Live BJ Dealers and Card Counting???
Quote: spc623I see it throughout posts on the web of traditional Casinos doing an excellent job at busting card counters. As stated in many other threads, I am extremely skeptical at using regular online Black Jack Casino programs. I like the rest of the schmucks on the web lost plenty on these betting sites playing blackjack. I just stuck to sports-betting for the last year, however I just now ran into the live dealer tables. Instead of long tedious hours keeping count, I have just been using software to keep count. On the live tables I have been winning consistently. My question is, do they monitor player activity like traditional casinos. At first glance I would assume yes, but maybe they are a bit lax due to reshuffling at around 50% of deck usage. I am most afraid of them freezing my funds.
You have been winning consistently on a game with 50% penetration? That doesn't sound right...
Quote: spc623I am a sports better, so I don't play table games oftern, so I have been trying to figure it out. From what I have read, I would need around 75% penetration for counting to be favorable, but with the software, it keeps track of all cards, so this gives me good data for later into the decks. I have been using my favorite sports betting system and incorporated it. I add 3 units to my bet after a loss and take away 2 units after a win, and when the true count is above +2, I raise my bet according to my bank roll. Its probably just a nice run, but am I breaking even with my count or is that not possible with only 50% penetration.
You can break even with a "normal" spread against a 50% pen shoe game. You can even make money in the long run, but the variance is going to be huge, because you're going to have to play with a very aggressive spread and basically put a lot of money on the table (e.g. maybe 15x your unit) whenever you get the chance, because you aren't going to see a lot of favorable counts. So, you will be playing with a positive expectation, but you may hit long losing streaks (even longer than normal) due to the spread required. Or you could hit a huge winning streak. Impossible to say with this game :).
I haven't run any of that through a simulator, it's just based on general knowledge of the game. Set up CVData with your specific parameters and see what it tells you.
I have no idea how well online casinos keep up with counters, but they have all the tools at their disposal to finger you as a counter with ease. And if they do that, who knows if you will get your money.
Best to play B&M to be honest.
Quote: spc623I had a feeling that was the case. Has anyone ever heard of a case where their funds were frozen? I think I will stay away from it to be safe.Thanks for the replies.
Since all cards and bets are recognized by the software, the casino would be a fool to not track the betting and playing efficiency of their players. You can't make consistent "cover plays" unless you give up your advantage (for which they would welcome you). If the casino is rough, they will probably just hope for your losing swings, and simply reject all cashouts on winning swings. Don't give them a freeroll.
Quote: spc623I had a feeling that was the case. Has anyone ever heard of a case where their funds were frozen? I think I will stay away from it to be safe.Thanks for the replies.
Winnings are frozen all the time at online Casinos if they expect, accuse, believe, imagine, were told by the tooth fairy that you are using software to count/win at their games. It doesn't take much for them to accuse you and be the judge and jury.
ZCore13
Quote: YesThereRealwat does it mean if ur name is a diff color?
Moderators are in green. Regular members are in blue. Members taking involuntary time off are in maroon.
Quote: beachbumbabsModerators are in green. Regular members are in blue. Members taking involuntary time off are in maroon.
ok thx
Quote: AcesAndEightsYou can break even with a "normal" spread against a 50% pen shoe game. You can even make money in the long run, but the variance is going to be huge, because you're going to have to play with a very aggressive spread and basically put a lot of money on the table (e.g. maybe 15x your unit) whenever you get the chance, because you aren't going to see a lot of favorable counts. So, you will be playing with a positive expectation, but you may hit long losing streaks (even longer than normal) due to the spread required. Or you could hit a huge winning streak. Impossible to say with this game :).
I haven't run any of that through a simulator, it's just based on general knowledge of the game. Set up CVData with your specific parameters and see what it tells you.
One factor you may not be considering: you can wong in and out at all or, to some extent at least, skip hands. That makes a big difference. Additionally, you can multi-table. As with poker, making $10 an hour at one table sucks: making $10x5 at different tables is a good hourly wage.
The real problem with the actuality of card-counting online is the numerous glitches with payment and decision-making that occur. Payoff errors occur at the rate of about one an hour. You do get the money back usually if you chase it but it is time-consuming hassle no one wants.
Quote: GBVThe real problem with the actuality of card-counting online is the numerous glitches with payment and decision-making that occur. Payoff errors occur at the rate of about one an hour. You do get the money back usually if you chase it but it is time-consuming hassle no one wants.
Where did this statistic derive from?
"Payoff errors occur at the rate of about one an hour."
Was this confirmed for just one software provider or can a player expect this error to occur with all software providers? One payoff error, per hour, per player, around the globe should be considered and treated as a serious issue.
Also, I don't understand why "decision-making" would become an issue while playing online or anywhere else for that matter.
Can you please be more specific?
Professional card counters are prohibited. If you are found to be a professional card counter playing in our "Live Dealer", your account is subject to immediate closure and all winnings will be forfeited.
Probably anyone that gets lucky enough to win 5 figures (or most likely even less) could be accused of being a pro.
I see that they run out of Costa Rica, which to me is always a red flag. Their information on Online Casino City (which is frequently incorrect) shows an awful lot of Costa Rican customers (more red flags).
And the biggest red flag of all - many of their customers are running Amigotechs software.
So, does anyone have any information on this particular operation. (For reasons, I'm looking into the possibility of plugging the Galewind product into someone's live feed core.)
Chris
Quote: 4ofaKindWhere did this statistic derive from?
"Payoff errors occur at the rate of about one an hour."
Was this confirmed for just one software provider or can a player expect this error to occur with all software providers? One payoff error, per hour, per player, around the globe should be considered and treated as a serious issue.
Also, I don't understand why "decision-making" would become an issue while playing online or anywhere else for that matter.
Can you please be more specific?
It is from my personal experience playing a range of software providers. Other people who have attempted to count cards online report similar findings. What typically happens is the dealer presses the wrong button and a win is settled as a loss. You complain to the dealer, the dealer calls the pit boss, the pit boss acknowledges the error, reassures everybody that they will be paid. Usually the lost payment shows up in your balance a few minutes later, but it can take much longer.
"Decision-making" is an issue because what tends to happen is that your decision is not recorded. Say for example, you get a two-card 11 vs 5. You hit the double button. Nothing happens. You hit it again, nothing happens. You tell the dealer something is wrong via chat. The dealer ignores you.
You keep complaining after the hand is settled. The dealer calls the pit boss. The pit boss won't do anything because although they know it is probably a transmission error at their end, it could be someone taking a shot, or it could be your connection. You lose money.
I don't believe these errors occur because of the way a specific operation occurs, I believe it is because of the intermittent nature of the way the internet sends information. I doubt they can actually tell even if they were motivated to find out.
