RaleighCraps
RaleighCraps
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July 8th, 2010 at 1:16:58 PM permalink
I am in PA for a trip and have decided to extend it to next week, for the start of the PA Craps play.
I will file a report on what I find. It will be either Mohegan Sun in Poconos, or Mt Airy Casino.
Always borrow money from a pessimist; They don't expect to get paid back ! Be yourself and speak your thoughts. Those who matter won't mind, and those that mind, don't matter!
AZDuffman
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July 8th, 2010 at 5:28:00 PM permalink
In the other side of the state, I took a peek at Rivers Casino tonight. No time to play, but just as well as the joint was packed. In the whole pit of mixed games I think I saw 2 empty seats, though a low/handicapped BJ game was closed. $10 min on some BJ and $15 on craps. I don't have time to play for at least a few weeks, but if there is anything anyone is interested in let me know.
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
Mosca
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July 8th, 2010 at 5:37:06 PM permalink
We were in Mohegan a week ago, and today we were down at The Sands. Mohegan looks a little cramped, but The Sands is huge, and it looks like table games will integrate there very well; The Sands will have a real casino feel to it.
A falling knife has no handle.
JohnnyQ
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July 8th, 2010 at 7:13:57 PM permalink
AZ:

Do you know if the Rivers in PA has any decent video poker paytables ?

thanks !
There's emptiness behind their eyes There's dust in all their hearts They just want to steal us all and take us all apart
ruascott
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July 8th, 2010 at 9:02:05 PM permalink
Was there a limit on the number of casino licenses allowed in PA? Seems to me the license limits end up - like all economics - limiting supply and driving up the "price" of gambling in all of the states where recent gaming has been added. I know this is just an early sample, and I'm sure it will cool down once the newness wears off, but $15 craps outside of Pittsburgh is rediculous.
pacomartin
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July 13th, 2010 at 1:14:20 PM permalink
There definately was a limit in PA. They have granted some licenses to additional mini casinos near resorts (500 slot machine maximum). Ohio will only grant four licenses (one for each major city).

PA will open it's 10th casino this fall (Sugar House in downtown Philadlphia).

The only two left is a second casinoe in downtown Philadelphia that Wynn briefly said he would run, and the second is a racino near the West Virginia border (which may not be economically viable).

Remember that half the money goes to the state. The state is not in the business of encouraging competition. They want casino operators who will stay in business and feed the state coffers.
ahiromu
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July 13th, 2010 at 1:58:57 PM permalink
So the state effectively has a 50% tax on gambling profits, casino-side? I'm not well versed on the whole taxation issue, but does this mean that there's a state-side 50% tax then they have to pay the federal corporate tax as well?
Its - Possessive; It's - "It is" / "It has"; There - Location; Their - Possessive; They're - "They are"
AZDuffman
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July 13th, 2010 at 6:53:05 PM permalink
Quote: JohnnyQ

AZ:

Do you know if the Rivers in PA has any decent video poker paytables ?

thanks !



They are terrible--7/5 JoB. If you do play note that the payout can and does get better if you play $1 on the multi-denomination machines. Still it just goes to 8/5 if I remember right.

To the board: if anyone wants to know a payout/etc post here or contact me when that feature goes live and I will report back next visit. Though that could be up to a month as I don't walk by before work everyday like I used to. (new job, new location)
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
cclub79
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July 13th, 2010 at 7:13:28 PM permalink
Quote: pacomartin

There definately was a limit in PA. They have granted some licenses to additional mini casinos near resorts (500 slot machine maximum). Ohio will only grant four licenses (one for each major city).

PA will open it's 10th casino this fall (Sugar House in downtown Philadlphia).

The only two left is a second casinoe in downtown Philadelphia that Wynn briefly said he would run, and the second is a racino near the West Virginia border (which may not be economically viable).

Remember that half the money goes to the state. The state is not in the business of encouraging competition. They want casino operators who will stay in business and feed the state coffers.



PA was weird. It had to be in a viable location that had suffered economic problems if it wasn't already a racetrack. PA Sands had been the closed Bethlehem Steel Works, Mt. Airy was the old "Beautiful Mt. Airy Lodge" that had been shuttered. Gettysburg wanted one and was turned down, though they continue to fight. The last I heard was there is ONE PA gaming license still available, and the Gettysburg group is gunning hard for it. There is a lot of opposition (as there was 5 years ago when it was first rejected) that don't want the area so close to hallowed ground to become a Casino Resort. Gettysburg really is in the middle of nowhere, about an hour to any other major suburbanized area (Frederick MD, Harrisburg PA, York PA), but it would be less than 2 hours from Balto and DC.
ruascott
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July 13th, 2010 at 7:38:06 PM permalink
Quote: cclub79

PA was weird. It had to be in a viable location that had suffered economic problems if it wasn't already a racetrack. PA Sands had been the closed Bethlehem Steel Works, Mt. Airy was the old "Beautiful Mt. Airy Lodge" that had been shuttered. Gettysburg wanted one and was turned down, though they continue to fight. The last I heard was there is ONE PA gaming license still available, and the Gettysburg group is gunning hard for it. There is a lot of opposition (as there was 5 years ago when it was first rejected) that don't want the area so close to hallowed ground to become a Casino Resort. Gettysburg really is in the middle of nowhere, about an hour to any other major suburbanized area (Frederick MD, Harrisburg PA, York PA), but it would be less than 2 hours from Balto and DC.



Interesting. I'm as pro-gambling as anyone you could find, but even I would be hesitant about allowing a casino being built at Gettysburg.
ruascott
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July 13th, 2010 at 7:40:22 PM permalink
Quote: AZDuffman

They are terrible--7/5 JoB. If you do play note that the payout can and does get better if you play $1 on the multi-denomination machines. Still it just goes to 8/5 if I remember right.

To the board: if anyone wants to know a payout/etc post here or contact me when that feature goes live and I will report back next visit. Though that could be up to a month as I don't walk by before work everyday like I used to. (new job, new location)



I would be interested in limits for not only BJ and Craps (i think PA has regulated that casinos must offer 10x odds), but also limits on some of the carnvial games, as well as what carnival games are offered.
AZDuffman
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July 14th, 2010 at 4:11:52 AM permalink
Quote: ruascott

Interesting. I'm as pro-gambling as anyone you could find, but even I would be hesitant about allowing a casino being built at Gettysburg.



I'd have to look closely at it. I know Gettysburg isn't large, but I'd consider a casino on the other side of town if it could insure there is no more commercial built on the battlefield for ewxample.

PA never does anything normal. This is the state where they opened EZ-Pass lanes then closed them shortly thereafter because some supervisor or politician noticed "there was no line of cars and cash customers were waiting." Those of us who had lived in other states instantly said, "That's the point and idea behind the special lanes!"
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
Niblick
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July 14th, 2010 at 6:58:18 AM permalink
Quote: AZDuffman

I'd have to look closely at it. I know Gettysburg isn't large, but I'd consider a casino on the other side of town if it could insure there is no more commercial built on the battlefield for example.



FWIW I keep hearing that the most likely successful candidate for that license is Nemacolin Woodlands.
Nemo Omnibus Horis Sapit
Mosca
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July 14th, 2010 at 7:15:16 AM permalink
Quote: AZDuffman

I'd have to look closely at it. I know Gettysburg isn't large, but I'd consider a casino on the other side of town if it could insure there is no more commercial built on the battlefield for ewxample.

PA never does anything normal. This is the state where they opened EZ-Pass lanes then closed them shortly thereafter because some supervisor or politician noticed "there was no line of cars and cash customers were waiting." Those of us who had lived in other states instantly said, "That's the point and idea behind the special lanes!"



Thing is, there is no "other side of town" from the battlefields. The battle took place all around the town. If you've never gone there, you should. There are no words to describe it. It is a deeply moving place. The words "hallowed ground" are not strong enough. Pictures don't do it justice. The best way I can describe the feeling of going there is, once you're there you say, "Oh. I didn't understand. But now I do." And then you can't describe it to anyone else, all you can say is, "You have to go there to understand."

If you do go, you absolutely have to drive 20 minutes south, just over the PA/MD border to Emmitsburg MD, and eat at Chubby's BBQ. It is one of the premier bbq joints in the US, IMO (not that I've eaten at them all, mind you). Tell my friend Tommy Caulfield that Mosca sent you. You will NOT be disappointed.
A falling knife has no handle.
RonC
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July 14th, 2010 at 8:19:43 AM permalink
Quote: Mosca

Thing is, there is no "other side of town" from the battlefields. The battle took place all around the town. If you've never gone there, you should. There are no words to describe it. It is a deeply moving place. The words "hallowed ground" are not strong enough. Pictures don't do it justice. The best way I can describe the feeling of going there is, once you're there you say, "Oh. I didn't understand. But now I do." And then you can't describe it to anyone else, all you can say is, "You have to go there to understand."



I second the emotional impact of a properly done tour of Gettysburg. I had the chance to go on a guided tour with a local expert. The tour was conducted with stops in the order the various battles took place. To stand there and understand what happened was beyond humbling. If you ever have the chance to have such a tour, do it! The tour guide beats the self-guided recorded tour by miles, but the self-guided one is pretty good, too.
teddys
teddys
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July 14th, 2010 at 10:23:56 AM permalink
Quote: RonC

I second the emotional impact of a properly done tour of Gettysburg. I had the chance to go on a guided tour with a local expert. The tour was conducted with stops in the order the various battles took place. To stand there and understand what happened was beyond humbling. If you ever have the chance to have such a tour, do it! The tour guide beats the self-guided recorded tour by miles, but the self-guided one is pretty good, too.



Sounds like it would be a great place to do Segway tours. I've been to Antietam (Sharpsburg for you Dixie lovers) and that was pretty cool. I want to visit Gettysburg sometime.
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4
RaleighCraps
RaleighCraps
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July 15th, 2010 at 7:50:46 PM permalink
I ended up going to Mt Airy Casino. They had a charity event opening on Sunday, $5 ONLY bets. I did not attend that. I was there at 9:45AM for the 10:00AM opening, which was not until 10:30 after all the fanfare. This was not the day to be in the casino if you were playing hooky. There had to have been 4 or 5 TV station cameras in there, and I bet there were 50+ still cameras taking constant pictures all day.
They had a couple of poker tables, a couple of roulette, and BJ. Not sure if there were any other card games. I was pretty well focused on craps only.
Mt Airy had 3 craps tables, 2 at $10, and 1 at $25.
3x-4x-5x odds
2x on the field 2 and 12
vig paid up front on Buy 4/10
Hop bets are on the felt, but no Fire bet or other odd bets.
Purple felt with white lettering.

I was on the table for the first official roll of the $10 table. For the record, the point was 6, and the shooter failed to make the point. The shooter also failed to hit the 8, so after 1 shooter I was -$90 :-(

My base dealer was a 3 yr veteran of Foxwoods, but the rest of the crew including the box was new. Compounding the problem, the 4 people to my immediate right were all playing Hi-Lo-Yo (2-12-11) on every roll! The stick wasn't sharp enough to realize she should leave the bets on the felt and just collect the new bet. Nor was the box smart enough to educate her, so EVERY roll she took down their bets, and we all waited while the four players threw their chips to the center of the table, and she tried to put the bets back in the correct order. C H O P P Y!!!! Ugggh
This continued for the first 2 hours, until the Foxwoods dealer was on stick, and he finally started leaving the bets up, and just collected the new bets. Two of the Hi-Lo-Yos lost money, but the other 2 stuck around a bit longer and both ended UP after 3 hours of play. UNREAL

The first 6 shooters all 7 out, then 1 point made 7out, 7 out, 7 out, 1 point made 7-out, and then I made 1 point and 7 out as the last shooter. 11 Shooters on the first round trip, 3 points made, AND not a single 4 or 10 was thrown on the die, until I threw a 4 to shoot at for my 2nd point, which I did not make.
I played until 3:00 PM and only 3 of us ever made 2 points. No one made 3 points on a single roll.
After a few hours of cold, the dark side was begging to be played. Of course, when I did bet the DC, my point was 10, so I laid $50 odds, watched the 10 hit 2 rolls later, and of course, one roll before the 7 out. Being this schnakebit for a year now is depressing me.

Mohegan Sun at Pocono Downs near Pittston was advertising table games, as was Hollywood Casino just south of Harrisburg. I have no idea if their odds/payouts/vigs are the same or not.
Always borrow money from a pessimist; They don't expect to get paid back ! Be yourself and speak your thoughts. Those who matter won't mind, and those that mind, don't matter!
JohnnyQ
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July 25th, 2010 at 6:14:29 AM permalink
Quote: AZDuffman

They are terrible--7/5 JoB. If you do play note that the payout can and does get better if you play $1 on the multi-denomination machines. Still it just goes to 8/5 if I remember right.

AZ:

Thanks, I'll take the Rivers off my to-do list.

Have you ever gone down to Belterra south of
Cincy ? We like it there and after even a little
bit of play you can get some good promo mailing
offers, including a free room on select dates.

There's emptiness behind their eyes There's dust in all their hearts They just want to steal us all and take us all apart
AZDuffman
AZDuffman
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July 25th, 2010 at 7:08:52 AM permalink
Quote: Niblick

FWIW I keep hearing that the most likely successful candidate for that license is Nemacolin Woodlands.



I have heard the same but doubt it will happen there. For those not local, Nemicolan Woodlands was built by Joe Hardy, founder of 84 Lumber. He and his family are not the most loved down there in Fayette County. Second, NW is fairlyh remote along a mostly two-lane mountain road. (For history buffs, it is the "National Road" the first "highway" in the USA.) They have had problems with PGA events for this same reason, access is terrible. There would be several better places to put it both locally and statewide.

Funny thing is I was there dealing Monte Carlo Night Craps last week and will be again this week. They seem to host several of those kind of parties as other dealers I work with have been there many times. Nice enough place even woth its own airstrip, but I don't see it as a good location.
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
PeteM
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July 25th, 2010 at 8:39:24 AM permalink
Quote: ruascott

Interesting. I'm as pro-gambling as anyone you could find, but even I would be hesitant about allowing a casino being built at Gettysburg.

In the middle of the woods on the south side of Little Round Top is a marker stone about 12"x12"by 18" high. Inscribed on top is "20th Maine". Typical New Englanders( Ah beleeve ahwr monument stone otta be ah mite mowha understated than those braggarts from New Yahk owa Virginya!). The stone marks the spot where the colors stood when Joshua Chamberlain "refused the line" and the 20th Maine Inf Regiment held off and then repulsed Col Oates' Alabama regiment, saving the Union left flank and possibly the entire battle for the US. I've been all over Gettysburg, from Devil's Den to Culp's Hill; I've walked from Seminary Road to The Angle(Pickett's Charge). I love shooting craps as much as anyone and I would rather see a Casino built on the National Mall than at Gettysburg.
If the shades of brave men abide anywhere, it's at our National Battlefield Parks- Gettysburg, Antietam, Shiloh, Chickamauga, Vicksburg, and others. Let those ghosts rest in peace!
And yeah, I know Vicksburg has riverboat gambling, but it IS down on the river, nowhere near the bluffs and hills surrounding the town where Grant and Pemberton glared at each other for 6 weeks during the siege.
"Win with a smile, lose with grace."
odiousgambit
odiousgambit
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July 25th, 2010 at 9:39:35 AM permalink
Quote: RaleighCraps

Being this schnakebit for a year now is depressing me.



I'm starting to think that guy who started the *Hoax...1.41%* thread has jinxed all us Craps players, nobody seems to be able to report doing worth a damn anywhere recently. Maybe it should have been "The Hoax that is the 0.374% HE with 3x-4x-5x odds" [g]

I've started to practice BlackJack, no kidding.
the next time Dame Fortune toys with your heart, your soul and your wallet, raise your glass and praise her thus: “Thanks for nothing, you cold-hearted, evil, damnable, nefarious, low-life, malicious monster from Hell!”   She is, after all, stone deaf. ... Arnold Snyder
Niblick
Niblick
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July 27th, 2010 at 7:02:59 AM permalink
Quote: AZDuffman

...is fairly remote along a mostly two-lane mountain road. (For history buffs, it is the "National Road" the first "highway" in the USA.) They have had problems with PGA events for this same reason, access is terrible.



Ironic, what you mentioned as being negatives are the very same reasons we hear for justifying Nemacolin Woodlands as THE next candidate.

I didn't know Joe Hardy was viewed in a negative light; I always thought that he was universally revered...a philanthropic kind of guy--however, I always heard his other family members did not enjoy the same reputation.

But these are views coming from the other side of the Commonwealth.
Nemo Omnibus Horis Sapit
teddys
teddys
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July 27th, 2010 at 8:38:39 AM permalink
Quote: PeteM

In the middle of the woods on the south side of Little Round Top is a marker stone about 12"x12"by 18" high. Inscribed on top is "20th Maine". Typical New Englanders( Ah beleeve ahwr monument stone otta be ah mite mowha understated than those braggarts from New Yahk owa Virginya!). The stone marks the spot where the colors stood when Joshua Chamberlain "refused the line" and the 20th Maine Inf Regiment held off and then repulsed Col Oates' Alabama regiment, saving the Union left flank and possibly the entire battle for the US. I've been all over Gettysburg, from Devil's Den to Culp's Hill; I've walked from Seminary Road to The Angle(Pickett's Charge). I love shooting craps as much as anyone and I would rather see a Casino built on the National Mall than at Gettysburg.
If the shades of brave men abide anywhere, it's at our National Battlefield Parks- Gettysburg, Antietam, Shiloh, Chickamauga, Vicksburg, and others. Let those ghosts rest in peace!
And yeah, I know Vicksburg has riverboat gambling, but it IS down on the river, nowhere near the bluffs and hills surrounding the town where Grant and Pemberton glared at each other for 6 weeks during the siege.


EEEEH EEEEH EEEEH Civil War Nerd alert! Beware, they are worse than Trekkies!

Just kidding, PeteM :) Glad to see this opinion here.
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4
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