This is some ambient noise similar to a casino.

If you have CVBJ practice with this on fairly loudly then see what your count is. I find my count is a little off. Though I can practice with loud music on these sounds from an arcade very closely matches that of a casino. As in what the casino's environment is like this ambient noise is disorienting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5cR4sVWBkxI

Its not the noise as much as the visual stimulation
that breaks your concentration. We use the same
part of our brain to concentrate with, as we do to
filter and assess visual input. Its easy to become
overloaded with visual stimulation in a casino and
lose 50% of our ability to concentrate.

I'm sure this has happened to most people as kids. You're trying to count something and one of your friends starts saying random numbers to throw you off. Or you're trying to make a basket, and your friend is standing there mimicking your movement and planning on throwing another basketball at the same time at the same hoop.

If the casino really wants to throw you off, anything somewhat like what you're trying to do should be the most distracting.

Revel does not do that.

Quote: rxwine

If the casino really wants to throw you off, anything somewhat like what you're trying to do should be the most distracting.

What throws me off in roulette is other people
making bets and the dealer mucking chips
when I'm trying to decide the next bet. Its
a lot of visual annoying stimulation. Noise
not so much, I can tune that out.

Quote: EvenBob

What throws me off in roulette is other people
making bets and the dealer mucking chips
when I'm trying to decide the next bet. Its
a lot of visual annoying stimulation. Noise
not so much, I can tune that out.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-HVyFLm2mn3Q/Th7pwYdiuFI/AAAAAAAAABs/8QWG_DMoQH0/s1600/vibrating-shaking-circle-visual-illusion-768861.jpg

Quote: BigJer

If you have CVBJ practice with this on fairly loudly then see what your count is. I find my count is a little off. Though I can practice with loud music on these sounds from an arcade very closely matches that of a casino. As in what the casino's environment is like this ambient noise is disorienting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5cR4sVWBkxI

If you want real casino noise grab it yourself. Most phones can record audio (and if not most can do video), just start it recording and put it in your shirt pocket. My phone will record over an hour of audio and the file size is under 1MB.

Quote: MonkeyMonkey

If you want real casino noise grab it yourself. Most phones can record audio (and if not most can do video), just start it recording and put it in your shirt pocket. My phone will record over an hour of audio and the file size is under 1MB.

I forgot about my phone.

Hi, BigJer (and everyone else),

I'm new-ish to blackjack, but I think I've got the hang of basic strategy. So, now I've started thinking about card counting.

Is there a beginner's type system you'd recommend for someone like me? I was going to start with Ace-Five, but that system's received some lukewarm comments on this board.

I'd appreciate any advice you could give.

Thanks very much.

Quote: hmmm23

Hi, BigJer (and everyone else),

I'm new-ish to blackjack, but I think I've got the hang of basic strategy. So, now I've started thinking about card counting.

Is there a beginner's type system you'd recommend for someone like me? I was going to start with Ace-Five, but that system's received some lukewarm comments on this board.

I'd appreciate any advice you could give.

Thanks very much.

I would go with HiLo. Some of the other systems are not strong enough such as Ace-5. Or the advantage you get from stronger counts is not enough considering the mistakes you can make.

You mentioned that you think you have the hang of basic strategy. That's not enough. You have to know it even if a bomb goes off next to you.

Also, many people say it takes only a couple of months to master counting. I think it takes about one year to perfect it. But that means to carry on a conversation with the dealer, players, and never lose the count.

Here's my training tips for beginning and almost any level counter.

__________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Things I did to improve my game

Some of these things you may have already heard but there are other things that can benefit you. If they work for an ADHD/Dyslexic then they can work for anyone. Some of this information I got through reading and some I developed on my own.

Accuracy first. As usual B.S. first. The speed will come fairly fast afterward. Getting speed is a rather easier part of this. You do not know B.S. until a bomb goes off next to you and you can still play it. I had also found that memorizing the deviations is much easier after mastering basic strategy.

GET CVBJ! Indispensable! You will not realize how inaccurate you might be until you use it! When I first started out I thought there was something wrong with the software. But through focusing and concentration I got it down. That meant stopping, pausing and checking the count. If the count was off then click on “Show Last Hand” and see were you went off. After going through sometimes one shoe my head would hurt. LOL. Remember to focus! Focus! Focus! BTW, counting down a deck of cards and naming the last card is not the same thing.

Deviations.
Memorize only 2 - 3 a day. It makes them stick a lot easier. Don't try to memorize them all at once since you will get most of them confused. Also start with the "easy ones to memorize." For example, 16 vs 10; stand on RC>0. Another easy one is splitting 10 against 4,5,6 against 6,5,4. That's it for one day! In the next day or two learn a couple more. Also, remember that the main importance in deviations are for betting! It appears – from Stanford Wong – that the main EV comes from betting and not from the playing deviations. That is you can make more money by using BS then varying your bets according to the count than just using deviations to make plays. To emphasize, the importance lies in keeping an accurate count; to bet correctly.

To speed up/get better, use CVBJ. This is your speed workout! First one should not do this until they have been just practicing regularly for at least 3 weeks. Use the DD shoe face up. Also, using the 2D shoe the errors won't get carried on throughout a longer 6/8D shoe. Then boredom after checking the count with using the wrong count setting in. Using the 2D shoe enables you to go faster for that shorter period of time. (However, if you do see that the count is off then go back and see where you were off. You won't believe how consistently you might make a mistake in one area.) This is very good for speed work; take a short interval of intensity, take a short break, then repeat. Yes this does work in BJ as well as running track. Remember to focus! Focus! Focus! It might seem that you are focusing too much but the level of focus will come in handily later when distractions are put into the mix.

When playing on CVBJ turn up the speed until you have to focus fairly intensely – not extremely intensely - to keep the count. Then play at that level until you are very comfortable. Then repeat. You will be going faster than 90% of the dealers in a fairly short time; 2 – 3 weeks most likely.

Play with fairly loud music on in the background. Make it louder than what's in the casino. After you master counting putting some music on serves as a distraction. In the beginning this was one of the harder things for me. However I could, in a short period of time, keep the count accurately. Remember to focus! Focus! Focus!

Eating
. Get a snack every three hours or so along with plenty of water. It helps the brain stay sharp.

Have someone distract you while practicing. You might have them ask you a question. While you have music on in the background, see if you remember the count, then answer the question that was put forth to you. Try to talk to them while maintaining the count. Have then start off with a “So where are you from?” LOL. Then later extend the conversation to other things. Try “ordering a drink”. After you have gotten down the conversation some other questions to ask you are “What time is it”? Later, use more questions with numbers in it e.g. “how do you play a particular hand in B.S.? “ This of course is to confuse you with the count. Then check the count to see if you can still keep it. But remember to build up the length of the conversation and do not immerse yourself into it all at once. Just add one question at a time until you are still accurate with the count then add in another question. Remember to focus! Focus! Focus! Later someone can talk to you like a chatty dealer who won't shut the ^(*) up.

To stop getting confused when remembering if the count was a plus or minus keep the negative count in a foreign language. Yes that does seem to work. I have found that you will rarely be off.

Fatigue. After practicing for a while if your count gets off then stop and take a break - figure around 15 minutes. Also take note of how long it took you to get tired! Before that point is when you should stop during real play; figure around a shoe or two before. Don't worry about the length of play time for now. You will extend it at a steady pace. At one time I could only count maybe two or three shoes and now I am up to at least ten!

If you noticed that your game might have gone wrong in real play figure out what it was then practice at home. I have a lot of experience with this. In the beginning if the count was say +7 and the dealer announced a card total of 16 then I would sometimes start the count at 16! Or if anyone tried to talk to me I would most like lose the count. 
Sometimes I would just forget the count for no apparent reason. So at home I would just keep repeating the count to myself even more so. Or get up and do something for a very short time then try to remember the count. In play you will find yourself automatically correcting errors. Whenever a possible situation appears, in practice always try to remember the count first then check it. You want to work your brain.

In general what ever environment you experience in a casino practice it at home and make it much worse! So, if there are ploppies galore at the casino, when practicing at home setup the players in CVBJ to be bad players. The same goes for everything previously mentioned.

After getting speed down you might want to learn to play slower. What?!?! You said slower?!?!?! Yes I did. One of my favorite casinos has dealers that seem very slow. Though I love the rules there, my God, the dealers can be what seems like a slow motion death deal. Believe it or not, one can actually lose the count if the game is toooooo slooooow. So every so often practice going slow – then simulate with a friend by putting in the chatter mouth dealer and see how the counting goes. Myself with ADHD will almost die with a slow dealer. So it actually took some training for me to slow down to the speed of the dealer. But as usual, try to find a fast dealer: As it means more EV too. Semyon Dukach has this problem with slow dealers also. Mentioning that with a slow dealer he is more likely to lose the count. 

When practicing suddenly stop the game and check your concentration/focus. If you are not as sharp as could be then get focused. When restarting the game bear down and focus.

Also, these tips are not meant as a way to “power your way” through the challenges in counting. It's meant more to train your was to being a better, perfect player.

Note: A main purpose of these exercises is to take away the countenance of concentration. Aside from bet spreading I think that the look of concentration is a tell tale signal to the PC on catching a counter.

Remember that it's all about focus! Remember to focus! Focus! Focus! I understand that many things I said here seem like it's all a focusing issue due to my ADHD. However, I watched this one documentary on the MIT BJ Team and one person said that the focusing he had to do was almost as hard as working on his PhD. And you could teach a piece of firewood to count cards if the firewood could focus. This gives you the kind of idea of the different levels of intensity that's needed to count cards talked about here. 

And if I – an ADHD/Dyslexic - can do it, anyone can do it!

Part II

Been practicing and you discover that your count is consistently off. You've been going on for months and everything is perfect but then it's all of a sudden off. You say "What the heck has happened?" Here's some tips to get back your game.

1. Take at least one full day off. What is probably happening is you are getting tired/burned out. Yes, I know it's very hard but you have to take at least one day off. Maybe 2 or 3 might help even more.
2. The opposite of this is not practicing enough. If you find that you have not practiced enough, at least a few days a week including playing time in the casino then you must practice even more. It's surprising how fast your skills came deteriorate in a short time unless you have been playing for years.
3. Get some exercise! If you can, take a run. Nothing clears up your mind like a good run. Working out with weights is also good. However I think that running is the best.
4. Make sure you are hydrated! As little as one quart of water deficient, on average, can effect your concentration. Also, I have noticed that the air in casinos is dry due to the air conditioning.
5. Eating right. For example, when you go to the buffet, or eat at home, start off with salad. Again, drink some fluids.
6. If you have been practicing using CVBJ then try counting down decks. And if you are using only decks then use CVBJ.
7. Remember, of course, to take a break first.

A bomb? You're not planning anything I should know about, are you? jk.

Thanks for those excellent tips. I've got a couple follow up questions.

1. By "CVBJ" do you mean Casino Verte software? If y, I see it's nearly $100. I'm cool with necessary expenses, but is there any way to torrent/pirate/or otherwise swipe that software for free?

2. For the HiLo option, which of the 3 versions of HiLo on Wiki's chart is the most profitable system? Am I right in guessing that "HiLo Opt I" is the easiest to learn? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counting_cards#Systems

3. Have you ever been asked to leave a casino for card counting? Ever had goons sweat you down (or am I thinking of the movies)?

4. A buddy of mine's also interested in counting; would having a two player team improve our chances of profits? We were thinking that on good counts, one of us could signal the other to sit down and play large stakes hands, to avoid forcing the first guy to jump from small to large bets. But we're just kicking stuff around.

Thanks again for your help!

Quote: hmmm23

A bomb? You're not planning anything I should know about, are you? jk.

Thanks for those excellent tips. I've got a couple follow up questions.

1. By "CVBJ" do you mean Casino Verte software? If y, I see it's nearly $100. I'm cool with necessary expenses, but is there any way to torrent/pirate/or otherwise swipe that software for free?

I did not just read that about pirating. Spend the $100. You'll get it back.

Quote:

2. For the HiLo option, which of the 3 versions of HiLo on Wiki's chart is the most profitable system? Am I right in guessing that "HiLo Opt I" is the easiest to learn? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counting_cards#Systems

I would still go with HiLo.

Quote:

3. Have you ever been asked to leave a casino for card counting? Ever had goons sweat you down (or am I thinking of the movies)?

I've had one back off.

No goons like in the movies.

Quote:

4. A buddy of mine's also interested in counting; would having a two player team improve our chances of profits? We were thinking that on good counts, one of us could signal the other to sit down and play large stakes hands, to avoid forcing the first guy to jump from small to large bets. But we're just kicking stuff around.

Wait until you've perfected counting. But yes it would profitable.

Quote:

Thanks again for your help!

Quote: hmmm23

A bomb? You're not planning anything I should know about, are you? jk.

Thanks for those excellent tips. I've got a couple follow up questions.

1. By "CVBJ" do you mean Casino Verte software? If y, I see it's nearly $100. I'm cool with necessary expenses, but is there any way to torrent/pirate/or otherwise swipe that software for free?

Seriously?

And some of the AP's here wonder why the house thinks of them as cheats. You just illustrated why. Take a bow.

Quote: hmmm23

2. For the HiLo option, which of the 3 versions of HiLo on Wiki's chart is the most profitable system? Am I right in guessing that "HiLo Opt I" is the easiest to learn? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counting_cards#Systems

The one you can apply without screwing up*.

Quote: hmmm23

3. Have you ever been asked to leave a casino for card counting? Ever had goons sweat you down (or am I thinking of the movies)?

Too many movies. You can get backed off, but I'm guessing if you don't want to pony up the $100 for software your bankroll isn't the sort that inspires fear in the pit. We sometimes reduce penetration for known AP's, but the margin is so thin anyway we still want their business.

Quote: hmmm23

4. A buddy of mine's also interested in counting; would having a two player team improve our chances of profits? We were thinking that on good counts, one of us could signal the other to sit down and play large stakes hands, to avoid forcing the first guy to jump from small to large bets. But we're just kicking stuff around.

Well... it can't hurt to have a buddy that can also count, but most tables that would allow the sort of bets you'd need to make good money also don't allow mid-shoe entry. YMMV, of course.

The best way I know to really practice is to really play. Find yourself a cheap table, $5 or less and give it a spin. Nothing helps you learn better than actually doing the thing you want to learn, IMO. Or, you can sit at home and count down decks until you've "got it cold" and then go play $500/hand and see how that works out for you. :)


* When I can tell someone is a novice counter (and it's usually not too hard to spot), I like to have a bit of fun with them. I'll endless attempt to engage them in conversation that includes lots of words like: plus, minus, 1, 2, true, running, and count. Or, as a shocker, I'll just flat out ask them what they have the count as. I've seen that nearly knock them off the stool. Then, no matter what they say, I'll say I have it as +2 (or whatever is different than what they say). It's also fun to point out all the visual distractions.

deleted

Quote: Ibeatyouraces

It is even nicer when these rogue dealers are actually counters themselves and on your team where they will count as a spotter while working and signal in a BP without anyone making small waiting bets.

Good if you can find them I suppose, my gaming license is worth more to me than the fraction of the tips I might illicitly "earn".

deleted

Quote: MonkeyMonkey

Seriously?

And some of the AP's here wonder why the house thinks of them as cheats. You just illustrated why. Take a bow.

Lighten up.

Quote:

You can get backed off, but I'm guessing if you don't want to pony up the $100 for software your bankroll isn't the sort that inspires fear in the pit.

If you haven't made the assumption I'm a 23 year old student with a ton of debt, then I've done a poor job of dropping bread crumbs.

Quote:

When I can tell someone is a novice counter (and it's usually not too hard to spot), I like to have a bit of fun with them. I'll endless attempt to engage them in conversation that includes lots of words like: plus, minus, 1, 2, true, running, and count. Or, as a shocker, I'll just flat out ask them what they have the count as. I've seen that nearly knock them off the stool. Then, no matter what they say, I'll say I have it as +2 (or whatever is different than what they say).

You and I are very different kinds of people.

Quote: Ibeatyouraces

Tips? No no no.

I don't know then, there are just as many cameras in the parking lot/garage as there are on the floor. And FWIW, I'm not in any hurry to tarnish my integrity. I make enough money to live on comfortably and I sleep like a baby.

Quote: hmmm23

Lighten up.

Stop asking how you can get stuff illegally and you won't hear another word out of me about it.

Quote: hmmm23

If you haven't made the assumption I'm a 23 year old student with a ton of debt, then I've done a poor job of dropping bread crumbs.

I don't give a wet slap what your station in life is, if you haven't figured out that card counting won't even earn you some meager pocket change without a substantial bankroll you haven't done your homework. Stop watching movies like "21" and go try out these ideas in a casino.

Quote: hmmm23

You and I are very different kinds of people.

Probably so. I would never take on debt to go to school, too many other options. But you seem to have a penchant for the "easy way". Good luck with that.

deleted

Quote: hmmm23

1. By "CVBJ" do you mean Casino Verte software? If y, I see it's nearly $100. I'm cool with necessary expenses, but is there any way to torrent/pirate/or otherwise swipe that software for free?

If you would kindly peruse the Forum Rules, you'll see that this is a violation of Rule 8, which states, "Keep it legal." Software piracy is a violation of the laws of the United States, so you are essentially attempting to solicit information to aid you in the commission of an illegal act.

The Forum Rules are located here for your perusal:

https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/info/rules/2-forum-rules/#post37215

I'm going to take it for granted that you had not read the Rules prior to making this post, and give you a Board Warning (No Suspension) on this one. However, should you violate this particular Rule again, the Suspension will be lengthy.

Quote: Mission146

If you would kindly peruse the Forum Rules, you'll see that this is a violation of Rule 8, which states, "Keep it legal." Software piracy is a violation of the laws of the United States, so you are essentially attempting to solicit information to aid you in the commission of an illegal act.

That's very kind Mission, especially in light of the fact that you must check a box that says you read and agree to follow the forum rules when you sign up. The text with the checkbox even includes the same handy link you posted.

Or maybe we should just lighten up around here... I'm sure Michael won't have any problem with his site becoming synonymous with gambling software warez trading. ;)