buzzpaff
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September 4th, 2012 at 11:32:27 AM permalink
I can hardly wait for doubleluck's reply saying once again that roulette players are just drooling at the prospect of having 7/5 and 8/5 bets.
EvenBob
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September 4th, 2012 at 11:32:36 AM permalink
First CasinoBoy, who rode in on a white horse to rescue
Doubleluck, has been suspended, now Double has disappeared.
Odd..

On Sunday night, when Face, who works at a casino, was
pointing out the faults of Craps for Roulette, or whatever its
called, all of a sudden, out of nowhere, another casino
employee who just happened to be reading the thread, joined
the forum and vehemently defended Craps for Roulette, or
whatever its called. Talk about a coincidence! Now CasinoBoy
is gone for threatening a forum member. Thats how passionate
he is about this new game going into the casinos.

How could I be making any of this up.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
Paradigm
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September 4th, 2012 at 11:43:59 AM permalink
Agree with you ME....the more I was thinking about this and Pacman's comments along with higher edge angle, my conclusion was that maybe what DoubleLuck has here is the a Over The Rainbow type bet that is structured like a Fire Bet.

One betting spot, close to the dealer side of table, OTR bets are handede/tossed to the dealer similar to Fire bet in craps and placed in a spot that won't get in the way of a "sweep the losses" motion. You need to hit X number of colors to win before a white/green (whatever section) is hit.

You have a higher house edge, but a potential for larger payoffs.

But there are all the same tracking issues as with Poker for Roulette or Last Digit to Win It, so it isn't problem free. Plus are you going to change the wheel to add one side bet? Not likely.

I guess I am left with the conclusion that any multi-spin Roulette wager for larger payouts is going to have most of these issues to overcome. If you want to make one of these multi-spin Roulette bets work, you first need to overcome these mechanical/implementation issues in an "elegant manner".
DJTeddyBear
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September 4th, 2012 at 11:45:22 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

First CasinoBoy, who rode in on a white horse to rescue
Doubleluck, has been suspended, now Double has disappeared.
Odd...

Well, he can't hide forever.

Thanks to ThatDonGuy's post, we know that Riverboat Roulette has a nice, prime location for G2E. (Good luck with that, BTW.)

That floor map also provided their web address: http://www.doubleluckgaming.com/ Why wasn't that posted somewhere in this thread yet? Hell, you can hardly swing a dead cat without bumping into a link to my Poker For Roulette site. (BTW, Wiz, thanks for letting me do that.)


If you think the info contained in this thread is confusing, check out their website.

It starts with the following splash page:
Admin note: removed image www.djteddybear.com/images/double_luck_gaming.JPG
News flash:
"Luck" is the middle name!


The rules section uses the term "Place bet" despite assurances in this thread that the craps terminology was just for our own benefit.


There are also references to "Fielder's Choice Craps" but gives no explanation of that game.
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ ————————————————————————————————————— Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
buzzpaff
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September 4th, 2012 at 11:46:49 AM permalink
Casinoboy seems to be such a jerk that I believe he was real.

Doubleluck should be removing all references to CRAPS from his rules, handouts, and rack cards if he truly appreciated the
value of feedback from forum members other than myself. Gee the Wiz, Roger Snow, and now MathExtremist and others has all given valuable advice.
But to be perfectly honest I believe most of it has fallen on deaf ears. I will be at his booth to collect my beer and toast to his
success.
I do not think I will have to push through a crowd to do so.
buzzpaff
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September 4th, 2012 at 11:51:40 AM permalink
" By providing decision-makers with our inventive alternatives to options traditionally offered, we help you increase player interest through game variety, assist you in providing a greater entertainment value for your clientele, aid you in heightening the quality of your customer’s overall gaming experience, and support you in gaining a distinct advantage in today’s fiercely competitive markets."


Sadly missing is increase profits. And just a mere 56 words in that sentence.
EvenBob
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September 4th, 2012 at 11:52:28 AM permalink
Quote: DJTeddyBear



There are also references to "Fielder's Choice Craps" but gives no explanation of that game.



Is Fielder's Choice Craps played on a roulette table
too? Is there any room on these tables to play actual
roulette?
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
buzzpaff
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September 4th, 2012 at 12:02:47 PM permalink
Both "Riverboat Roulette" and "Fielder's Choice Craps" have met the legal requirements for table game variations as determined by the state of Missouri by having both a mathematical analysis and a legal analysis conducted by GLI.
Face
Administrator
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September 4th, 2012 at 12:59:35 PM permalink
Quote: doubleluck

Face, do you believe that players may buy-in to the notion of chasing "new" patterns with the colored neighborhoods?



I'd say a great many Roulette players are indeed pattern chasers, but how that influences the chance of them re-buying isn't something I can tell. I can only guess about the guys I see on the floor, but as I told CasinoBoy, patterns and sections and that stuff isn't something I normally concern myself with, so I've never looked into it. Sorry =/

Quote: MathExtremist

I agree. I don't think roulette needs any more bets that pay roughly the same odds as existing wagers, especially if the edge is 3x as high. An edge >15% should be reserved for jackpot-style wagers, something that pays meaningfully more than the regular game. People don't play the Fire Bet because the low-end payout is 25x, they play to hit the 1000x jackpot. In roulette, I can accomplish a jackpot by using an inside-number parlay, bet 1 to win 35, parlay all 36 for 1296 and down. That has an aggregate edge of 10.25% (5.26% all the time, and another 189% of the original bet 1/38 of the time). If the player can manufacture almost a 1300x win with a 10% edge, I don't see them paying 18% for a 2x payout.

The performance concerns have been previously noted and I don't need to rehash them here, but they should be addressed. What I'd do, if I were redesigning this, is remove most (if not all) of the existing bets and replace them with one or maybe two jackpot-style bets. That gets rid of the performance concern and adds a truly different payout option to the game.



Give much weight to ME's advice.
The opinions of this moderator are for entertainment purposes only.
doubleluck
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September 4th, 2012 at 1:19:36 PM permalink
I've been silent because I had to get back to the grind of my everyday job. Additionally, since the explanation of the Riverboat Roulette clearly sucks, I have been busy trying better refine the message and to employ the KISS method for the rules. As far as the website, the rules haven't been changed to elmininate the craps terminology yet -- but they will be soon.

Help me on this one:

I'm not understanding all the sudden chatter about the HE being so high when everyone originally stated that the HE was far too low. From my understanding, and I could be absolutely WRONG on this but, bets being resolved does not equate to the HE. The HE on these wagers are 2.63%, 4.21%, and 5.26% -- GLI ran the rumbers & I have the report to prove it. However, when the 18.18% number was mentioned in the thread that was NOT the HE.....that is how long it takes before there is a resolution on the wager. From my understanding, this means that since most gamblers leave bets that push in action, this would mean that the 3-spot sections would have money "in action" 81.82% of them time. If I'm wrong on this please help me understand as well as how the GLI report is so totally off-base.

Thanks.....
doubleluck
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September 4th, 2012 at 1:25:19 PM permalink
News flash:
"Luck" is the middle name!q]

News flash:
No it isn't...For anyone who cares to stop by our booth, you'll find out.
7craps
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September 4th, 2012 at 1:34:32 PM permalink
Quote: doubleluck



I'm not understanding all the sudden chatter about the HE being so high when everyone originally stated that the HE was far too low. From my understanding, and I could be absolutely WRONG on this but, bets being resolved does not equate to the HE. The HE on these wagers are 2.63%, 4.21%, and 5.26% -- GLI ran the rumbers & I have the report to prove it. However, when the 18.18% number was mentioned in the thread that was NOT the HE.....that is how long it takes before there is a resolution on the wager. From my understanding, this means that since most gamblers leave bets that push in action, this would mean that the 3-spot sections would have money "in action" 81.82% of them time. If I'm wrong on this please help me understand as well as how the GLI report is so totally off-base.

Thanks.....

First off, you post a thread on Labor Day weekend in the US.
Baseball, BBQs, drinking, partying, having a great time.

I did not even think about the HE per spin and per bet resolved until I was having a BBQ dinner and was shooting the breeze with Guido.

He started to count on his fingers and said the HE was quoted as per spin and that should make the 2 to 1 Yellow worse than the 2 to 1 on the Big 6 wheel.

We laughed at it and he went back to flipping burgers (his specialty) and I see he posted his thoughts last night.

You need to understand gaming math.

house edge per spin and per bet resolved can be two different values.

Your color bets, they are.
These are horrible bets for the player.
They will find this out very quickly.

Time for you to learn some math from the Wizard

BTW IMO very possible the GLI guys did you a total disservice.
Very incomplete unless you just did not understand the math they showed you.
if they did not show you both values and explained to you the difference in them,
they are not the ones folks want to use in the future.
winsome johnny (not Win some johnny)
doubleluck
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September 4th, 2012 at 1:41:01 PM permalink
Thanks 7Craps,

Are place bets in craps horrible for the player or are the one-roll bets better? How are these two any different?
7craps
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September 4th, 2012 at 1:45:54 PM permalink
Quote: doubleluck

Thanks 7Craps,

Are place bets in craps horrible for the player or are the one-roll bets better?

Some are way better than others.

https://wizardofodds.com/games/craps/

Place bets also have a per roll and per bet resolved values.
About halfway down the page is a nice table to view.

Since most craps players leave their bet up until a resolution, I would go by that value.
House edge is used to calculate the Expected Value (EV) or Expected Loss for the player.

The EV tells the story
winsome johnny (not Win some johnny)
7craps
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September 4th, 2012 at 1:59:45 PM permalink
You just need to recalculate the house edge and different payoffs yourself and see.

The Yellow at 2 to 1 is 18.18% per bet resolved
edit
at 5 to 2 is -4.5% (- 1/22)
this looks much better or
(12 to 5 is -07.27% (- 4/55)
winsome johnny (not Win some johnny)
doubleluck
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September 4th, 2012 at 2:00:34 PM permalink
Well Gentlemen, it's back to the grind and back to work....I may be silent for a while after coming to the forum because I now have LOTS of work to do! For those of you who provided constructive feedback, thanks for all your help and I'll see you in a few weeks.
doubleluck
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September 4th, 2012 at 2:01:31 PM permalink
Quote: 7craps

You just need to recalculate the house edge and different payoffs yourself and see.

The Yellow at 2 to 1 is 18.18%
at 5 to 2 is 9.09% this looks much better



Thanks 7craps!
7craps
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September 4th, 2012 at 2:17:24 PM permalink
Quote: doubleluck

Well Gentlemen, it's back to the grind and back to work....I may be silent for a while after coming to the forum because I now have LOTS of work to do! For those of you who provided constructive feedback, thanks for all your help and I'll see you in a few weeks.

You should easily be able to make house edge adjustments/payoffs yourself quite quickly.

Hey, a casino may even LOVE the idea of a 18.18% HE bet that pays 2 to 1.
I am sure they could adjust the payoffs to meet their liking.

The long term problem I see with this is gamblers after losing and losing and losing stop making certain bets, even without knowing the HE.

The Craps Field bet is a case in point.
Years ago, it was over 11% HE as I recall (too lazy to pick up Scarne's book)
and they tried, over the years, different numbers and different payoffs until players liked the current ones and they still play it.

Remember the game of Craps as it is today was not invented, it evolved from a popular game to what it is today. During the 2 world wars, it was the most popular casino game.


I actually like the color idea.
Many gamblers have favorite colors.
I do not know if all your colors are the ones that are liked the most

Continued Good Luck
winsome johnny (not Win some johnny)
Mission146
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September 4th, 2012 at 3:11:35 PM permalink
I still think Roulette Keno would have been a good idea...it could have been so cheap!
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
EvenBob
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September 4th, 2012 at 5:20:22 PM permalink
Quote: 7craps


I actually like the color idea.
Many gamblers have favorite colors.



Good grief. Thats not going to save this. Look at
Alphabet Roulette. There was a dynamite idea,
replace the numbers with letters and spell your
name or cuss words or whatever. It actually got
an install, where it died a very long boring death.

And it was a good idea.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
DJTeddyBear
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September 4th, 2012 at 6:32:45 PM permalink
Quote: 7craps

I actually like the color idea.
Many gamblers have favorite colors.

That's the theory behind Diamond Roulette, but it's got very few installs.
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ ————————————————————————————————————— Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
Keyser
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September 4th, 2012 at 7:40:58 PM permalink
To be honest, I like the ingenuity and motivation that the game designers have. If at first you guys don't succeed, try, try, again. Don't give up. It's the American way. :)
buzzpaff
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September 4th, 2012 at 8:14:33 PM permalink
You already bought the space at G2E, but afterwards put this dog to sleep.

Moneysuit31 will be at G2E but I am not at liberty to announce who his distributor is at this time.

A new version, but same basic structure.
buzzpaff
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September 5th, 2012 at 9:52:05 AM permalink
Both "Riverboat Roulette" and "Fielder's Choice Craps" have met the legal requirements for table game variations .

I can't wait to see Fielder's Choice Craps. Will it be on a Roulette table too ?
buzzpaff
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September 6th, 2012 at 9:20:40 PM permalink
Does the DUCK sleep with the fishes ?
Boney526
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September 6th, 2012 at 10:49:42 PM permalink
Quote: Keyser

To be honest, I like the ingenuity and motivation that the game designers have. If at first you guys don't succeed, try, try, again. Don't give up. It's the American way. :)



Yep. This was a great idea. I own a roulette wheel, and had a similar idea. I played it for fun with a friend and he loved it. It was a multi-spin bet that would typically take a while to resolve, so he was basically playing the normal game, leaving the side bet I created up. He said it was good because all of the other roulette bets are instantly settled, and you win or lose very quickly (high variance) so this let him at least bet on something with less variance.

(Not to mention the bet was simple, like yours, no patterns to track on say a history display)

Of course some of my other friends didn't really like the bet, so it really depends on the players. If not enough players like the idea, it won't be profitable. If the casinos don't think it's profitable enough, than it won't see the light of day.

I now think the biggest flaw is finding a good edge, at which the bet is not a rip off - but is still high enough for the casino to have it. Remember that on this bet, the HE per resolved shouldn't be too high. But also remember that it will take longer to resolve than a typical roulette bet, which has an edge of 5.26%.

IMO - you should have an edge per bet resolved in the range of 3.5-6 percent. But I don't know anything about what it takes for a game to make it into a casino.
buzzpaff
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September 7th, 2012 at 12:02:09 PM permalink
" But I don't know anything about what it takes for a game to make it into a casino. " Neither does anyone else.
The inventor of 3 card poker says the hardest thing he had to do in his life was try and get his game into casinios.
buzzpaff
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September 7th, 2012 at 8:33:19 PM permalink
So much for following the advice given here. This from G2E:

Riverboat Roulette
Category: New Product
Riverboat Roulette is a new spin on a timeless classic. It's standard roulette with place bets & designed to increase interest & profitability!
DJTeddyBear
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September 7th, 2012 at 8:54:10 PM permalink
That was set up before they started asking for our opinions.

Remember that they also purchased that booth space before they knew what the house edge was.
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ ————————————————————————————————————— Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
EvenBob
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September 7th, 2012 at 9:03:01 PM permalink
Quote: DJTeddyBear



Remember that they also purchased that booth space before they knew what the house edge was.



Yeah, so? Doesn't everybody? They think they have a winner,
they don't need no stinking house edge..
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
buzzpaff
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September 7th, 2012 at 9:12:54 PM permalink
Quote: DJTeddyBear

That was set up before they started asking for our opinions.

Remember that they also purchased that booth space before they knew what the house edge was.




This is what you see when you are viewing info at the G2E website. Thay have access to change that NOW !
buzzpaff
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September 8th, 2012 at 8:26:05 PM permalink
Hey Doubleluck, look up here.
buzzpaff
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September 8th, 2012 at 9:02:43 PM permalink
I sent doubleluck a PM chastising him for being here instead of working on G2E. He promptly left. Hopefully i will not have to rat him out to his brother.
Buzzard
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December 3rd, 2012 at 5:37:44 PM permalink
The Riverboat seems to have left the dock for uncharted waters. The website no longer any contact info and the Linkedin company
profile no longer lists any products. Seems a shame. I met the brothers at G2E and they seemed like straight shooters.

But they were in over their heads. Getting any sort of game into a casino or the interest of a distributor is a tuff, tuff game.
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
DJTeddyBear
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December 3rd, 2012 at 9:46:12 PM permalink
They redesigned the website. It DOES have contact info. A form, phone number and address are on the contact page.

For the record, they are one of the featured exhibitors at the Raving Table Game Conference this week.
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ ————————————————————————————————————— Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
McDemon
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May 20th, 2013 at 2:25:59 PM permalink
Only chance of making this work is to use the french roulette number system, a double zero wheel has no chance of getting any traction. Good luck though
Controversial sometimes, brutally honest..Always
charliepatrick
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September 26th, 2013 at 1:48:51 PM permalink
The game is now being trialled and I saw the wheel in Salford last weekend - sadly it was Sunday afternoon so the table wasn't actually open (there was a United-City match distracting everybody!). Thus I didn't see how much of an issue odds such as 7/5 or 8/5 would be in practice. While watching five goals on TV, I worked out that offering 6/4 2/1 and 5/2 (albeit 2/1 has no house edge) would have been so much easier (cf simple Craps), so suspect different neighbourhood sizes might work easier.
Buzzard
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September 26th, 2013 at 2:43:46 PM permalink
This from the Luck Brothers

Kevin Luck <e8kluck@yahoo.com>

3:20 PM (21 minutes ago)

to me
We have a version where there are 8 color neighborhoods that all pay 2:1. However, that means even MORE colors and an even MORE crowded felt .....however, we're not opposed to giving the house / players what they want.
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
doubleluck
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September 26th, 2013 at 3:40:33 PM permalink
Quote: charliepatrick

While watching five goals on TV, I worked out that offering 6/4 2/1 and 5/2 (albeit 2/1 has no house edge) would have been so much easier (cf simple Craps), so suspect different neighbourhood sizes might work easier.



Buzz emailed me to let me know there has been some more activity on this thread so I thought I'd respond directly. We have SEVERAL variations of the game with varying sizes of neighborhoods, payouts, etc. It appears that the payouts you worked-out are coming solely from a dealer's perspective 1.5 to 1; 2 to 1; and 2.5 to 1. While these may be cleaner for the dealer, the house edge on that version would be far too low. As a result, we don't believe that would be an attractive enough edge for the house. Of all the variations we have, we felt the version being trialed now best considers all parties involved.
charliepatrick
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September 27th, 2013 at 4:41:58 AM permalink
Quote: doubleluck

...payouts...1.5 to 1; 2 to 1; and 2.5 to 1..house edge...far too low...

Thanks for your quick feedback. Yes I agree that the house edge would be far too low, which was a shame as it was such a neat paytable. I can also see that having eight sets of three slots, each paying 2 to 1, is an alternative option but has lots of colours and a higher HE (unless you use 7 losers), so the one you picked is probably the best (also casinos have 20p chips if they allow £1 minimums).

btw Gala used to have Dice Magic (see http://www.ukcasinotablegames.info/dicemagic.html ) which was simple Craps for the weekends and had some bets (e.g. 4 pays 2/1) at zero HE and a low maximum (£25); even so it had limited appeal. But on a roulette layout, I agree with you, and can't imagine a house allowing reasonable sized bets at 0HE.
IGRM
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November 12th, 2013 at 6:39:37 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

Good grief. Thats not going to save this. Look at
Alphabet Roulette. There was a dynamite idea,
replace the numbers with letters and spell your
name or cuss words or whatever. It actually got
an install, where it died a very long boring death.

And it was a good idea.



It was a good idea but as a roulette player I wouldn't transition from the number board, I know the wheel and where all the numbers are on the board. This game feels similar but is a completely different and I would guess that it would only appeal to first time players, why else would they make diamond shapes for the colors rather than splitting the bet?
IGRM
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November 19th, 2013 at 11:39:25 AM permalink
Quote: doubleluck




My brother and I are one of the "independents" that will be debuting our roulette variation, "Riverboat Roulette", at G2E this year. As a result, I'm wanting to gain viable feedback from members of the group because I know you are ones who will view the game with a high level of scrutiny and an analytical eye. As a result, please give me your honest feedback -- all feedback is good!

Riverboat Roulette Rules of Play

1. Riverboat Roulette is a roulette variation that allows players the ability to play traditional roulette while adding to option of making multiple spin wagers on any of the six multi-spin colored sections on the roulette wheel.

2. Players may wager on any of the multi-spin colored sections or on the single-spin white section.

3. Winning colored section bets pay odds on winning wagers.

4. Winning white section bets also pay odds but lose on all other outcomes.

5. Colored section wagers that don't win "push" and only lose when the outcome results in the white section (Called a White Out) -- creating a multiple spin version of roulette.

**Note: Players may leave their pushed wagers in place, take them down, or add to their bets**


House Edge on New Betting Options

White Neighborhood: 5.26% ( Winning Payout of 7:2)
Blue & Orange Neighborhoods: 2.63% (Winning Payout of 7:5)
Purple & Pink Neighborhoods: 4.21% (Winning Payout of 8:5)
Light Blue & Yellow Neighborhoods: 5.26% (Winning Payout of 2:1)

** Mathematical Analysis Conducted by GLI**

Points to Consider

We have several designs that we have developed for the wheel / layout. As a result, the images you see are only one wheel / layout of many. However, we purposely grouped the neighborhoods together to entice players to increase their average bet per spin in their attempt to better predict the outcome of each spin.

Additionally, since three multi-spin neighborhoods exist on each side of the wheel, we feel that some players may view these options as a new type of "dozens" bet. Although we did protect all the various possibilities of neighborhoods (from a 1 spot neighborhood to an 8 spot neighborhood), we deliberately made neighborhoods of 5, 4, and 3 spots on each side, instead of 4 neighborhoods of 3 (which would pay 2:1) or 3 neighborhoods of 4 (Paying 8:5). This way, if they truly want to buy this "dozen" bet, they will have to bet of minimum of $5 on each neighborhood or 3 times the amount of a traditional dozen bet in order to get all their 12 numbers grouped together. However, they will only get paid 2:1 odds on 3 of the 12 numbers.

Next, we also believe that some roulette players may not actually play the multi-spin wagers, but will use the highlighted sections to help them determine numbers that they will bet straight up and in higher amounts.

Security

We also believe that by highlighting the multi-spin, colored, neighborhoods, it will be much easier for casino personnel & security to better determine if sectioning / weak dealing procedures are present and to better identifyi AP roulette players (if you believe in such a thing).

Over-the-Rainbow Bet

Although you don't see it on the version depicted above, we have also developed a side-bet for those players and casinos looking for some trip changing winning wager. This bet is similar to a fire-bet / bonus-craps type wager where a specified number of the colored neighborhoods must be hit before a "White Out".

Tell us what you think!

In closing, I know we already broke one of the Wizard's Commandants about tinkering with roulette (lol), however, I would appreciate any and all feedback on the game and feel free to provide both "positive" and "negative" feedback. After all, we feel that all feedback is good because it may help us consider things we've not thought of or help us refine our approach in offering Riverboat Roulette to casinos and players alike. If you're going to be at G2E this year, stop by and see us at booth #2712!



If you adjust the numbers of each color you could make the pay-outs much simpler for the dealer and for the player. Which may give you better chances of getting an install.
beachbumbabs
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November 20th, 2013 at 2:12:21 PM permalink
Congratulations, Luck Brothers, on Silver in Raving!
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
doubleluck
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November 21st, 2013 at 1:42:12 PM permalink
Quote: beachbumbabs

Congratulations, Luck Brothers, on Silver in Raving!



Thanks Babs!
Wizard
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July 15th, 2014 at 5:57:10 PM permalink
After seeing Riverboat Roulette at the Golden Gate after McNugget Challenge #3 (July 7, 2014) it was finally time to write a page on it.

Please check out my new page on Riverboat Roulette. As always, I welcome all comments, questions, and especially corrections.

I'm hoping doubleluck will give me some images of the game for the page.

Also, there is a separate thread on the patent. Let's try to keep this thread on the topic of everything about Riverboat Roulette other than the patent. As a matter of practice, I would have preferred the patent announcement to be put in this thread.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
DJTeddyBear
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July 15th, 2014 at 7:05:40 PM permalink
Mike -

Nice page, but.....

Quote:

Each number is assigned two colors. For purposes of this explanation, I will call them the "outer colors" and "inner colors."
The outer colors can be red, black, or green in the same numbers are conventional roulette.


As seen in the initial frame of the video on their website, you've got that backwards. The dominant inner color is the standard red/black/green. ...Unless they swapped that on the live version.

You left off the 'resolved edge' on the blue / orange bets.

The pay table has a heading of "number" above the pays. That should be "pays". Also, I think the partial/decimal payouts should be listed as 8:5 and 7:5. Or 8 to 5, 7 to 5.

That's all I noticed on first scan.
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ ————————————————————————————————————— Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
Wizard
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July 15th, 2014 at 7:28:36 PM permalink
Quote: DJTeddyBear

As seen in the initial frame of the video on their website, you've got that backwards. The dominant inner color is the standard red/black/green. ...Unless they swapped that on the live version.



I think I was going by this image.



Thank you for the other corrections.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
doubleluck
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July 16th, 2014 at 9:36:08 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

I think I was going by this image.



Thank you for the other corrections.

Mike, you're correct. The colors you refer to as "inner colors" are the newer colors and the "outer colors" are the standard ones.

Additionally, there is also a "Rainbow Bet" that is another component of the game. It's similar to a "Fire Bet" in that a player makes a wager that all 6 "inner colors" will hit in 6 consecutive spins. As a result, red, black, green and white are all losers for this wager, AND any "inner color" that repeats also becomes a loser on any SUBSEQUENT spin.

The casino has the option of various payouts and may begin paying out players when as little as 4 or 5 "inner colors" successively hit. However, the top payout is $1000 FOR $1 when a player hits all 6 "inner colors" in 6 consecutive spins.

I will send you the math report from GLI so you have the numbers on this bet, as well.

In closing, this bet wasn't a part of the game when we originally created the video. Lastly, it also doesn't appear on the unit currently in play at the Golden Gate. The DTR was apprehensive about having it on the layout due to him thinking that it may be "too much" for his dealers to initially handle. As a result, we made a concession to remove it in order to get the installation. That same DTR now believes it would be an excellent side bet to have on the layout as it gives the "jackpot" lure that the typical roulette player is seeking. However, he is no longer employed at the Golden Gate and the current management is still taking a wait and see stance.
Paradigm
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July 16th, 2014 at 12:34:51 PM permalink
Time on the floor and continued gathering of data to support good game performance....sometimes all game developers get to do is wait and see as well :-).

Are you still getting performance data out of any UK installations? I can't recall if those trials went live or were still ongoing or what their status is right now. I do recall from Raving that installs somewhere showed meaningful increases in win over standard roulette, hopefully that is continuing. Multiple installs can provide a "smoother" reality of how a game is performing.

Keep her going and here is hoping for good variance for the existing installs.
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