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bbvk05
bbvk05
Joined: Jan 12, 2011
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January 15th, 2011 at 8:33:41 PM permalink
Just threw it over to "YES". The state should not force anyone to enter into contracts just because those contracts are frequently offered to other people.
P90
P90
Joined: Jan 8, 2011
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January 15th, 2011 at 9:21:35 PM permalink
Sure. Casinos should be encouraged to ban any player who is winning, and are free do decide whether to pay monetary value for his chips, not pay it, or confiscate the chip, the latter being advised in case of winning players. Here is the solution to America's gambling problem, brought on a silver platter.

Seriously speaking, there are virtually no casino games where a non-cheating player can actually win long-term (counting hole-carding and shuffle-tracking as mild forms of cheating). They don't offer 100.2% payback on VP for no reason, it wouldn't change the paytable much to offer 99.8%; they offer it to make players feel they are at an advantage.
In Blackjack, it's impossible to gain an edge flat-betting; you can have perfect playing and insurance efficiency, know the exact composition of the remaining deck/shoe, and the house will still be ahead. High table maximums are designed to provoke tourists to overbet their bankroll and lose their winnings and more, and the possibility of counters taking advantage of it is a fair price to pay.

Offering games that can be beaten, advertising them with the implication they can be beaten, and then banning anyone actually trying to beat them is nothing more than a mild form of "extract their losses, keep their winnings" business strategy.


Having said that, I don't believe it is the state's duty to regulate casinos to stop these practices. As a libertarian, I believe it is the players' duty to ignore casinos practicing this business model. Nonetheless, it still does strongly reek of mob mentality.
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rxwine
rxwine
Joined: Feb 28, 2010
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January 15th, 2011 at 11:47:12 PM permalink
Hmm, suppose you have this scenario... A car dealer offers a free item just for showing up. They do it every weekend. Finally, the dealer notices that some of the same people keep showing up and getting the free items, but never contribute anything to the bottom line. So, they make it a point to say these people aren't welcome and ban them from the lot. But they keep advertisiing the same ad, every week, "free item, just for showing up". Which is true, except for certain people. And the ad never says that certain people will be barred.

Okay, I don't know if that was such a good comparison (but I tried)/
Quasimodo? Does that name ring a bell?
P90
P90
Joined: Jan 8, 2011
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January 15th, 2011 at 11:52:32 PM permalink
Well, it's kind of different. High-skill players still play the game and pay for playing. But since the game involves both chance and skill, they have a greater chance of getting ahead than average players. That's really all there is to it.

I agree the casinos should have means of recourse against players trying to use them as five to nine, but most "counters" that get caught this way are random guys that just read about Hi-Lo and have no idea about camouflage. And even then the means of recourse can be simply limiting a player to 1-2 bet spread (well enough to defeat any advantage possible from counting); bans are a vindictive measure, not defensive.
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Wavy70
Wavy70
Joined: Nov 3, 2009
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January 16th, 2011 at 12:09:57 AM permalink
I agree they should ban people who know how to play. Conversely they should invoke the "Calvinball" rules from Calvin and Hobbes.
I have a bewitched egg that I use to play VP with and I have net over 900k with it.
P90
P90
Joined: Jan 8, 2011
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January 16th, 2011 at 5:34:03 AM permalink
"Sir, could you please leave the establishment? You can leave your chips with me and we will not press charges."
"What did I do?"
"This is the second time you hit 16 against a 7. We do not take kindly to this sort of behavior here."
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40487
40487
Joined: Dec 14, 2009
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January 18th, 2011 at 2:31:47 AM permalink
Hey pay them not to play. A few AP's can do damage not only in their claims, but also can wipeout tables, and stop other players from sitting down. If there's
a history with that player in that casino. Can keep bets down, and the ones that likes to carry cheerful conversations as they feed on 3 hours of acomplishment.
Yeah pay them, it would help me..
Success comes before work, only in the dictionary.
Ibeatyouraces
Ibeatyouraces
Joined: Jan 12, 2010
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January 21st, 2011 at 10:37:31 AM permalink
deleted
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
dm
dm
Joined: Apr 29, 2010
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January 21st, 2011 at 12:45:36 PM permalink
Quote: Ibeatyouraces

Counting in no way is cheating in ANY form and the lawmakers and courts have said so. Cheating is a FELONY and I am sure if counting was cheating that the casinos would have these/us players locked up and the key thrown away.




If counting is legal then why can't you record the played cards on a machine or computer program? You're saying it's legal to count in your head but not on a machine?
toastcmu
toastcmu
Joined: Nov 11, 2009
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January 21st, 2011 at 12:55:39 PM permalink
Quote: dm

If counting is legal then why can't you record the played cards on a machine or computer program? You're saying it's legal to count in your head but not on a machine?



Bingo. Most gaming statutes state that using an "aid" to count is prohibited. Since card counting can be done with your brain, they can't make it illegal without throwing everyone out of the casino. They will make it harder for you to count, but it's legal according to the statutes.

-B

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