RNC: Make America Dumber

Quote: bobbartop

It's theft. Mugabe robbed the country. A child should be able to recognize this, it is so simple.

Your insistence that a child should recognize this is not true as very few people, children and adults, agree with your position. It's obvious you are not going to change your mind, so the only appropriate action is to stop entering into any contract where you accept US Dollars. You already know the US government is just going to steal them from you, so it is your own fault for not protecting yourself.

Quote: AZDuffman

If you doing so well then why do you have people subsidizing your health insurance via Obamacare?

Do you have any insurance of any kind at all? I'm going to go out on a limb and assume you drive a car. Welcome to subsidization. Life insurance? welcome to subsidization. Home Owners insurance? welcome to subsidization.

Quote: TomG

Your insistence that a child should recognize this is not true as very few people, children and adults, agree with your position. It's obvious you are not going to change your mind, so the only appropriate action is to stop entering into any contract where you accept US Dollars. You already know the US government is just going to steal them from you, so it is your own fault for not protecting yourself.

The only appropriate action is to urge my congressman to restore backing to our currency and fight against deficit spending. I can still vote. I do not want to see our country fall apart. Everyone is busy watch sports on the weekend but no one is paying attention to what their congressman is voting on. It's not just me getting robbed, it is all of us. If our government keeps doing what Obama just did the last eight years, we are going to pay a steep price.

Quote: bobbartop

The only appropriate action is to urge my congressman to restore backing to our currency and fight against deficit spending.

I'm sorry, do you actually think deficit spending is bad? There are always two sides to the ledger, and if someone's a borrower, someone else is a lender. Do you think lending is bad? Have you never taken out a loan? If it's okay for you, why isn't it okay for a larger entity like a corporation or a government?

Quote: MathExtremist

I'm sorry, do you actually think deficit spending is bad? There are always two sides to the ledger, and if someone's a borrower, someone else is a lender. Do you think lending is bad? Have you never taken out a loan? If it's okay for you, why isn't it okay for a larger entity like a corporation or a government?

When I'm the one paying the interest on the 20 trillion, I think deficit spending is bad. As a 'high earner' over half of my income goes to some tax entity. I'm not against loans per se.... But taking in 3 trillion and spending 4 trillion just makes absolutely no sense to me. I know that's not how ME's household works!

Quote: MathExtremist

You don't get a free pass by calling me names. Maybe Trump gets away with playing hide the weenie by being boorish but you don't. If inflation is theft, why isn't deflation theft too? You were complaining about your $5 pies the other day? Suppose I'm a pie maker who spends 30 minutes to bake a pie so I can sell it to you for $5. Now suppose you control the magic knob and press the "deflation" button. So deflation happens and the price of a pie drops to $2.50. You're happy, you get cheap pies. I'm far less happy, I now have to work twice as hard to make the same $5. You have stolen my time. Why aren't you a thief?

You are not working twice as hard for the "same" $5. The $5 in your example now has twice the value.

Quote: bobbartop

I propose you haven't seen nothing yet. If someday our money is worth nothing because irresponsible politicians have run up huge debt and printed worthless fiat money to pay for it, we'll find out what "dire straits" really is.

If we keep doing what we’re doing we’ll keep getting what we’re getting. (Forgot who’s quote that was)

The country and the rest of the world are already in dire straits. The last couple of decades the young new voters have been brain washed through constant one-way liberal education.

Elections are no longer about anything other than voting for party. It’s like the Cripes and the Bloods going to the polls. I would vote for any candidate on any party line if I believed in what they say.

For my money both Clinton and Trump are ridicules choices the country is forced to choose from. Yet, when you consider Clinton driving the bus loaded with us and pushing the gas pedal to the floor while still heading directly into the wall, Trump starts to look like the better alternative.

We know what Clinton will do for sure; she’ll keep giving us what we’ve been getting. (????) With Trump he might be able to change the direction of our future in his first 4 years. Real change takes many years to create. If it’s good we re-elect him. If not we move on. But at least we have a chance for something to change.

One way or another really doesn’t matter to me. My future is short, secure, and well planned. The brain washed kids thinking FREE is the answer and voting that way will eventually pay 10 times more then what they were hoping for.

What shocks me most of all is how could any person in this country not just take a real look around them and not see what is happening. How could a good parent be in denial when it comes to the security of their children.

Quote: blackhole

I

One way or another really doesn’t matter to me. My future is short, secure, and well planned. The brain washed kids thinking FREE is the answer and voting that way will eventually pay 10 times more then what they were hoping for.

What shocks me most of all is how could any person in this country not just take a real look around them and not see what is happening. How could a good parent be in denial when it comes to the security of their children.

About how I feel. I probably got 25 years left at best. As long as I get my house paid for I should be set. But I look around and see a generation coming up that not only willingly gives away their freedoms but in many cases is asking to have them taken away. They are so worried about being "tolerant" that anyone can do or say anything as long as they are not offended. OTOH, they get offended and it is time for a new rule or law taking away more freedoms.

Quote: SOOPOO

When I'm the one paying the interest on the 20 trillion, I think deficit spending is bad. As a 'high earner' over half of my income goes to some tax entity. I'm not against loans per se.... But taking in 3 trillion and spending 4 trillion just makes absolutely no sense to me. I know that's not how ME's household works!

If I'm ever in a position to take in 3 trillion, I'll let you know, but in truth that's only a 1.33x debt/income ratio. If you've ever gotten a mortgage, you're assuming a much higher debt relative to your income -- the median income in the US is about $52k and the median home price is $189k, so that's 3.63x on the year. Then you amortize over multiple years and it drops to a fraction of your regular income, usually 0.3x to 0.4x. And yes, you're paying interest on that, that's the cost of borrowing the money. Everything has a cost.

There is no conceptual difference between an individual borrowing and a government borrowing. Or a company -- if you're an entrepreneur (as I am) and want to start a company (as I have/as I am), usually your debt to income ratio is infinite because you're pre-revenue for a few months or years. That's just what it takes to start a business these days, it's nearly impossible to find a bunch of software engineers to work for equity but no money, so you have to borrow to pay them. Meanwhile your product hasn't launched yet so there is zero revenue. If lending were outlawed, the vast majority of businesses would never have been started. Including Apple, Starbucks, and Nike.

Lending is nothing more than a form of investing, and investing is not a bad thing. If you're a high earner, you've got an investment portfolio. I'm willing to bet some of it is in government bonds of some sort, and therefore you are a lender to the same government whose debt you're complaining about. Clearly there is a market for borrowing money if you're in it.

When someone lends money to the United States, they're investing in our ability to repay that debt. Until five years ago, that ability was unquestioned -- and it should be because the Constitution says so: "The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned." But along comes Donald Trump and says "we can renegotiate our debt" which is something you only ever do on the threat of default. He may be proud of discharging his own debts via bankruptcy, but trying that with the US debt would not only be strictly unconstitutional but also a violation of the Presidential oath of office. And tank the economy as a bonus. But whatever, laws and promises don't apply to him. Only he can fix it.

Quote: bobbartop

Rhodesia was once a wealthy nation, they had exports, they had an educational system, a good standard of living. Mugabe takes over and inflates their dollar to where it has zero value. They printed Trillion Dollar notes, that are worth nothing. Any value anyone had is gone. Where did it go? It was stolen. Inflation is theft. The whole country is poverty stricken now. People must sift in the rivers for small amounts of gold grains to buy bread. Only gold is accepted. A Trillion Dollar bill will buy nothing.

It's theft. Mugabe robbed the country. A child should be able to recognize this, it is so simple.

Your knowledge of history is poor, at best. Rhodesia was a breakaway state from the South African Union. It was never a wealthy nation. In fact most nations didn't recognize it as a state, and about the only thing it exported was violence.

Quote: billryan

Your knowledge of history is poor, at best. Rhodesia was a breakaway state from the South African Union. It was never a wealthy nation. In fact most nations didn't recognize it as a state, and about the only thing it exported was violence.

Too bad this forum doesn't allow personal insults. Hopefully I can still tell you that you don't know wtf you're talking about. Rhodesia was a prosperous nation that could feed itself AND export, until the communists took over in 1979 and completely destroyed the country. (and its currency)

One thing I am, and that is perceptive. I do not know you. But it took you over a day to come up with this gem, and I am going to guess that three days ago you had never even heard of Rhodesia. I'm not stupid. I'd bet my left nut that you only recently googled it, found a wiki article, and now think you know everything there is to know about Rhodesia.

Aren't you the same guy that told me a couple days ago that American History is not a proper course for college? Please, stop, you're killing me. My side hurts.

Quote: bobbartop

Too bad this forum doesn't allow personal insults.

Why, because otherwise you would have used one in response? It's a sorry state of affairs when the only reason you're civil is to avoid punishment.

Quote: MathExtremist

Why, because otherwise you would have used one in response? It's a sorry state of affairs when the only reason you're civil is to avoid punishment.

I know you are but what am I.

Quote: bobbartop

Too bad this forum doesn't allow personal insults. Hopefully I can still tell you that you don't know wtf you're talking about. Rhodesia was a prosperous nation that could feed itself AND export, until the communists took over in 1979 and completely destroyed the country. (and its currency)

One thing I am, and that is perceptive. I do not know you. But it took you over a day to come up with this gem, and I am going to guess that three days ago you had never even heard of Rhodesia. I'm not stupid. I'd bet my left nut that you only recently googled it, found a wiki article, and now think you know everything there is to know about Rhodesia.

Aren't you the same guy that told me a couple days ago that American History is not a proper course for college? Please, stop, you're killing me. My side hurts.

You'd be wrong. Again. As a ROTC cadet who majored in PolSci and was commissioned in 1981, Rhodesia wasn't history, it was current events. Rhodesia was recognised as a country by a handful of other countries- South Africa, Israel, pre-revolutionary Iran and a few minor ones. It wasn't in the United Nations, in fact the strictest economic sanctions the UN imposed was on Rhodesia.. The highest percentage of GDP ever devoted to the military was in Rhodesia and when the new government took office, it inherited a national debt well over 50% of GDP.
Would you like to know a bit about the ancient walled city of Zimbabwe, the oldest intact walled city in the world?
How about the trek of the Boers from Cape Town? Roarkes Drift? The March on Pretoria?

I never said American history shouldn't be taught in college. I said colleges shouldn't be reteaching things taught in fifth and sixth grade. College level history shouldn't be about who the Founding Fathers were, any more than a college math class shouldn't be teaching the multiplication tables.

Quote: MathExtremist

Why, because otherwise you would have used one in response? It's a sorry state of affairs when the only reason you're civil is to avoid punishment.

He likes to quote ludwig von Mises. A man who believed compromise was a sign of weakness, that it was better to defend the indefensible than to apologize., and it was easier to destroy his opponents than reason with them.As he said, he learned about him in seventh grade.

For what it's worth, I've also read just about every book Wilbur Smith has written. I know they are fiction but historically, they are pretty accurate depictions of the times.

Quote: billryan

He likes to quote ludwig von Mises. A man who believed compromise was a sign of weakness, that it was better to defend the indefensible than to apologize., and it was easier to destroy his opponents than reason with them.As he said, he learned about him in seventh grade.

And worse, the GOP's chosen presidential candidate is cut from the same cloth. He's making it publicly acceptable to act badly in public discourse under the guise of "not being PC". There is a vast difference between not being PC and intentionally (and personally) insulting someone. It's shameful when he does it, and it's shameful when his angry disciples do it too.

Quote: MathExtremist

angry disciples

Great name for a band.

Quote: RogerKint

Great name for a band.

Even better with a frontman. _______and the Angry Disciples. Fill in the blank...

Quote: MathExtremist

And worse, the GOP's chosen presidential candidate is cut from the same cloth. He's making it publicly acceptable to act badly in public discourse under the guise of "not being PC". There is a vast difference between not being PC and intentionally (and personally) insulting someone. It's shameful when he does it, and it's shameful when his angry disciples do it too.

I'd like to think the voting public wouldn't reward such an openly boorish lout with the Presidency.

But for some reason, I guess that is something to admire for some people.

Yeah, I know some will say, he has another side. He gives me little reason to suspect he's really in control and not erratic though..

Quote: MathExtremist

Even better with a frontman. _______and the Angry Disciples. Fill in the blank...

Bad Religion with special guests Rob Singer and the Angry Disciples.

Quote: MathExtremist

If I'm ever in a position to take in 3 trillion, I'll let you know, but in truth that's only a 1.33x debt/income ratio. it.

For a MathExtremist sometimes you aren't too good at math! Debt 20 trillion. 'Income' 3 trillion. That's a ratio of 6.67, not 1.33! If our debt was 4 trillion I'd agree with you. It's 20 trillion and Hillary will gladly add 5-10 more trillion, without batting an eyelash.

Quote: billryan

You'd be wrong. Again. As a ROTC cadet who majored in PolSci and was commissioned in 1981, Rhodesia wasn't history, it was current events.

Can you recommend any good books about the Rhodesian Bush War, both fiction and non-fiction?

Quote: LoneStarHorse

I regrettably watched the RNC last night, my feelings after watching it are. We are making America Dumber than we already are.
Example Kim K has not one talent, yet America has made her very wealthy

The Democrats aren't?

Quote: TigerWu

Can you recommend any good books about the Rhodesian Bush War, both fiction and non-fiction?

I can recommend a short youtube video called Gold for Bread, which shows what the communists have done to this country, and their currency. Rhodesia once had a middle class, rare on the African continent.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ubJp6rmUYM

Quote: TigerWu

Can you recommend any good books about the Rhodesian Bush War, both fiction and non-fiction?

Its been twenty years or more but offhand, Wilbur Smith wrote several fictional books,, especially one that follows the Ballentine family,and Peter Godwin wrote non-fiction, but mostly from the view of the whites. At the time, Soldier of Fortune had many great first person stories, written by Americans and Brits that joined the conflict as volunteers. They might be archived online.

Quote: SOOPOO

For a MathExtremist sometimes you aren't too good at math! Debt 20 trillion. 'Income' 3 trillion. That's a ratio of 6.67, not 1.33! If our debt was 4 trillion I'd agree with you. It's 20 trillion and Hillary will gladly add 5-10 more trillion, without batting an eyelash.

Fair enough, but I thought you were using your own numbers as an example. The real numbers for 2015 were 3.25T income, 3.7T spend, for a deficit of about 450B, so not 1T.

But more to the point, if you're really a budget voter, it's important to use the right numbers. You've inadvertently substituted "Hillary" for "Trump" in your last sentence.
I don't know where you get the idea that the debt will increase more under Hillary than Trump, but at least based on their published plans here's what the CRFB says:

(from http://crfb.org/papers/promises-and-price-tags-fiscal-guide-2016-election.)

Trump increases the debt by $11.5T because he's going to slash taxes. Hillary increases the debt by $0.25T because she isn't. If you are opposed to deficit spending, you absolutely should not vote for Trump.

You aren't factoring the money we will get when we send Mejico a bill for the wall and all the assorted goodies we will get for all the winnings we will be doing.
Of course, when Trump eradictes crime, what becomes of the million or so cops we no longer need.

Quote: billryan

You aren't factoring the money we will get when we send Mejico a bill for the wall and all the assorted goodies we will get for all the winnings we will be doing.

Trump cuts tax revenue by $1.1T/year ... the entire GDP of Mexico is $1.1T/year ... I get it now, he's going to annex them and call it a wash.

Yeah, that's the ticket.

Hope the gambling conversations at this site are more educated then what I'm reading in this thread. Obviously, politic conversations are a bust here.

Quote: blackhole

Hope the gambling conversations at this site are more educated then what I'm reading in this thread. Obviously, politic conversations are a bust here.

Don't get your hopes up too high. I'm pretty new here, and so far I've seen a lot of dice threads. I think I skimmed a post that was talking about mentally influencing the board in a holdem game. I didn't read very far. Maybe it was a troll. If it was, that would be a good troll. Obviously there are many young people on this board, I can feel it. That's ok, I was a kid once.

Quote: LoneStarHorse

We are making America Dumber than we already are.
Example Kim K has not one talent, yet America has made her very wealthy

There used to be regulations in place to prevent any media company, or individual from controlling the media in any one market.

There were strict limits on how many newspapers, radio and television stations any corporation or person could own.

This was designed to prevent anyone from gaining too much influence on public opinion.

The Telecommunications Act of 1996 removed these restrictions.

Prior to the passage of the Act in 1996, there were fifty media companies in the USA and thousands of small radio stations.

Today, there are only six media companies with 272 media executives controlling 90% of what we see, hear and read in this country.

This is mass brainwashing that controls public opinion, trends, government policy and legislation.

Kin Kardashian is 'beautiful' because they tell you she is.

They could turn manure into a health food tomorrow if they chose to.

Democracy in Peril

The U.S. National Debt Clock is working again.

$20 trillion ind Federal Debt, but much more ominous is the $102 trillion in unfunded liabilities.

That figure increases by $5 trillion annually.

The Gross Debt to GDP ratio of 105.76% shows we are now borrowing money to pay the interest on the debt.

Debt per taxpayer is $162,000.

Liability per taxpayer is $860,000.

Then there is the combined State and local gov't debt of $3 trillion.

States can't print money like the Feds.

Quote: Tanko

There used to be regulations in place to prevent any media company, or individual from controlling the media in any one market.

There were strict limits on how many newspapers, radio and television stations any corporation or person could own.

This was designed to prevent anyone from gaining too much influence on public opinion.

The Telecommunications Act of 1996 removed these restrictions.

Prior to the passage of the Act in 1996, there were fifty media companies in the USA and thousands of small radio stations.

Today, there are only six media companies with 272 media executives controlling 90% of what we see, hear and read in this country.

This is mass brainwashing that controls public opinion, trends, government policy and legislation.

SNL did a "TV Funhouse" cartoon about this back in the day. Not too surprisingly, it only aired once, and was subsequently pulled from all reruns of that show.

Quote: blackhole

Hope the gambling conversations at this site are more educated then what I'm reading in this thread. Obviously, politic conversations are a bust here.

They're a bust most places.