EvenBob
EvenBob
Joined: Jul 18, 2010
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February 6th, 2014 at 12:50:51 AM permalink
Quote: Mission146

I'm talking dollar amounts based on a chart I saw, I'll find it within the next eighteen hours.



We just had a thread about this a few months ago,
roulette is doing well, it always does well. It will
always do well, they love the 35/1 payout.
"It's not enough to succeed, your friends must fail." Gore Vidal
Tomspur
Tomspur
Joined: Jul 12, 2013
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February 6th, 2014 at 12:54:51 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

More than twice as big, 10 times as big. Go to a casino
in the UK or France or Germany and all you see is roulette
tables. Some casinos will have 20 tables of roulette and 5 of
BJ. Same in S America and Africa. It's a fascinating game
and will be here long after the others have gone the way
of Faro..



I didn't want to sound like I was hyperbolizing :)

I have actually dealt many of those roulette games were you cannot see the layout and the stacks of chips look like sky scrapers. Most fun I have ever had dealing!

I also dealt to Johnny Clegg (look him up if you don't know the name). Facinating character and between all the primping and doing coke, he is a super human being :)
“There is something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a man.” - Winston Churchill
Mission146
Mission146
Joined: May 15, 2012
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February 6th, 2014 at 2:41:28 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

Holy cow, Mission, wrong on all counts. Most (most!) of
the people I see playing roulette in local joints and
in Vegas are under 35. And as far as making money, it's
doing better in Vegas % wise than BJ. It's holding it's
own as it always has and always will. 200 years and
counting, it's the original casino game.

The numbers came out a few months ago, roulette is
not fading in the least.



Roulette, as of 2012, had held its own pretty well on The Strip with a loss of revenue of 5.7% and a loss of roughly 4% of tables across the State. As relates The Strip, Roulette was only out-performed in revenue by Baccarat, which had a dramatic revenue increase:

http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/11263-table-games-dying-in-nevada/2/#post180595

On the other hand, for Off-Strip, rest of Clark County and Nevada, Roulette performed terribly in revenue being beaten (slightly) by Craps and significantly by Three-Card Poker, Mini-Baccarat, Let it Ride, Pai-Gow Poker and, "Other Games," in terms of percentage lost of revenue:

http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/11263-table-games-dying-in-nevada/2/#post180636

In terms of revenue share:

http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/11263-table-games-dying-in-nevada/4/#post180803

You'll see that Blackjack, as expected, significantly defeats Roulette, as does Craps, particularly Off-Strip. Baccarat does almost nothing Off-Strip, but probably beats Roulette overall just with The Strip numbers. Three-Card Poker and Pai-Gow Poker both had revenues fairly close to Roulette Off-Strip.

Roulette was a distant third according to a report from Atlantic City posted here in 2011:

http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/6289-is-roulette-a-dying-game/#post88123

Finally, there is the study from the thread you referenced, and you are correct that Roulette outpaced Craps:

http://gaming.unlv.edu/reports/strip_game_mix.pdf

However, this study seems only to consider the Strip, and Roulette performed relatively better on The Strip than it performed Off-Strip and the rest of Nevada pursuant to the links above. That's true in terms of revenue decline.

Furthermore, this is just the unit share by game for Roulette still being at 9.98% for 2012, it doesn't mean Roulette ADDED tables necessarily, you could take other tables away, which would cause Roulette to increase in relative presence while not actually adding any tables. In fact, we happen to know that Roulette lost a few tables in recent years, just less than other games on a relative basis.

You'll also see that, "Others," which includes Proprietary Games, has over twice the presence of Roulette, just on The Strip.

Roulette and Craps are back and forth in revenue share, it's true that Roulette was superior in 2009, 2010 and 2012, but Craps had superior revenues as recently as 2011 and every year prior to 2009.

Furthermore, it's the same thing as Table Count, if less people gamble, in general, then Roulette will stay relatively the same but gain relative market share in terms of revenue. In terms of revenue, of course, Baccarat (which I assume includes proprietary variations) and Blackjack utterly dominate Roulette and the category, "Others," exceeds Roulette slightly.

Baccarat also does well for its variations, and the same can be said for Blackjack variations and side bets...and that's what this is...a Roulette side bet.

Worthy of note is that Baccarat has over FOUR TIMES the revenue share of Roulette on virtually the same share of physical tables... In 2011, Baccarat did over 4.5 times what Roulette did on FEWER tables.

Side bets are where it's at, you can have Blackjack and Baccarat, but keep them fresh, and that's what DoubleLuck is attempting to do with Riverboat Roulette. He's not trying to reinvent the wheel (weak pun, I know) just to improve it.

I make no claims as to Roulette's performance overseas, though I do know the Rules are generally better. I would also be interested in seeing these same numbers for Off-Strip and rest of Nevada casinos, because with the earlier data in the posts linked towards the top, it seemed as though Roulette did disproportionately better on the Strip.
Vultures can't be choosers.
Paradigm
Paradigm
Joined: Feb 24, 2011
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February 6th, 2014 at 6:17:02 AM permalink
Congratulations DoubleLuck Bros! I will be in Vegas the first weekend in May staying Downtown and will certainly give it a look at The D. I am not a big roulette player, but we observe and ask around at The D to see what the dealers are saying about the game.

Including the UK trials, how many RIver Boat Roulette tables are now in play?
doubleluck
doubleluck
Joined: Jun 16, 2012
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February 6th, 2014 at 6:31:11 AM permalink
Quote: Paradigm



Including the UK trials, how many RIver Boat Roulette tables are now in play?

Thanks, Mike!

Total installations to date are still just the two. We also have commitments for two more in NY state but chose to focus our efforts on getting the game into Las Vegas first. We just feel Vegas gives us the greatest potential to make the biggest impact -- especially with the concentration of properties. Additionally, when we were at Raving's we had contacts from Las Vegas express real interest in the game but flatly stated they would not be the first to move on it. The constant theme was, "Get it installed in another property first". As a result, once we get the 2-3 going in the downtown area, we'll look to get the others installed in the NY property.
DJTeddyBear
DJTeddyBear
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
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February 6th, 2014 at 7:02:19 AM permalink
Congrats. Best of luck, Luck Brothers!



(Now if I could only get someone interested in Poker For Roulette...)
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁 Note that the same could be said for Religion. I.E. Religion is nothing more than organized superstition. 🤗
doubleluck
doubleluck
Joined: Jun 16, 2012
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February 6th, 2014 at 7:03:45 AM permalink
Quote: DJTeddyBear

Congrats. Best of luck, Luck Brothers!

Thanks DJ!

Quote: DJTeddyBear

(Now if I could only get someone interested in Poker For Roulette...)

I'm sure there are casinos out there that will take a shot....you just have to put it in front of them. I've found that most people are not in the buying mode when you call them on the phone or just show up at their doorstep. You have to be in the marketplace where they're shopping and looking to buy -- Exhibit. While it may be pricier, the rewards are bigger and most importantly you are better in control of making contacts and your own destiny.
Paradigm
Paradigm
Joined: Feb 24, 2011
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February 6th, 2014 at 7:20:00 AM permalink
Two tables become four tables with the Vegas installs, that sounds like some good momentum to me!

I agree with you on the "come back with some performance data" response from prospective clients. We have a few of those types of "opportunities" as well. Hoping that variance smiles favorably on both of our trials so we can turn those into additional installs. Best of Luck :-)!
CrystalMath
CrystalMath
Joined: May 10, 2011
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February 6th, 2014 at 7:51:48 AM permalink
Congratulations, Luck Brothers! Seems to be a good month for new indy-installs. Wishing you success!

You guys are from Spring, right? I used to live in north Houston, right next to IAH.
I heart Crystal Math.
Buzzard
Buzzard
Joined: Oct 28, 2012
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February 6th, 2014 at 8:22:44 AM permalink
Josie and I lived in Houston ( Katy ) in the 80's, but got paroled after 3 years.
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet

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