D Day in Vegas

Quote: beachmonkey

You seem to be a good friend to him, good for you both. He has only to convince himself that he is a good guy, as for the others , myself included , should not be used as the barometer of acceptance , far from it.
Faceless people on a keyboard/ mobile phones displaying various forms of psychosis, so he’s better off believing in him self rather than just talking about it. I’m sure you’re helping him though this as well. Good man.
Kind regards.

Feel free to PM me what the Admin edited out of your post, I would love to know.

You seem to be making some assumptions here.

I have met up with ZK 3 times and we shot pool. I don't know that anyone would consider that as being in "good friend" territory. If so, I have a ton of good friends I didn't know about. He has always been respectful, calm, friendly and a decent guy in person. Others have also met up with him (not just at the group meet up) all reports have been good.

There were a few things at the beginning he said that seemed like BS. "I'm coming to Vegas to AP" "I'm a great FIFA player" "I have x car" and a few other things. They all turned out to be true.

I guess people would rather hear from the guys that claim they beat -EV games every time they play while using their "keep hydrated" bunk systems.

I think he deserves some of the ribbing and constructive criticism he gets, especially considering some of the stuff he says online, just not all the nastiness.

I cant think of anything specific off hand, I believe I have picked up on some eyebrow-raising things you have said yourself.

Quote: AxelWolf

Feel free to PM me what the Admin edited out of your post, I would love to know.

You seem to be making some assumptions here.

I have met up with ZK 3 times and we shot pool. I don't know that anyone would consider that as being in "good friend" territory. If so, I have a ton of good friends I didn't know about. He has always been respectful, calm, friendly and a decent guy in person. Others have also met up with him (not just at the group meet up) all reports have been good.

There were a few things at the beginning he said that seemed like BS. "I'm coming to Vegas to AP" "I'm a great FIFA player" "I have x car" and a few other things. They all turned out to be true.

I guess people would rather hear from the guys that claim they beat -EV games every time they play while using their "keep hydrated" bunk systems.

I think he deserves some of the ribbing and constructive criticism he gets, especially considering some of the stuff he says online, just not all the nastiness.

I cant think of anything specific off hand, I believe I have picked up on some eyebrow-raising things you have said yourself.

First administration only editorial was condense my Quote of your post. No need to pm.
Second that’s how friendships are formed re above your quote, time plus connection etc. never be ashamed of a friendship they are more valuable than meer associations.
Third raise your eyebrows as much as you like, I don’t care. I haven’t claimed anything re bunk system or similar. I have not asked for , nor will I ask for funds , respect nor adoration. I will offer an opinion on occasion whether that is of value to anyone or not I don’t care. If it is of value to someone good I’m happy as per usual. If administration wish me to stop posting, I’m good for that as well, I don’t care. Let me know. I been in bigger hell than anything you lot can say or do. I don’t care ie no offence to you specially axel wolf ( I think your are ok) but I don’t give a rats rrrzzz
Fourth I’m not about to embellish about what I do re my income stream, there are many ways to make money at a casino. I am not to make public any thing that may jeopardise that , as you know they can change the playing field as they see fit. As far as I can tell I haven’t broken any laws. Nor will I as personal freedom is paramount to my lifestyle.
Fifth kind regards.
Merry Christmas.
P.s sixth I have a far side sense of humour at times, mostly .

Well, first off, I moved out of my apartment this morning. Im flying back home for 3 weeks to be with family for christmas and new years and didnt want to have to pay 3 weeks worth of rent for no reason. Ill be sleeping in my car for the next 2 days and just playing blackjack until my flight.

Blackjack wise, its continued to be a disaster and just so you know how unlucky Ive been im close to -1.5 SD down from expected results. Just the start anyone wants right as soon as they move out on their own? Bankroll is now down to 46.5k and my flight home is actually a one way ticket, mostly to save money from a round trip fare. Two one way tickets end up being cheaper. Im also pretty demoralized with this city and a part of me is not sure I want to return, so this one way ticket gives me some flexibility.

So theres the update for anyone who gives a damn. Im ready to just let this thread die, but people keep bumping it up for whatever reason.

Why not just save the one-way flight and drive the car home, especially if you don't think you'll return? Why would you not stay in in one of Vegas' 125,000 hotel rooms. I don't get you. You are extremely sensitive to finances. What did you do with any or all of the stuff that you accumulated? Most people when they move somewhere buy furniture, dishes, clothes, electronics, etc. What did you do with all of that? Or did you always think it was temporary?

Heck, with the level you play, you could easily find a casino you rarely frequent (like GVR), book two nights, play with a card, and stay RFB for free. Why are you sleeping in your car?

Enjoy your time with your family.

Quote: ZenKinG

So theres the update for anyone who gives a damn. Im ready to just let this thread die, but people keep bumping it up for whatever reason.

I give a damn. Enjoy your family over the holidays.

Make sure Santa doesn't cheat you this year.

Ok I said under a bridge, never in your car. I’m willing to admit I was wrong.

On a serious note, enjoy the time with your family and use it to evaluate where you are and what you want to do in life. Maybe some time away from Vegas will help you see all the positives you have going for you that you seem to not realize.

Or ignore my advise like you did from everyone else here who tried to help you.

Either way, never mind, waste of a post.

He should have just invested half his roll in bitcoin when it was around 2k.

Then again, with his luck it would have crashed for sure (-;

Quote: AxelWolf

Feel free to PM me what the Admin edited out of your post, I would love to know.

You seem to be making some assumptions here.

I have met up with ZK 3 times and we shot pool. I don't know that anyone would consider that as being in "good friend" territory. If so, I have a ton of good friends I didn't know about. He has always been respectful, calm, friendly and a decent guy in person. Others have also met up with him (not just at the group meet up) all reports have been good.

There were a few things at the beginning he said that seemed like BS. "I'm coming to Vegas to AP" "I'm a great FIFA player" "I have x car" and a few other things. They all turned out to be true.

I guess people would rather hear from the guys that claim they beat -EV games every time they play while using their "keep hydrated" bunk systems.

I think he deserves some of the ribbing and constructive criticism he gets, especially considering some of the stuff he says online, just not all the nastiness.

I cant think of anything specific off hand, I believe I have picked up on some eyebrow-raising things you have said yourself.

I edited beachmonkey's post for a lost bracket when quoting you, which messed up the formatting and made her response part of your quote. Didn't change a word of content. Fwiw, if I were to change content, other than masking a swear, I would say what I changed with a redaction note, and have been doing that for years.

Quote: beachbumbabs

I edited beachmonkey's post for a lost bracket when quoting you, which messed up the formatting and made her response part of your quote. Didn't change a word of content. Fwiw, if I were to change content, other than masking a swear, I would say what I changed with a redaction note, and have been doing that for years.

I was unaware that member is a her. If so, that explains a lot.

I thought beachmonkey was either a her or a bot.

Quote: RS

I thought beachmonkey was either a her or a bot.

Well, you probably cheated and looked at her profile, I almost never look at someone's profile(I just forget it's even a thing). Gender: Female. That doesn't have to be accurate.

I guess she may have said or given clues as to what gender she was in her posts(can so someone give me an example?), but I almost never read her entire posts, I may skim them at times.

Nah, I didn't look at her profile. Just figured with that name = girl. Then I tried reading some of "her" posts and thought it was a bot. Still not sure.

Quote: RS

Nah, I didn't look at her profile. Just figured with that name = girl. Then I tried reading some of "her" posts and thought it was a bot. Still not sure.

That's strange, why would the name beachmonkey make you think female? Perhaps you shouldn't answer that. (-;

That would be the last name I would pick if I was a female. I would have to pick Nathan.

I'm glad you guys got that figured out. I can finally sleep.

Beachmonkey did post about putting a tampon on the table,so theres that.

Quote: prozema

I'm glad you guys got that figured out. I can finally sleep.

Not so fast, let me give you a reason to lose some more sleep, after reading a few of that member's posts, I don't care what anyone says, I'm convinced that person is not a female, at least not by my standards. If they claim to be female I will address them as such.

Quote: Hunterhill

Beachmonkey did post about putting a tampon on the table,so theres that.

I'm glad I missed or forgot about that. No thanks to you.

Quote: AxelWolf

Not so fast, let me give you a reason to lose some more sleep, after reading a few of that member's posts, I don't care what anyone says, I'm convinced that person is not a female, at least not by my standards. If they claim to be female I will address them as such.

Axel's' Standards for Being Female.... If that's not the perfect topic for an article, I don't know what is... We must have it.

Ha! :-)

Quote: prozema

Axel's' Standards for Being Female.... If that's not the perfect topic for an article, I don't know what is... We must have it.

Ha! :-)

Putting a checkmark in the female box or getting a sex change doesn't count in my book.

I don't care what sex people are attracted to, I don't care what or who they choose to become. I can respect their right to do so. I would never dislike anyone for simply doing so or being different.

But, If you are born a female, you remain female in my book, and vice versa.

Sorry, Caitlyn Jenner, I still view you as a man.

Edit to add: I'm biased when it comes to bull dykes. Almost all my experiences being around them have been bad. I tend to avoid them if at all possible.

I guess this forum is not as politically correct as I was led to believe.

And AP's slipping into town with inadequate bankrolls, renting apts. they have to bolt from so they can escape paying rent for 3 weeks, and sleeping in cars?

Is this real?

I think most eventually successful professional AP's started with lower BR than they would recommend and many have spent an occasional night in the car, I know I have. As have some people who have launched startups, put themselves through college without going through the debt bomb that cripples many college graduates for decades.

Make fun of it if you want, spending the occasional night in your car when you have the iffy bankroll size (that can afford the hotel) shows a certain desire or level of commitment to get where you want to go. And the biggest threat to that size BR in blackjack is always the overhead to your cost of living.

ZK, you haven't failed at this, you're dreams are just to invested in it working this time or in a certain timeline. The first time I tried I had to get another job for like 9 months, tried again and we're over 3.5 years from now then. The only way you're not going to make it is if you quit trying. Unfortunately you don't get to pick when it's going to happen and there's not really a predictable timeline when you need to readjust bet sizes. I think you know this but just have trouble accepting it since you're overly invested in it working in a certain timeline.

That being said, I would definitely recommend getting a part time job working just enough hours to cover at least cover your cost of living. I think this will do wonders for you psychologically/stress wise. You can look at it as temporary if you like. Enjoy your time with your family use it to reflect on what you think you want to do, your life is a journey, it's all good and you can always re-evaluate and back up unless you're burning every bridge on the way there (?) or trap yourself with too many obligations.

Be the hero of your own story bro, you can do it. Best wishes. Below is a video I find helpful to listen to occasionally being self employed as an AP when I'm really struggling with motivation or frustrating variance. A bit corny, but it usually helps me snap out of a funk.

Deciding to sleep in a car for two days simply illustrates how inept ZK has handled moving to Vegas. I'm not here all that much longer, but get free room offers from a dozen casinos on a monthly basis, as well as a decent amount of free play. Learning to exploit casino clubs has to be an essential part of a successful APs portfolio.

delete

Quote: billryan

. Learning to exploit casino clubs has to be an essential part of a successful APs portfolio.

It really doesn't Bill. It is surprising that he doesn't have a couple room comps I guess. I know numerous players who almost exclusively play table games unrated and make 75-200k a year, don't exploit casino clubs really at all. Depending on your concentration, it can (and became for me) more of an opportunity cost because it can tie you down to the area and discourage/prevent travel to more lucrative opportunities that pop up if you are mostly a solo player. The free play and the food comps allowed me to keep my food expenses at $4 a day simply for comped buffet tips early on so I do agree it would be helpful for him to learn that. Trying to jump into VP mailers without knowing where/what to play along with a bad run is actually what destroyed my initial bankroll though, the edge was too thin.

Also, your situation is so different (residual monthly income that covers basic living expenses?) that it is really just no sort of comparison.

One thing he definitely needs to stop doing that will surely doom him if he keeps it up is talking about how unlucky/cursed he is and comparing himself to guys who got lucky early. You aren't even on the extreme end of the bell curve, and one thing that has never worked for anyone is making excuses for why others are doing better. Gotta cut out that negative process. Ok, off my soapbox.

Quote: billryan

Deciding to sleep in a car for two days simply illustrates how inept ZK has handled moving to Vegas. I'm not here all that much longer, but get free room offers from a dozen casinos on a monthly basis, as well as a decent amount of free play. Learning to exploit casino clubs has to be an essential part of a successful APs portfolio.

This I agree with.

ZK's all over the map when it comes to efficiency of purpose, which is why I said he was inadequately bankrolled. The fact that he's being a cheapskate about everything confirms my point.

I don't see much sense in becoming an AP without securing at least the next 10 years of a DECENT, RESPECTABLE life. Plus any family plans ahead? Gambling should never be the end-all from the get-go. That's been proven time and time again.

Quote: horse

I don't see much sense in becoming an AP without securing at least the next 10 years of a DECENT, RESPECTABLE life. Plus any family plans ahead? Gambling should never be the end-all from the get-go. .

That comes later. Same for the path of most people who aren't born on 3rd base, paying off college debt on the entry level jobs. Whatever your occupation is should never be the end all.

Quote: mcallister3200

I think most eventually successful professional AP's started with lower BR than they would recommend and many have spent an occasional night in the car, I know I have. As have some people who have launched startups, put themselves through college without going through the debt bomb that cripples many college graduates for decades.

The lives of people in different socioeconomic classes...may look unusual to each other.

Not wanting to pay for a hotel room...may sound strange to middle-class/upper-class people.

A) Working-class: Survival. Enjoy money when you have it. Have a network of people to borrow/lend money.
B) Middle-class: Save money to retire. Work hard.
C) Upper-class: Find a fulfilling way to live. Money is always available. Success is from connections & networking.

-----
Many years ago, I came to Vegas with a $2,000 bankroll and a 15-yr-old car about to die. I only made $1,200-1,500/month ($40-50/day), but still saved money that first year. Gross profit was $14,000 (Only gambled about 8-9 months of the year, traveled the other 3-4 months).

Would have loved to have ZK's bankroll then...

What did I do to save money?

1) Some weekday rooms were only $10/night (combination of internet & casino specials). It was before the resort fee nightmare (Now, Golden Gate is probably cheapest 2* at $44/night, but some 1.5* weeklies are $220-300). At my play levels, I had only a few free rooms/month.

2) During the cooler days, especially on expensive weekends, I slept in my car on the street (Don't know if any Vegas casinos are friendly to sleepers in their parking lots. It's 50/50 in Indian casinos, but I didn't want to risk it in Vegas). I had a fitness club membership for showers, and a $29/month storage unit.

3) As much free food as possible. Grocery shopping. Graveyard specials ($1.99 steak & eggs ... now $4.99 at South Point).

4) No taxis or buses. Walked as much as possible to save gas.

With expenses of only a few hundred a month, I could build a bankroll.

--------
As Bob Dancer wrote in one of his articles,

The #1 skill you need to make money at gambling is: The ability to SAVE money.

If I can paraphrase Bob's story. A lady asked Bob if he could teach her to make money at video poker. He asked her if she had saved any money from her job. When she said no, Bob said he couldn't teach her to make money gambling.

-----
Other helpful gambling skills

#2) Finding +EV situations with +CE (in other words, within your bankroll & RoR limitations). Some people are successful without this, by just getting lucky. (Most successful entrepreneurs will tell you that they were "stupid lucky" on their first business. It gave them the cash to pay for future mistakes.)

#3) Not getting kicked out of casinos

#4) Improving your hourly rate (by comparing opportunities & taking better ones). Some people work very long hours (5,000-6,000 hrs/yr), but most very successful ones are part-timers (<1,000 hrs/yr). In my experience the most profitable gamblers often have full-time jobs, have created their own businesses, or are retired from good careers.

#5) Finding types of gambling you enjoy. Staying in one poker room all day. Flying around the world. Exploiting casino marketing. Beating other players.

Many APs look very similar, but the very good ones all look UNIQUE. The best gamblers I know all have certain favorite methods, and they avoid most other methods.

In business, we might say "focus on your core competencies". Some APs are trying to make money with a bazillion different methods at once (it's a good sign that they are still climbing the learning curve...whether in business or gambling). When you know your profitability & skills better, you tend to focus.

Cool story, enjoyed it. I think, especially for those that aren't supremely naturally, gifted, that process of grinding it up in any endeavor but especially AP is a really helpful process. Helps you to develop he mindset and skills to look at things at different angles and in different ways almost as a necessity for survival.

Never thought I'd run into the glamorisation of gamblers sleeping in cars, gobbling down dollar ninety-nine meals, and basically scrubbing by just to be able to keep going to casinos, here.

Stragglers who survive by having a network of people foolishly willing to lend them money need to get a life.

It's all about preparation and having years worth of expenses covered while living a normal life to me. If you have to struggle then you shouldn't be gambling.

Quote: horse

It's all about preparation and having years worth of expenses covered while living a normal life to me. If you have to struggle then you shouldn't be gambling.

Yeah, that's easy. I'll just eat a five-bean burrito, sit down on the toilet and crap out, "Years worth of expenses."

The fact of the matter is that, if you find the right situation, there are a number of plays out there that are very low in risk and from which you can make a fairly steady amount of money on your average day.

If you had essentially unlimited time and probably about two grand, no other responsibilities, there are plays and places out there such that you never lose the two grand if you're being extremely conservative with what you're doing. Further, you can develop some kind of network and maybe get to the point where you work for another AP, if you choose.

There are many people out there who choose not to be beholden to traditional employment, mostly types that don't like being told what to do. Those are the types of guys you will sometimes see doing certain things because at least they succeed or fail on their own terms and essentially under their own control.

There may be people with some knowledge of gambling, even low bankroll guys, who despite all attempts can't find a job that results in the daily that they make from gambling.

You'll see that Mamat referred to, "Especially on expensive weekends," when it comes to crashing in the car. Did you think about that for a second? I think what he's saying is that there was no way for a player at his level, at the time, to get a comped and/or reasonably priced room during Super Bowl weekend, or things like that. I've seen what some of those casinos are asking for a room on SB weekend, and were I a millionaire, I wouldn't pay it. Principle alone.

As far as saving money on food goes, I really don't see what could be considered wrong with that under any set of circumstances. If someone can get a steak and eggs for $1.99 (at that time) does it really behoove the person to go somewhere else and pay $7.99 for the same exact end result?

It's pretty simple: just get something called a job beforehand so the money is in a savings acct. Then the person wouldn't have to live like a pauper.

What good is it going into the gambling world if it means having to scrape by? That's what I mean by preparation. It's up to the individual, but I choose to have a comfortable existence, especially if I'm doing something new.

I agree there's plays out there that with enough hard work can be exploited for the newbie. It just seems a little more reasonable to live decently and to have your expenses covered for a number of years just in case. Nothing is guaranteed, especially in gambling.

Everyone is different. If it is not illegal , you can do it. If it is not immoral, you can do it and sleep well. My choice might not be the same as yours.

Quote: horse

It's pretty simple: just get something called a job beforehand so the money is in a savings acct. Then the person wouldn't have to live like a pauper.

That's my point, people get jobs, people lose jobs. Sometimes, the reason why they lost their job is not necessarily their fault.

I know of a few actual AP's (or guys who work for them) for whom this is the exact or a similar situation. I won't go into too much detail, but one older guy was a reasonably successful business owner for, I believe, two or more decades and the business went belly up and he put everything he could in trying to turn it around. That didn't end up happening. Either way, he works for a much higher level AP than he and gets along just fine. In his case, it's almost like having a traditional employer.

I know of no fewer than two other guys who lost their jobs and just used it to get by while they were looking for something else. One of the two guys would ultimately go on to find another job in his field, but knowing the AP took care of his (reduced) expenses until something came up. He didn't have a substantial amount of money when he lost that job, but he effectively never had to tap into what of it he did have.

Finding a job is often easier said than done, but despite what all of the, 'Sky is falling,' people say, it seems that the vulturing opportunities aren't drying up in casinos. They're changing, but not drying up completely. Hell, there are a few machines that are even less risk and better return than a few that they replaced. Not always, of course.

Quote:

What good is it going into the gambling world if it means having to scrape by? That's what I mean by preparation. It's up to the individual, but I choose to have a comfortable existence, especially if I'm doing something new.

The same good as it is anywhere else. Lots of people just scrape by. I don't think someone without access to better jobs would use, "What good is it working in a grocery store if it means having to scrape by," as a justification for being homeless and starving to death instead.

If you have a comfortable existence, then that's fantastic as there are many who are not so fortunate. I also agree that it would be ideal to have a few years of expenses backing you up before getting into any independent venture, but ideal and possible are often two different things. Especially when you look at ideal v. immediately possible.

Quote:

I agree there's plays out there that with enough hard work can be exploited for the newbie. It just seems a little more reasonable to live decently and to have your expenses covered for a number of years just in case. Nothing is guaranteed, especially in gambling.

I agree, again, that having such expenses covered is a good ideal and it should be aspired to. I don't think there are too many low-level AP's, who do only that, who don't aspire to moving up to bigger and better plays. It's really pretty similar to how a mail room clerk aspires to move up to manage the mail room, then get a job in a department, then become the head in that department...etc.

And, like you said, nothing is guaranteed. Some people just want to take the lack of a guarantee and either succeed or fail on their own terms. Further, some have a greater risk tolerance than others, and it stands to reason that AP's will be outside of the first standard deviation when it comes to the amount of risk that they are willing to tolerate.

I guess no one who is now very wealthy was ever homeless, broke, ate cheap, slept on friends floors or in their car.

In order to build a business, you have to start off cheap, if you don't have that much capital. A bunch of businesses's origins are "garage startup" types. How do you think Facebook, Apple, or a bunch of others started?

It makes sense for some and doesn't make sense for others. It depends on your life circumstances. If you're young, debt free, no wife/kids, and some money, then you're in decent shape to go the "garage startup / cheap" route, where if you fail, you can go find a job, build it back up, and try again if you want, like what McAllister said.

If you're older, wife and kids, have to pay off mortgages or whatever adults do, have debt, other responsibilities, etc. then going the previous route probably isn't the best idea for you, since you need a steady and guaranteed income.

Quote: AxelWolf

I guess no one who is now very wealthy was ever homeless, broke, ate cheap, slept on friends floors or in their car.

I doubt I qualify as very wealthy, but I am well off. I can confirm that I have had to sleep in my car before including one night in Las Vegas in the binions garage. I drove to Las Vegas because I had won a seat in whatever binions called the poker event they ran right after the wsop moved to the Rio.

To this day, I have kept a blanket I bought at a garage sale as a reminder of when I was less fortunate. I don't remember what I paid for that blanket... Probably 50 cents or a dollar... But when I bought the blanket, it was the only one I had and it kept me warm. I was so happy to have that blanket because the apartment I was in had a really flaky heater. I've actually had several repairs made to the dollar blanket over the years, not only because of the sentimental value, but because that blanket is more comfortable than anything else I can find at any price. And believe me, my wife loves buying expensive bedding.

Oh, and to this day... I love eating cheap.

I was kinda like ZK... i still am to a some degree. I fancied myself as a lone wolf... Didn't want any help from anyone... Wanted to do it all on my own. I even had to move back into mom's basement once for awhile. I can totally relate to what he's going through.

Even with all that said, I do think another source of income with less variance than blackjack would help him.

IIRC he first thing I said was he should get a part time job when first moving to Vegas.

Quote: Mission146

Yeah, that's easy. I'll just eat a five-bean burrito, sit down on the toilet and crap out, "Years worth of expenses."

The fact of the matter is that, if you find the right situation, there are a number of plays out there that are very low in risk and from which you can make a fairly steady amount of money on your average day.

If you had essentially unlimited time and probably about two grand, no other responsibilities, there are plays and places out there such that you never lose the two grand if you're being extremely conservative with what you're doing. Further, you can develop some kind of network and maybe get to the point where you work for another AP, if you choose.

There are many people out there who choose not to be beholden to traditional employment, mostly types that don't like being told what to do. Those are the types of guys you will sometimes see doing certain things because at least they succeed or fail on their own terms and essentially under their own control.

There may be people with some knowledge of gambling, even low bankroll guys, who despite all attempts can't find a job that results in the daily that they make from gambling.

You'll see that Mamat referred to, "Especially on expensive weekends," when it comes to crashing in the car. Did you think about that for a second? I think what he's saying is that there was no way for a player at his level, at the time, to get a comped and/or reasonably priced room during Super Bowl weekend, or things like that. I've seen what some of those casinos are asking for a room on SB weekend, and were I a millionaire, I wouldn't pay it. Principle alone.

As far as saving money on food goes, I really don't see what could be considered wrong with that under any set of circumstances. If someone can get a steak and eggs for $1.99 (at that time) does it really behoove the person to go somewhere else and pay $7.99 for the same exact end result?

I'm a low roller and had a half dozen super bowl weekend offers.
In Zks case, the weeks before Christmas are slow as Hell.

Quote: AxelWolf

Putting a checkmark in the female box or getting a sex change doesn't count in my book.

I don't care what sex people are attracted to, I don't care what or who they choose to become. I can respect their right to do so. I would never dislike anyone for simply doing so or being different.

But, If you are born a female, you remain female in my book, and vice versa.

Sorry, Caitlyn Jenner, I still view you as a man.

Edit to add: I'm biased when it comes to bull dykes. Almost all my experiences being around them have been bad. I tend to avoid them if at all possible.

Ok for this poster I’m making an exception for the rules I give to myself as my personal guideline to keep me from my reverting to my nasty past, it is very easy to be a nasty person, I actually have all the boxes ticked that allows me to be bad . I have all the social disadvantages from a very hard part of town. That rule I’m going to bend is never explain to anyone anything about my past. I’m disappointed you and a few others here have decided to apply this bullying tactic. I am not a bull dike I learnt to fight and protect myself because in hard town that was the only way you made it through. I was steered into the direction of a martial art, it helps to focus and channel the extreme desire to really f##k people up. I was one of the very first female door person in Australia in the early eighties, I found putting men on there arse relatively easy. Yes at that time I did get tremendous satisfaction seeing some bloke pussy whipped the realisation on that face. Priceless. Yes women and bull dikes much harder to put on the ground, they scratch and claw at the eyes and face ,so one had to be super aggressive to get it over with in under 30 sec, a few of you will know what I mean.
I believe the reference you are referring to is in the pm I sent to you , from memory it was something like this , I don’t mind going toe to toe . Threatening behaviour is not my style, I usually just do , I do now as I’m older exercise a rigid discipline. The body is no longer able to backup the agility needed in a street situation. I’m a little sad I missed the new cage fighting era , but then in some ways not , as I’m sure I may have used it as the penultimate excuse to kill someone, nasty me , and another rule surfaces never make excuses ever, cop it sweet or don’t do the crime. Rhonda Rousse isn’t a bull dike ( I’m only assuming)
I’m disappointed that someone genderized the criteria to post here, I didn’t notice in the wov mission statement female, potential bull dike, transgender, or homosexual are not to post here. Must be in the small mind print at the bottom of the page perhaps.
I don’t believe in hero’s as no one saved me in hard town, I’m thankful I had help. I don’t believe in martyrdom , nor do I believe I need to argue , so i won’t . I’m happy to say that if you need to believe you all are correct in everything you think, then you are .
I actually don’t know why ,and to clarify this is not directly , solely aimed at you axel wolf , but at all that what I’m about to say resonates with.
Why don’t you just cut to the chase on some of these post/threads and just say to various posters things like . Don’t post here your a fool, or do some homework come back when you know what you’re talking about ,which incidentally is never . Or you don’t fit the gender requirements don’t post, your political opinion is not relevant don’t post , your not me don’t post .
That would work fine by me as if I’d known this I would have saved time and maybe walked the dog a bit more at the beach. Oh and yes I do understand monkey is a slang in America for a part of a female body, snicker snicker little boys. There are many words and pictures you all use in you non de plumes that have other meanings, and quite frankly some of you should just stop fawning,read some of your own posts, grow a pair. No great loss . This is my last post. I will work out how to log out of my account here as I’ve had some problems there. Oh technically inept don’t post here.
I will have a great Christmas and I wish you all do as well.
Kind regards.

Quote: beachmonkey

Oh and yes I do understand monkey is a slang in America for a part of a female body, snicker snicker little boys.

If it is it must be something new. In my 50 years I have never heard that monkey was slang for a female body part.

Quote: DRich

If it is it must be something new. In my 50 years I have never heard that monkey was slang for a female body part.

I can think of a word that ends with a y.

Quote: DRich

If it is it must be something new. In my 50 years I have never heard that monkey was slang for a female body part.

We actually used it, as kids, to refer to our own (male) equipment.

Quote: beachmonkey

I believe the reference you are referring to is in the pm I sent to you, from memory it was something like this I don’t mind going toe to toe

I do not ever recall reading or sending you a PM. I have no doubt there was, but I cannot recall it at all, I don't even have a veg recollection of it. I do remember contacting one or more people from Austrailia asking about particular machines, that could have been you. You may ask why not just go look at the PM. I would love to... if this site had a PM search feature(Feel free to forward it to me)

Anyways, there was nothing at all in any communications privately or publicly that lead me to believe anything about your gender, age, race, sexual preferences or background. As I said before, I just assumed you were male. I never put any thought into your gender until BBB referred to you as she. Only after that, I read a few of your current posts and that lead me to believe you were most likely a male. I just got that impression from how you talked/wrote(I don't think I would be alone in assuming that given a short sample size). I should not have assumed since I really don't know how people from Sydney talk/write as I have almost no experience with anyone from Sydney.

Just so you know, I was not calling you a dyke and my comment about them was not directed at you, or inspired by you. I have mentioned my bias towards them in the past(perhaps on a different forum, I don't recall.) It was just an afterthought I had during the conversation at the time.

Whatever the case, you are mostly okay in my book, I'm glad you are here posting. I hope you were not offended by anything I said. HFGL

Beachmonekey, you've probably figured out that some of the posters here seem to regress to their childhood or infantile state when dealing with a new woman.

Think: "juiciejennyie" a tragi-comic WoV farce if ever there was one.

One thing about nerds: they're usually socially maladroit.

Not that all WoVers are nerds: but a lot are.

Quote: MrV

Beachmonekey, you've probably figured out that some of the posters here seem to regress to their childhood or infantile state when dealing with a new woman.

Think: "juiciejennyie" a tragi-comic WoV farce if ever there was one.

One thing about nerds: they're usually socially maladroit.

Not that all WoVers are nerds: but a lot are.

maladroit... Wow. I had to look that up. I always thought that it was just an old Weezer album. So I looked it up... Hope this post saves someone some time.

Anyway, so dictionary.com says maladroit means:. lacking in adroitness; unskillful; awkward; bungling; tactless.

But what does adroitness mean?? I hate definitions that include words that I need to look up definitions for!

So here is what adroit means:.

expert or nimble in the use of the hands or body.
cleverly skillful, resourceful, or ingenious

Quote: Mission146

We actually used it, as kids, to refer to our own (male) equipment.

No doubt followed up by some bullying. Some kids are just asking for it (-;

I have never heard of it before either, I thought I was updated on all my urban slang.

here is what I found.
Monkey
Slang for the female genetalia, P***y!
Hey dog, that b***h has a fat a** monkey!!

I take it BM was not intending her name to mean BeachP***y.

When I think of a Beach Monkey(not our beachmonkey), I think of a cute, but evil, scurvy looking, little monkey that has sand mites and sand fleas, who might run off with my stuff and toss his s**t at me in the process. Where can I get one!!?

Well it turns out, sleeping in my 2 door car was never going to work. If I had a 4 door where I could actually lay down, maybe it would have worked. I lasted until about 2am moving from the cold parking lot to the parking garage until the left side of my back got strained out and couldnt sleep. Having a persistent cough and coughing up phlegm for the past 5 days after getting over a massive headache, I just couldnt last anymore in there and needed a proper sleep so i ended up finding the cheapest motel possible for 38 bucks a night.

As much as I love saving money, the combination of pain in my back as well as being sick just wasnt worth it to save $76.

I finally did win a session though of around $700 in one shoe, basically won every hand I got playing heads up. Not holding my breath though.

Quote: MrV

Beachmonekey, you've probably figured out that some of the posters here seem to regress to their childhood or infantile state when dealing with a new woman.

Think: "juiciejennyie" a tragi-comic WoV farce if ever there was one.

One thing about nerds: they're usually socially maladroit.

Not that all WoVers are nerds: but a lot are.

And who might you be referring to? If you think I should be included in that group feel free to say so, I won't take it as a PI.

Actually, i had no particular members in mind; as referenced, my comment was triggered by recalling the infamous juiciejennie thread.

Lots of time I don't pay attention to who posts what, I just recall the content.

To their credit (?) the level of clumsy idiocy, political incorrectness and juvenilie behavior shown by WoVers in this thread wasn't one tenth as tragi-comical as it was with JJ four years ago.

Ah, those were the days.