Was there ever reality in this slot machine myth?

Slot machines today are RNG programed and there is no such thing as a "due" machine. No need to discuss that further. But on this weekend's trip mentioned elsewhere I had to explain it to my poker buddy. However, it got me to thinking. Was there ever a time when machines were "due" to hit? My understanding is that before the early to mid 1970s there was not really a "true" RNG program out there for slots and VP and the Circus Circus Empire was started by profits earned making one. So, is this myth out there because machines were once "due" to hit, from the mechanical ones to the first modern-looking ones in the 1970s?

Quote: AZDuffman

Slot machines today are RNG programed and there is no such thing as a "due" machine. No need to discuss that further. But on this weekend's trip mentioned elsewhere I had to explain it to my poker buddy. However, it got me to thinking. Was there ever a time when machines were "due" to hit? My understanding is that before the early to mid 1970s there was not really a "true" RNG program out there for slots and VP and the Circus Circus Empire was started by profits earned making one. So, is this myth out there because machines were once "due" to hit, from the mechanical ones to the first modern-looking ones in the 1970s?

The mechanical ones couldn't possibly have been "due", because they had no way to remember past spins.

There was no true RNG available in the first days of computer-based slots, but there still isn't such a program available today--only a pseudo-RNG. The question is whether a computer-based machine would "store" the results of recent spins, and alter future outcomes accordingly. Aside from the fact that this would violate about fifteen different gaming regulations, my understanding is that only the last few spins are stored in memory, to help resolve disputes. So no, I don't think any machine, past or present, has ever become "due".

Quote: mkl654321

The mechanical ones couldn't possibly have been "due", because they had no way to remember past spins.

Completely untrue. In fact, the better pay out machines were stalked in Vegas and when one hadn't paid off in a few weeks, teams of players would descend on them and play them till did pay off, which sometimes took awhile. The casinos didn't care, somebody had to win, it was all the same to them. The woman BJ player who was interviewed in 'Gambling Wizards' (I can't recall her name) ran a profitable slot team in the 80's. She had teams of elderly people who played the machines that were 'due' and she made over 100K a year doing it. She also says those days are long gone thanks to the computer chip.

Quote: EvenBob

Completely untrue. In fact, the better pay out machines were stalked in Vegas and when one hadn't paid off in a few weeks, teams of players would descend on them and play them till did pay off, which sometimes took awhile. The casinos didn't care, somebody had to win, it was all the same to them. The woman BJ player who was interviewed in 'Gambling Wizards' (I can't recall her name) ran a profitable slot team in the 80's. She had teams of elderly people who played the machines that were 'due' and she made over 100K a year doing it. She also says those days are long gone thanks to the computer chip.

I'd like to see some proof of this. I'd also like to know how a mechanical machine became "due".

And the fact that such a machine eventually did pay off for those "teams" wouldn't have meant that it was "due". What I'd like to see is some proof that the machines would somehow change their own jackpot probabilities in midstream as more and more time elapsed without them being hit. This would probably have been possible in SOME way, but it would have been totally illegal, and aside from that, why would a casino do it? The longer the big jackpot is there, the more people will play the machine. The casino WOULD care about that.

Quote: mkl654321

I'd like to see some proof of this. I'd also like to know how a mechanical machine became "due"..

In fact, I know somebody who did it in Vegas in the 50's on the cast metal one armed bandits that are so collectible now. He would stake out machines with his buddies and when one didn't pay off for awhile, they would play it till it did. They would play it non stop in shifts for as long as it took. It was very boring but it was profitable and many people were doing it. As long as coins were going in, the casinos could care less who won.

Quote: EvenBob

In fact, I know somebody who did it in Vegas in the 50's on the cast metal one armed bandits that are so collectible now. He would stake out machines with his buddies and when one didn't pay off for awhile, they would play it till it did. They would play it non stop in shifts for as long as it took. It was very boring but it was profitable and many people were doing it. As long as coins were going in, the casinos could care less who won.

That doesn't prove the machines were, in fact, "due", which implies that the chance of hitting the jackpot was getting greater as time went on. How, exactly, would a mechanical machine have done that? And what about the fact that doing that would have been totally illegal, so if the casino managed this somehow, they would have been cheating FOR the customer??

Quote: mkl654321

That doesn't prove the machines were, in fact, "due",

Some players noticed that the mechanical machines paid off on a very regular basis. Nothing exact, nothing you could pin down, but if a machine didn't pay off for a few weeks, its was due to pay off sometime soon. On some of them they broke even, but on a vast majority they made money. It was grunt work, but it beat a 9 to 5 job. I'm certainly not making this up, its well known Vegas lore.

Quote: mkl654321

That doesn't prove the machines were, in fact, "due", which implies that the chance of hitting the jackpot was getting greater as time went on.

Machines weren't "due" because a person couldn't say what hour they were going to pay off, Detroit hasn't been "destroyed" because you can still see a rotting hulk of a city, where does this word-meaning hair-splitting end?

Quote: AZDuffman

Machines weren't "due" because a person couldn't say what hour they were going to pay off, Detroit hasn't been "destroyed" because you can still see a rotting hulk of a city, where does this word-meaning hair-splitting end?

Using the proper word isn't "hair-splitting"; it's using the proper word. Playing a machine because it's supposedly "due" means you think that the machine is more likely to hit than it was before. I would still like to see some proof of that, as in, how did the machine perceive the lapse of time since the last jackpot, and then alter itself accordingly?

Quote: EvenBob

Some players noticed that the mechanical machines paid off on a very regular basis. Nothing exact, nothing you could pin down, but if a machine didn't pay off for a few weeks, its was due to pay off sometime soon. On some of them they broke even, but on a vast majority they made money. It was grunt work, but it beat a 9 to 5 job. I'm certainly not making this up, its well known Vegas lore.

Well, there's a lot of "lore" out there. I would still like to know how anyone thought the machine knew that it hadn't hit a jackpot, and how it altered itself accordingly to change the chance of that jackpot.

I am also still wondering exactly WHY the casino would do this.