Triplell
Triplell
Joined: Aug 13, 2010
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January 22nd, 2012 at 5:46:44 PM permalink
So I was thinking recently of an interesting way to gamble a quick $200 or so on craps, without worrying that it would all get wiped out in a single roll.

Walk up to the table, wait for a new shooter. Lay every number, backing with $30 each (or whatever value you are comfortable with, although increments of $30 would work best)....

6 numbers, $35/number = $210 dollars. Best case scenario, the shooter rolls a bunch of come-out 7's.

Worst case scenario, the shooter has a good roll, rolling every point before a 7. For an added twist, you can throw come bets up after the come out roll.

Obviously this is still negative expectation, but it would be a fun way to gamble with $200 and not have to worry about losing it all at once. It would also work well for those with a very limited bankroll.

Assuming commission is paid on the win-only, you would be looking at around a 2% house edge. However, come-out 7's would result in a quick $143 bucks.
dwheatley
dwheatley
Joined: Nov 16, 2009
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January 22nd, 2012 at 6:29:40 PM permalink
Why not just play DP and DC with odds? You get more interactivity (placing less bets more frequently), with lower house edge.
Wisdom is the quality that keeps you out of situations where you would otherwise need it
MrV
MrV
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January 22nd, 2012 at 7:48:24 PM permalink
The play might make sense if the casino lets you take your lay bets down and returns all the buy-in money the lay bets cost you.

That way you could plan to leave the lay bets up until the shooter hits a predetermined number of numbers, and then take them all down.

Not a bad way to capitalize on a quick seven out.
"What, me worry?"
YoDiceRoll11
YoDiceRoll11
Joined: Jan 9, 2012
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January 22nd, 2012 at 11:52:45 PM permalink
Quote: Triplell


Assuming commission is paid on the win-only, you would be looking at around a 2% house edge.


Wrong. You are looking at a much higher HE.
AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
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January 23rd, 2012 at 8:03:17 AM permalink
I dont know what the math or edge is on this strategy but this is how I play craps tournaments. On the very first roll of the dice (regardless of the shooter) I lay all the numbers with a passline bet hoping for a 7. While the rest of the tournament players are pleased with the come out 7 (passline bet amounts are usually limited in a tournament) I'm collecting on the passline and also on the "no bets" on the numbers.

I did this in an MGM tournament a few years back and the first shooter threw three come-out 7s, then a point (lost one of my bets) and then a 7-out. Second shooter did about the same.

While I was the winner at my table, other players at other tables did better on the field which had a 5,000 chip maximum.

Only once was I in a tournmanet when any shooter had a monster roll and that was at Caesars about 8 years ago where one lady held the dice for all the rolls in the first, morning session, and then all but one of the rolls in the second, afternoon session.

after the tourney I played at a table with her when it was point-7 about a dozen times that night.
tconley19
tconley19
Joined: Oct 25, 2011
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January 23rd, 2012 at 8:34:41 AM permalink
Alan,
I tried this strategy on WinCraps. IMHO, I would definitely chart the table to see if quick 7-outs are happening. You can get ahead quickly, but give it right back even quicker. Definitely not a strategy for a warm or hot table.
Tom
Triplell
Triplell
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January 23rd, 2012 at 9:57:37 AM permalink
I never stated this as the "best" way to play craps, or even close to the best way. It's simply an alternative way to play that some people may favour, giving quite a bit of action without an astronomically high house edge. And from my calculations, the house edge per bet resolved would be roughly 2%, assuming that commission is paid on win-only. I would like to see why you think it would be much higher than that (and what is much higher then that? 4%, 12%?). I feel like you may be misinformed.

I usually play the do's and follow up with come bets, although I'm always trying to find ways to "switch things up". I don't like to make DC bets, as it's annoyying when the shooter rolls a ton of repeaters (while ignoring the other numbers completely)...

To each their own. I would never take this bet down once made.
YoDiceRoll11
YoDiceRoll11
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January 23rd, 2012 at 10:47:47 AM permalink
Quote: Triplell

And from my calculations, the house edge per bet resolved would be roughly 2%, assuming that commission is paid on win-only. I would like to see why you think it would be much higher than that (and what is much higher then that? 4%, 12%?). I feel like you may be misinformed.



Lay Bets
Lay 4/10: House edge is 2.44%
Lay 5/9: House edge is 3.23%
Lay 6/8: House edge is 4%

Combined house edge if bet all: 3.23% ("roughly" 3% if you are in a fig vig casino) (which, to me is a lot more than 2% especially since you are betting 6 numbers at a time, exposing more of your bankroll).

Sorry, "roughly" 2% is incorrect without very specific circumstances that would lower it (ie. pushing the house on the vig). The difference between 2% and 3% may not be much to you, but in math, it is a very large chasm especially when exposing so much of your BR at one time.

Quote: Triplell

It's simply an alternative way to play that some people may favour, giving quite a bit of action without an astronomically high house edge.



This much is true.

Best of luck.
Triplell
Triplell
Joined: Aug 13, 2010
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January 23rd, 2012 at 5:40:39 PM permalink
My casino has the payout of the following:

4 40 wins 19 -0.016666667
5 30 wins 19 -0.02
6 25 wins 19 -0.04
8 25 wins 19 -0.04
9 30 wins 19 -0.02
10 40 wins 19 -0.016666667
SanchoPanza
SanchoPanza
Joined: May 10, 2010
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January 23rd, 2012 at 6:01:59 PM permalink
Quote: Triplell

6 25 wins 19 -0.04
8 25 wins 19 -0.04


"Your" casino isn't paying correctly on the 6 and 8. It should be 20 for 25 (24 + 1 vig).

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