bobsims
bobsims
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April 16th, 2014 at 2:58:51 PM permalink
If this was such a great idea why didn't the socialists do it in 2009-2011 when they had the House by a 60 seat margin, a fillibuster proof majority in the Senate and dumbo in the White House?
Kind of makes you wonder, doesn't it?
Sonuvabish
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April 16th, 2014 at 3:25:13 PM permalink
Quote: bobsims

If this was such a great idea why didn't the socialists do it in 2009-2011 when they had the House by a 60 seat margin, a fillibuster proof majority in the Senate and dumbo in the White House?
Kind of makes you wonder, doesn't it?



You mean Democrats? Because they are capitalists. You don't have to be a socialist to think this is a good idea. But it might help if Congressmen were poor and not directly plugged into incentives from the defense industry. If you pay me $1 million dollars, I will think anything is a good idea. Just name it. No, I don't wonder about anything. Politicians are corrupt. They just made a movie about ABSCAM...how many guys did they get in that?
ams288
ams288
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April 17th, 2014 at 6:15:59 AM permalink
Quote: bobsims

If this was such a great idea why didn't the socialists do it in 2009-2011 when they had the House by a 60 seat margin, a fillibuster proof majority in the Senate and dumbo in the White House?
Kind of makes you wonder, doesn't it?



Because it's a good issue to motivate the Democratic base to get out and vote.

When a political party is on the right side of an issue and a large majority of Americans agree with them on it, I'm all for them using it as a wedge issue in election years.
Ding Dong the Witch is Dead
bobsims
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April 17th, 2014 at 12:34:14 PM permalink
Quote: s2dbaker

For one thing, the government is involved already because there is currently a minimum wage. Raising the minimum wage will help get the working poor off of government assistance among many other benefits to the individuals and communities in which they live.



Which is why I am STILL waiting for an explanation from one of you leftists as to why, if raising the minimum wage is SUCH a great idea why didn't your party just do it during the 2 years it had a 70 seat majority in the House, a filibuster proof majority in the Senate and the crackhead in chief waiting in the White House?
bobsims
bobsims
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April 17th, 2014 at 12:39:26 PM permalink
Quote: boymimbo

I would also note that they've raised minimum wage in more than a dozen states to above the federal mandate and there was no effect.

So this is a huffaballoo about nothing. Raise minimum wage, get some more people off welfare and food stamps and enable more Americans to enter the middle class where they will spend!



Which would make sense if even ONE of the many states controlled by your party has raised the minimum wage to $10.10 an hour. Today, not in 2018 or some other fairy tale time. Not one, not Mexifornia, Oregon, Maryland, Delaware, Illinois, Minnesota or the New England states (save NH and Maine) which all have Democrat governors and Democrat legislatures.
Not one.
Why not?
chickenman
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April 17th, 2014 at 12:58:04 PM permalink
Alarmingly, late last month the Connecticut state senate approved a bill to go to $10.10. One can only hope the lower body kicks it to the curb. None of the bozos in legislatures understands a smidgen of economics.
Dalex64
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April 17th, 2014 at 1:46:14 PM permalink
Quote: bobsims

Which is why I am STILL waiting for an explanation from one of you leftists as to why, if raising the minimum wage is SUCH a great idea why didn't your party just do it during the 2 years it had a 70 seat majority in the House, a filibuster proof majority in the Senate and the crackhead in chief waiting in the White House?



I'm not one of those leftists, but I will propose a reason.

the cost of living during that time was lower, so people's earnings to expenses ratio was better, so there was less pressure to raise the minimum wage.

Now, the cost of living has gone up, but the minimum wage has not, so the pressure to increase the wage has gone up.

It seems that they thought the minimum wage was good enough, at that time. Now their opinion is it isn't good enough.

You can now see where these 'leftists' are in charge, and are in fact right now raising the minimum wage. Obama has done so with the federal contracts, and I just read today in Ypsilanti, MI the city council is doing the same thing - $10.10 minimum wage for all new city contracts. There are several local businesses who are declaring a higher starting wage for traditionally minimum wage jobs.

Why aren't they raising it to $15 or $20, or even higher? It is obvious to me that they know that there are consequences to raising the minimum wage. So, they are not entirely clueless.
LarryS
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April 17th, 2014 at 5:49:46 PM permalink
Quote: Dalex64

I'm not one of those leftists, but I will propose a reason.

the cost of living during that time was lower, so people's earnings to expenses ratio was better, so there was less pressure to raise the minimum wage.

Now, the cost of living has gone up, but the minimum wage has not, so the pressure to increase the wage has gone up.

It seems that they thought the minimum wage was good enough, at that time. Now their opinion is it isn't good enough.

You can now see where these 'leftists' are in charge, and are in fact right now raising the minimum wage. Obama has done so with the federal contracts, and I just read today in Ypsilanti, MI the city council is doing the same thing - $10.10 minimum wage for all new city contracts. There are several local businesses who are declaring a higher starting wage for traditionally minimum wage jobs.

Why aren't they raising it to $15 or $20, or even higher? It is obvious to me that they know that there are consequences to raising the minimum wage. So, they are not entirely clueless.



The cost of living is going up over the last 10 years but so has technology that makes me not need alot ofthese minimum, wage workers.

Do I need a paperboy to get more money...heck I can get the news online. I dont need a physical newspaper. If the newspaper goes up in price there comes a tipping point where I dont need it anymore.

Cashiers at walmart.....I dont need them...I have been shown via the self check out that an untrained person(me) can do the job and more quickly
If walmart let all the cashiers go and only kept 1 or 2 for disabled people....it would be fine with me. But give them a big raise???...what for...technology has diminished their value.

Cashiers at fast food.....there comes a tipping point where if fast food goes to a certain price......some people wont go. And technology allows it. It is very common now for the workplace to have an employee break room with one or more microwaves. Who needs mcdonalds for 7 dollars....when you can pop in a microwave and never leave the store. And its cheaper. Technology says I have cheaper alternatives that dont invovle a mcdonalds cashier and burger flipper. If they get more money based on non marketplace pressures.....and prices go up.....business will be lost. There are so many more choices for fastfood based on technology that the mcdonalds cashier and burger flipper has less value to me as they did 10 years ago

Ice cream store wrokers?....If they get a big raise and prices go up.....there comes a price where I would just rather go to my local supermarket and pick from the 100 choices I have, and buy the topings I want....and do it myself. In the 60's you could go to the supermarket and only find chocolate vanilla and maybe strawberry. Now in my supermarket there is almost a full side of the isle for ice cream. The novelty of getting exotic flavors from an ice cream parlor is gone. I dont need the scooper gal/guy to sell me an overpriced single scoop as it is. But with higher wages comes higher prices for the product....and more peopel will feel that way.

The cashiers anywhere else......they get a big raise and prices go up.....due to technology I can sit on my ass and order the item online and get it delivered to my home. It will just drive more people to the internet....make your local shopping centers into ghost towns....thereby increasing your local taxes needed to keep things going....its a real domino effect.

So yes the cost of living has gone up over the last 10 years....but the value of the jobs that get paid minimum wage have less value to me because of technology.
Dalex64
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April 17th, 2014 at 6:42:49 PM permalink
Minimum wage has nothing to do with the value of the work provided. It is completely artificial. The minimum wage is supposd to provide a certain amount of buying power. Not necessarily enough for one person to live on, or provide for a family, but just some level of buying power.

That buying power is dropping, therefore supporters of raising the minimum wage are advocating for a higher one.

My main point is that it is an artificial number, and has nothing to do with technology or the value of services provided.
LarryS
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April 17th, 2014 at 8:45:27 PM permalink
Quote: Dalex64

Minimum wage has nothing to do with the value of the work provided. It is completely artificial. The minimum wage is supposd to provide a certain amount of buying power. Not necessarily enough for one person to live on, or provide for a family, but just some level of buying power.

That buying power is dropping, therefore supporters of raising the minimum wage are advocating for a higher one.

My main point is that it is an artificial number, and has nothing to do with technology or the value of services provided.




I know minimum wage has nothing to do with value of work provided, because without it people would make alot less for some jobs that have little value.

However that does not address the FACT....that if for example, minimum wage at mcdonalds goes up substantially, the prices goe up and or the quality of the product goes down to make up for it......and when this happens, less people will visit mcdonalds, leading for a cut in hours, leading to less buying power for the employees. People in fast food think that the general public will gladly pay more and more for a "meal". There are so many more choices now.
I worked at a big box store a couple years ago...and in the employee break room there were 4 microwaves, and 3 refrigerators. In smaller offices microwaves are common. There comes a time where individuals figure they can save 1000 dollars a year by bringing in their own food. Its inconvenient....but when prices go up there is a tipping point where fast food is not a viable option. So all those fast food employees clamouring for a big raise....they should be careful what they wish for. There will be consequences to that increase.

Years ago when the minimum wage went up, I was in management in a huge pharmacy chain. The first thing that happened months before..leading up to the increase...we were instructed there was a hiring freeze on full timers (as wages went up.....at least the cost of benefits payed out will go down,,,this included min wagers as well as those making significantly over min wage). We received cuts in hours, so we could get used to doing more with less.....the people who worked there were expected to do more.....and those that didnt cut it were let go or had hours reduced just in time for the increase in wages. So when the increase occured....there were less people working...however the ones that remained were the sharpest people who could multitask. More was expected from everyone.

There is only so much payroll dollars to go around. And if the minimum wage is increased significantly it will elicit a significant response from the employers.....hour cuts, price increases, quality cuts. If someone was working 40 hours in a company and gets cut down to 32.....at the higher rate...and now has to pay for their own benefits....its a net loss

In that climate , if you think welfare folks who havent been able to sharpen their skills with experience over the years in a working environment are gonna start looking for these better paying jobs......you are right...yes they will. WILL THEY GET THE JOBS??....nope....not in a climate where everyone is going to be expected to do more.
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