"Nice" men/women
Poll
 | 10 votes (43.47%) | ||
| | 1 vote (4.34%) | ||
| | 8 votes (34.78%) | ||
| | 9 votes (39.13%) |
23 members have voted
Quote: MoscaMy thought is once you relax and stop thinking about it all so much, everything comes pretty naturally.
Be considerate. Be nice, but have a backbone. Don't be a pushover.
Also, most guys who try hard to be nice give too much, both socially and sexually. By doing that you create two bad situations. The first is an inequality; no one wants to feel in debt to a partner, especially emotionally. It makes the debtor feel small. Second, it's great to give, but if you never take, you deprive your partner of the pleasure of giving. Sometimes a woman wants her man to take. Be considerate. Give you partner the gift of pleasing you.
Recent research says that aroused people will do things that they would find dirty normally. You want to reach that spot where your partner feels comfortable enough to get there. Then you'll be there too. Then you'll get that great share feeling. Then you can be as nice as you want to be, because you want to be. And remember don't be a pushover. You don't have to be an asshole. But if you always go to the flower show instead of watching the game, be prepared to be miserable and then eventually get told "It isn't you, it's me." Bullshit, it was you. She got nothing invested, because you always gave in.
I dunno. I'm married, I don't have to go through all this again, and I don't want to. But that's what worked for me. If I was to do it all over, I'd do it that way again.
I agree with pretty much everything Mosca said, with one exception. There are guys (many) who, while aroused, want things from a woman that, if she is equally aroused, will participate in happily. That part is very accurate. However, after everybody's had their fun, guys (some, but more than a few) will then judge the woman for indulging their "dirty" desires, or even for allowing any sex, and she's no longer some one they want to be with. Huge double standard, and definitely not "nice". So, a "nice" partner (adding to what I said before) will leave his inhibitions at the bedroom door, and leave what happens there in the bedroom, continuing to enjoy her outside of that part. Lots of things are great in the bedroom among consenting adults, from fantasies to fetishes to certain games and practices, but there has to be trust and respect on everybody's part. If you wonder why it's so hard to get a woman into bed, this is part of why; she has to believe that this is not the whole point of your interest, and that there's a reason to see each other past the point of allowing the sexual activity to start.
Quote: beachbumbabsI agree with pretty much everything Mosca said, with one exception. There are guys (many) who, while aroused, want things from a woman that, if she is equally aroused, will participate in happily. That part is very accurate. However, after everybody's had their fun, guys (some, but more than a few) will then judge the woman for indulging their "dirty" desires, or even for allowing any sex, and she's no longer some one they want to be with. Huge double standard, and definitely not "nice". So, a "nice" partner (adding to what I said before) will leave his inhibitions at the bedroom door, and leave what happens there in the bedroom, continuing to enjoy her outside of that part. Lots of things are great in the bedroom among consenting adults, from fantasies to fetishes to certain games and practices, but there has to be trust and respect on everybody's part. If you wonder why it's so hard to get a woman into bed, this is part of why; she has to believe that this is not the whole point of your interest, and that there's a reason to see each other past the point of allowing the sexual activity to start.
I knew a couple once and the girl used to get upset at the it that he didn't "force her" to stay home rather than have her weekly "girls' night out" -- I was tempted, but didn't care enough, to ask if she would then be mad if he told her not to go out as she could then claim he was "controlling"
I never tell anyone what to do in a relationship--if they want to go out, go out...they want to spend their money on something, go spend...I'm not anyone keeper or master...and I should never have to "force you" to spend time with me
Quote: MoscaI can only speak from my experience, which is male. Thanks for adding the experience from the other side. I don't think I've ever wanted to be a "nice" guy. I've always wanted to be a good guy. The nice part (without quote marks) follows.
You have solved the eternal riddle, Mosca. I'll say it again; Mrs. Mosca is one of the luckiest women on the planet.
No no he didn't solve the DATING riddle, everything changes once people are in a relationship. Romance and other things became a bigger factor.Quote: beachbumbabsYou have solved the eternal riddle, Mosca. I'll say it again; Mrs. Mosca is one of the luckiest women on the planet.
We have to realize different generations, age and race all factor into this. Lets talk about what most men are looking for 18 to 30 hot chicks.
What is the average 18 to 30 american girl attracted to(lets take looks out of this). Just like anything its different for each person. As a general rule. Any of these are the opposite of what girls want: nerdy/brainy, quiet(unless its a mysterious quiet), shy, to nice, desperate, unpopular, boring, foolish, pushover, not confidant, to emotional, style less, pushy, clingy. Being overly nice to a girl when you first meet her rarely works. Yammering on how beautiful she is, kills it. Best line ever, You're kind of cute, let me get your number, maybe i'll give you a call sometimes.
If you really want to hook a hot chick. For the first few dates (If you can get that far) DO NOT: Do some dinner and a movie,Dress Conservative, buy her flowers, make everything perfect.
You should do something casual. Preferably something you might be good at,(probably not video games) never let a girl win.Do something fun so she can loosen up and possibly forget this is a DATE. Girls are often guarded on a date, especially at dinner. Never fawn all over her.
I'm not saying don't go to dinner, I'm just saying don't do some boring dinner and a move crap.
You straight guys have to put up with a whole song and dance. You have to try to figure out a creature that is more complex than a space alien. You must decipher codes and actions, because what they say is not really what they really mean. You have to try to figure out what they really want and then have to put on a whole song and dance pretending to be that person they want. There really should be some sort of book or instructions for you guys.
Quote: kewljStraight guys have it rough. My world is just so much simpler. I find a guy that can cook more than just toast, gives good head, likes football and will leave me alone the rest of the time with no guilt trips about lack of attention or quality time or any of that crap.
You straight guys have to put up with a whole song and dance. You have to try to figure out a creature that is more complex than a space alien. You must decipher codes and actions, because what they say is not really what they really mean. You have to try to figure out what they really want and then have to put on a whole song and dance pretending to be that person they want. There really should be some sort of book or instructions for you guys.
I am jealous, for sure.
Quote: ncfatcatAsk them mean trick trivia questions
STOP with the trivia questions.
I cant imagine its like this for all homosexual relationships.Quote: kewljStraight guys have it rough. My world is just so much simpler. I find a guy that can cook more than just toast, gives good head, likes football and will leave me alone the rest of the time with no guilt trips about lack of attention or quality time or any of that crap.
You straight guys have to put up with a whole song and dance. You have to try to figure out a creature that is more complex than a space alien. You must decipher codes and actions, because what they say is not really what they really mean. You have to try to figure out what they really want and then have to put on a whole song and dance pretending to be that person they want. There really should be some sort of book or instructions for you guys.
I would think some gay men are even more complicated then some females.
Quote: beachbumbabsHowever, after everybody's had their fun, guys (some, but more than a few) will then judge the woman for indulging their "dirty" desires, or even for allowing any sex, and she's no longer some one they want to be with. .
Well, yeah. We want women to do all that
stuff, but we don't want to marry them. We
really want to marry our mothers, and mom
would have never done any of that dirty
stuff. I realized as I got older that I don't
want a hot sexy woman, all I want is a woman
who is nice to me most of the time. Most
women I know treat their husbands like crap.
Quote: EvenBobWell, yeah. We want women to do all that
stuff, but we don't want to marry them. We
really want to marry our mothers, and mom
would have never done any of that dirty
stuff. I realized as I got older that I don't
want a hot sexy woman, all I want is a woman
who is nice to me most of the time. Most
women I know treat their husbands like crap.
Music to my ears...
Quote: aceofspadesMusic to my ears...
Divorce lawyers, it doesn't take much to cheer
them up.
Quote: AxelWolfNo no he didn't solve the DATING riddle, everything changes once people are in a relationship. Romance and other things became a bigger factor.
We have to realize different generations, age and race all factor into this. Lets talk about what most men are looking for 18 to 30 hot chicks.
What is the average 18 to 30 american girl attracted to(lets take looks out of this). Just like anything its different for each person. As a general rule. Any of these are the opposite of what girls want: nerdy/brainy, quiet(unless its a mysterious quiet), shy, to nice, desperate, unpopular, boring, foolish, pushover, not confidant, to emotional, style less, pushy, clingy. Being overly nice to a girl when you first meet her rarely works. Yammering on how beautiful she is, kills it. Best line ever, You're kind of cute, let me get your number, maybe i'll give you a call sometimes.
If you really want to hook a hot chick. For the first few dates (If you can get that far) DO NOT: Do some dinner and a movie,Dress Conservative, buy her flowers, make everything perfect.
You should do something casual. Preferably something you might be good at,(probably not video games) never let a girl win.Do something fun so she can loosen up and possibly forget this is a DATE. Girls are often guarded on a date, especially at dinner. Never fawn all over her.
I'm not saying don't go to dinner, I'm just saying don't do some boring dinner and a move crap.
I think you have a point. I have never been a hookup guy. I've always been a relationship guy. My stuff works for guys like me.
Quote: rainmanI'm not entering into anything with a women where I need a lawyer to get me out.
You don't need a lawyer to get divorced, in fact
your wife would prefer you not to have one..
And if they say "No," don't dwell on it, move on.
Quote: EvenBobWell, yeah. We want women to do all that
stuff, but we don't want to marry them. We
really want to marry our mothers, and mom
would have never done any of that dirty
stuff. I realized as I got older that I don't
want a hot sexy woman, all I want is a woman
who is nice to me most of the time. Most
women I know treat their husbands like crap.
You got it in one.
Oh, &@%$ no, I wouldn't want to wake up married to someone just like dear ol' Mom. Even if she didn't currently reside in a little box on a bookshelf right over there. I don't doubt that would be right for plenty of others, but one size doesn't fit all. Wouldn't have been a happy fit for Mom either, as she wasn't too shy to say often enough, generally right after she told me I'd be an idiot & no son of hers if I ever bet a horse running against the dead rail bias at Hollywood Park, usually right before she reminded me that her ashtray was overdue to be emptied and while I'm up her whiskey glass could stand a refill. And she was generally right about that, too.Quote:our mothers
Quote: DrawingDeadOh, &@%$ no, I wouldn't want to wake up married to someone just like dear ol' Mom. Even if she didn't currently reside in a little box on a bookshelf right over there. I don't doubt that would be right for plenty of others, but one size doesn't fit all. Wouldn't have been a happy fit for Mom either, as she wasn't too shy to say often enough, generally right after she told me I'd be an idiot & no son of hers if I ever bet a horse running against the dead rail bias at Hollywood Park, usually right before she reminded me that her ashtray was overdue to be emptied and while I'm up her whiskey glass could stand a refill. And she was generally right about that, too.
Great post, DD. Thanks.
Quote: DrawingDeadOh, &@%$ no, I wouldn't want to wake up married to someone just like dear ol' Mom. .
No no no, not THAT mom, the one I hated
as a teen and never spoke to as an adult.
We want to marry the mom we had when
we were 3, who loved us unconditionally
and forgave everything we did. Who was
always glad to see us and was our best
friend. That mom.
I'm not entering into anything with a women where I need a lawyer doctor to get me out.Quote: rainmanI'm not entering into anything with a women where I need a lawyer to get me out.
A guy found a magic lamp, squeezed it and, lo! a genie comes out and is ready to grant him a wish.Quote: kewljStraight guys have it rough. My world is just so much simpler. You straight guys have to put up with a whole song and dance. You have to try to figure out a creature that is more complex than a space alien.
The guy says "Well, you see, I'm afraid of boats and of airplanes, yet I would love to travel. My dream is of a huge bridge over the Atlantic to be able to drive to Europe."
"Wow! Wow! I may be a genie but I still am limited in what I can create. Can't you ask something else?"
"Well, I have always wanted to understand women and..."
"OK! How many lanes on your bridge?"
The term nice is usually indicative of people who are shy and/or pushovers, which is a major turnoff, though I personally think the term is silly, women like "Alpha-dogs". So being turned off by nice people is not surprising. That said you can be a polite person while being confident and holding your terirtory.
Likewise, I imagine men love nice girls because they love when females give them any kind of attention so that is not surprising either.
As far as marriage, I will never get married, partly due to my personality (I hate answering to people and having to be around the same people for excessive amounts of time), and I also have to travel all over which would make marriage difficult, but even if I had a steady 9-5 job, I still would not be interested, besides as others have said unless your wife makes more than you (which is rare) it is always -EV, and with divorces at an all time high (well over 50%), the most likely outcome for any marriage (even much higher for young marrriages) is divorce.
Quote: GandlerAs far as marriage, I will never get married, partly due to my personality .
From my experience and observation, marriage
mostly sucks. I know not one couple who has
been married over 10 years and is happily married.
I know some that say they are, but if I'm around
them for any length of time I can see the resentment
for each other right under the surface.
If I wasn't married I would never do so again. It's
something that was invented so children would
be protected, it really has no other function.
Quote: GandlerThe term nice is usually indicative of people who are shy and/or pushovers, which is a major turnoff, though I personally think the term is silly, women like "Alpha-dogs". So being turned off by nice people is not surprising. That said you can be a polite person while being confident and holding your terirtory.
Yes, exactly. This is it. Remember that the research did not use the word "nice", they used the word "responsive". The author of the article twisted it into "nice" so that he could use the "nice guys finish last" phrase. In other words, it's poor reporting.
It is possible to be nice and treat a woman with respect without being a doormat. You can be self-confident / assertive / "alpha" without being an asshole.
Often times, the assholes are the people who don't naturally have those qualities but are trying to fake it.
Quote: AxiomOfChoiceYes, exactly. This is it. Remember that the research did not use the word "nice", they used the word "responsive". The author of the article twisted it into "nice" so that he could use the "nice guys finish last" phrase. In other words, it's poor reporting.
It is possible to be nice and treat a woman with respect without being a doormat. You can be self-confident / assertive / "alpha" without being an asshole.
Often times, the assholes are the people who don't naturally have those qualities but are trying to fake it.
I agree 100% . The media frequently does this when reporting on scietific studies, they love to sensationalize. Some men try to hard and over compensate by being jerks. And some people just have no social skills.
I try to stay confident, while being polite and classy. It sounds very cheesy, but to use a fictional example: James Bond probably has the perfect blend of sophistication and manners while always being confident and in control (and well dressed).
To paraphrase Winston Churchill even in warefare there is no excuse to lose your manners.
There is enough rude people in the world without the need to encourage more men to be rude in hopes of impressing women lol
Quote: EvenBobFrom my experience and observation, marriage
mostly sucks. I know not one couple who has
been married over 10 years and is happily married.
I know some that say they are, but if I'm around
them for any length of time I can see the resentment
for each other right under the surface.
If I wasn't married I would never do so again. It's
something that was invented so children would
be protected, it really has no other function.
But if not for her, who would shed a tear at your graveside ?
Quote: AxiomOfChoiceIt is possible to be nice and treat a woman with respect without being a doormat.
What I see is men kissing their wives asses
every min of the day because they're scared
of pissing her off some how. They learned
the hard way that they can't live with a pissed
off woman, so they have no choice but to
constantly placate her.
Quote: EvenBobWhat I see is men kissing their wives asses
every min of the day because they're scared
of pissing her off some how. They learned
the hard way that they can't live with a pissed
off woman, so they have no choice but to
constantly placate her.
I guess that's a sign of a bad marriage. Or maybe it's just a sign of marriage, I wouldn't know and don't care to lol.
In my mind, somebody having that much control and influence over you, with the threat of divorce as ample suppressing fire, does not seem like a happy time... But maybe I'm just weird...
Quote: GandlerI guess that's a sign of a bad marriage. Or maybe it's just a sign of marriage.
It's a sign of marriage. Charleton Heston was married
for over 50 years and he said the secret was learning
to say you're sorry in a dozen different ways, even if
you're not. Constantly soothe and placate her, kissing
her ass day in and day out. Otherwise she'll drive
you insane.
Quote: EvenBobWell, yeah. We want women to do all that
stuff, but we don't want to marry them. We
really want to marry our mothers
Oh, where did you get that?
Quote: EvenBobIt's something that was invented so children would
be protected, it really has no other function.
You forget, it also was invented so women would be protected. This aspect is well understood by men with daughters.
IMO, a man should marry someone who makes a great wife, and if he wants a lover, he should then go get a lover. His wife as his lover? Maybe the first few years.
Yep, I know, immoral and also perilous. But I stand by that.
