Joined: Nov 12, 2009
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October 22nd, 2014 at 4:02:39 PM permalink
I assume that if a 7 and craps were being thrown that the dice were severely biased towards the 1-6.

So you bet a high-low and hop the 6-1.

And run for the bank.
----- You want the truth! You can't handle the truth!
Joined: Nov 12, 2009
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October 22nd, 2014 at 4:04:21 PM permalink
One stupid whale can cause the craps win% to go out of whack or cause the Bac numbers to go negative. We've seen that.
----- You want the truth! You can't handle the truth!
Joined: Sep 28, 2014
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October 22nd, 2014 at 5:16:01 PM permalink
If the dice are rigged you should be able to win a few million easy.

Take a photo of the few million you won from the crooked dice.

Otherwise shut up with the random fake accusations.
Joined: May 9, 2010
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October 22nd, 2014 at 5:44:06 PM permalink
Quote: sc15

If the dice are rigged you should be able to win a few million easy.

Take a photo of the few million you won from the crooked dice.

Otherwise shut up with the random fake accusations.

Any bias in dices is the same as bias in Roulette wheel. You should not complain it or make it public.
You just quietly make millions out of it before the casino takes it out.
winning streaks come and go, losing streak never ends.
Joined: Nov 30, 2009
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October 22nd, 2014 at 5:53:10 PM permalink
I believe that this current post and this thread are just trollers (or the same person) trying to cause trouble. Classic controversial first post, which is very rare for an actual new member to dive into right off the bat. No follow up comments either.

I am an employee of a Casino. Former Table Games Director,, current Pit Supervisor. All the personal opinions I post are my own and do not represent the opinions of the Casino or Tribe that I work for.
Joined: Jan 17, 2013
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October 22nd, 2014 at 8:51:52 PM permalink

This is not the first time this nonsense has come up on this board... shaved dice, unbalanced dice and on and on
and then you should be able to make a million.....nonsense.... period.

First if the dice are shaved or unbalanced your not going to have to many sevens while at the same time have a
balanced distribution between 1/6 6/1 5/2 2/5 or 4/3 3/4.. not going to happen.

If your just seeing way to many 7's of all kinds you certainly can make money on the don't or lay the point as long
as that trends lasts. This has nothing to do with the dice.

Now a couple of things can happen if you have unbalanced dice... if you see lots or mostly 1/6 6/1, you will also
see lots of crap numbers ad not many 6 or 8 or 5 or 9. You can make this work for you, but playing the donts
may not be one of them because your not seeing more 7;s just one kind of 7.

If you seeing lots of 4/3/ or 3/4 your also seeing more 6 & 8 and hard 6 and hard 8. These are not properly balanced
dice but they can work in your favor with the increase in 6 & 8 and hardways. We had these type of dice tonight
and it worked well with a good many hard 6 & 8 . It was a fun night. These are not the best for playing on a ATS
table so I limit my bets some on them. We had number of good rolls tonight and not a single ATS win, but still
very nice win.

The hard part about playing with unbalanced dice is all the dice in the trey may not be the same, so different combinations
can produce different results. If the guy in front of you has a decent roll, you can say same dice....and it may help some.

unbalanced dice can be playable, but idea is it is a huge money maker for a don't player is not supportable.

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October 22nd, 2014 at 10:56:28 PM permalink
Sith lord was probably at the table or nearby. Possibly even Gary Loveman.
I am a robot.
Joined: Jan 30, 2014
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October 23rd, 2014 at 11:46:36 AM permalink
Was it the same KIND of 7 every time? I.E. Always a 6-1, 5-2, 3-4?
Joined: Apr 18, 2013
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October 24th, 2014 at 3:18:26 AM permalink
Quote: DrawingDead

Well that's odd. How did they arrive at that? Are you sure you understood it correctly? Because if that's so, then apparently something peculiar and "unfair" is happening to the dice all over Nevada. To everyone, players and casinos alike, depending on where you happen to go in any given month.

According to the most recent Gaming Revenue Report of the Nevada State Gaming Control Board (which is available RIGHT HERE) for August 2014 almost none of the geographic regions reported a win percentage that was neatly within that range, and neither did the State as a whole.

Quote: Bohemian

The Caesars Atlantic City craps Win % for February, 2012 was 32.2 % according to their signed NJ tax return.

Does NJ report casino revenue much differently than many other jurisdictions, including Nevada? Because I'm accustomed to looking at Nevada and some other jurisdictions' reports in which that property specific information is considered proprietary and is not released to the public in that form, except as aggregated among multiple licensees by geographic area as in the report I quoted from the NGCB linked to above.

DrawingDead, New Jersey used to report Craps gaming revenues much better than Nevada ever has, until December, 2013. See Caesars Atlantic City craps Win % for October, 2013 at 36.1 % according to their signed NJ tax return which can be found here:

Caesars Atlantic City October, 2013 Tax Return

Caesars Atlantic City craps Win % for November, 2013 at 27.2 %

Then (for all your conspiracy junkies), detailed Craps reporting by New Jersey disappeared in December, 2013.
See New Jersey Tax Returns by Casino by Month

Nevada State Gaming Revenue Reports

As for Nevada Gaming Revenue Reports for craps, they are about as useful as a cow's 5th teat or the office of the Vice President. According to the Nevada State Gaming Commission, Tax Revenue Reports are completed on a cash basis only and do not follow "generally accepted accounting principles" (or "GAAP"). Specifically, they ignore the Matching Principle and the Revenue Recognition Principle of basic accounting guidelines.

For instance, if Caesar's Las Vegas takes a marker for $50,000. from a customer in September, they "Drop" that marker into the slot but they do not have to report the $50,000.00 on their September Revenue Report. Caesar's Las Vegas may not report that $50,000. into income until 30 days later when that customer pays off that marker in a different month (October). However, let's assume in September that Caesar's Las Vegas customer lost $10,000. (20%) of his $50,000. marker.

Nevada Reporting - September
Drop - 0
Win - $10,000.
Win % = approx 1 million %

Nevada Reporting - October
Drop - $50,000
Win - 0
Win % = 0

Proper Accounting or IRS Reporting - September
Drop - $50,000.
Win - $10,000.
Win % = 20%

In addition to Nevada reporting apples and oranges with regard to win percentages on Craps for any casino that takes markers, they also combine many casinos so it makes it tough to analyze properly what any casino is doing on a craps table or within it's resort. When we asked the Nevada State Gaming Commission if we could have access to more detailed numbers per casino OR just a copy of their tax return like New Jersey provides, they said that would not be fair to each casino's proprietary information. I believe the Wizard or Michael Shackleford has had similar stonewalling from Nevada when it comes to more detailed numbers. Basically you can get more information from Wall Street, the SEC reporting in Annual Reports or even New Jersey regarding a company than from Nevada. Transparency in Nevada is non-existent. What are they trying to hide.

And now what are they trying to hide in New Jersey. As you referenced, "don't rule out malice."
Joined: Oct 23, 2014
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October 24th, 2014 at 5:52:53 AM permalink
In addition to what Bohemain stated .. it's not just markers .. depending on where a table is placed you could have a different proportion of players coming in with chips from other tables.

Plus another variable is duration of play and number of bets. Most tables theoretical wins are just a few % .. but that number is compounded because people take their wins and rebet .. so even if the theoretical win on a table is only 3% .. a player who bets $100 usually rebets his theoretical $97 .. and then his $94 .. $91 .. etc etc

AND ... lol .. there is a huge fluction of % on craps tables between the various bets ... and even on the main bets like the Pass Line .. those win % vary drastically depending on if a player plays full odds or no odds or something in between!

Also .. "theoratical win" and "Drop:Win %" are completely different! Shaved dice would affect theoretical win directly .. but Win % number would just be hidden amoungst the factors above!

Plus .. there is a big difference between "shaved" dice and "rounded" dice. If all corners are symetrically round and all sides of equal size, then even if they aren't perfect cubes they are still perfectly random! And some might argue even more secure as I'd think it would be harder to cheat evenly rounded dice than perfect cubes! ;)

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