EvenBob
EvenBob
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July 26th, 2010 at 7:27:02 PM permalink
Quote: bluefire

Technically, all results comply with variance. But that's exactly what luck is: short-term variance patterns.

In your example, "bad luck" would be the short-term negative variance that person experienced over the rest of his life.



Exactly! Thats the term I had forgotten, luck is really short term negative or positive variance. Nothing mysterious about it at all.
"It's not enough to succeed, your friends must fail." Gore Vidal
boymimbo
boymimbo
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July 26th, 2010 at 7:56:05 PM permalink
Quote: dictionary.com

Luck:
1. the force that seems to operate for good or ill in a person's life, as in shaping circumstances, events, or opportunities: With my luck I'll probably get pneumonia.
2. good fortune; advantage or success, considered as the result of chance: He had no luck finding work.
3. a combination of circumstances, events, etc., operating by chance to bring good or ill to a person: She's had nothing but bad luck all year.
4. some object on which good fortune is supposed to depend: This rabbit's foot is my luck.



There is very much a thing as luck.
----- You want the truth! You can't handle the truth!
Mosca
Mosca
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July 26th, 2010 at 7:56:15 PM permalink
The world has probability, and it also has chaos. Chaos looks like probability, but it is still chaos, and the difference is luck.

And furthermore, none of this takes place on the pages of a book; it happens in life, in the world of experience, to people. Everyone is still ignoring or bypassing the emotional dimension of luck. The dice, the cards, the wheel, the circuitry are all without emotion. For those inanimate, there are only odds and variance. But for us, the players, the biological, thinking, FEELING creatures, experiencing "luck" is WHY WE DO THIS. There are easier ways to make a living. But the THRILL of good luck--! Nothing like it.

And the despair of bad luck. The feeling you have when you've blown your entire day's bankroll and it isn't even 2PM. Ugh. "Negative variance" doesn't much describe that feeling, not even a little bit.

"Luck" is inside you. It isn't the variance. It is the feeling you have, both in anticipation of the event and then for the resolution of the event. It describes potential, and attitude, and it also describes results. "Variance" is when it happens in a textbook. "Luck" is when it happens TO YOU.
NO KILL I
EvenBob
EvenBob
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July 26th, 2010 at 9:03:04 PM permalink
A guy gets drunk and dies when he hits a tree on the way home. Bad luck for him. The ambulance driver who answers the call is having a slow night and gets paid by how many runs he has. Good luck for him. The dead guy had no life insurance, bad luck for his family. They have a huge garage sale just make ends meet, good luck for the buyers. The wife has to sell the house for much less than its worth because they can't live there now. Bad luck for her. The new owner got a bargain, good luck for him. And on and on.

Luck is a meaningless word because it covers everything. Its not a mysterious force that wanders aimlessly around, effecting people this way and that. Its a word that covers what we don't understand. The guy hit the tree because he was drunk. The wife went broke because he didn't buy life insurance. She lost the house because he hit a tree. Luck had nothing to do with anything.
"It's not enough to succeed, your friends must fail." Gore Vidal
bluefire
bluefire
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July 26th, 2010 at 9:10:51 PM permalink
Quote: Mosca

The world has probability, and it also has chaos. Chaos looks like probability, but it is still chaos, and the difference is luck.

And furthermore, none of this takes place on the pages of a book; it happens in life, in the world of experience, to people. Everyone is still ignoring or bypassing the emotional dimension of luck. The dice, the cards, the wheel, the circuitry are all without emotion. For those inanimate, there are only odds and variance. But for us, the players, the biological, thinking, FEELING creatures, experiencing "luck" is WHY WE DO THIS. There are easier ways to make a living. But the THRILL of good luck--! Nothing like it.

And the despair of bad luck. The feeling you have when you've blown your entire day's bankroll and it isn't even 2PM. Ugh. "Negative variance" doesn't much describe that feeling, not even a little bit.

"Luck" is inside you. It isn't the variance. It is the feeling you have, both in anticipation of the event and then for the resolution of the event. It describes potential, and attitude, and it also describes results. "Variance" is when it happens in a textbook. "Luck" is when it happens TO YOU.



When I use the word luck in everyday life, it could have emotion or it could be completely emotionless. Generally, I just use it to mean that something was perceived to have happened by chance: "I got lucky and found a decent parking spot" or "Luck was on his side when the ref missed that call". Both of those can be really emotionless statements, or they can have emotion behind them.

I don't think luck is an adjective describing emotion. It could give you an idea as to the emotion that person was experiencing based off of the context, but it doesn't always describe emotion.

In gambling, the reason it's exciting is because you have the opportunity to win something extremely valuable, or lose something extremely valuable: money. As a result, gambling is always going to have emotion attached to it. The emotion is more tied to the activity itself and is a function of luck (or short-term variance), but isn't in and of itself luck.
Mosca
Mosca
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July 26th, 2010 at 9:23:55 PM permalink
Yeah, and Webster's Dictionary and The Rime of the Ancient Mariner are both just arrangements of letters.
NO KILL I
bluefire
bluefire
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July 26th, 2010 at 9:32:17 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

A guy gets drunk and dies when he hits a tree on the way home. Bad luck for him. The ambulance driver who answers the call is having a slow night and gets paid by how many runs he has. Good luck for him. The dead guy had no life insurance, bad luck for his family. They have a huge garage sale just make ends meet, good luck for the buyers. The wife has to sell the house for much less than its worth because they can't live there now. Bad luck for her. The new owner got a bargain, good luck for him. And on and on.

Luck is a meaningless word because it covers everything. Its not a mysterious force that wanders aimlessly around, effecting people this way and that. Its a word that covers what we don't understand. The guy hit the tree because he was drunk. The wife went broke because he didn't buy life insurance. She lost the house because he hit a tree. Luck had nothing to do with anything.



I'm not sure "luck" is being used the way I'd use it - I certainly wouldn't say it was bad luck for a drunk driver to crash into a tree. That didn't happen by chance.

I think "luck" is appropriate for something like this:

Would you describe people born in North America as lucky? I consider North America to largely be the most desirable place to live. However, 92.11% of the population lives elsewhere. Therefore, anyone born into North America would have experienced good luck, as it was something positive that happened to them by seemingly random chance. Now, granted, you can break it down into specific parents causing the children to be born in that continent, etc, but there is a feeling of random chance given that you aren't in control.
bluefire
bluefire
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July 26th, 2010 at 9:35:18 PM permalink
Quote: Mosca

Yeah, and Webster's Dictionary and The Rime of the Ancient Mariner are both just arrangements of letters.



Letters that we've all negotiated agreed upon meanings to. There's nothing about the way the word luck is used in everyday life that always conveys excitement.

Luck creates emotion, but isn't emotion itself.
EvenBob
EvenBob
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July 26th, 2010 at 11:50:11 PM permalink
{{I'm not sure "luck" is being used the way I'd use it - I certainly wouldn't say it was bad luck for a drunk driver to crash into a tree. That didn't happen by chance.}}

Of course it was chance, it wasn't planned and it certainly wasn't by choice.
"It's not enough to succeed, your friends must fail." Gore Vidal
JerryLogan
JerryLogan
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July 27th, 2010 at 12:15:14 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

A guy gets drunk and dies when he hits a tree on the way home. Bad luck for him. The ambulance driver who answers the call is having a slow night and gets paid by how many runs he has. Good luck for him. The dead guy had no life insurance, bad luck for his family. They have a huge garage sale just make ends meet, good luck for the buyers. The wife has to sell the house for much less than its worth because they can't live there now. Bad luck for her. The new owner got a bargain, good luck for him. And on and on.

Luck is a meaningless word because it covers everything. Its not a mysterious force that wanders aimlessly around, effecting people this way and that. Its a word that covers what we don't understand. The guy hit the tree because he was drunk. The wife went broke because he didn't buy life insurance. She lost the house because he hit a tree. Luck had nothing to do with anything.



That's uneducated at best. "Health" applies to every person in either good or bad terms. Every issue you mentioned as well as the health issue are almost entirely understood.

I'd say you're not at the level you like you think you are. Looks like the majority understand that. Bad luck for you.

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