Don't confuse certain issues.
Casino Credit? Yeah, maybe the best was the old RENO joint that had no credit department. Didn't offer markers. Didn't have to collect on any markers. Bring what you can afford to lose and if you lose it, go home.
Markers? Back in Benny Binions heyday, it was MANHOOD you were talking about. Benny greeted you by name, well you sure felt proud and held your head up high. Benny took your marker, same thing. It ain't for nothin' that in Guys and Dolls Sky Masterson got threatened with having it buzzed all over town that he had welshed on his marker. When the Sears Credit Card was the hardest one to get and had the highest collection rate in history; Vegas markers were at an even higher collection rate despite there being no legally enforceable effect to them under California law. Why? A marker meant something. Nobody welshed on his marker.
Murder? Heck, its rare for "the mob" or anyone who thinks they are 'the mob' to hit someone. First, it tends to interfere with further debt collection if someone is dead. Second, it tends to bring publicity and outside interest. Oh sure, it may be akin to attracting a mosquito but no body likes mosquitos, specially those that tend to look in all directions. I read about a man in a car with his pants down and I think of Car Girls. One girl is reaching in front, the other girl is reaching for his wallet, the damn fool tried to get his money back ... and his death ain't got nothing to do with any "dipping into funds" or "slow payment". Leaving one pants pocket turned inside out is the more usual sign to advertise what the motivation for the hit was. He stole from the wrong people. Bars, gas stations, Convenience Stores used to be Bank Drops for criminals. You know, like a bank's night deposit box for legit businesses. Policy runners, policy banks, hookers, bookies all had to deposit their money by a certain time. Ain't no one gonna let the winning policy numbers be tallied and THEN let a policy runner turn in his slips showing people who bet on that number. Bookies gotta submit their money and layoff requirements before the race is run.
Few years ago in London one couple let their cell phone batteries get low and failed to call in the results of the final goal kick, so alot of people watching the game 'live' on the internet but not really 'live' in actuality couldn't make their online bets on that final kick. Millions of dollars at stake, bets from Chinese Servers to Ukraine Servers couldn't be made because the live data from the stadium was unavailable to the 'live' but up to two minute telecommunications delay on the broadcast. Now all the cops who worked that case got counseling when they went to the couple's crime scene. A lesson had to be taught, but usually orgainized crime does not benefit from publicity.
I know one guy got killed because he would not raise his prices. He was taking all the profitable Weekend Brunch business for miles around.
I know one guy had three separate bookies, but all he lost was his restaurant and fish brokerage business, not his life. Its bad for business to kill someone.
I know one man got killed by a Bimbo he took boating. They went for a dip and she swam back to the boat and let him try to catch up. When he finally died, she pretended to not know how to use the radio. He had stolen money from people he shouldn't have, but the murder was not to teach him or anyone else a lesson. The murder was to keep divorce lawyers and forensic accountants from getting too close to the real books.
Well, at first I thought he got killed for not paying up, but later realized they'd never kill him for that, or even do it to try to make an example of him. It was for a different reason unknown to me.
But it was the Mob I think - the circumstances don't fit jealous wife, common robbery, etc. Yeah, you could make another conclusion about pants down LOL.
Even the mob has "flukes" now and then.
One Mobster got worked over real bad and then received some cement shoes for his midnight swim in San Francisco Bay. He had made a mistake of turning a personal beef with a straight and narrow Game Warden into an order for a hit. He had not known that Mister Big had the greatest respect for that Stand Up Game Warden who had already made it clear to Mister Big that he was a federal law enforcement officer first last and always and would never hesitate a moment to act like one despite the Game Warden's and Mr. Big's shared interest in the culinary preparation of game birds .
Haven't notice RC on here much lately. Hope all is well with him.
RC is doing okay. Thx GWAE.
I find the new forum format is much slower and harder to navigate, so I only stop by if I am totally bored, and up for a little self loathing.
Tues morning there was a $5 craps table open at Cherokee. First time I have seen that amount.
When I was at the new Valley River casino last fall, around 8AM, they had $5 games.
As OG said, this time around it was $15, and it appears they are getting the $$$$ GA money they were hoping for, so I doubt I will go back down there again.
Before we met OG and wife, my wife and I hiked Upper Whitewater Falls and Rainbow Falls also on this trip. There was limited water, so the falls weren't quite as exciting, but they were fun nonetheless.
I have cashed 3 and 4 k without paying off the market but larger amount get more scrutiny and if you are a frequent player cashing large 10k amounts it would be much much harder without giving them to a friend .
As far as credit report I have never had my credit pulled ever not sure who told you they do. It's basically bank history and adb (average daily balance)
Good write-up. I was curious about this myself. Thanks for the info.
Caesar's was super easy. Fill out the online form, present identification and check at cage, then go to a table and ask for money.
I had a similar issue cashing out. Same night I took out the marker, I wanted to pay it off. Cashier couldn't do it because it wasn't in the system, so they had to go find it amongst the collected chips. Process probably took 20 minutes. If you're going to pay off your marker, just settle it the next day when the cashier can process it.
I have to expect most places are going to make it pretty easy.
As far as my concern, most credit things are not done this sort of old-fashioned way, calling your bank and all that. Now that I've taken the step, hard to relate to that concern.
I checked with Twin River.
They said if you take a marker out for under $1k you have 7 days to pay it back.
If you take out a marker for more than $1k and under $5k you have 14 days to pay it back.
If you take out a marker greater than $5k you have 28 days to pay it back.
If you don't pay it back it comes out automatically.
If a guy can balance his checkbook, I see no reason to not just let it hit your bank account. It's just a check.
well, I suppose you might feel you have too much cash on hand.
PS: I don't think I should be able to 'edit' ... although I wouldn't
I am glad to hear everything worked out for you.
Can you loan me a few bucks now? :)
One million dollars please. Slippery slope here. Ten years from now you might wind up with dementia and sign your life away for a few ounces of clay. Scary.
ha ha! Old man OG could be in for it! No kidding I guess.
Certainly there seem to be no safeguards in place once you get past the post. This is possibly intentional, since in the cases where I suspect it is predatory practice against problem gamblers, they want to be able to claim innocence.
Thanks for the "credit report," OG!
I seem to recall many years ago, I was playing craps and a guy came to the table and took out a marker for $2k. When the dealers gave him his chips, the Boxman kept the marker slip on top of his bank, instead of putting it down the money slot. At the end of his session, the guy colored up $2k+ in chips. Then the Pit asked him if he wanted to take care of the marker then and there. The guy agreed, and the PB tore up the marker slip. Presumably, they would have dropped it in if he had lost or had wanted to walk with all of his chips.
As it was, the Boxman cut out $2k of the guy's chips, and he left with only his profits. I'm curious if it is still done this way anywhere. From your description, OG, it sounds like the casinos are more than happy if you don't pay back your marker and are content to just cash it in after a month or so.
>it sounds like the casinos are more than happy if you don't pay back
>your marker and are content to just cash it in after a month or so
I think I can confirm this with MGM. Smaller outfits may be more interested in quicker collection. It may also be a matter of different pit people getting different messages from their bosses, or just different training on the way up.
Recently I saw a Law and Order episode where off handedly they mentioned the con artist was previously charged with check kiting. Looked it up, and found out, writing a check without funds like at a casino, then depositing the money before the check cleared a few days later, was actually illegal. They also call it riding the float.
when I want to play a heavy craps session, I bring $3k cash.
$3k in 100s is still pretty bulky in my wallet.
when I read this blog post, I thought it was the perfect solution till you said you cant pay off your marker the same day?
doesn't that defeat the purpose of not wanting to carry a lot of cash?
>riding the float.
I think in the case of markers, where you are told you have so many days, it would be hard to get convicted of 'riding the float'. Of course you can still be prosecuted for simply writing a bad check. BTW when you follow these cases, it looks like the casinos readily take payments not-in-full. Once this is allowed, the only thing remaining that the casino probably cares about is that the debt is not dischargeable in bankruptcy proceedings.
>you cant pay off your marker the same day?
I just learned myself from Joeman's comment that the thing to do might be to tell the pit you want to pay it off and keep it handy, and then pay it off without going to the cashier. But,
>doesn't that defeat the purpose of not wanting to carry a lot of cash?
why not just take out $500 to $1000 or so at a time? You don't have to take a marker for $3000
One casino in Reno had NO credit expenses, much less credit losses.
Their policy was bring your money with you and when its gone, its gone. We do not extend credit to anyone.
It was a good policy.
Sure those statutes that let the District Attorney be your free collections agent sure helps, but the Horseshoe rarely ever had to send collection letters. The mere thought of Benny Binion not greeting you by name when you entered the room was enough to get you to pay up. A gentlemen stood by his markers and made good on them, a la Guys and Dolls.
If you were a stand up guy, you paid your debts or you never came back to Vegas...ever.
I was playing blackjack in a Vegas casino. My friend had been increasing his bet until it got to $400, then he drew aces. He didn't have enough to cover the $400 split, so he asked for a quick marker. The floor manager didn't ask him for his ID, or for his room number, or to see his credit card; he just asked see his hand. He looked at his hand and said OK; they give him $200 (enough to fully cover his split), he won + paid the $200 back instantly, all in-stride.
Any idea who gives these mystery loans to degenerate gamblers? just out of idle curiosity......
Perhaps you are hinting in a humorous way you want one of these loans.
No you don't.
Well, feel free to set up 'markers' with some casino. It is possible to use them and not get into a jam. But you don't want to be in this situation.
Maurice Clarett is another guy this happened to.
There seems usually to be a hint that illegal gambling outfits are the ones to do this, but one thing to take away from this is that brick and mortar casinos will do it too. That system of 'markers' that they use has all the aspects of risk-free loaning that the illegal guys get into, and produces the same result.
When you search google news, the Clinton Portis stories all slavishly report that he was writing bad checks. Yes, he was, but the way he was forced into doing it will some day be illegal in some states, I predict. It's that 'marker' system. Perhaps it is illegal in some states now.