 to 1 instead of 5 to 1) and make the symbol bets the sucker bets since those clearly state 10 to 1.

Quote: tringlomane

Very possible. But with 10 to 1 etched on those portions of the wheel, its hard to offer much better. To lower the edge on most of the wheel a bit, he could make all quints pay more (like 10 to 1 instead of 5 to 1) and make the symbol bets the sucker bets since those clearly state 10 to 1.

The best case scenario would still be the eight, and that slightly over 20% HE still, with Quints paying 10 to 1.

I don't personally have a problem with the HE for a charity event, the HE is simply the HE. If someone really doesn't want to look at the numbers and figure out (betting the eight with 5 to 1) that he or she is basically playing Fifteen-Zero Roulette, then that's fine. Fifteen-Zero Roulette would actually be slightly better, and I believe that Riva has considered offering Double-0, just with reduced payouts on some of the inside bets.

For a carnival game, (at a literal carnival or fair) I think it's pretty disgusting, but not wholly out of the ordinary.

You might also notice that all of the Quints are to the right of the Symbols, there's a good example of Carny design right there. You can rig that up for a little extra push at the appropriate time, hidden foot pedal, little bit of mental math, (symbol bets against others) dealer spins the wheel towards his and the players right, and you give it just that little extra push off a Quint or Symbol when appropriate. I'd like to see a picture of the back of it, but yeah, plenty of ways to rig that bad boy up to drop a little further right if you make sure the players can't see behind it.

Sometimes 30+% just isn't enough, you know!