FleaStiff
FleaStiff
Joined: Oct 19, 2009
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October 14th, 2010 at 7:37:05 AM permalink
>When and why did they change it? I thought craps has always been the same.
They changed their website that showed the diagrams. They didn't change anything about how the game is played, just the website that showed how bets are positioned.
"you should whether that is you or not"??? is that a typo?
Yeah, typo. I gotta stop posting drunk.
It should have been you should know whether that is you or not. If a dealer says to the Stick something about a certain bet for "my three", you should know if that dealer is talking about you or someone else. Its just that if you are following what is happening you will more likely catch the dealer mistakes. Most crews are alert and capable, but mistakes do get made. Particularly at places where there are very few Don't Players and then I show up.
soulhunt79
soulhunt79
Joined: Oct 8, 2010
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October 14th, 2010 at 11:01:32 AM permalink
I've seen all but #4.

The only one I'd add up there is a wrong payout on a passline odds bet. The dealer has a stack of red and white in their hands and instead of paying me 4 red/2 red I get 4 red/2 white.



In general the ones I've seen missed most often is the bets that are inconsistent. Betting the Field 20% of the time for example. Any bet I have out there all the time the dealer is remembering. Other ones he has to look at the table and verify. I'm not saying that is good, just something that I assume comes with practice. Newer dealers are probably far more likely to miss bets like that than dealers that have been there for years.
kenarman
kenarman
Joined: Nov 22, 2009
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October 14th, 2010 at 12:51:18 PM permalink
I usually see very few mistakes with my bets but I bet a regular pattern that the dealers quickly learn. I have had many more instances when the dealer has caught a bet I missed and reminded me.

I also always mention to the dealer when I have pressed a bet during hot roll and a busy table. ie I have all the numbers covered with come bets and having been just getting paid on and off. If I press the next come bet I always let them know before they start the on and off payout without noticing the pressed bet.

If have always found if you work with the dealers and tip you will always get good service and the benefit of the doubt on a missed payout.
Be careful when you follow the masses, the M is sometimes silent.
soulhunt79
soulhunt79
Joined: Oct 8, 2010
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October 14th, 2010 at 1:30:10 PM permalink
Quote: kenarman

I usually see very few mistakes with my bets but I bet a regular pattern that the dealers quickly learn. I have had many more instances when the dealer has caught a bet I missed and reminded me.



This has actually been my experience too. I've missed a few come bets and a few have let me still put it up. I'm sure I just lost that money again, but the number of times where they have helped me has exceeded the number of times they made a mistake.
focd
focd
Joined: Sep 15, 2010
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October 14th, 2010 at 9:20:18 PM permalink
Quote: soulhunt79

I've missed a few come bets and a few have let me still put it up.


Can you explain to me what this means? Does it mean you didn't actually put up a bet and they let you bet on it still? Thinking about it, why would you want to add a late come bet? If the point is rolled, wouldn't the odds be against you?
superrick
superrick
Joined: Jul 14, 2010
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October 14th, 2010 at 11:07:11 PM permalink
focd

Here is the deal; most casinos now have a lot of dealers that donít know what they are doing, depending on the casino you are playing at!

Bigger casino will have better dealers, most of the time, but like everything else in life this does not hold true all the time! You need to know what you have bets on, and also make sure the dealer books the bets, donít take anything for granted; itís your money not theirs and you need to look out for it!

Some dealers shouldnít even be in a casino thatís how bad they are, on the other hand there are some great dealers, but any more they are getting harder to find!

Learn how to count where your bet is placed, start with the first chip the is placed in the place number box, from the left hand side if you are standing on the right side of the table, then count them around to where you have your chips in the chip rack. If you are placing them in the 4 chip rack then you are the fourth chip to the right side counting from left to right.

Make sure all your bets get put there every time you make a bet on any point!

Try these;

1. Dealers payís everybody on the table on a seven out, when a dealer from a different casino spoke-up and told them that they just paid on a seven out. The dealers told him they knew what they were doing and continued to pay on every seven that was made.
The suit was nowhere to be found, and everybody on the table was screaming at the top of their lungs every time a seven was made! That had to be the best one I ever saw in a casino, we still talk about it with the dealer that told them that it was a seven out and you donít pay on a seven out! 
This happened in a small casino with a bunch of break-in dealers!
 
2. Dealers that leave your odds up when you are betting come bets, and a seven was made on the come out roll.

3. Dealers that leaves your hardway bets up when the point was made soft. This can happen a lot if you have the dealers up on a bet under your control!

4. Dealers pay you the wrong amount, in your favor, needless to say it happens the other way around too!

5. Dealers do not book the bet and it hits, make sure the dealers book every bet you put down on the table!

6. Dealers pay your bet to someone else; this can happen a lot at night. There buddy is getting paid on your bets and you are not. The dealer just moved you bet over to his buddies spot on the box. This will happen when you have drunks on the table, watch out for this move by an unscrupulous dealer that doesnít think he is getting paid enough, and wants to make his pay check off you!

7. Dealers that forget to pay your place bet, because you only place bet, and will not have a PL be unless you have the dice. This happens all the time if you bet like me, if someone established the 8 as a point, and I want to bet on it, I still place bet it and will never have a PL bet!

8. Dealers mark up the wrong point.

9. Dealers that are asleep at the table, I always play the grave yard shift!

10. Dealers that insist on placing your bets on the PL when you already told them you do not want them there!

Well there are 10! Next up, lets see what else you guys can come-up with I have a lot more, but I am sure you guys have a bunch more you can come up with!
Note, all my post start with this is just my opinion...! You do good brada ..! superrick Winning comes from knowledge and skill when your betting and not reading fiction http://procraps4u2.myfanforum.org/index.php ...
FleaStiff
FleaStiff
Joined: Oct 19, 2009
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October 15th, 2010 at 1:16:16 AM permalink
I sure have never experienced everyone getting paid on a Seven but I have experienced dealers taking all come bets on a Seven-Out.

Note: Its probably helpful to say Stick's left or right or Boxman's Left or perhaps Right or Dealer's Left and Right,

I've been told "You have money on the table" when I say thank you and start to walk away. I've probably been able to keep track of my bets when I started playing, but time and beverages and losses play a role. For the dealers I would imagine its: Time, Lack of Beverages and Lack of Tips that affects their alertness levels. Usually dealers know what they are doing but sometimes they just are not paying attention. I've had a DontCome bet that had not traveled or not been paid when 2 was rolled. Oddly enough I've noticed that an empty table can have mistakes because with only 2 or 3 minimum bettors at the table the dealers can be mentally elsewhere.
SanchoPanza
SanchoPanza
Joined: May 10, 2010
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October 15th, 2010 at 7:50:52 AM permalink
One mistake that I use to see what dealers are up to is when I have both lay bets and don't come bets live and I ask for the lay bet to come down. If the dealer is doing it by rote, they will start taking down behind the line.
soulhunt79
soulhunt79
Joined: Oct 8, 2010
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October 15th, 2010 at 9:18:05 AM permalink
Quote: focd

Can you explain to me what this means? Does it mean you didn't actually put up a bet and they let you bet on it still? Thinking about it, why would you want to add a late come bet? If the point is rolled, wouldn't the odds be against you?



Yes, It has only happened like 3-4 times that I can remember, generally after a 2/3/12 is rolled AND where the shooter has been going a while where I'm sitting there with all my numbers covered and I rarely have to put up anymore money. I just miss that my come bet was taken down because craps was rolled.

So next roll comes up there isn't a come bet but a 6 is rolled. Normally I would still be up on it, instead they just pay me and I'm off the 6.


I know it is making my odds worse. I'd be better off with a place bet depending on which number is rolled. How much I don't know, but it can't be massive since this situation rarely happens. Also since it generally happens on a table where I'm winning big, I care even less. :)
RaleighCraps
RaleighCraps
Joined: Feb 20, 2010
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October 15th, 2010 at 2:32:09 PM permalink
Quote: soulhunt79

I know it is making my odds worse. I'd be better off with a place bet depending on which number is rolled. How much I don't know, but it can't be massive since this situation rarely happens. Also since it generally happens on a table where I'm winning big, I care even less. :)



This is where the Vegas 3-4-5x odds comes into play. Assume a $5 PL bet (but it doesn't matter what the base bet is). If you take the full 3-4-5x odds offered, you will end up getting paid the EXACT same amount, as if you had place bet it. Therefore, the ONLY thing that makes the PL w Odds bet any better is the comeout 7/11 winner (which is reduced by the 2,3,12 loser).

So, when you miss the come bet, and they 'let' you put the '6' up anyway with full odds, it is the exact same thing as if you had just place bet the 6 for $30. HOWEVER, if you had place bet it, you could take it down if you desire. With the come bet, you could only take back your odds. The base bet would have to stay.

There is one case though where I agree with putting the come bet up anyway. You are establishing with the box that you are making this bet, and you are willing to take the bet. However, this means that if a 7/11 was rolled, they should be willing to pay you for the missed bet.

If you get on a table that has 5x odds or greater on all of the points, then the 'late' come bet is a better deal for you than the place bet. Of course, this is what they call a PUT BET. Not every casino allows PUT bets, but I know the Tunica and Biloxi casinos do. A PUT bet is basically making a Come bet on the number you choose. you are forgoing the comeout roll advantage, but you get to PUT your bet on your number, and then put full odds behind it. Again, you can take back your odds at any time, but the base PUT bet has to stay until resolved.

$10 base bet on a 10x table.
$120 place bet 6 will pay $140
$10 put bet 6 with $100 odds will pay $130
Slight advantage to PUT bet the 6/8 on a 10x table.

$100 place bet 5 will pay $140
$10 Put bet 5 with $90 odds will pay $145 (pays $160 if you take the full $100 odds)
Put bet on the 5/9 is a much better deal

$100 Buy bet on the 4 pays $195 (200 less the 5 vig)
$10 Put bet 4 with $90 odds pays $190
So Put bet is worse than the Buy bet.
Always borrow money from a pessimist; They don't expect to get paid back ! Be yourself and speak your thoughts. Those who matter won't mind, and those that mind, don't matter!

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