Thread Rating:

Mission146
Mission146
Joined: May 15, 2012
  • Threads: 122
  • Posts: 12554
July 15th, 2018 at 8:46:03 PM permalink
Quote: RS

I agree....well, at least from a devil's advocate point of view. But do you think the left would actually support this and mix it in with the abortion laws and whatnot? I don't think so.



I donít know if they would or not. If Iím honest, probably not. I donít see how itís not consistent with equal rights, or as close to equal as possible, though.

Either way, I think a man can do it now, itís just much more complicated.

The first thing he would have to do is not claim paternity, thatís the easy part.

The next thing that she would have to do would be to sue him for child support by which he would be compelled to appear in court and submit to a paternity test.

However, if he already lived in a different state and had no plans to ever go to the previous state, then he could simply not show up for court. He might be charged and convicted with Failure to Appear in absentia (which he has also not appeared for) but that would not be a Federal crime, itíd be a state-level crime. That would mean itís possible (maybe probable) that the state would not want to have the person extradited back to them, which assumes they get caught for anything in the first place.

Quote:

That isn't the argument though. The argument is due to finances. Yes, there are other arguments, like health reasons, rape, "her body", etc. but I'm not talking about those. If you immediately jump to one of those reasons when discussing the financial argument, then that means the financial argument holds no water.



I tend to ramble, sometimes. I think the financial argument holds water, I just meant that women and men canít truly have equal rights in this regard due to the practical concern of the baby being in her body. In my mind, I had kind of already jumped ahead to, ďWhat if the guy wanted it, but she didnít,Ē when I wrote that.


Quote:

That's the other side of the coin, which I was countering with the idea I brought up. Right now, if she wants to have the baby, then he's on the hook for child support and he can't get out of it. If he wants to have the baby, shouldn't he have a say in the matter? You can't just say, "The women get all the rights, the men don't get sh** for rights" and expect any kind of equality or fairness in that scenario.



I agree with you in principle 100%, the question is just one of implementation. Also, do his rights to the child exceed her right not to carry the thing around for several months and push it or have it cut out of her body?
Vultures can't be choosers.
Mission146
Mission146
Joined: May 15, 2012
  • Threads: 122
  • Posts: 12554
July 15th, 2018 at 8:47:34 PM permalink
Quote: dogqck

So then my taxes willgo to WIC, Food Stamps, Medicaid, etc for Mom and baby and Daddy just knocks up another. Wait a minute, never mind. That already happens now. My error.



Yup, so Iím guessing youíre in favor of abortion if she wants an abortion, right?
Vultures can't be choosers.
dogqck
dogqck
Joined: Jun 22, 2018
  • Threads: 1
  • Posts: 94
July 15th, 2018 at 9:16:15 PM permalink
Why the hell would you think that ? I just think the dad should be paying child support if it's his kid. I have a younger brother who skipped on 3 kids, 3 different Moms. moved to Florida. Bragged to me once that he only had another year and statue of limitations were up and he could go home. That was last time I talked to him. He died recently. His legacy is a beautiful daughter who is glad he's dead. I had heard every excuse from she will just spend the money on drugs to her new husband is loaded. Hey, it's your kid asshole. If you really think she's using drugs, call social services, fight for custody, etc. DEAD beat dads, drop dead!
Mission146
Mission146
Joined: May 15, 2012
  • Threads: 122
  • Posts: 12554
July 15th, 2018 at 9:29:26 PM permalink
Quote: dogqck

Why the hell would you think that ? I just think the dad should be paying child support if it's his kid. I have a younger brother who skipped on 3 kids, 3 different Moms. moved to Florida. Bragged to me once that he only had another year and statue of limitations were up and he could go home. That was last time I talked to him. He died recently. His legacy is a beautiful daughter who is glad he's dead. I had heard every excuse from she will just spend the money on drugs to her new husband is loaded. Hey, it's your kid asshole. If you really think she's using drugs, call social services, fight for custody, etc. DEAD beat dads, drop dead!



I just figured youíre worried about where your taxes are going, so youíd be pro-choice, abortion being the cheaper option...even if tax money were paying for it. (It doesnít)

Anyway, I know what you mean, but dead beat dads and single moms arenít the only ones availing themselves of social safety nets.
Vultures can't be choosers.
rxwine
rxwine
Joined: Feb 28, 2010
  • Threads: 162
  • Posts: 9306
July 15th, 2018 at 11:36:35 PM permalink
Quote: Mission146

Honestly, there's a fair Constitutional Rights question to be asked about whether or not it should have been put to the states to begin with.

If you want to know the truth, I think we might actually be less polarized on the national level if more was left up to the states. I'm not sure what the other effects of such a thing would be, and a good many of them would certainly be negative, but that would be one of the positive ones.



For women with means, well off, that's not a big deal, in fact, they may even pay for their own care. For women without means, possibly depending on a city bus to even go to work, only having abortion available in some other state that allows it, is another big deal.

I don't have a problem with your idea in general, but in this case I think I do, and pretty sure pro-choice advocates have the same problem with that suggestion as they've likely heard it before.

And they've already managed to cut access in several ways already even within states.
Quasimodo? Does that name ring a bell?
rxwine
rxwine
Joined: Feb 28, 2010
  • Threads: 162
  • Posts: 9306
July 16th, 2018 at 12:07:08 AM permalink
Quote: RS

That's the other side of the coin, which I was countering with the idea I brought up. Right now, if she wants to have the baby, then he's on the hook for child support and he can't get out of it. If he wants to have the baby, shouldn't he have a say in the matter? You can't just say, "The women get all the rights, the men don't get sh** for rights" and expect any kind of equality or fairness in that scenario.




To, actually make it a fair process we need to put a 8 to 10 pound object in your belly for 9 months. Then on the appropriate day you'll have to sit on the toilet and crap it out completely whole. It will do a giant number on your rectum but that can be sewn back up and we can pump you full of antibiotics.
Quasimodo? Does that name ring a bell?
Mission146
Mission146
Joined: May 15, 2012
  • Threads: 122
  • Posts: 12554
July 16th, 2018 at 8:22:58 AM permalink
Quote: rxwine

For women with means, well off, that's not a big deal, in fact, they may even pay for their own care. For women without means, possibly depending on a city bus to even go to work, only having abortion available in some other state that allows it, is another big deal.

I don't have a problem with your idea in general, but in this case I think I do, and pretty sure pro-choice advocates have the same problem with that suggestion as they've likely heard it before.

And they've already managed to cut access in several ways already even within states.



I donít disagree with your point, but no idea is perfect. I definitely concede that living in a state with no legalized abortion would make it tougher to get an abortion. I imagine that poorer rural women who want an abortion sometimes deal with the same thing right now.
Vultures can't be choosers.
SOOPOO
SOOPOO
Joined: Aug 8, 2010
  • Threads: 107
  • Posts: 6407
July 16th, 2018 at 11:27:58 AM permalink
When do hearings start? (This is a SCJ thread....)
VCUSkyhawk
VCUSkyhawk
Joined: Sep 22, 2013
  • Threads: 21
  • Posts: 644
July 16th, 2018 at 12:26:07 PM permalink
Cocain Mitch has said the judiciary committee will start the discussions around 9-1
I got a plan, we take all your picks we reverse them like one of those twilight zone episodes where everything is the opposite. You say "black" we go white.
reno
reno
Joined: Jan 20, 2010
  • Threads: 124
  • Posts: 721
September 12th, 2018 at 4:53:47 PM permalink
Senator Sheldon Whitehouse (D-RI) wants to know if Brett Kavanaugh has a gambling addiction.

Kavanaugh's debts and bank balances have gone up & down rather abruptly. His financial disclosure forms indicated that in 2016, his credit card debt ranged from $60,000 to $200,000, but in 2017 all of his debt (excluding his mortgage) was gone.

Here are the questions that Whitehouse has submitted to Judge Kavanaugh:


  • Jump to: