NokTang
NokTang
Joined: Aug 15, 2011
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March 4th, 2015 at 9:25:41 PM permalink
Quote: sc15

Yes, if you stiff a casino they report to central credit and every other casino will know about it. Despite that, I've heard of stories of people being granted credit even though they've defaulted on a marker to another casino. The fact that most of the time marker money never leaves the building, makes lousy high risk loans worthwhile.

What I'm saying is, after the initial check, there's very little, if any due diligence. I've personally received (and still have) credit lines in excess of my bank account balance tied to the credit line. I have the cash to pay those lines, but the casino has no way of knowing that. Every time I lose my credit line at a place, the casino without fail gives me more when I ask for it.



Good points. The part about the money never leaving i.e. lost vs passing the chips to a friend or somehow cashing them yourself at the cage seems key. I wonder if such antics are noted on the central credit report/file.

I specifically recall Harvey's in Lake Tahoe sending me a letter again, many years ago, revoking my credit line as I had closed the account it was tied to. I had not informed them but they must have done a routine check/update. I had no trip planned etc. to trigger said update.

Your credit report is also available in real time so in the case you outline, they know you are credit worthy when increasing your credit line. I would assume they do a quick update and govern their decision based upon on what they see. All of this takes seconds, not even 60 seconds, these days.
Baccaratfrom79
Baccaratfrom79
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March 4th, 2015 at 9:29:31 PM permalink
Quote: sc15



Markers are only a problem for people if they're dumb enough to sign one they can't afford to pay.



People get into problems all the time. I used to have a large repossession agency in NJ/NYC/LI, 15 guys with 9 trucks. The days of instant finance 89 to 94ish. Finance and can't pay or insure. We did thousands of vehicles a month. They don't do that much any longer the same as what the housing markets were doing in South Florida and Southern Cali/NV, etc., prior to 2008. The no doc loans. You might not get into trouble but a lot do.

Myself, if I cant pay I rather not play, casino, cars, housing, etc. I can always jerk around the utilities in a pinch. Cash is king.
Bac79=Hazardous Material and Chemical person correcting other's mistakes. Non AP'er, I can't count cards, low intelligence. Sprinkles magical dust on the cards. Has a lucky monkey. Baby also has a green one. Sum it up: "It's okay just blame me, it's all my fault"! ( No one believes me--so I chose to stop posting)
NokTang
NokTang
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March 4th, 2015 at 9:32:03 PM permalink
Quote: Baccaratfrom79

Think again. Google the District Attorney's office in LV and read. If you don't do markers skip it, if you and don't pay, read. Simple. It is a crime and they do prosecute and extradite. They started that a few years ago. Period.



They extradite you from another state?

In any event, if the person simply doesn't have the money, said exercise would seem fruitless and other than teaching him/her a lesson and hoping the word gets out. I guess it has as you are repeating it here. I personally have no intention of defrauding any casinos but when a person gets drunk etc. it seems he/she might be the victim, not the criminal. The victim of casino credit being granted when he/she isn't of capacity to make rational decisions in addition to said casino knowing the person isn't credit worthy.
Baccaratfrom79
Baccaratfrom79
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March 4th, 2015 at 9:44:39 PM permalink
Quote: NokTang

They extradite you from another state?

In any event, if the person simply doesn't have the money, said exercise would seem fruitless and other than teaching him/her a lesson and hoping the word gets out. I guess it has as you are repeating it here. I personally have no intention of defrauding any casinos but when a person gets drunk etc. it seems he/she might be the victim, not the criminal. The victim of casino credit being granted when he/she isn't of capacity to make rational decisions in addition to said casino knowing the person isn't credit worthy.



Your round of thinking also applies to bars serving drinks. It has been challenged and won and lost in criminal and civil courts of law on behalf of a defendant. Myself (meaning me-myself and I) rather not have handcuffs on sitting in jail waiting to tell a judge I didn't mean to do it. Whether casino credit, drunk driving, bank robbery or rape. So you know what, I don't take casino credit, I don't get drunk and drive, I don't rob banks and I don't rape women. I also don't let the dog I don't own any longer poop on someone's lawn or walk down the street without a leash cause it is against town code.
Bac79=Hazardous Material and Chemical person correcting other's mistakes. Non AP'er, I can't count cards, low intelligence. Sprinkles magical dust on the cards. Has a lucky monkey. Baby also has a green one. Sum it up: "It's okay just blame me, it's all my fault"! ( No one believes me--so I chose to stop posting)
NokTang
NokTang
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March 4th, 2015 at 10:05:37 PM permalink
Quote: Baccaratfrom79

Whether casino credit, drunk driving, bank robbery or rape..



Where we seem to differ is I don't equate casino credit to the other criminal acts you so gracefully outline.

Cheers. Headed to Starbucks for a coffee and to start the day's activities which don't include anything outlined above but do unfortunately involve one criminal action, that of getting a massage. Sorry, I should say two since I'm also taking a drug which requires a prescription and I don't have same....
Baccaratfrom79
Baccaratfrom79
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March 4th, 2015 at 10:27:36 PM permalink
Quote: NokTang

Where we seem to differ is I don't equate casino credit to the other criminal acts you so gracefully outline.

Cheers. Headed to Starbucks for a coffee and to start the day's activities which don't include anything outlined above but do unfortunately involve one criminal action, that of getting a massage. Sorry, I should say two since I'm also taking a drug which requires a prescription and I don't have same....



Making a point, unrelated but then again very possible to get arrested for DUI in Las Vegas and when they run your license the warrants pop up for the bad checks from the high limit rooms you and your team ran for a number of years. Then you sit in jail waiting to explain the judge how the casino twisted your arm to make you sign the credit markers so you can play and lose. The girl in the car got paranoid and yelled raped but then you tried to explain the judge how she was actually the massage therapist but didn't have a happy ending license and those funny little pills the cops found just happened to be illegal also. Hope your little poodle in the back seat has tags cause if not that is another violation as well.
Bac79=Hazardous Material and Chemical person correcting other's mistakes. Non AP'er, I can't count cards, low intelligence. Sprinkles magical dust on the cards. Has a lucky monkey. Baby also has a green one. Sum it up: "It's okay just blame me, it's all my fault"! ( No one believes me--so I chose to stop posting)
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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March 5th, 2015 at 12:52:17 AM permalink
Quote: sc15

I'm asking this because of how loose casino credit is, and how easy it is to get into debt you can't actually afford to pay off (so it's not just an instance of someone refusing to pay because they don't want to).

I personally have over a million in credit spread throughout las vegas (lines from 20 - 150K). I DON'T have that much money. If I were to go and lose my line of credit at every place I have it in vegas, I'd be broke. I also have lines of credit at individual properties that exceed the balance of the bank account that I gave them when applying for the credit. The increases were through a host, and the decisions were made based off my play, and they did no additional due diligence to make sure that I had the money to pay it (if they did they would've rejected it since the account I gave them doesn't have much money in it). I have also had additional credit given when I lost my line of credit, and it was given immediately (like, in 10 - 15 minutes. They rush to quickly do the paperwork so they can get me back playing). Obviously no due diligence is done during this.

With this "let the player lose first, worry about collecting later" practice, how much of markers drawn never get paid back?

Somehow I think this is illegal.

Personally I don't care and i'm not judging.

They went after guys for this type of stuff before.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
sc15
sc15
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March 5th, 2015 at 12:57:08 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

Somehow I think this is illegal.

Personally I don't care and i'm not judging.

They went after guys for this type of stuff before.



What's illegal? Getting credit lines exceeding my bank account balance? Or even more money than I have?

It's certainly not illegal. It's only becomes illegal if I start signing markers I don't intend on paying back. I didn't get the credit lines to stiff casinos on markers, I got em because I play at a lot of different places and it's nice to have it everywhere.

Technically by the letter of the law, you're writing a bad check if you sign a marker and don't have funds available in your bank account for it to be cashed immediately, but they have to give you a chance to pay it back before any DA is going to look at it.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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March 5th, 2015 at 4:04:26 AM permalink
Quote: sc15

What's illegal? Getting credit lines exceeding my bank account balance? Or even more money than I have?

It's certainly not illegal. It's only becomes illegal if I start signing markers I don't intend on paying back. I didn't get the credit lines to stiff casinos on markers, I got em because I play at a lot of different places and it's nice to have it everywhere.

Technically by the letter of the law, you're writing a bad check if you sign a marker and don't have funds available in your bank account for it to be cashed immediately, but they have to give you a chance to pay it back before any DA is going to look at it.

sory perhaps I confused lines of credit with markers. I thought you had a million in markers spread around.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
sc15
sc15
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March 5th, 2015 at 12:01:32 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

sory perhaps I confused lines of credit with markers. I thought you had a million in markers spread around.



lol, wouldn't be much of an APer if I'm being prosecuted for being unable to pay gambling debts.

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