Moving to/Living in NoVa (Alexandria, VA)

This is a "living on your own for the first time" and "anything about NoVa" thread. I request that everyone who has the time, takes the time to help me out here. My dad is a Japanese accountant (think stereotype) with a "my way" kind of attitude, I'd really appreciate secondary opinions on everything.

Alright so awhile back I applied for a job as a patent examiner and after two full months I got an offer. I have lived in Seattle my entire life, only moving to/from downtown for college. I have a few statements to set the tone then questions.

- I'm going to live in Northern Virginia, not DC or Maryland. I have my reasons for this and it's pretty much set in stone.
- I'm willing to pay $1200 max for housing. More if I skip the car. I know some areas are plagued by mosquitoes, I don't want that and I'm willing to pay.
- The USPTO is between King and Eisenhower metro stations on the blue/yellow lines.
- I really don't care about a nightlife.

Questions/Topics:

Please comment on anything

1. (Housing) - I've been looking into Huntington & Van Dorn metro areas (Blue & Yellow lines). These seem on the cheaper/safer side because they're pretty far from DC proper. Safety is my #1 concern, followed by price.

2. (Car, transportation) - Owning a car. Most likely I'll be taking the metro to work everyday because my employer will cover it, but I would still really appreciate the flexibility of owning a car. If I decide against a car, I will save that extra $500-600/month to buy a car later. Although financially it is much more intelligent to skip the car, my personal "value" of having a car is VERY high.

3. Gambling budget. I need to build a bankroll and be able to fund that bankroll enough. I have very good money management (I leave "even" the majority of the time) so I'm just curious how you guys manage/build your bankroll throughout the year. This is not for APers, I play craps.

Quote: ahiromu

1. (Housing) - I've been looking into Huntington & Van Dorn metro areas (Blue & Yellow lines). These seem on the cheaper/safer side because they're pretty far from DC proper. Safety is my #1 concern, followed by price.

Young people in the area today seem to do the room-mate thing to save money on rent. If you are not willing/able to do that, your going to have to make some compromises. A house in the Huntington area that will fit your budget might not fit the "safe neighborhood" requirement. You might check out unthrilling-for-a-multitude-of-reasons single bedroom condominiums, they possibly are cheap now, certainly the mortgage rates are cheap. Surely some are for rent. Ought to fit the safety requirement too.

Quote:

2. (Car, transportation) - Owning a car. Most likely I'll be taking the metro to work everyday because my employer will cover it, but I would still really appreciate the flexibility of owning a car. If I decide against a car, I will save that extra $500-600/month to buy a car later. Although financially it is much more intelligent to skip the car, my personal "value" of having a car is VERY high.

Re the metro [the train], being near it costs more in rent/housing value. Perhaps a bus will work.

Quote:

3. Gambling budget. I need to build a bankroll and be able to fund that bankroll enough. I have very good money management (I leave "even" the majority of the time) so I'm just curious how you guys manage/build your bankroll throughout the year. This is not for APers, I play craps.

Craps requires a big bankroll the way most of us play it. Surely any financial advisor has to tell you not to gamble at all, if you are young and just starting out. OK, you are going to play anyway, you don't have to tell us. I'd say never show up with less than $500 you can truly afford to lose. That still means limits, you will bust out with that and have to replace it. Please don't have 100% of savings go to gambling.

Around here your nearby choices are Charles Town WV and just now open, Arundel Mills MD.

The former is Hollywood Casino where there is a Craps Table, 2X odds, and only recently reasonable table minimums. Been there once but no tables were open in the morning and I left without gambling. Availability has also improved though, I am told. Most people I have talked to just didnt like the experience for one reason or another.

The latter is Maryland Live! That will mean e-craps with giant dice under a dome that vibrates them to simulate a roll. I concluded they must be fair dice and a normal fair game, but for more check out some threads and some blogs. 3x4x5x.Note, not a real table.

I think the next closest Craps is in Delaware, Dover or Harrington. Harrington for sure and also probably Dover now are 10x odds if betting $10 [often the min anyway]. Relaxed atmosphere. Downside is: never forget to dodge busy times for the Bay Bridge, RT 50; that means going on the weekend is dicey.

You may find some PA places are not too much further and no Bay bridge prob., but I have no facts about that.

Thank you very much for the response, I really appreciate it.

On the housing...
I put in some serious time over the past day looking at craigslist, I'm probably going to have to live with someone for my first year. I might be willing to bump my budget up a hundred or two if I forgo the car. My biggest issue is having to start in three weeks (make the move within two), so I don't have enough time to properly shop around.

On the gambling...
Yeah building up a big enough bankroll is huge. I'm afraid my gambling habit will have to go on the backburner while I build up a safety net.

Quote: odiousgambit

Please don't have 100% of savings go to gambling.

My dad is a Japanese CPA and all applicable stereotypes, he even had those gigantic glasses when I was little. I'd be disowned if I pulled a Terrance Watanabe.

I would expand your housing search a bit beyond right near the office, if possible. Limiting to those two stops does tend to limit the "safe" and "affordable" options. I know the first 3 years I was in the area I had roomates just because rents were high. I moved to Crystal City first, but I just checked and a studio in my old apt building goes for 1500, yikes!

I know the city of Alexandria runs a bus system within the city - google Dash bus Alexandria and you should be able to bring up the routes (sorry, bad linking skills).

Definitely think about traffic when deciding where to locate if you have a car - DC metro doesn't have the 2nd worst traffic now for a reason!

As for the gambling budget, I move a small amount of money into a fun account - depending on how you do it, you could raise a decent amount in a month or two, and then go play. Best of luck!

-B

Since you are not thoroughly familiar with the area you are moving to, clearly hold off on buying a car until you actually see how your life is without one. I recommend against an unknown roomate, unless you absolutely cannot afford to live alone. An unknown roomate can have unknown people in your apartment, with unknown acctivities, etc... As far as your gambling bankroll, first you should decide how much 'emergency cash' you want to have saved up. Once that coffer is filled then I would say you could start amassing your craps foundation. By the way, I'll be in Washington early October, before the HotBlonde challenge finale, and am always up for meeting with forum members. If interested shoot me a pm.

I've been living in the DC metro area (Arlington, actually) for about 10 years. I think you are very low on your housing budget. You will be very unlikely to get a place within walking distance of a Blue/ Yellow line station at $1200/ month. Most Metro stations have bike racks-- something you should seriously consider. The commuter benefit will cover a bus, as well, so I'd look at bus routes when choosing places.

Distance from DC is not a good metric for safety. There are some extremely safe areas very close to the city and some less safe areas further out. Arlington (where I live) is the closest suburb to DC, and we had our first homicide in two years a few weeks ago; not too many cities of 200,000+ can say that. (It was a murder/suicide, so not exactly the random violence that folks fear.)

In particular, I've never been all that taken with Van Dorn; seems too industrial to be really nice. This area really varies neighborhood by neighborhood; you might want to consider actually taking a trip here before signing a lease.

If you want a car (and it certainly sounds like you do) I'd consider looking at some of the places on/ near Duke Street; there are probably some places (particularly if you go west of 395) that will be conceivable, and the commute should be tolerable. There's probably a bus route that serves this corridor, too.

I would NOT look outside the Beltway. If you're coming from the south along US-1 you will spend ridiculous amounts of time in stop and go traffic; from the west you'd spend even more time.

I think that most people cannot fathom just how congested it is here; I grew up in the New York City suburbs, and DC is much MUCH worse. Unless your tolerance for that is very high, I'd pay a premium to avoid it.

On the mosquito thing, this is literally the first I've heard of it. I mean, there are mosquitoes, but no more than any place else on the East Coast, and a ton less than when I lived in Raleigh.

Good luck.

Quote: ahiromu

comment on anything

1. (Housing) - I've been looking into Huntington & Van Dorn metro areas (Blue & Yellow lines). These seem on the cheaper/safer side because they're pretty far from DC proper. Safety is my #1 concern, followed by price.

Consider the roommate thing. I did that in AZ, while friends and family thought I was nuts it mostly worked out. It saves a ton of money and gives you some built-in network in your new city. If you do that, try to find a room in a house and not an apartment. Don't lock yourself into more than a few months to start. Most people on CL will go with that, nobody wants to live with someone they dislike so a try-out period works. And like a romantic relationship, people do not want to find new rooms or roommates. I was a six month lease then month-to-month for 2.5 years. The hardest thing I had to explain to older family about having roommates (housemates) was that I rented a room and had my own life, we were roommates, we were not Bert and Ernie.

2. (Car, transportation) - Owning a car. Most likely I'll be taking the metro to work everyday because my employer will cover it, but I would still really appreciate the flexibility of owning a car. If I decide against a car, I will save that extra $500-600/month to buy a car later. Although financially it is much more intelligent to skip the car, my personal "value" of having a car is VERY high.

My cousin has lived in DC for some time now, just moved to VA. In DC he and his now-fiance did the ZipCar thing, said it worked grat in that market. $5-600 a month? That is a lot for a car if you are starting out in a town. Buy used if money is tight.

I greatly appreciate all of the information you guys have given me, each of you took the time to actually write something useful.

On driving...
My dad has offered to both give me his 2yo car and ship it... So I'd only be paying for parking (possibly), insurance and gas directly. Maintenance indirectly, but I'll just add a bit to my emergency fund for that. So that whole situation is a done deal.

AZ: $5-600 was including every cost of the car. Monthly payment, insurance, gas, etc. There's no way I'm going to buy a $30000 car, ever probably.

On housing...
I really don't want to live with a roommate, so I'm actually just about to craigslist $1500 max and see what pops up. I'll still look at houses with roommates because if it's tolerable, it would be worth saving a few bucks. For those of you who know the area intimately, I'll probably post an area here to get your opinions.

Again, thanks guys.

Location opinion request:

Landmark neighborhood in Alexandria. (Unnamed apartments) specifically if that means anything to you.

Quote: ahiromu

Location opinion request:

In that spot you have a lot of recent immigrants from all over; one gets the idea it's blue-collar immigrant. Should be safe enough and that type of wage earner seems to be able to make rent.

[edits]

My buddy and his wife, both 28 pay $1800/mo for a small apt near the Courthouse Metro stop in Alexandria.

Landmark mall is nearly vacant, which appears to be nearby. So long as it doesn't suffer the same fate as Springfield mall, which is a higher crime area in Fairfax county. Overall the city of Alexandria isn't too bad - most of the lower cost areas seem to be clustered around I-395 and in the "West End" of the city west of I-395. If you do bring a car, be expected to pay between 90-120 for parking near the PTO. The one thing I miss about growing up in Texas, where land is plentiful (i.e. - free parking from work).

-B

Oh Landmark mall is dead? That's disappointing to hear. I plan on catching the Van Dorn metro (free shuttle from complex). If the shuttle/metro is too much of a pain or unsafe, $90 for parking and a negligible amount of gas is well within my budget. I'll just trade all of my hard ways for driving to work, I guess that would be fine.

Google maps is saying 8-11 minutes to drive, but I bet it doesn't calculate traffic too well. Does 15 minutes from the Landmark Mall to the PTO sound like a safe guess, or am I highly underestimating four miles worth of Alexandria traffic?

Again, just a huge thank you to everyone that has given me input. I sincerely appreciate it.

Another question: Alexandria in general, Landmark neighborhood specifically. What is the topography like? I'm wondering how easy it is to walk around, I'm accustomed to hilly Seattle which is a pain in the ass to even walk 10 blocks (with groceries) sometimes.

*Rethinking the car

this particular complex is atop a hill, but nothing too severe about the grade. You will walk down to everything though. Walking with groceries would be quite a drag. Get a little cart with wheels or that is a no-go.

Quote: odiousgambit

this particular complex is atop a hill, but nothing too severe about the grade. You will walk down to everything though. Walking with groceries would be quite a drag. Get a little cart with wheels or that is a no-go.

The problem with walking down to everything is that you'll eventually have to walk back uphill, but at least emotionally it's nice to know your trip to wherever will be easier. I'll be renting a car my first week and figuring it out afterward.

Thank you very much.

Yeah, Landmark Mall pretty much sucks. There's talk of redevelopment, but that is years out.

I think that 15 minutes is pretty reasonable, even in traffic; the amount of gas you burn would be truly negligible.

You might be able to get a parking credit from the PTO, too, although $100/ month sounds pretty low; in downtown DC, I pay about $275. Obviously, you'll be paying less in Alexandria, but I'm not sure that you'll only be paying 1/3 what I am, but I've never priced it.

I know I keep harping on this, but you should definitely check out the bus routes/ schedule. When we bought our townhouse, we couldn't afford to be that close to a Metro station, but there is a bus line that is right down the corner. Until we had our daughter and getting home as quickly as possible after work became my priority, I used the bus all the time to get into the District. The biggest problem with it was that it had to go on I-395 for a time, which was often backed up. You wouldn't be in that situation, so I think that it would take not too much more time to ride the bus than to drive, and you'd save a ton on parking, especially with the Metro discount from the PTO.

So, what happened Did you make the move yet?