Soft 18
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February 8th, 2013 at 6:08:35 AM
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Does anyone else see players continually misplaying Ace-7, or Soft 18? This seems to be the most misplayed hand in Blackjack (in my own personal observations, of course). Even some dealers give me strange looks whenever I hit or double, and I just shake my head.
Fighting BS one post at a time!
February 8th, 2013 at 6:25:16 AM
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Most people stand, against all cards. And occasionally give you a hard time when you do something different. Maybe... 1 in 20 players know that sometimes it is correct to hit or double. Some dealers I've met know too. I'd agree it's probably the universally most misplayed hand.
As an aside, I once met a Spanish21 dealer that knew to hit 3 card 17s against an A. That is dedication.
As an aside, I once met a Spanish21 dealer that knew to hit 3 card 17s against an A. That is dedication.
Wisdom is the quality that keeps you out of situations where you would otherwise need it
February 8th, 2013 at 7:25:32 AM
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I got yelled at by everyone when I hit my soft 18 against the 10 last night at Switch playing 3rd base. I got an 8 (derision), then 4 to get 20. The dealer unfortunately had 14 and hit the 6 to get to 20 and kick pretty much everyone's ass at the table. The dealer would have had 22 otherwise.
I yelled back at them. They left.
I yelled back at them. They left.
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You want the truth! You can't handle the truth!
February 8th, 2013 at 7:49:03 AM
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DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
February 8th, 2013 at 7:54:03 AM
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Quote: Beethoven9thDoes anyone else see players continually misplaying Ace-7, or Soft 18? This seems to be the most misplayed hand in Blackjack (in my own personal observations, of course). Even some dealers give me strange looks whenever I hit or double, and I just shake my head.
I think we had a thread like this but let me add splitting 4s and 9s and the always controversial 12 vs 2 and 3. Add to that the changes to a H17 game if you play one and you've got enough to start a riot!
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
February 8th, 2013 at 8:02:26 AM
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DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
February 8th, 2013 at 8:04:00 AM
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Try hitting a 12 on a "4" at Blackjack Switch with a full table and then run!
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You want the truth! You can't handle the truth!
February 8th, 2013 at 8:05:03 AM
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People lose their damn minds when you double A,8 against a 6 in a H17 game.
February 8th, 2013 at 8:50:58 AM
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DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
February 8th, 2013 at 8:54:26 AM
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Quote: IbeatyouracesI absolutely love doubling A,9 vs 5 or 6 when the count it high. Makes them run away as if you're splitting tens.
Now you're talkin'.
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
February 8th, 2013 at 9:15:05 AM
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We talked about soft 18, and how it's the most misplayed hand in blackjack, in the first episode of our podcast. Dr. Mike recalled the story of how he hit a soft 18 against the dealer's 10, and the dealer berated him mercilessly. "What a terrible move! You don't know what you're doing! I've been dealing this game for twenty years, blah, blah, blah."
YouCanBetOnThat.com, a podcast for the recreational gambler
February 8th, 2013 at 9:19:46 AM
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Most dealers learn the game from ploppies.
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
February 8th, 2013 at 10:40:40 AM
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What would be very interesting to see is a grid of basic strategy that you could alter for mistakes that are traditionally made by most players and see how the house edge is adjusted.
I can enivison a template where you can adjust the game rules (i.e. hit soft 17/stand soft 17, 2 decks vs. 6 decks, surrender, etc.) like you can in Wiz's template, but then also allow you to change the individual player decisions (i.e. never doubling on A/8, or not correctly splitting 9's, etc) and see what those errors contribute the that players actual H.E.
Big project for someone, but I bet that you could sell that for a nominal charge. Who's up for that, Mips/Teliot/ME/CrystalM/etc. I'd buy a copy for $20 or less.
I can enivison a template where you can adjust the game rules (i.e. hit soft 17/stand soft 17, 2 decks vs. 6 decks, surrender, etc.) like you can in Wiz's template, but then also allow you to change the individual player decisions (i.e. never doubling on A/8, or not correctly splitting 9's, etc) and see what those errors contribute the that players actual H.E.
Big project for someone, but I bet that you could sell that for a nominal charge. Who's up for that, Mips/Teliot/ME/CrystalM/etc. I'd buy a copy for $20 or less.
February 8th, 2013 at 9:32:08 PM
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The idea is to double a soft 18 against a loser dealer hand right? I gotta admit that I didn't know that at first but came to my attention when I was practicing on Wizard's blackjack trainer.
Maybe it's a good thing the dealer thinks you are an idiot if you double on a soft 18, maybe they will rate you at a higher house advantage.
Maybe it's a good thing the dealer thinks you are an idiot if you double on a soft 18, maybe they will rate you at a higher house advantage.
February 8th, 2013 at 9:39:15 PM
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Quote: ComplexEnigmaThe idea is to double a soft 18 against a loser dealer hand right? I gotta admit that I didn't know that at first but came to my attention when I was practicing on Wizard's blackjack trainer.
Maybe it's a good thing the dealer thinks you are an idiot if you double on a soft 18, maybe they will rate you at a higher house advantage.
There is no such thing as a loser dealer hand before you see the second card. Dealers bust less than 50% of the time on any upcard they are showing.
It's hard to give sound-bite reasons why one decision is different than others. If I had to give one I'd say that the chance of improving your hand is high enough that you want more money on the table, when balanced with the dealer's increased chance of busting.
February 8th, 2013 at 10:04:03 PM
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The wiz's simple strategy says to stay with a 12 against a dealer 2....but the custom game says to hit. Why the difference?
February 8th, 2013 at 10:07:44 PM
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Quote: BeardgoatThe wiz's simple strategy says to stay with a 12 against a dealer 2....but the custom game says to hit. Why the difference?
The simple strategy is designed for simplicity, not accuracy. Hitting 12 v 2 is the correct move.
February 8th, 2013 at 10:44:42 PM
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I got berated once for doubling soft 18 against a 6. He basically called me greedy. I ignored him. I think people are more forgiving when you hit it as opposed to situations when you double it.
February 9th, 2013 at 3:18:55 AM
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Quote: FourFiveFaceI got berated once for doubling soft 18 against a 6. He basically called me greedy. I ignored him. I think people are more forgiving when you hit it as opposed to situations when you double it.
Split your 10s when the know it all has a big bet up.
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
February 9th, 2013 at 4:23:07 AM
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Regarding dealers and who they learn from:
check out the videos the Wizard made that has Paigowdan teaching BJ. In the second video at about 2 minutes, Dan essentially uses the old canard "you assume the dealer has a 10" [not what he says, but essentially his point]. Now I think a lot of Dan, dealer extraordinaire, and I am sure he knows basic strategy better than me. But evidently he still has a memory of some bad stuff he learned from way back when, maybe from ploppies as 1BB says.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aB8s9eErMIM
check out the videos the Wizard made that has Paigowdan teaching BJ. In the second video at about 2 minutes, Dan essentially uses the old canard "you assume the dealer has a 10" [not what he says, but essentially his point]. Now I think a lot of Dan, dealer extraordinaire, and I am sure he knows basic strategy better than me. But evidently he still has a memory of some bad stuff he learned from way back when, maybe from ploppies as 1BB says.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aB8s9eErMIM
the next time Dame Fortune toys with your heart, your soul and your wallet, raise your glass and praise her thus: “Thanks for nothing, you cold-hearted, evil, damnable, nefarious, low-life, malicious monster from Hell!” She is, after all, stone deaf. ... Arnold Snyder
February 9th, 2013 at 4:25:43 AM
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This happens to me all the time. I tell them it is by the book after that I get hit with some old wisdom BS. I once got yelled by the !!dealer!!!! For splitting 4s against her six. It got so bad I called over the pit boss to shut her up. Just play right and watch other people's money drift away. I hate when people don't hit 12 vs 2. That normally pisses people off !$&@ them!!!!
February 9th, 2013 at 4:26:07 AM
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Quote: GstimThis happens to me all the time. I tell them it is by the book after that I get hit with some old wisdom BS. I once got yelled by the !!dealer!!!! For splitting 4s against her six. It got so bad I called over the pit boss to shut her up. Just play right and watch other people's money drift away. I hate when people don't hit 12 vs 2. That normally pisses people off !$&@ them!!!!
February 9th, 2013 at 6:08:59 AM
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Quote: GstimThis happens to me all the time. I tell them it is by the book after that I get hit with some old wisdom BS. I once got yelled by the !!dealer!!!! For splitting 4s against her six. It got so bad I called over the pit boss to shut her up. Just play right and watch other people's money drift away. I hate when people don't hit 12 vs 2. That normally pisses people off !$&@ them!!!!
You'd hate playing with me. Sometimes I hit it and sometimes I don't.
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
February 9th, 2013 at 6:37:54 AM
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My favorite is splitting 9's against an ace on a high count. It' s a pretty rare occurrence, but you get some weird looks, especially because you have a big bet out at the time. Hitting hard 17 against an ace on a high negative count is also a cool move, although you really shouldn't be at the table in this situation.
February 9th, 2013 at 7:29:35 AM
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DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
