WoV Challenges

WoV Challenges

Note, these challenges are non-negotiable & will be conducted on a date & time that all parties agree to. Never will there be multiple challenges conducted at the same time or on the same day. Anyone I trust can be the bagman or a 3rd party member.

A) John Henry vs the Steam Engine - I challenge any & as many WoV members who want to participate, to a match of speed in which the player who produces the correct answers the fastest wins all the buy-ins. The buy-in will be a minimum of $1,000 (I will agree to any amount of money I can get my hands on, I have spoken to multiple backers who have agreed to spot me as much money as needed for this specific challenge) from every player & there will be only 1 question. Once all players have agreed & are ready to begin the challenge, a 3rd party WoV member will be required to provide the question (& have the correct answers to compare). Once this happens, the challenge will commence. The question is: What is the probability of making the total deck's poker hand rankings (we already have the correct hand ranking order) from 4 cards drawn (without replacement) using a modified deck of X amount of face values, Y amount of suits & Z amount of colors? The values of X & Y & Z need to be ≥ 5 & ≤ 1,000...You're correct for thinking that a deck with 1,000 face-values, 1,000 suits & 1,000 colors would give you a deck of one hundred million cards. However, to get full credit for the answers, the player must 1st have the exact number of hands per hand ranking & then provide a recording of the full process of how they achieved the answers. (For the sake of consistency the Ace will always be the highest card & 2 will always be the lowest so that a straight will not cross from the 2nd highest rank, to the ace, then the 2). The 3rd party is responsible for coming up with the values of X & Y handling the money, plus evaluating the answers. Once someone provides the answers with the exact number of hands per hand ranking, the challenge will be put on pause to review their work & allow the player to upload the video footage of their process. Players can use any method to obtain the answer, as long as it follows these criteria: A) Players must start from scratch and not use any previous work. B) Players must input everything by hand, copy & paste from within the players work by hand is acceptable but programming macros to complete tasks is not. C) The use of software (such as a spreadsheet) to do calculations is acceptable. The use of software that was not written by hand within the time of the challenge is unacceptable. Writing computer code to solve the answers is however acceptable. D) The video upload must demonstrate how the player came up with the answer, or how the player's work product by hand came up with the answer (if not then it must be assumed that the player cheated). No explanation is necessary for any mental math. If the player who proved the answers the fastest has an error in their work then the challenge is voided & the same question with different values for X, Y & Z will be chosen & the process will repeat until there is a winner. P.S. Any contestant (doesn't matter if you win or lose) who refuses to publish (within 24 hours from the completion of the challenge) their recording of their work during the challenge to YouTube & leave the video public for a month, will receive a 1-year suspension from WoV.

Side Bet - I will accept 1 to 1 odds from any WoV member (as long as I can get the money) that I can solve the correct answers for challenge A in under 3 hours with the aid of my phone to use google spreadsheets.

B) Cash Game Poker - I challenge any WoV member to a heads up poker match. The game will either be No-Limit Texas Hold'em, Mississippi Stud, Lowball & of course California Roll. The location will be at an agreed-upon location prior to accepting the challenge, with a felted card table (I don't play online). The opponent will provide a dealer for the game. All games will start with me shuffling the deck followed by the dealer shuffling & then me cutting the deck (& I get to complete the cut) right before the dealer deals the cards. All buy-ins will be $100 (nothing more, nothing less) and will be converted into chips of equal value. The challenge is over after 8 hours of time (not game time) has passed since the challenge started, or a player refuses to re-buy after busting out. There will be a 15-minute break in between every 1 of gameplay, even if players are in the middle of a hand. Players are required to make plays after 1 minute of time has passed with a verbal 30-second countdown. Any player who refuses to make a play after the 30-second countdown has expired will be forced to fold their hand. This challenge must be live-streamed (allowing anyone I choose to record the match from any angle except directly behind the players (the dealer is not considered a player). The footage also must be uploaded to my YouTube channel. At any point, if anyone (including the dealer) is caught cheating then the match is over & the cheater must pay either the opposing player or both players 3 times their current chip value. Once the match is complete all chips will be exchanged for the correct cash value with no fees.

C) Slot Game Search - I challenge anyone WoV member to find any casino slot machine with the slot game (main game) having a game per hour (gph) of ≤ .6 a second. If you look carefully at my previous post I never said I challenged rdw4potus to find a slot game that was < 3 seconds, but rather challenged him to back-up his claim that he could find an American slot machine with the main game ghp speed 5 times faster than 3 seconds! Remember the Royal Slots is < .5 seconds ;)

I think the challenge should automatically include WTflush & rdw4potus as contestants, since they were offering the challenge after all. I think we should give them 24 hours to find such a machine or they should put up a month of suspension. If I lose then I'll put up the month of suspension. Sounds fair, right?

D) Math Championship - I challenge any WoV member to a mathletes competition where all questions are equally divided into the chosen math subjects that both competitors agree to. I don't want to hurt anyone's feels so how about the loser buy the winner dinner whenever things go back to normal (if they ever do).

Quote: USpapergames

C) Slot Game Search - I challenge anyone WoV member to find any casino slot machine with the slot game (main game) having a game per hour (gph) of ≤ .6 a second. If you look carefully at my previous post I never said I challenged rdw4potus to find a slot game that was < 3 seconds, but rather challenged him to back-up his claim that he could find an American slot machine with the main game ghp speed 5 times faster than 3 seconds! Remember the Royal Slots is < .5 seconds ;)

Are you claiming IF your machine was in a casino you could get out 7200 actual spins an hour including any bonus rounds etc?

I haven't clocked the exact number of spins you can get out on some of the slots I have come across that are super fast, I just know it's instant flash stopping and credits as fast as you can push the button.

Aside from an advantage player I don't know who would want to do that.

I vaguely remember some online casino (perhaps it was a btc casino) where you entered the number of games and how much you wanted to bet along with some other options. It instantly played all the games and showed the outcome of each game played and your final results.

Quote: USpapergames

WoV Challenges

Note, these challenges are non-negotiable & will be conducted on a date & time that all parties agree to. Never will there be multiple challenges conducted at the same time or on the same day. Anyone I trust can be the bagman or a 3rd party member.

A) John Henry vs the Steam Engine - I challenge any & as many WoV members who want to participate, to a match of speed in which the player who produces the correct answers the fastest wins all the buy-ins. The buy-in will be a minimum of $1,000 (I will agree to any amount of money I can get my hands on, I have spoken to multiple backers who have agreed to spot me as much money as needed for this specific challenge) from every player & there will be only 1 question. Once all players have agreed & are ready to begin the challenge, a 3rd party WoV member will be required to provide the question (& have the correct answers to compare). Once this happens, the challenge will commence. The question is: What is the probability of making the total deck's poker hand rankings (we already have the correct hand ranking order) from 4 cards drawn (without replacement) using a modified deck of X amount of face values, Y amount of suits & Z amount of colors? The values of X & Y & Z need to be ≥ 5 & ≤ 1,000...You're correct for thinking that a deck with 1,000 face-values, 1,000 suits & 1,000 colors would give you a deck of one hundred million cards. However, to get full credit for the answers, the player must 1st have the exact number of hands per hand ranking & then provide a recording of the full process of how they achieved the answers. (For the sake of consistency the Ace will always be the highest card & 2 will always be the lowest so that a straight will not cross from the 2nd highest rank, to the ace, then the 2). The 3rd party is responsible for coming up with the values of X & Y handling the money, plus evaluating the answers. Once someone provides the answers with the exact number of hands per hand ranking, the challenge will be put on pause to review their work & allow the player to upload the video footage of their process. Players can use any method to obtain the answer, as long as it follows these criteria: A) Players must start from scratch and not use any previous work. B) Players must input everything by hand, copy & paste from within the players work by hand is acceptable but programming macros to complete tasks is not. C) The use of software (such as a spreadsheet) to do calculations is acceptable. The use of software that was not written by hand within the time of the challenge is unacceptable. Writing computer code to solve the answers is however acceptable. D) The video upload must demonstrate how the player came up with the answer, or how the player's work product by hand came up with the answer (if not then it must be assumed that the player cheated). No explanation is necessary for any mental math. If the player who proved the answers the fastest has an error in their work then the challenge is voided & the same question with different values for X, Y & Z will be chosen & the process will repeat until there is a winner. P.S. Any contestant (doesn't matter if you win or lose) who refuses to publish (within 24 hours from the completion of the challenge) their recording of their work during the challenge to YouTube & leave the video public for a month, will receive a 1-year suspension from WoV.

Side Bet - I will accept 1 to 1 odds from any WoV member (as long as I can get the money) that I can solve the correct answers for challenge A in under 3 hours with the aid of my phone to use google spreadsheets.

B) Cash Game Poker - I challenge any WoV member to a heads up poker match. The game will either be No-Limit Texas Hold'em, Mississippi Stud, Lowball & of course California Roll. The location will be at an agreed-upon location prior to accepting the challenge, with a felted card table (I don't play online). The opponent will provide a dealer for the game. All games will start with me shuffling the deck followed by the dealer shuffling & then me cutting the deck (& I get to complete the cut) right before the dealer deals the cards. All buy-ins will be $100 (nothing more, nothing less) and will be converted into chips of equal value. The challenge is over after 8 hours of time (not game time) has passed since the challenge started, or a player refuses to re-buy after busting out. There will be a 15-minute break in between every 1 of gameplay, even if players are in the middle of a hand. Players are required to make plays after 1 minute of time has passed with a verbal 30-second countdown. Any player who refuses to make a play after the 30-second countdown has expired will be forced to fold their hand. This challenge must be live-streamed (allowing anyone I choose to record the match from any angle except directly behind the players (the dealer is not considered a player). The footage also must be uploaded to my YouTube channel. At any point, if anyone (including the dealer) is caught cheating then the match is over & the cheater must pay either the opposing player or both players 3 times their current chip value. Once the match is complete all chips will be exchanged for the correct cash value with no fees.

C) Slot Game Search - I challenge anyone WoV member to find any casino slot machine with the slot game (main game) having a game per hour (gph) of ≤ .6 a second. If you look carefully at my previous post I never said I challenged rdw4potus to find a slot game that was < 3 seconds, but rather challenged him to back-up his claim that he could find an American slot machine with the main game ghp speed 5 times faster than 3 seconds! Remember the Royal Slots is < .5 seconds ;)

I think the challenge should automatically include WTflush & rdw4potus as contestants, since they were offering the challenge after all. I think we should give them 24 hours to find such a machine or they should put up a month of suspension. If I lose then I'll put up the month of suspension. Sounds fair, right?

D) Math Championship - I challenge any WoV member to a mathletes competition where all questions are equally divided into the chosen math subjects that both competitors agree to. I don't want to hurt anyone's feels so how about the loser buy the winner dinner whenever things go back to normal (if they ever do).

In section A, shouldn’t it be a billion, not 100 million? Welcome back. And HNY! As far as B, Shouldn’t you mention Blind size, and whether or not there will be antes? I would love to be judge for that one!

USpapergames,

I will propose a challenge to you. Texas Holddem like challenge.

The players will have their choice of three starting hands. The three starting hands will be AKo, a pair of fours, or 89s. One player gets to choose their starting hand of the three. The next player gets to choose one of the remainning two hands. A flop is dealt, the turn is dealt, and the river is dealt. The person with the best hand wins. We will repeat this game 500 times. The player that wins the most hands wins the challenge.

I am willing to bet up to $1000 if you are interested. You can choose who deals the cards and we will use a standard deck of poker cards.

Quote: USpapergames

B) Cash Game Poker - I challenge any WoV member to a heads up poker match. The game will either be No-Limit Texas Hold'em, Mississippi Stud, Lowball & of course California Roll. The location will be at an agreed-upon location prior to accepting the challenge, with a felted card table (I don't play online). The opponent will provide a dealer for the game. All games will start with me shuffling the deck followed by the dealer shuffling & then me cutting the deck (& I get to complete the cut) right before the dealer deals the cards.

Quote: USpapergames

So I used to be a real card mechanic. You can ask any one of the SF performers that work the pier, I was a performing card magician for a couple of years & had my own street performers license. I have straight out cheated many poker games using nothing more than my hands & the deck they provided. I would never even once consider using that machine over my cardsharp skills & I'm nowhere close to the best. But I have slights today that would impress you more than that table.

Uh...

Quote: ThatDonGuy

Quote: USpapergames

B) Cash Game Poker - I challenge any WoV member to a heads up poker match. The game will either be No-Limit Texas Hold'em, Mississippi Stud, Lowball & of course California Roll. The location will be at an agreed-upon location prior to accepting the challenge, with a felted card table (I don't play online). The opponent will provide a dealer for the game. All games will start with me shuffling the deck followed by the dealer shuffling & then me cutting the deck (& I get to complete the cut) right before the dealer deals the cards.

Quote: USpapergames

So I used to be a real card mechanic. You can ask any one of the SF performers that work the pier, I was a performing card magician for a couple of years & had my own street performers license. I have straight out cheated many poker games using nothing more than my hands & the deck they provided. I would never even once consider using that machine over my cardsharp skills & I'm nowhere close to the best. But I have slights today that would impress you more than that table.

Uh...

I was wondering why he needed to touch the deck at all if theres a dealer.


Whatever the case.... I'm willing to play him a heads up Texas holdem cash game if he ever gets to Las Vegas. We can have a trusted member deal the cards or play in a real casino.

I'll do D.

Quote: AxelWolf

Are you claiming IF your machine was in a casino you could get out 7200 actual spins an hour including any bonus rounds etc?

I haven't clocked the exact number of spins you can get out on some of the slots I have come across that are super fast, I just know it's instant flash stopping and credits as fast as you can push the button.

Aside from an advantage player I don't know who would want to do that.

I vaguely remember some online casino (perhaps it was a btc casino) where you entered the number of games and how much you wanted to bet along with some other options. It instantly played all the games and showed the outcome of each game played and your final results.

AxelWolf, you smart....How did you just now come to the conclusion that Royal Slots can do > 7,200 games an hour when I have been saying this the entire time??? BTW you are very wrong about what the players like and if you conducted some player analysis for slots you would know that slot a LARGE percentage of slot players specifically play slot machines because of the games per hour!!!

Quote: SOOPOO

In section A, shouldn’t it be a billion, not 100 million? Welcome back. And HNY! As far as B, Shouldn’t you mention Blind size, and whether or not there will be antes? I would love to be judge for that one!

Your correct, 1 billion. So FWI, I originally had the challenge set to use the standard poker hand rankings from a standard deck with any face values and suits from 5 to 1,000 so originally I had the number set to 1 million but then when I changes the challenge to the royal decks hand rankings to make the challenge more difficult, I totally made a careless mistake in the math lol.

As to the antes & blinds, I did set the blinds when I started the game would be a $1-2 game, if I had mentioned antes there would be antes ;)

Quote: DRich

USpapergames,

I will propose a challenge to you. Texas Holddem like challenge.

The players will have their choice of three starting hands. The three starting hands will be AKo, a pair of fours, or 89s. One player gets to choose their starting hand of the three. The next player gets to choose one of the remainning two hands. A flop is dealt, the turn is dealt, and the river is dealt. The person with the best hand wins. We will repeat this game 500 times. The player that wins the most hands wins the challenge.

I am willing to bet up to $1000 if you are interested. You can choose who deals the cards and we will use a standard deck of poker cards.

:( That's not even a challenge but rather just taking someone's money through ignorance of probability :( There have been plenty of cheats that I've cheated in the past, but what you just tried to pull was way beyond my comfort level. Even if I was an idiot at probability theory you still shouldn't be manipulating people into taking a challenge that they actually have 0 chance at winning :(

Quote: ThatDonGuy

Quote: USpapergames

B) Cash Game Poker - I challenge any WoV member to a heads up poker match. The game will either be No-Limit Texas Hold'em, Mississippi Stud, Lowball & of course California Roll. The location will be at an agreed-upon location prior to accepting the challenge, with a felted card table (I don't play online). The opponent will provide a dealer for the game. All games will start with me shuffling the deck followed by the dealer shuffling & then me cutting the deck (& I get to complete the cut) right before the dealer deals the cards.

Quote: USpapergames

So I used to be a real card mechanic. You can ask any one of the SF performers that work the pier, I was a performing card magician for a couple of years & had my own street performers license. I have straight out cheated many poker games using nothing more than my hands & the deck they provided. I would never even once consider using that machine over my cardsharp skills & I'm nowhere close to the best. But I have slights today that would impress you more than that table.

Uh...

Hopefully, you read the rest of the comments to that thread. Guys, it's not possible to cheat if I as the player only gets to cut the cards. Did you guys read the section of the challenge that talks about the rewards the other player gets for catching cheaters??? Serious, I would have to be able to pull a cold deck switch right in front of everyone to be able to cheat the way the challenge is constructed. The difference is that I'm ok with the dealer attempting to cheat since I actually know the best chests & in one of the very few poker players in the world to ever catch a dealer cheating at a poker table. So again, I'm not worried about cheating and neither should anyone else who takes on the challenge. I will spot any cheater plus I have a poker reputation to defend so obviously I'm not going to cheat, especially when I don't need to win. Plus it's not like the stakes are anywhere close enough for me to even consider creating. No joke, the game needs to have more than a million dollars on the table for me to even consider cheating at any game ;)

Quote: USpapergames

:( That's not even a challenge but rather just taking someone's money through ignorance of probability :( There have been plenty of cheats that I've cheated in the past, but what you just tried to pull was way beyond my comfort level. Even if I was an idiot at probability theory you still shouldn't be manipulating people into taking a challenge that they actually have 0 chance at winning :(

You may be an idiot on probability theory, how did you conclude that there is a 0% chance of winning? If you can't explain it we will all just assume that you are.

Quote: AxelWolf

Quote: ThatDonGuy

Quote: USpapergames

B) Cash Game Poker - I challenge any WoV member to a heads up poker match. The game will either be No-Limit Texas Hold'em, Mississippi Stud, Lowball & of course California Roll. The location will be at an agreed-upon location prior to accepting the challenge, with a felted card table (I don't play online). The opponent will provide a dealer for the game. All games will start with me shuffling the deck followed by the dealer shuffling & then me cutting the deck (& I get to complete the cut) right before the dealer deals the cards.

Quote: USpapergames

So I used to be a real card mechanic. You can ask any one of the SF performers that work the pier, I was a performing card magician for a couple of years & had my own street performers license. I have straight out cheated many poker games using nothing more than my hands & the deck they provided. I would never even once consider using that machine over my cardsharp skills & I'm nowhere close to the best. But I have slights today that would impress you more than that table.

Uh...

I was wondering why he needed to touch the deck at all if theres a dealer.


Whatever the case.... I'm willing to play him a heads up Texas holdem cash game if he ever gets to Las Vegas. We can have a trusted member deal the cards or play in a real casino.

Sounds good to me, but why wait for me to come to Vegas. I know it will happen eventually but you could always come to California ;)

Quote: Wizard

I'll do D.

Happy accept, but let's wait till this whole covid thing blows over so we could do the challenge properly with buzzers & all math work done by hand, the challenge was supposed to be fun anyways ;)

Quote: DRich

You may be an idiot on probability theory, how did you conclude that there is a 0% chance of winning? If you can't explain it we will all just assume that you are.

Sorry, my LPD kicked in there. I mean that the player who goes 1st would have a zero % chance of gaining an edge in the game (statistically).

Quote: DRich

USpapergames,

I will propose a challenge to you. Texas Holddem like challenge.

The players will have their choice of three starting hands. The three starting hands will be AKo, a pair of fours, or 89s. One player gets to choose their starting hand of the three. The next player gets to choose one of the remainning two hands. A flop is dealt, the turn is dealt, and the river is dealt. The person with the best hand wins. We will repeat this game 500 times. The player that wins the most hands wins the challenge.

I am willing to bet up to $1000 if you are interested. You can choose who deals the cards and we will use a standard deck of poker cards.

1, Does the player with the first choice of starting hands rotate, or does winner of previous hand have first choice?

2. Do the AK and 44 hands have any of the same suit as the 98s?

3. AKo>98s>44 in a three-handed go-to-showdown action.

AKo ~ 37%
98s ~ 34-35% depending upon suits in other hands
44 ~ 28%

But the rules seem to imply two players and only two out of three hands are picked:

98s (52%)> 44 (47%)
44 (54%) > AKo (46%)
AKo (60%) > 98s (40%)

So, whomever picks second has the advantage. Whomever picks first should pick 44.

So, there's no mystery as to strategy here.

Quote: gordonm888

1, Does the player with the first choice of starting hands rotate, or does winner of previous hand have first choice?

2. Do the AK and 44 hands have any of the same suit as the 98s?

3. AKo>98s>44 in a three-handed go-to-showdown action.

AKo ~ 37%
98s ~ 34-35% depending upon suits in other hands
44 ~ 28%

But the rules seem to imply two players and only two out of three hands are picked:

98s (52%)> 44 (47%)
44 (54%) > AKo (46%)
AKo (60%) > 98s (40%)

So, whomever picks second has the advantage. Whomever picks first should pick 44.

So, there's no mystery as to strategy here.

Most people assume picking first gets an advantage, but obviously going second is better.

Quote: DRich

Most people assume picking first gets an advantage, but obviously going second is better.

Seriously? Who would ever assume that going 1st in this game would ever give you an advantage?

Quote: USpapergames

Seriously? Who would ever assume that going 1st in this game would ever give you an advantage?

Most people.

Quote: DRich

Most people.

The problem is your challenge is known as the rock paper scissors of poker ;) There are tons of poker articles that literally just talk about it. And matching suits with your opponent's cards can have a rather large impact but it's been known for a while now that the pair is mathematically the best option heads up. But the math changes significantly with 3 plays & even more with 4 ;)

Quote: USpapergames

AxelWolf, you smart....How did you just now come to the conclusion that Royal Slots can do > 7,200 games an hour when I have been saying this the entire time??? BTW you are very wrong about what the players like and if you conducted some player analysis for slots you would know that slot a LARGE percentage of slot players specifically play slot machines because of the games per hour!!!

I haven't really been reading everything you write, so I'm not really sure what you have been saying "the entire time". I'm just confirming if your slot was in a real casino setting if it could clock in at 7200 sph. One can only push the button so fast. Perhaps theres something extra about your concept that's totally different than a traditional slot. There are already machines out there that basically go as fast as you can push the button.

I agree, one of the reasons people play slots over other csinos games is because of the speed of play, however, theres a limit to how fast people actually want to play. You will not see all that many people spinning as fast as possible on my chachines that allow for super fast spinning. I'm certain the most important aspect to the average slot player is exciting frequent bonus rounds that have the potential to pay big with various gimmicks such as sticky wilds, multipliers, level ups and retriggers. Graphics and sounds also play a big part. Well known themed slots may initially attract players to try it out, however, they won't keep coming back unless it has most of the elements I mentioned above.

Quote: USpapergames

Quote: AxelWolf

Quote: ThatDonGuy

Quote: USpapergames

B) Cash Game Poker - I challenge any WoV member to a heads up poker match. The game will either be No-Limit Texas Hold'em, Mississippi Stud, Lowball & of course California Roll. The location will be at an agreed-upon location prior to accepting the challenge, with a felted card table (I don't play online). The opponent will provide a dealer for the game. All games will start with me shuffling the deck followed by the dealer shuffling & then me cutting the deck (& I get to complete the cut) right before the dealer deals the cards.

Quote: USpapergames

So I used to be a real card mechanic. You can ask any one of the SF performers that work the pier, I was a performing card magician for a couple of years & had my own street performers license. I have straight out cheated many poker games using nothing more than my hands & the deck they provided. I would never even once consider using that machine over my cardsharp skills & I'm nowhere close to the best. But I have slights today that would impress you more than that table.

Uh...

I was wondering why he needed to touch the deck at all if theres a dealer.


Whatever the case.... I'm willing to play him a heads up Texas holdem cash game if he ever gets to Las Vegas. We can have a trusted member deal the cards or play in a real casino.

Sounds good to me, but why wait for me to come to Vegas. I know it will happen eventually but you could always come to California ;)

It's just not interesting enough to make a special trip for. There are 2 yearly WOV gatherings, we even set up home poker games a few times a year, and other reasons people come to Vegas often, it just seems much easier and logical to do it here.

Quote: AxelWolf

I haven't really been reading everything you write, so I'm not really sure what you have been saying "the entire time". I'm just confirming if your slot was in a real casino setting if it could clock in at 7200 sph. One can only push the button so fast. Perhaps theres something extra about your concept that's totally different than a traditional slot. There are already machines out there the at basically go as fast as you can push the button.

I agree, one of the reasons people play slots over other csinos games is because of the speed of play, however, theres a limit to how fast people actually want to play. You will not see all that many people spinning as fast as possible on my chachines that allow for super fast spinning. I'm certain the most important aspect to the average slot player is exciting frequent bonus rounds that have the potential to pay big with various gimmicks such as sticky wilds, multipliers, level ups and retriggers. Graphics and sounds also play a big part. Well known themed slots may initially attract players to try it out, however, they won't keep coming back unless it has most of the elements I mentioned above.

There are so many things wrong with this comment that I'm going to need some time to address them all properly.

P.S. ah dang it, Cobra Kia season 3 just came out. Hopefully, I don't get hooked watching the entire season tonight :/

P.P.S. So I'm quite confined you haven't read my game design analysis for Royal Slots, I think it will answer a lot of your question. I swear on my life no slot machine comes close to the speed of Royal Slots. We have already previously discussed why bonus rounds are not considered part of the slot game, I suggest going back and reading the previous comments to the advantage play thread. But even if you are correct that the side games are more important (even tho royal slots can produce payouts that are ruffly equal with the need of a side game) with a faster slot game you can get to the side games faster which is literally proving my point lol. Ask yourself why physical slot machines do so well compared to video slot machines if your list of requirements was such a thing? Just do some reading and all your questions will be answered. Let me know if you still can't find the information you're looking for, but only once you have reviewed it.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ZU1I46yJs_nyDv7RnpbOFAWHG8Gj9Zj3DI8-gK2PTD4/edit?usp=drivesdk

Quote: AxelWolf

It's just not interesting enough to make a special trip for. There are 2 yearly WOV gatherings, we even set up home poker games a few times a year, and other reasons people come to Vegas often, it just seems much easier and logical to do it here.

:/ Fine Vegas it is. But when I win your money the rematch will be in California! If I can make a trip to see you, you can do the same ;)

So this guy admits to being a card mechanic and cheating in many poker games then offers a live poker challenge where he gets to shuffle the deck and cut. What a joke.

Your slot challenge doesn't even make sense. You said find a slot with a games per hour of LESS THAN or equal to .6 spins per second.

This is like saying a car has a top speed of less than 50 miles per second per hour. Utter nonsense. Every game can have a speed of less than .6 spins per second if I push the button slow enough.

You initially said no slot in the US can be played at faster than 1 spin every 3 seconds. I offered to bet I can show you games twice as fast as that. I don't know where this new number came from.

Quote: USpapergames

Ask yourself why physical slot machines do so well compared to video slot machines if your list of requirements was such a thing? Just do some reading and all your questions will be answered.

Physical slot machines get trounced in the gaming marketplace compared to video slot machines.

Quote: USpapergames

Let me know if you still can't find the information you're looking for, but only once you have reviewed it.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ZU1I46yJs_nyDv7RnpbOFAWHG8Gj9Zj3DI8-gK2PTD4/edit?usp=drivesdk

I had not seen a cogent description of the actual advantages of 'The Royal Slot Machine' design before. I still have not. We could have a poll to see which, if any, of the arguments in this document makes any sense to people who understand the subject. This is my favorite:

Quote: USpapergames

"Fewer Errors = Greater Efficiency - All gaming machines require computer maintenance due to computations. Now just because Royal Slots doesn't use a calculated method for payline evaluators, it does however use a lot of data functions & probably more computations per game. However, Royal Slots has a lower amount of overall computations per day with less burn out because the program only makes computations when in play. Today's slots need to continuously produce random number sequences at around 1,000 computations per second. This is an inherently flawed design & is a waste of both hardware & energy just to produce fair RNG. Royal Slots could immediately go into screen saver mode & collect an energy savings + increase in the longevity of the hardware because it isn't under the constant strain of generating random numbers."

I predict that Royal Slots would be in screen saver mode almost 24 hours per day.

Quote: USpapergames

Ask yourself why physical slot machines do so well compared to video slot machines if your list of requirements was such a thing? Just do some reading and all your questions will be answered. Let me know if you still can't find the information you're looking for, but only once you have reviewed it.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ZU1I46yJs_nyDv7RnpbOFAWHG8Gj9Zj3DI8-gK2PTD4/edit?usp=drivesdk

Do you mean physical reel machines vs video reel machines in casinos? Both would be a physical slot machines, no?
I'm going to assume that is what you were talking about.
I have no clue why you think physical REEL slot machines do so well compared to Video REEL slot machines? It's the Video slot machines that have all but taken over and are much more popular nowadays than reel machines.

It seems as if you're trying to resurrect physical reel machines with a twist. Thats been done already and it seem like a niche market. Personally, I dislike those types of machines. I really dislike the 90's reel slot machines, it's like torture "having to play" those for long periods of time.

If I were you, I would spend my time trying to come up with something completely new and potentially revolutionary, not resurrect the past. What will you do if everything moves online or in some totally different direction?

"We have already previously discussed why bonus rounds are not considered part of the slot game" Yes, you keep mentioning this, it makes me wonder if when there are PHYSICAL REELS involved, they considered two separate things and have special/ different requirements?

I half heartedly read through your proposal(I don't come here for homework). I noticed you have 7200 spin's listed as a potential speed, and described being able to play as fast as you can hit the button, just as I did before I ever read any of your proposal. As I already pointed out, there are already video slots out there where you can do just that. I have no clue how fast the new ones with physicals reels can go, but it's super fast, faster than 95% of the players want to go.

Please don't take this the wrong way or as me hating on you. From what I did read of your proposal, I didn't see anything that would make me stop and say, wow that's really unique, new and interesting.

You said, " I swear on my life no slot machine comes close to the speed of Royal Slots."
"comes close" is subjective, please put up a number that would be sufficient. Remember, your statement makes it seem as if your slot is vastly superior in speed, so if you say coming close is 7100 or something high, then what you are really telling us is that your slot is not really all that special when it comes to speed. Do you have a working prototype to prove your slot gets out 7200 SPH?
My slot gets out one million spins per hour, everyone including the casinos wins when they play my slots, my slots will solve world hunger. See how easy that is?

FYI, I'm the last one to be pointing out spelling errors, but, i'm not writing proposals or anything like that. In the last paragraph you spelled the name of your own company wrong(OUCH!!!!!!) >>> U.S. Paper GaNes<<<<

Quote: WTflush

So this guy admits to being a card mechanic and cheating in many poker games then offers a live poker challenge where he gets to shuffle the deck and cut. What a joke.

Your slot challenge doesn't even make sense. You said find a slot with a games per hour of LESS THAN or equal to .6 spins per second.

This is like saying a car has a top speed of less than 50 miles per second per hour. Utter nonsense. Every game can have a speed of less than .6 spins per second if I push the button slow enough.

You initially said no slot in the US can be played at faster than 1 spin every 3 seconds. I offered to bet I can show you games twice as fast as that. I don't know where this new number came from.

Should people be suspended for spreading false information about me???

1) the challenge states I only get to cut the cards. I ask for this to guarantee that the dealer isn't cheating me!!!

2) Your comment obviously isn't the best at math so allow me to make things easier for you to comprehend. Find a slot machine that can produce 100 games per minute which would make each game with an average of .6 seconds.

3) The only comment that is nonsense is yours

4) So that was a white lie, what I wanted was people to not just take my word for it but also check the research I published, then you would realize I was referring to physical slot machines because that's my actual plan for casino domination ;) I was only ever planning on licensing a video version of Royal Slots, the physical version will be the greatest slot machine ever created & believe it or not the physical version actually has advantages over the video version! Plus the physical version of Royal Slots will be the cheapest slot machine to manufacture & it literally has every advantage that the operators & the players care about!!!

Quote: Mental

Physical slot machines get trounced in the gaming marketplace compared to video slot machines.

That's not true, in fact studies have proved the exact opposite that physical slot machines will ALWAYS retain more customers than a video slot. Studies have proven that graphics & animations only attract customers, not retain them. If the customer is attracted to the side games then add a video side game to your physical slot machine. The main reason why people prefer video slots is A) video slots often have specific themes (like the Wizard of Oz games from SG) because the gaming cabinet can be reprogrammed with as many software changes that the operator wants. Video slot hands are sometimes being changed twice a year! & B) video slots are ALOT faster than physical slot machine (which if anything should prove that speed matter in a slot game!). A physical slot of Royal Slots will have fast gph speeds than any video slot machine!!!

Quote: Mental

I had not seen a cogent description of the actual advantages of 'The Royal Slot Machine' design before. I still have not. We could have a poll to see which, if any, of the arguments in this document makes any sense to people who understand the subject. This is my favorite:

I predict that Royal Slots would be in screen saver mode almost 24 hours per day.

Since your such a great game designer, why don't you analyze Royal Slots for me? Are you too scared that I will just disprove everything you say? Is this why your asking for help from other members to rip on work???

Quote: AxelWolf

Do you mean physical reel machines vs video reel machines in casinos? Both would be a physical slot machines, no?
I'm going to assume that is what you were talking about.
I have no clue why you think physical REEL slot machines do so well compared to Video REEL slot machines? It's the Video slot machines that have all but taken over and are much more popular nowadays than reel machines.

It seems as if you're trying to resurrect physical reel machines with a twist. Thats been done already and it seem like a niche market. Personally, I dislike those types of machines. I really dislike the 90's reel slot machines, it's like torture "having to play" those for long periods of time.

If I were you, I would spend my time trying to come up with something completely new and potentially revolutionary, not resurrect the past. What will you do if everything moves online or in some totally different direction?

"We have already previously discussed why bonus rounds are not considered part of the slot game" Yes, you keep mentioning this, it makes me wonder if when there are PHYSICAL REELS involved, they considered two separate things and have special/ different requirements?

I half heartedly read through your proposal(I don't come here for homework). I noticed you have 7200 spin's listed as a potential speed, and described being able to play as fast as you can hit the button, just as I did before I ever read any of your proposal. As I already pointed out, there are already video slots out there where you can do just that. I have no clue how fast the new ones with physicals reels can go, but it's super fast, faster than 95% of the players want to go.

Please don't take this the wrong way or as me hating on you. From what I did read of your proposal, I didn't see anything that would make me stop and say, wow that's really unique, new and interesting.

You said, " I swear on my life no slot machine comes close to the speed of Royal Slots."
"comes close" is subjective, please put up a number that would be sufficient. Remember, your statement makes it seem as if your slot is vastly superior in speed, so if you say coming close is 7100 or something high, then what you are really telling us is that your slot is not really all that special when it comes to speed. Do you have a working prototype to prove your slot gets out 7200 SPH?
My slot gets out one million spins per hour, everyone including the casinos wins when they play my slots, my slots will solve world hunger. See how easy that is?

FYI, I'm the last one to be pointing out spelling errors, but, i'm not writing proposals or anything like that. In the last paragraph you spelled the name of your own company wrong(OUCH!!!!!!) >>> U.S. Paper GaNes<<<<

Yes, you are correct in that I am referring to the physical reels of a slot machine. I am being very careful to avoid the work "mechanical" for a specific reason, so when I say physical I am referring to the physical reels.

Your also correct about that video slot machines have taken over the industry. But if anything I see this as a good thing because believe Royal Slots not only can gain an edge over any other slot game, but can do it as a physical machine! Believe it or not the physical machine of Royal Slots will actually cost significantly less than a cabinet from China! And they will be made in the USA!!! This is just one of those you gotta trust me moments, I can t realise my designs to the public until Royal Slots is literally found everywhere in Nevada! And I mean grocery stores & airports ;)

So apparently you haven't played the program for Royal Slots yet? It's down below :/

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1-daoqMkefHRYQJiX-CmeFNZ2eKHZpJUL/view?usp=drivesdk

Here is the problem with your speed comment. 1st try and figure out what the fastest video slots gph is before you try and compare to royal slots, trust me royal slots is the fastest (& I consider a huge difference in gph speed around 1.5x). Your right that the speed increase isn't as impressive when comparing video slots to physical slots, that's partially the reason why strategy is to dominate the physical slot market.

Thank you for pointing out the spelling error, my LPD makes me blind to seeking things like that. Btw your slot machine legally can't get 1 million games per hour since federal law states all gaming machines must have the player actively control each wager of their money. Meaning it is 100% illegal to make a machine that would automatically bet your money for you. It's not possible for any human to possibly play a game that fast so your comment's statement is completely fu** o* i* ;)

Quote: USpapergames

1) the challenge states I only get to cut the cards. I ask for this to guarantee that the dealer isn't cheating me!!!

Quote: USpapergames

All games will start with me shuffling the deck followed by the dealer shuffling & then me cutting the deck (& I get to complete the cut)

Quote: USpapergames

But I have slights today that would impress you more than that table.

...

Quote: USpapergames

I'm sorry, who is right about 3 seconds being the fastest slot speeds????????????????????????????????????

Next time you want to pick a fight with me make sure you know what your talking about 1st.

Quote: WTflush

USPG; how much would you like to bet that I can go to a random casino tonight and film 5 totally different machines which are faster than 1.5 seconds per spin?

Quote: USpapergames

Find a slot machine that can produce 100 games per minute which would make each game with an average of .6 seconds.

You keep contradicting yourself. I don't think I have anything to gain by replying beyond this point.
If this is all a a really long, elaborate attempt to troll this forum; congrats you got us.

P.s. I don't know anything about game design but I'm guessing the difference between ≤ and ≥ is pretty important. You might want to look into that.

Quote: WTflush

Quote: USpapergames

All games will start with me shuffling the deck followed by the dealer shuffling & then me cutting the deck (& I get to complete the cut)

...








You keep contradicting yourself. I don't think I have anything to gain by replying beyond this point.
If this is all a a really long, elaborate attempt to troll this forum; congrats you got us.

P.s. I don't know anything about game design but I'm guessing the difference between ≤ and ≥ is pretty important. You might want to look into that.

Sorry, the LPD thing is difficult to deal with. What I mean is that it doesn't matter If I get to shuffle 1st since the dealer shuffles right after me. Honestly, I don't need to shuffle. I was just wanting to wash the deck every few hands for not eve. 10 seconds just to guarantee that the dealer isn't keeping track of any card locations. How about this, if everyone is so scared of me even touching the cards lol, then rent a deckmate & nobody will need to shuffle or cut & the dealer can do all the card work ;)

Quote: USpapergames

Btw your slot machine legally can't get 1 million games per hour since federal law states all gaming machines must have the player actively control each wager of their money. Meaning it is 100% illegal to make a machine that would automatically bet your money for you. It's not possible for any human to possibly play a game that fast so your comment's statement is completely fu** o* i* ;)

I just played an online slot machine in the USA. I set it to auto-play mode, and it played the right number of games for me to fulfill my play-through requirement. Did I just violate federal law?

I also play a slot machine in a B&M casino which will repeat my bet until I run out of credits or hit a hand pay. Is this another violation? It seems the operators don't know the federal regulations as well as you do

Quote: USpapergames

Thank you for pointing out the spelling error, my LPD makes me blind to seeking things like that. Btw your slot machine legally can't get 1 million games per hour since federal law states all gaming machines must have the player actively control each wager of their money. Meaning it is 100% illegal to make a machine that would automatically bet your money for you. It's not possible for any human to possibly play a game that fast so your comment's statement is completely fu** o* i* ;)

Could you please cite that Federal law? I would really like to see it since I don't believe that it exists.

Quote: USpapergames

Yes, you are correct in that I am referring to the physical reels of a slot machine. I am being very careful to avoid the work "mechanical" for a specific reason, so when I say physical I am referring to the physical reels.

Your also correct about that video slot machines have taken over the industry. But if anything I see this as a good thing because believe Royal Slots not only can gain an edge over any other slot game, but can do it as a physical machine! Believe it or not the physical machine of Royal Slots will actually cost significantly less than a cabinet from China! And they will be made in the USA!!! This is just one of those you gotta trust me moments, I can t realise my designs to the public until Royal Slots is literally found everywhere in Nevada! And I mean grocery stores & airports ;)

So apparently you haven't played the program for Royal Slots yet? It's down below :/

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1-daoqMkefHRYQJiX-CmeFNZ2eKHZpJUL/view?usp=drivesdk

Here is the problem with your speed comment. 1st try and figure out what the fastest video slots gph is before you try and compare to royal slots, trust me royal slots is the fastest (& I consider a huge difference in gph speed around 1.5x). Your right that the speed increase isn't as impressive when comparing video slots to physical slots, that's partially the reason why strategy is to dominate the physical slot market.

Thank you for pointing out the spelling error, my LPD makes me blind to seeking things like that. Btw your slot machine legally can't get 1 million games per hour since federal law states all gaming machines must have the player actively control each wager of their money. Meaning it is 100% illegal to make a machine that would automatically bet your money for you. It's not possible for any human to possibly play a game that fast so your comment's statement is completely fu** o* i* ;)

The link wants me to download something, i prefer not to download anything.

If we are talking about VIDEO slots without physical reels , then i know how fast they spin. Again, I ask, what do you consider anywhere close?

Quote: Mental

I just played an online slot machine in the USA. I set it to auto-play mode, and it played the right number of games for me to fulfill my play-through requirement. Did I just violate federal law?

I also play a slot machine in a B&M casino which will repeat my bet until I run out of credits or hit a hand pay. Is this another violation? It seems the operators don't know the federal regulations as well as you do

1st, it's online. 2nd, No because you set a predetermined amount to bet. You missed my point, no program could automatically play once it receives credits. So you would need a player with a million credits on auto play & have the machine set to play through that amount.

Quote: DRich

Could you please cite that Federal law? I would really like to see it since I don't believe that it exists.

So I was thinking of 18 US Code Chapter 50 but I think 🤔 I have been remembering things wrong. I'm not the law expert so my opinion shouldn't be one that should be pursued just to disprove ;)

Quote: AxelWolf

The link wants me to download something, i prefer not to download anything.

If we are talking about VIDEO slots without physical reels , then i know how fast they spin. Again, I ask, what do you consider anywhere close?

I'm sorry but if the program was published on Android you would still need to download it :/ The program is 16 megabits, I promise there is no spyware or viruses. I can't think of any that would be that tiny anyways. But if you still don't trust me then by all means find some phone your not using and download it ;)

But on a side note, autoplay sucks. If a company wanted to license Royal Slots and use autoplay I would not care. But there is a serious reason why I won't spin the reels faster than 200 fps (& I have been misleading on this subject). If you read this article carefully you will see why autoplay in inferior (& it has nothing to do with the Arthur's opinion):

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.gamblingsites.org/blog/should-you-use-autoplay-on-slot-games/amp/

Also, everyone should watch my video on the differences between Royal Slots & every other slot game. The speed increase is not Royal Slot's biggest advantage, but rather the fact that Royal Slots doesn't use a calculated payout method!!!

https://youtu.be/aLnigwdDVRM

Quote: USpapergames

So I was thinking of 18 US Code Chapter 50 but I think 🤔 I have been remembering things wrong. I'm not the law expert so my opinion shouldn't be one that should be pursued just to disprove ;)

That chapter only mentions the illegality of gambling ships and using phone lines to place bets.

I have a feeling you are thinking of either a state regulation, or something in a Tribal Compact.

USpapergames, you have previously posted about how you were interviewing for a position as a senior game designer with a well known company.

IMO, no well known company would tolerate their chief game designer behaving like you are on this manic thread, challenging people to various competitions for significant sums of cash and admitting to be a card mechanic.

So, it would seem evident that you were not offered that game design job. Is that correct?

Quote: ThatDonGuy

That chapter only mentions the illegality of gambling ships and using phone lines to place bets.

I have a feeling you are thinking of either a state regulation or something in a Tribal Compact.

Correct, I can't keep track of the laws anymore :/

I have only done Nevada & California State laws & I have done WAY more research on Nevada gaming laws since I don't want to high an attorney for every question I can think of just to try and take over that state. So my bet would be on a Nevada regulation, sadly there see so many :/

As I recall:

44 > AKo
AKo > 89s
89s > 44

Quote: gordonm888

USpapergames, you have previously posted about how you were interviewing for a position as a senior game designer with a well known company.

IMO, no well known company would tolerate their chief game designer behaving like you are on this manic thread, challenging people to various competitions for significant sums of cash and admitting to be a card mechanic.

So, it would seem evident that you were not offered that game design job. Is that correct?

Here is the reality of this situation. I didn't really want the job to begin with. I could end up spending my best ideas & making IGT millions just to gain a reputation :/ Having a job is beneath me & I think I was just going tho some midlife crisis giving into the idea of getting a job after all the years of work I dedicated to this pursuit. So I already declined the job offer, but was excited that they are still interested in Royal Slots, which licensing it was all I wanted to begin with.

Now that being said, isn't it ironic that you think im misbehaving when I think its the other way around. I've been showing people respect until they disrespect me. When Royal Slots takes over the casino industry you will reconsider four position. The thing you dont realize is that everything that is happening in this forum is actually what I wanted. I dont want to reveal too min information, puzzles are so much more fun. But just like Sun Tzu teaches, you must know your enemy before you can defeat them.

Also, why am I the bad guy for making the challenges when almost double digits of WoV members have made challenges towards me????

Quote: teliot

As I recall:

44 > AKo
AKo > 89s
89s > 44

Correct!

So I'm going to tell you a story from my high school years in hopes that every WoV member can gain some insight. So when I moved to Stockton I was 14 & starting high school as a freshman. Nobody knew who I was & I had never been around other nerds before. I had never seen so many kids want to spend their lunch break inside a library before. And the regulars all had 1 thing in common, they all played trading card games & that year Yu-Gi-Oh the card game came to America & I was the 1st to play it but only 1 other person at school played the game & I just wanted to make some friends with similar minds.

So I quit playing the game & picked up magic the gathering. It was much more difficult to learn (the rules were easy since I already had played some tough games growing up but the amount of cards I needed to learn at that age took a toll on me) but everyone played it so that was good enough reason for me to learn. I remember making some decks out of cheap cards and doing alright against some of the kids & getting destroyed by others. This went on for weeks until one day I beat one of the elite players (they were always hanging out with each other). Next thing I know J*** aka "Land Machine" a junior (I forget his last name) is challenging me to a match where the winner would leave the library forever. He used cards I didn't even know existed since they were so expensive & I didn't own a computer plus my parents didn't even have internet. I lost & left but he stepped out of line that day by humiliating me in front of everyone! If he hadn't done that I'm positive this would be the end of the story.

So I ending up getting a hold of a magazine catalog & which had a list of the current list of cards & then found an article that discussed what deck one of the tournament players was using. I realized a decklist wasn't good unless I knew how to play it. So I started putting a point value of every card's potential and then started to find the most effective combinations of the highest-scoring cards to use in a deck. But it was non-use, nobody wanted to play me since I wasn't at the library. So I got the idea of challenging another elite player that I hadn't played to match during class. I remember use playing while the teacher was lecturing & needing to win because I had just wagered that the winner would get to keep any card from their deck & I had just gotten lucky from trading a lot of holos for Piracy & didn't want to lose it.

I won & next thing you know he wants to play again & I tell him from here on out we only play for keeps, he agrees. I have over a dozen of his cards by the end of the day & the next day his buddies want a crack at me. I could immediately play since In wasn't done completing my new deck. I only won my previous match because I remembered what cards wherein his deck from observing one of his previous games, so I counter picked a deck that worked best against his. It was a gamble since he could have changed out his deck for a better one, but I was willing to gamble.

Long story short I won dozens of times against several people all through that week. Then out of nowhere, J*** comes to me saying that he can't find anyone to play him anymore since nobody has cards because of me. I tell him that it's not fun being a king with no army. He asks me what I want in exchange for giving back all the cards I've won. I tell him that I want to go back to playing in the library & that I want him to be the one exiled. He says fine, let's play on those terms then. I agree but this time I tell him best 3 out of 5. We play & I win 3 to 1.

But the story isn't over, after that I was able to make some friends in the library. But nobody wanted to play me because I had destroyed the actual competition. I might not have been upset, but I wasn't happy. I later found out a lot more about J*** from visiting his funeral reception. I really think we could have been good friends if we just could have gotten along better :'(

Quote: USpapergames

I'm sorry but if the program was published on Android you would still need to download it :/ The program is 16 megabits, I promise there is no spyware or viruses. I can't think of any that would be that tiny anyways. But if you still don't trust me then by all means find some phone your not using and download it ;)

OK, I will think about it.. It seems like I need a special app or something to run it, it's not straightforward to me. give me some instructions and ill prob do it.



You seem to have avoided my other question two times now.

Quote: AxelWolf

OK, I will think about it.. It seems like I need a special app or something to run it, it's not straightforward to me. give me some instructions and ill prob do it.



You seem to have avoided my other question two times now.

I'm sorry, I'm rather preoccupied today but still want to help. Please remind me your what your 2nd question is?

Quote: USpapergames

I'm sorry, I'm rather preoccupied today but still want to help. Please remind me your what your 2nd question is?

I am also preoccupied today. The wives can't agree on where they wan to go on vacation this year. They don't like my suggestions,

Quote: USpapergames

I'm sorry, I'm rather preoccupied today but still want to help. Please remind me your what your 2nd question is?

You said, " I swear on my life no slot machine comes close to the speed of Royal Slots."
"comes close" is subjective, please put up a number that would be sufficient. Remember, your statement makes it seem as if your slot is vastly superior in speed, so if you say coming close is 7100 or something high, then what you are really telling us is that your slot is not really all that special when it comes to speed.


What do you consider anywhere close, what number would exceed "anywhere close"?