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1 vote (9.09%)
1 vote (9.09%)
3 votes (27.27%)
1 vote (9.09%)
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3 votes (27.27%)
2 votes (18.18%)
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11 members have voted

NewToCraps
NewToCraps
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August 16th, 2014 at 2:48:36 PM permalink
. SUB - CRAP - TIONsm .

information about the game has been temporarily removed ...
PM me if you want any information about the game.
Last edited by: NewToCraps on Feb 5, 2018
Learned Craps in 2013 .... Developed and have a PATENT on Craps "Back On Bet" side bet ... Working on Craps game variations hope to have patents in 2018 - Second Chance Craps and Sub-Crap-tion ... A completely new dice game idea is next - D.. Dice D......
GWAE
GWAE
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August 16th, 2014 at 2:58:31 PM permalink
One thing that I don't like is that you will 1 out mu h quicker than 7 out which means my turn will be quicker.
Expect the worst and you will never be disappointed. I AM NOT PART OF GWAE RADIO SHOW
mustangsally
mustangsally
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August 16th, 2014 at 3:03:04 PM permalink
yes, very interesting

Now gots to play this during the Angels game tonight
Bet the over!

I am still waiting for the SCC demo so I can play it off the floor
but if this is all you have
(Did you ask JB? or even Ahigh? (t)he(y) could say no, yes?)

Guess I could to take JB Craps game and change the code around to play these newest games.
If I am successful, I might just try, I think JB would get mad at me for using his code, just a heads up
added: JB will get paid no matter who uses his code (only fair)

My husband is super fast with computer code, but he charges way too much
I still love dice games
Sally
I Heart Vi Hart
NewToCraps
NewToCraps
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August 16th, 2014 at 3:06:27 PM permalink
Quote: GWAE

One thing that I don't like is that you will 1 out mu h quicker than 7 out which means my turn will be quicker.


That is true with 10 vs 6 ways to lose, but you also have larger win amounts when you hit your numbers with ratios based on 10 instead of 7.

Next is to put Second Chance Craps together with Sub-Crap-tion and have the "turns" be longer ...
Learned Craps in 2013 .... Developed and have a PATENT on Craps "Back On Bet" side bet ... Working on Craps game variations hope to have patents in 2018 - Second Chance Craps and Sub-Crap-tion ... A completely new dice game idea is next - D.. Dice D......
GWAE
GWAE
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August 16th, 2014 at 3:55:35 PM permalink
Quote: NewToCraps

That is true with 10 vs 6 ways to lose, but you also have larger win amounts when you hit your numbers with ratios based on 10 instead of 7.

Next is to put Second Chance Craps together with Sub-Crap-tion and have the "turns" be longer ...



I was not talking about the pays. One reason I play craps is to shoot the dice. I don't want my turns to go quicker. I guess it will get back to me quicker if I have any money left.
Expect the worst and you will never be disappointed. I AM NOT PART OF GWAE RADIO SHOW
NewToCraps
NewToCraps
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August 16th, 2014 at 4:00:00 PM permalink
Quote: GWAE

I was not talking about the pays. One reason I play craps is to shoot the dice. I don't want my turns to go quicker. I guess it will get back to me quicker if I have any money left.



I have found the answer for shooting longer ... I go on cruises where in the afternoons there are but a few players, sometimes I even shoot all by myself.
Learned Craps in 2013 .... Developed and have a PATENT on Craps "Back On Bet" side bet ... Working on Craps game variations hope to have patents in 2018 - Second Chance Craps and Sub-Crap-tion ... A completely new dice game idea is next - D.. Dice D......
GWAE
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August 16th, 2014 at 7:43:07 PM permalink
Quote: NewToCraps

I have found the answer for shooting longer ... I go on cruises where in the afternoons there are but a few players, sometimes I even shoot all by myself.



I am a weird breed of person. I play to shoot but I won't play unless there are at least 3 other players. The game moves to quick when it is just me. quick game = busto quicker
Expect the worst and you will never be disappointed. I AM NOT PART OF GWAE RADIO SHOW
vegas702
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August 16th, 2014 at 8:50:47 PM permalink
.....
mustangsally
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August 16th, 2014 at 9:58:12 PM permalink
Quote: GWAE

One thing that I don't like is that you will 1 out mu h quicker than 7 out which means my turn will be quicker.

actually not many will notice any difference.
Craps average length of shooters hand = about 8.53 rolls including the 7 out
SCT = about 7.95 rolls including the 1 out
0.58 roll is really nothing
the median stays the same too at 6 rolls

so second chance craps should work well for this game too, without looking at it

Sally
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mustangsally
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August 16th, 2014 at 10:18:11 PM permalink
Quote: vegas702

Very creative & I like the idea. Going to have to digest this some more......

very different yes

My only complaint, as I have now played it and it plays OK,
is regular Craps the pass wins 22.2% on come out roll and abouts 27% on the point round and

This version has it flipped over and it is hard to win in the point round but when you do it does pay nice
The first 3 points I established was the 5 and not once did it win. to be expected

I show about
cor win: 0.357142857
cor lose: 0.214285714

point win: 0.133078231 <<< I can feel this
1 out: 0.295493197

Time for music and dancing
more dice games next weeks
Sally
I Heart Vi Hart
NewToCraps
NewToCraps
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August 17th, 2014 at 5:25:12 AM permalink
Quote: mustangsally

very different yes

My only complaint, as I have now played it and it plays OK,
is regular Craps the pass wins 22.2% on come out roll and abouts 27% on the point round and

This version has it flipped over and it is hard to win in the point round but when you do it does pay nice
The first 3 points I established was the 5 and not once did it win. to be expected



You're right, with the Two not availabe as a Point number, the point will be made less often.

I have a version 2 (in my patent application it was the main version, and what I show it on the site was the patent second version).
All four place numbers are available as a point numbers, so you would see the point being hit more often.
The only thing was that it is a bit unusual with:
Pass Bets losing on Zero Bar 6-6, and Don't Pass Bets winning on Zero Bar 6-6 and 1-1.

It puts the Pass Bet HE at 1.21%, and 0.28% with full odds,
and the Don't Pass Bet HE at 1.28%, and 0.22% with full odds.
(lower HE than the other way - NOT AS GOOD FOR THE HOUSE)


Come-Out Phase


Pass Bet:
    WIN on a One (pays 1:1)
    Lose on a Zero Bar 6-6
Don't Pass Bet:
    WIN on a Zero Bar 6-6 and 1-1(pays 1:1)
    Lose on a One
Point Phase

Pass Bet:
    WIN on the Point (pays 1:1)
    Lose on a 1-Out
Pass Odds Bet:
    WIN on the Point(2 pays 5:4) (3 pays 5:3) (4 pays 5:2) (5 pays 5:1)
    Lose on a 1-Out
Don't Pass Bet:
    WIN on a 1-Out (pays 1:1)
    Lose on the Point
Don't Pass Odds Bet:
    WIN on a 1-Out (2 pays 2:5) (3 pays 3:5) (4 pays 2:5) (5 pays 1:5)
    Lose on the Point1-Out

Making the Point Number - the same shooter returns to a Come-out phase.
Rolling a 0, 2 or Any Non-Point Place number - the same shooter keeps rolling in the Point Phase.
Rolling a 1-Out - ends the round and a new Shooter starts a new round of a game.

Odds are 8X-6X-4X-2X, so full odds on a $5 Pass Bet will pay $5 for the Pass Bet and $50 for the Odds Bet

Come Bets and Don't Come Bets are just like the Pass Bet and Don't Pass Bet,
but are only available in the Point Phase


I wonder if players would accept the unusual rules, and prefer the additional point number?
Pass Bets lose a bit less often on Come-out rolls (6-6 is 1 in 36 rolls), Pass Bets and Pass Odds Bets can win with a Point of Two being made, BUT you're exposed to lose the Pass Bet and Pass Odds Bet on a 1-Out.
Last edited by: NewToCraps on Apr 9, 2016
Learned Craps in 2013 .... Developed and have a PATENT on Craps "Back On Bet" side bet ... Working on Craps game variations hope to have patents in 2018 - Second Chance Craps and Sub-Crap-tion ... A completely new dice game idea is next - D.. Dice D......
mustangsally
mustangsally
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August 18th, 2014 at 9:06:51 AM permalink
Quote: NewToCraps

You're right, with the Two not availabe as a Point number, the point will be made less often.

I have a version 2 (in my patent application it was the main version, and what I show it on the site was the patent second version).
All four place numbers are available as a point numbers, so you would see the point being hit more often.

I say better, still plays hard to win in point round especially when points 4 and 5 come out too often.
point win = 0.202270723
natural win = 0.277777778
(about the inverse of regular Craps)

maybe something really different like point 4 or point 5 (a 3 point version with points {2,3,4or5}
if either is set might be a workable solution
and/or maybe always lose on a 1 (or some other number. that keeps the rules very simple)
thinking outside of the box as
dice difference game is outside of the box


but the 6.43 rolls per shooter hand 
rolls per game	= 1145/504 (2.271825397)
games per 1out = 9072/3205 (2.830577223)
= 4122/641

is now really felt
(regular craps = 8.52551 or 1671/196)

Roll 2 and 3 are tied for the highest probability of being the 1out roll
and 5 is a high median
losing the dice too fast (FAST 1 outs) really is not that much fun

I think when players FEEL they can win and have a decent shot at it
the rules are what they are and players will adapt to them
I think I like the point round having a higher winning probability
always more action to be had

Back to the Future!
Sally Oh
I Heart Vi Hart
mustangsally
mustangsally
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August 18th, 2014 at 10:09:09 AM permalink
For your line bets ver2
Quote: NewToCraps

One PROBLEM: the HE for a Pass Bet is 1.21% and 0.28% with full oddes taken,
and the HE for a Don't Pass Bet is 1.57% and 0.24% with full odds taken,
(the House would see this as TOO LOW).

I have to disagree

Only the value is low not what counts = EV

(you can double-check my work)
The EV for a $5 pass line bet at regular Craps (rC) is about 2.1cents per roll (7/495 * 165/557 * $5)

The EV for a $5 pass line bet at SCTv2 is about 2.7cents per roll
(55/4536 * 504/1145 * $5) or closer to 2.6686cents per roll

Does not look too low to little young me!

Keep the target in sight
more EV per roll for the house could mean more EV per idea for you

Sally
I Heart Vi Hart
Buzzard
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August 18th, 2014 at 10:15:17 AM permalink
Combine this with a perpetual motion machine and you have a WINNER !
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
mustangsally
mustangsally
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August 18th, 2014 at 10:51:18 AM permalink
Quote: Buzzard

Combine this

this

Quote: Buzzard

with



Quote: Buzzard

and you have a WINNER !

I like kissing girls
I Heart Vi Hart
mcallister3200
mcallister3200
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August 18th, 2014 at 11:37:46 AM permalink
I honestly I just read the name of the game and said no, couldn' t even read the rest.
NewToCraps
NewToCraps
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August 18th, 2014 at 1:19:50 PM permalink
Quote: mcallister3200

I honestly I just read the name of the game and said no, couldn' t even read the rest.



I was gonna use "Dice Minus" and abbreviate it "Dinus".
Would you have read more then ?
Learned Craps in 2013 .... Developed and have a PATENT on Craps "Back On Bet" side bet ... Working on Craps game variations hope to have patents in 2018 - Second Chance Craps and Sub-Crap-tion ... A completely new dice game idea is next - D.. Dice D......
NewToCraps
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August 18th, 2014 at 6:22:18 PM permalink
Quote: Buzzard

Combine this with a perpetual motion machine and you have a WINNER !



Did you see my next game initials on my signature ... PMC ? Perpetual Motion Craps
Learned Craps in 2013 .... Developed and have a PATENT on Craps "Back On Bet" side bet ... Working on Craps game variations hope to have patents in 2018 - Second Chance Craps and Sub-Crap-tion ... A completely new dice game idea is next - D.. Dice D......
Buzzard
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August 18th, 2014 at 8:34:29 PM permalink
An honest mistake on my part. Thought that stood for Plenty More Crap.
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
NewToCraps
NewToCraps
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August 18th, 2014 at 8:42:30 PM permalink
Always entertaining with you around .... LOL
Learned Craps in 2013 .... Developed and have a PATENT on Craps "Back On Bet" side bet ... Working on Craps game variations hope to have patents in 2018 - Second Chance Craps and Sub-Crap-tion ... A completely new dice game idea is next - D.. Dice D......
Buzzard
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August 18th, 2014 at 8:44:30 PM permalink
Do you own a hat ? just asking.
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
allinriverking
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August 18th, 2014 at 9:40:15 PM permalink
Looks like Buzz is gonna make a suggestion....
Buzzard
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August 18th, 2014 at 9:44:07 PM permalink
Hey I am the one who voted Great Game. Honestly.

Plus my ex-wife from the parallel universe has already suspended one nice guy ( bozo) tonight.
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
beachbumbabs
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August 18th, 2014 at 9:59:45 PM permalink
Quote: Buzzard

Hey I am the one who voted Great Game. Honestly.

Plus my ex-wife from the parallel universe has already suspended one nice guy ( bozo) tonight.



Today was a rough one. 3 suspensions. One new guy, one remedial, one spammeister. Welcome back; I missed you.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
Buzzard
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August 18th, 2014 at 10:01:52 PM permalink
Quote: beachbumbabs

Today was a rough one. 3 suspensions. One new guy, one remedial, one spammeister. Welcome back; I missed you.



I will be at G2E, unless this year continues to suck.
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
vegas702
vegas702
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August 19th, 2014 at 5:13:58 AM permalink
.....
21Flip
21Flip
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December 28th, 2014 at 9:35:51 PM permalink
The name of the game is horrendous. It is difficult to read, and it feels forced.

May I suggest Sparc? It is craps backwards, after all.
Dieter
Administrator
Dieter
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December 29th, 2014 at 12:38:57 AM permalink
Quote: 21Flip

May I suggest Sparc? It is craps backwards, after all.



You might have problems calling it Sparc, just like you might have troubles calling a dice game Pentium (even if it was based on the number 5).
May the cards fall in your favor.
RS
RS
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December 29th, 2014 at 4:08:02 AM permalink
I like the idea. I was surprised at how impressive it is. Good odds, easy enough to understand, just close enough yet quite different than regular craps. I saw the title and thought "another person with some stupid idea that's gonna suck" -- but it is not that way at all.

I would definitely play it if it was in a casino. Good luck on getting it on the market.
21Flip
21Flip
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December 29th, 2014 at 5:01:59 AM permalink
Quote: Dieter

You might have problems calling it Sparc, just like you might have troubles calling a dice game Pentium (even if it was based on the number 5).



Eh. I don't think that the trademark office would find that a reasonable price is likely to confuse a dice game with a microprocessor.

But, you know, the World Wildlife Federation won against the World Wrestling Federation, sooo.... who knows? :-)
Dieter
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Dieter
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December 29th, 2014 at 5:22:59 AM permalink
Quote: 21Flip

Eh. I don't think that the trademark office would find that a reasonable price is likely to confuse a dice game with a microprocessor.



All I know is that I wouldn't be inclined to risk it if I could come up with another name.

Sure, it might be allowed, but it might also be 2 years of lawyers and negotiations.
May the cards fall in your favor.
NewToCraps
NewToCraps
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March 8th, 2015 at 7:00:46 AM permalink
Quote: 21Flip

The name of the game is horrendous. It is difficult to read, and it feels forced.

May I suggest Sparc? It is craps backwards, after all.



Originally I was going to call it "Craps Minus" or "Minus Craps" ...
but I thought "Sub-crap-tion" actually rolled off the tongue fairly easily
(not feeling forced) and was kinda "catchy"
Learned Craps in 2013 .... Developed and have a PATENT on Craps "Back On Bet" side bet ... Working on Craps game variations hope to have patents in 2018 - Second Chance Craps and Sub-Crap-tion ... A completely new dice game idea is next - D.. Dice D......
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