Wellbush
Quote: WellbushDo you think MDawg's a fraud?I
Well, if you have to ask ...
Quote: MrVWell, if you have to ask ...
He didn't have to ask. It's a trolling trap question, anyway. Even if someone did think MDawg was a fraud, (I don't, by the way) they couldn't answer in the affirmative without violating the Personal Insult Rule. However, if they ignore the question, then someone can conveniently assume that they would have answered in the negative.
In the best possible light, it's an unfair question to ask (because a person who believes so could not answer yes without risking a ban) and is irrelevant and off-topic to this thread anyway. MDawg has stated that he does not follow a mechanical betting system of any kind, and even if he did, MDawg's claims would have zero bearing on the truth, falsehood, validity or invalidity of anything said by Wellbush in this thread.
In the worst possible light, one could interpret the question was being asked in the hopes that people would respond in the affirmative, and consequently, get themselves banned for personal insult for doing so.
Either way, the question is a trolling question, so what light you look at it in only changes the degree.
it was none. just a joke. but heyQuote: DieterThis is either trolling, an insult, or hate speech.
I don't care to figure it out; it's clearly out of line.
7 days.
is this an insult? believers have brains, too.Quote: Mission146For many believers (not necessarily anyone in this thread) of various (and unnamed) things, believers tend not to use science, mathematics and logic to address things because they have no grasp of those three things or how those three things might apply. I tend to believe, if they did, then they would no longer be believers.
i was referring to winning gamblers who do so on a permanent basis. not temporarily. why would i make an argument for temporary winners?Quote: Mission146There's nobody who ever said that, "Rare gamblers," may not be, at present, beating the casinos using a system. If there are enough people using systems, for a time, it becomes almost certain that more than zero of them are on the winning side at any given point. If you had 10,000 players all playing the Martingale, the number of trials (for each) required until they are all on the losing side AFTER a given trial is huge.
the post has got nothing to do with MDawg, per se. i was using MDawg as an example of someone beating the casinos on a permanent basis. that was on topic in the conversation i was having.Quote: Mission146
Why would you ask a question such as, "Do you think MDawg's a fraud?" I wasn't aware that this thread was about him.
i don't think so.Quote: Mission146
Even if someone thought MDawg was a fraud, it's not as if that person could say so without violating Forum Rules. Thus, you are asking a question that a person is required to:
A.) Ignore---which could be interpreted as them answering, 'No,' even if they believe the answer is yes.
what's wrong with that?Quote: Mission146
B.) Respond to with a, "No."
i don't necessarily think so. posters can give an affirmative answer in all sorts of ways without breaking the rules.Quote: Mission146
C.) Say, "Yes," (if that's what the respondent actually believes) and get suspended.
dittoQuote: Mission146
Please explain how asking that question is not trolling.
dittoQuote: Mission146He didn't have to ask. It's a trolling trap question, anyway. Even if someone did think MDawg was a fraud, (I don't, by the way) they couldn't answer in the affirmative without violating the Personal Insult Rule. However, if they ignore the question, then someone can conveniently assume that they would have answered in the negative.
In the best possible light, it's an unfair question to ask (because a person who believes so could not answer yes without risking a ban) and is irrelevant and off-topic to this thread anyway. MDawg has stated that he does not follow a mechanical betting system of any kind, and even if he did, MDawg's claims would have zero bearing on the truth, falsehood, validity or invalidity of anything said by Wellbush in this thread.
In the worst possible light, one could interpret the question was being asked in the hopes that people would respond in the affirmative, and consequently, get themselves banned for personal insult for doing so.
Either way, the question is a trolling question, so what light you look at it in only changes the degree.
Quote: Wellbushit was none. just a joke. but hey
My misunderstanding.
Waka waka waka.
Quote: MrVWell, if you have to ask ...
Regarding the tales of winning 50 out of 52 times and all that, is MDawg a fraud? Interesting question. It's a very different question from "Is MDawg lying?"
Now let me break down the "Is MDawg lying" question first. If I reported to you every time I made 10 out of 10 free throws in practice, and skipped reporting every time I did not, is that lying? Technically, it's not lying.
And if I then went on bragging about my free throw shooting and how people were always watching me and complimenting me on my foul shooting, would I be lying? Who knows, but possibly not. If I only tell you the comments made by people who watched me sink 10 out of 10 and skipped the comments (like "you suck, loser") when I made 6 out of 10, is that lying? No, it's self-serving, biased reporting, but it's not technically lying.
Where it turns into lying, and being a fraud, is if somebody directly asks, "So, your foul shooting includes every session you practice?" and you say yes when the answer is no. Then you are a liar and a fraud. But up to that point, you're just guilty of seeing how gullible people are.
Now as to fraud, if I give a lecture to Emily's School for Morons, Imbeciles, and Idiots (using the old formal IQ classification categories -- look it up) and I tell Emily's students that I ride a dragon and kill evil casinos for a living, and all of Emily's students believe me, is that fraud? If people are incapable of ascertaining reality from fairy tales, then the issue, I suppose, really is not on my end. It's on the end of the Morons, Imbeciles, and Idiots.
In conclusion, selective reporting of reality isn't really fraud unless you pin the person down with a statistical, not an anecdotal, series of questions, and then they lie.
And second, if people are unable to grasp what is and isn't possible when the claims are outrageous, that's partly because they are attending, whether intentionally or not, Emily's School for Morons, Imbeciles, and Idiots (using the old formal IQ classification, of course, and not meant as any judgement).
Quote: redietz
Now as to fraud, if I give a lecture to Emily's School for Morons, Imbeciles, and Idiots (using the old formal IQ classification categories -- look it up) and I tell Emily's students that I ride a dragon and kill evil casinos for a living, and all of Emily's students believe me, is that fraud? If people are incapable of ascertaining reality from fairy tales, then the issue, I suppose, really is not on my end. It's on the end of the Morons, Imbeciles, and Idiots.
In conclusion, selective reporting of reality isn't really fraud unless you pin the person down with a statistical, not an anecdotal, series of questions, and then they lie.
And second, if people are unable to grasp what is and isn't possible when the claims are outrageous, that's partly because they are attending, whether intentionally or not, Emily's School for Morons, Imbeciles, and Idiots (using the old formal IQ classification, of course, and not meant as any judgement).
I am a little confused here, what happens if the person who gives the lecture at the Emily school puts his very real name and home address on the blackboard and makes note of it when he begins his lecture? Resulting in the students comprised of Morons, Imbeciles, and Idiots start laughing at him for supplying that information. Many of the students then start calling him a moron, imbecile, and idiot should those students be suspended, considering their lack of understanding?
Quote: BoSoxI am a little confused here, what happens if the person who gives the lecture at the Emily school puts his very real name and home address on the blackboard and makes note of it when he begins his lecture? Resulting in the students comprised of Morons, Imbeciles, and Idiots start laughing at him for supplying that information. Many of the students then start calling him a moron, imbecile, and idiot should those students be suspended, considering their lack of understanding?
BoSox, I think it's self evident I don't much care if Morons, Imbeciles, and Idiots are laughing at or with me. If you'd like me to post my name and address here, just ask. I'll oblige. No hay problema, senor.
I'm not some anonymous wannabee card counter upset that some people with a k in their name make an actual living at it.
For those looking up my address on google maps, check in on me Sunday. After a month of no yard work and what looked like corn growing out of the gutters, I finally had a crew start cleaning up the premises. They should wrap up by Saturday, so google the address Sunday, if you would. The place had been a mess; Tennessee got clobbered with storms the last few weeks. It's not necessarily my only address (for example, I lived in Orange for two years while maintaining this property), but it is my favorite. No state income tax, and it looks as if the Unabomber lives here, as my girlfriend says. Always a plus. The timber on the property may be worth more than the house.
My real name has been out there publicly vis-a-vis gambling since 1979. So that's nothing new.
Quote: redietz
For those looking up my address on google maps, check in on me Sunday.
This matters not until one of the Google street view cars tours your neighborhood again.
It's not a live feed.
Unless I am misreading, this
<<I'm not some anonymous wannabee card counter upset that some people with a k in their name make an actual living at it.
>>
refers to the person whom you are quoting and to whom you are responding above,
and <<Morons, Imbeciles, and Idiots>> refers to, since it is a continuation of your addressing the rhetorical question about MDawg, anyone who believes in MDawg.
All seem to be testy, insulting comments.
But...why? What's the big deal. Why not just cultiver votre jardin and leave people alone to believe what they will. Why do you care if some believe and some do not? And what's this nonsense about how people must uncloak themselves on anonymous forums in order to be credible?
Quote: Dieter
It's not a live feed.
somewhere in some neighborhood the police have access to alot of those doorbell cameras and you have no choice whether or not it happens or not
Quote: heatmapsomewhere in some neighborhood the police have access to alot of those doorbell cameras and you have no choice whether or not it happens or not
Amazing things we do these days.
I knew most of the doorbell cameras had been compromised by illicit actors; I didn't realize Google was using those feeds to update Street View.
I was most disappointed when I learned google earth wasn't going to be live. The possibilities were endless.
I used to compete against myself. 25 right handed followed by 25 left handed. Then best of 7 etc, etc.
Much easier to make a higher percentage in the park or an empty gym.
But in a real game when your uniform is drenched in sweat, you're grabbing your shorts to catch your wind, and you took it in the nuts stepping down for a charging foul? Just making one free throw is easier said than done. Then try it when the crowd goes silent and both teams clear the floor. Making it sends the game to OT. A miss sends your team to the locker with an L.
THAT's when all those free throws in the park or empty gym come in handy.
were you on duty or playing?Quote: Marcusclark66Had one the other night where a player got so upset with another he actually swatted his stack of chips and then slugged the guy for making the wrong decisions when to pull as well.
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Quote: WellbushAs usual, I had some bird sitting near me complain about my BJ play. trying to tell me I wasn't hitting when i should, and that it was effecting the cards she was getting, and making her lose. i tried telling her whatever i did had no effect on her, and that the continuous shuffle machine made sure of it. she wouldn't buy it. she was bleeding chips real fast, too. another at the table backed my case, too. that was more than enough for her and she up and left. meanwhile, i still had plenty of chips..the gall of her!
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That is not accurate. If you receive your third card before she does, your actions absolutely affect her cards.
In the long run, your actions will even out, but in the short term every decision you make directly changes her potential hand. I wouldn't change my decisions, but your choices absolutely effect the players that come after you.
Quote: Marcusclark66Had one the other night where a player got so upset with another he actually swatted his stack of chips and then slugged the guy for making the wrong decisions when to pull as well.
Good.
Somebody simply has to teach those ploppies how to play the game.
no, i was on her left, which i presume would be the same as in the US. so she got dealt before I, which made her accusation even more ridiculousQuote: billryanlink to original post
That is not accurate. If you receive your third card before she does, your actions absolutely affect her cards.
In the long run, your actions will even out, but in the short term every decision you make directly changes her potential hand. I wouldn't change my decisions, but your choices absolutely effect the players that come after you.
Quote: Wellbushwere you on duty or playing?link to original postQuote: Marcusclark66Had one the other night where a player got so upset with another he actually swatted his stack of chips and then slugged the guy for making the wrong decisions when to pull as well.
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On duty at the property I was working at.
I was going to say the same thing. Well said.Quote: billryanQuote: WellbushAs usual, I had some bird sitting near me complain about my BJ play. trying to tell me I wasn't hitting when i should, and that it was effecting the cards she was getting, and making her lose. i tried telling her whatever i did had no effect on her, and that the continuous shuffle machine made sure of it. she wouldn't buy it. she was bleeding chips real fast, too. another at the table backed my case, too. that was more than enough for her and she up and left. meanwhile, i still had plenty of chips..the gall of her!
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That is not accurate. If you receive your third card before she does, your actions absolutely affect her cards.
In the long run, your actions will even out, but in the short term every decision you make directly changes her potential hand. I wouldn't change my decisions, but your choices absolutely effect the players that come after you.link to original post
Quote: billryanAccording to my wifi, there has been an FBI surveillance van parked down the block from me for the past few months. Maybe you could tap into their video feeds.
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I was most disappointed when I learned google earth wasn't going to be live. The possibilities were endless.
Bill my daughter always list her wifi as FBI Surveilance Van just to scare the tweakers in the neighborhood.
i'm not quite following you there. this is European bj in australia. there can be no effect on the dealer's hand. all hands are played from the right side of the table, to the left. there is no hole carding, no peeking, and no surrender. once the player's hands are dealt with, the dealer turns over his face down second card, and finishes his hand. payouts then ensue. no player on someone's left can effect players on their right, coz all players to someone's right have their hands completed first.Quote: billryanAs your actions directly affect the dealer's hand, it also affects the players who went before you, as well.
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the guy who slugged seems like a lunatic. does that happen often?Quote: Marcusclark66Quote: Wellbushwere you on duty or playing?link to original postQuote: Marcusclark66Had one the other night where a player got so upset with another he actually swatted his stack of chips and then slugged the guy for making the wrong decisions when to pull as well.
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On duty at the property I was working at.link to original post
i'm not saying there's any effect my friend. are you following what you yourself are posting?Quote: billryanThat could be the next Wellbrush Paradox. How can something that has zero long-term effect have a huge short-term one?
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Quote: Wellbushi'm not quite following you there. this is European bj in australia. there can be no effect on the dealer's hand. all hands are played from the right side of the table, to the left. there is no hole carding, no peeking, and no surrender. once the player's hands are dealt with, the dealer turns over his face down second card, and finishes his hand. payouts then ensue. no player on someone's left can effect players on their right, coz all players to someone's right have their hands completed first.link to original postQuote: billryanAs your actions directly affect the dealer's hand, it also affects the players who went before you, as well.
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Players to the right can affect players to the left. You are right of dealer so your hits and stands affect dealer. What happens to dealer affects whole table.
Easy example, you are the last player and have 12 vs dealer 3. You stand. Dealer turns over and 9 for 12 and draws a 9 for 21. Whole table loses. If you had hit your 12, as basic strategy advises, you would have had the 21 and dealer may have busted.
Quote: Wellbushi'm not quite following you there. this is European bj in australia. there can be no effect on the dealer's hand. all hands are played from the right side of the table, to the left. there is no hole carding, no peeking, and no surrender. once the player's hands are dealt with, the dealer turns over his face down second card, and finishes his hand. payouts then ensue. no player on someone's left can effect players on their right, coz all players to someone's right have their hands completed first.link to original postQuote: billryanAs your actions directly affect the dealer's hand, it also affects the players who went before you, as well.
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Let's say you are in the middle of the table. Two players on either side. For simplification, all five players are dealt 16s and the dealer is showing a five. All the players stand and the dealer reveals a ten for a total of 16. As everyone stood, the first card out in the second round belongs to the dealer. It is a five and everyone loses.
Back it up and now you hit your 16, and you get the five for a total of 21. The next two people stand on their 16s and now the dealer takes the second card of the round- a ten. He busts and everyone wins. All because you took a card and affected the entire table.
In this case, an unorthodox move saved the entire table. Had you stood, everyone loses. By hitting everyone won. The players to your left and the players to the right. It could just as easily gone the other way and your hit might cause everyone to lose, just as easily.
Every card put in play affects every hand and every card after it. If you play the game for the long term, this will even out.
However, those who claim there is no long run and care for short term results...........
yes, true. but over all hands played over any reasonable length of time, each player should get their maximum possible return if they are playing according to basic strategy. that's what's documented on various gambling sites. the effect of some hands by various players sitting in various positions at the table, would even out over any reasonable length of time.Quote: unJonlink to original post
Players to the right can affect players to the left. You are right of dealer so your hits and stands affect dealer. What happens to dealer affects whole table.
Easy example, you are the last player and have 12 vs dealer 3. You stand. Dealer turns over and 9 for 12 and draws a 9 for 21. Whole table loses. If you had hit your 12, as basic strategy advises, you would have had the 21 and dealer may have busted.
yes, correct. it can work both ways - favourably and unfavourably. the bird sitting to my right was losing coz of mostly her play. the effect of others would have been fairly negligible.Quote: billryanlink to original post
Let's say you are in the middle of the table. Two players on either side. For simplification, all five players are dealt 16s and the dealer is showing a five. All the players stand and the dealer reveals a ten for a total of 16. As everyone stood, the first card out in the second round belongs to the dealer. It is a five and everyone loses.
Back it up and now you hit your 16, and you get the five for a total of 21. The next two people stand on their 16s and now the dealer takes the second card of the round- a ten. He busts and everyone wins. All because you took a card and affected the entire table.
In this case, an unorthodox move saved the entire table. Had you stood, everyone loses. By hitting everyone won. The players to your left and the players to the right. It could just as easily gone the other way and your hit might cause everyone to lose, just as easily.
Every card put in play affects every hand and every card after it. If you play the game for the long term, this will even out.
However, those who claim there is no long run and care for short term results...........
Quote: Wellbushthe bird sitting to my right was losing coz of mostly her play. the effect of others would have been fairly negligible.
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You may be underestimating how superstitious people can be at a gambling table.
Since your style of play clearly did not meet her standards, despite her noble and heroic efforts to restore the lucky flow of the cards to her position, you may be to blame.
This is nonsense, of course. Play your hand well, do well. Play your hand poorly, get poor results.
👍Quote: DieterYou may be underestimating how superstitious people can be at a gambling table.
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Since your style of play clearly did not meet her standards, despite her noble and heroic efforts to restore the lucky flow of the cards to her position, you may be to blame.
This is nonsense, of course. Play your hand well, do well. Play your hand poorly, get poor results.
I lost, okay, how could you say always?
I reminded the guy and he had trouble remembering. Twas about 8 years back. Took him a little while, but after I explained the situation, it surfaced in his mind, too. I wonder how many of us have the same kind of experiences when we visit a casino?
Quote: Marcusclark66Had one the other night where a player got so upset with another he actually swatted his stack of chips and then slugged the guy for making the wrong decisions when to pull as well.
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I would love to play with that guy. I would bet minimum and do everything that would piss him off.
Quote: DRichQuote: Marcusclark66Had one the other night where a player got so upset with another he actually swatted his stack of chips and then slugged the guy for making the wrong decisions when to pull as well.
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I would love to play with that guy. I would bet minimum and do everything that would piss him off.link to original post
He was banned from our properties as well as being arrested, the patron he hit signed a complaint with law enforcement that responded.
But I heard today that the patron desires to withdraw the charge. Not up to us, he has to talk to the District Attorney's Office.
obviously for Asian women, it's a cultural thing...gambling.
while i was at this bj table playing for a couple of hours, winning and losing, this asian bird drops in. she's playing for about 30 mins. then at one moment she just stops and stares at me. i don't quite know how to put this, but i think she was sussing me out in some way. what way? i couldn't tell. as mentioned, i don't normally frequent casinos so i don't know if "come ons" are normal in this environment, or she had some other motivation. just thought it was interesting.
For the most part, these women are just looking for guidance to win at the tables. In other words, if they notice someone who tends to win, they latch on to him, at the tables. And yes, many of them are quite wealthy. In the not so distant past, one of them (not Asian) made it clear she wanted to see me as part of a relationship but I told her I was married.
Asian society is probably fairly patriarchal, and you really notice this at the Baccarat tables. In general, the player who places the high wager is followed by the others at the table (with notable exceptions, when someone from another group, typically a different race - not Asian - bucks heads and bets against), and that person with the high wager who chooses the hand usually ends up being a man. Which means that the women tend to follow the men's choices in Baccarat hands. At least - put it this way - no Asian man is going to want to seem like he is following a woman's hand choices at the tables.
Now at blackjack, that's a whole different story. There are many girls at blackjack tables that are not wealthy, and are just in the casino to have fun. In the past, when I was single, I met more than a few really really hot very young American girls at the tables that I dated, from all over the West Coast, East Coast, from everywhere.
But over all, it is interesting, to see some of these clearly really wealthy Asian women showing up at the tables regularly, alone. Where are their husbands? I never see them, if they are even married. And on some of them I note clearly the lack of any wedding ring. All of the ones I have met are quite sweet, but there is a sadness to them as they wonder why they can't win, and unfortunately, most of them do lose - but just come back with more and more money to play anyway.
these are serious insultsQuote: sabreA little casual racism and misogyny on a Monday morning.
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i see. that's the thing. so many asian women, sometimes with one or two other asian women, without any man to be seen, with money and playing at the tables. and, as you say, they don't appear to be winning. i don't really get why they chew through so much cash. obviously it's the enjoyment. somehow i don't make the connection that women can be like this. i'm caucasian and i just don't think other races feminine population, are the same.Quote: MDawgI have become friends with a number of women in casinos, and at the Baccarat tables most of the women tend to be Asian, although I have met women of all races at the tables.
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Asian society is probably fairly patriarchal, and you really notice this at the Baccarat tables. In general, the player who places the high wager is followed by the others at the table (with notable exceptions, when someone from another group, typically a different race - not Asian - bucks heads and bets against), and that person with the high wager who chooses the hand usually ends up being a man. Which means that the women tend to follow the men's choices in Baccarat hands. At least - put it this way - no Asian man is going to want to seem like he is following a woman's hand choices at the tables.
Now at blackjack, that's a whole different story. There are many girls at blackjack tables that are not wealthy, and are just in the casino to have fun. In the past, when I was single, I met more than a few really really hot very young American girls at the tables that I dated, from all over the West Coast, East Coast, from everywhere.
But over all, it is interesting, to see some of these clearly really wealthy Asian women showing up at the tables regularly, alone. Where are their husbands? I never see them, if they are even married. And on some of them I note clearly the lack of any wedding ring. All of the ones I have met are quite sweet, but there is a sadness to them as they wonder why they can't win, and unfortunately, most of them do lose - but just come back with more and more money to play anyway.
i can't say the same about men, though. men are clearly prepared to gamble.
Quote: Wellbushthese are serious insultslink to original postQuote: sabreA little casual racism and misogyny on a Monday morning.
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Speaks to his opinion of the post, not of you personally. Keep trying.
Quote: Mission146Quote: Wellbushthese are serious insultslink to original postQuote: sabreA little casual racism and misogyny on a Monday morning.
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Speaks to his opinion of the post, not of you personally. Keep trying.link to original post
I tend to agree.
i don't. i was just stating facts, and musing on those facts. sabre was speaking to what he thought were my opinions.Quote: DieterQuote: Mission146Quote: Wellbushthese are serious insultslink to original postQuote: sabreA little casual racism and misogyny on a Monday morning.
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Speaks to his opinion of the post, not of you personally. Keep trying.link to original post
I tend to agree.link to original post
obviously for Asian women, it's a cultural thing...gambling."
Maybe it's a cultural thing, but these are not facts.
they are when i go. how are they not?Quote: billryan"mainly Asian women. they come and they play at table games, and they got money! i could be wrong but i think most of them are addicted.
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obviously for Asian women, it's a cultural thing...gambling."
Maybe it's a cultural thing, but these are not facts.
