Is Mexico dangerous place to visit?

Quote: EvenBob

From the pic that I saw, you look Latino, why would they be shocked? I used to go to Tijuana all the time 30 years ago. Not anymore, I'm just an old white guy & I really don't fit in there.

I'm only 25% Spanish. Spaniards are pretty white in Mexico since most Mexican's are "mixed people", from Spanish and indigenous ancestry. But the point is that most of the violence in Mexico is not racially based. It is a byproduct of the cartels who make their money in drugs, kidnapping, and prostitution. The most common victims are Mexicans since it is considered not good business to rile up the American consulate.

You could be earmarked for being white, but more likely if you are white and drive a Range Rover.

Ciudad Juarez is often cited as the most violent place in the Western Hemisphere, but without firm numbers it is difficult to say if it is worse than Detroit. It does look like young women are the target of one or more serial killers. But it is really ground zero for the drug trade. It is the most common place for an American homicide.

Worldwide American Deaths 2010(Natural causes not included)

219	21%	Homicide (107 in Mexico)
4	0%	Execution (4 in Mexico)
29	3%	Drug Related
17	2%	Terrorist Action (Afghanistan & Iraq)
133	13%	Suicide
125	12%	Disaster (121 in Haiti)
113	11%	Drowning
422	40%	Accidents Transportation

Locations of Homicides in Mexico

39	Chihuahua (mostly Ciudad Juarez)
28	Baja California (12 TJ, 6 Rosarito)
9	Sonora (near border)
8	Tamaulipas (near border)
1	Coahuila (near border)
1	Nuevo Leon (near Monterrey)
4	Distrito Federal
2	Durango
1	Guanajuato
2	Guerrero (near Acapulco)
8	Jalisco
1	Michoacan
1	Morelos
3	Nayarit
1	Sinaloa
1	Quintana Roo (Cancun)
1	Oaxaca

The one American who died in Oaxaca last year seems to be a counter-example. A 46 year old real estate developer who was killed with a machete for an unknown reason.


Oaxaca (South of Mexico City) is distant from the drug trade. It is kind of ironic, because it is here that the Western world was largely introduced to the world of hallucinogens. R. Gordon Wasson (a 60 year old New York V.P. of JP Morgan of all things) launched the “psychedelic revolution” with his Life magazine article of 13 May 1957, in which he publicized his experience on the nights of 29-30 June, 1955, in the remote Oaxacan village of Huautla de Jiménez with the Mazatec curandera or shaman María Sabina. The article was the first to use the term “magic mushroom,” which was probably invented by the magazine’s editor.

María Sabina is almost always pictured smoking what looks like a joint. Actually she only smoked tobacco. The drug she used for her spiritual journeys was always mushrooms and she did not smoke any pot. She briefly became a celebrity who traveled around the world and met the new generation of rock singers in the early 1960's. Of course, she had no idea what she had unleashed by entertaining that banker. Hallucinogens were never taken recreationaly by her people, they were always part of their religious ceremonies.

I'm actually not completely clear on this: Does classifying a death as "Drug related" suggest that it involved smuggling or involved an overdose?

There is really no such thing as an overdose of heroin. Most such deaths are hypersensitivity reactions to contaminants.

I think the drug related deaths meant they died of acute lead poisoning in an area known for buying drugs.

Quote: Doc

I'm actually not completely clear on this: Does classifying a death as "Drug related" suggest that it involved smuggling or involved an overdose?

The State Department is required by law to make this report. But clearly they are just trying to meet the letter of the law. They don't seem to want to provide any details or analysis. Even by the standards of a simple database they are not even careful about uniform categories. Since there is a date associated with each death they don't seem to want to get into any fights with relatives of the deceased, so they use these broad categories.

There is no explanations of the categories. I suppose that some of the 6K or so "natural deaths" per year probably have some homicides or suicides in them. Here are the categories without combining any of them. The "Disaster" is mostly the Haiti earthquake.

Cause	World 8 years	Mexico	Canada
Grand Total	6,481	1789	110
Homicide	1,135	438	5
Execution	18	16
Drug-Related	182	36	3
Suicide	810	144	14
Terrorist Action	264
Drowning	718	215	9
Drowning - Bay	1
Drowning - Beach	20	4	1
Drowning - Bridge	1
Drowning - canal	1	1
Drowning - Lake	6		5
Drowning - Ocean	34	8
Drowning - Pool	9	5
Drowning - River	10	1
Drowning - Sea	1
Disaster	158	1
Vehicle Accident - Auto	1,462	583	26
Vehicle Accident - Motorcycle	263	77	5
Air Accident	226	27	10
Maritime Accident	67	10	1
Other Accident	804	152	25
Vehicle Accident - Bus	86	21
Vehicle Accident - Other	62	11	4
Vehicle Accident - Pedestrian	108	38	2
Vehicle Accident - Train	13
Other Accident - Fall	8	1
Other Accident - Hiking	1
Other Accident - Mountian climbing	2
Other Accident - Rafting	1
Train Accident	8
Under Investigation	1
Unknown	1

Quote: FleaStiff

There is really no such thing as an overdose of heroin. Most such deaths are hypersensitivity reactions to contaminants.

I think the drug related deaths meant they died of acute lead poisoning in an area known for buying drugs.

There absolutely is such a thing as an overdose of heroin. Enough will make you stop breathing. You don't live too long without breathing.

Granted, there are "bad neighborhoods" in all major cities. However, the ones who are the most familiar with the places to avoid, and therefore, the most likely to feel, "safe" because they are avoiding those areas, are the locals.

When you ask the question to folks who don't know the barrio from the bar district, they can only rely on the information they have been exposed to. In Mexico's case, sensational news coverage of shootouts, beheadings and police station bombings. Unless I have been informed by a trusted source where it is "safe", I have a hard time feeling comfortable in an unfamiliar town/city/country.

In the case of Las Vegas, there are some neighborhoods that should be avoided by tourists. Unknowingly, I have cut through a few of them late at night on foot, or turned off the freeway into them in my car, due to crummy GPS coordinates. I found out later that my property, and possibly my life were at risk, and now would not go through them. However, I also know that there are many "safe" places in Las Vegas, where I can feel secure, and can recommend them to others.

I don't have the same local knowledge about Mexico. I don't know the "safe" and "unsafe" areas, even in or adjacent to the tourist areas. All areas would have to be considered "unsafe" unless vouched for by a trusted source. It is unfortunate, but it is easier to write off the whole country than go through the trouble of learning where to stay, and where to avoid.

Quote: Ayecarumba

Unless I have been informed by a trusted source where it is "safe", I have a hard time feeling comfortable in an unfamiliar town/city/country.

25 August 2011 Last updated at 21:02 ET
Deadly attack on casino in Monterrey, Mexico
In broad daylight.
At least 20 people have been killed and eight injured in an attack on a casino in the northern Mexican city of Monterrey.
Armed men broke into the building and set it alight, but it is not clear whether the fire was caused by grenades, or an arson attack.
bbc

Quote: SOOPOO

There absolutely is such a thing as an overdose of heroin. Enough will make you stop breathing. You don't live too long without breathing.

This is straying off topic but let me say that it takes alot of heroin to kill. Most of these "suddenly strong heroin" deaths are strange. Twenty addicts in a shooting gallery, all share the same two or three suppliers, some share needles, all the suppliers get their junk from the same upstream source ... yet One Addict dies "of an overdose" the others don't even get sick, much less die. Would you swallow that guff if it was rich white republican women at an afternoon tea eating lady fingers?

Quote: FleaStiff

Would you swallow that guff if it was rich white republican women at an afternoon tea eating lady fingers?

That depends on how many ladyfingers and who made them.

Quote: FleaStiff

This is straying off topic but let me say that it takes alot of heroin to kill. Most of these "suddenly strong heroin" deaths are strange. Twenty addicts in a shooting gallery, all share the same two or three suppliers, some share needles, all the suppliers get their junk from the same upstream source ... yet One Addict dies "of an overdose" the others don't even get sick, much less die. Would you swallow that guff if it was rich white republican women at an afternoon tea eating lady fingers?

The whole environment as a "control" sounds pretty shaky for asserting much of anything, including the case for being hard to overdose on heroin.