Lucky
Lucky
Joined: Nov 6, 2009
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September 19th, 2011 at 12:46:00 AM permalink
ATTN: Paradigm

That's the idea ... a "different proposition" that qualifies and wins frequently - in different ways at different times - playing alongside the BJ hand. Well articulated!
"Success consists of going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." -- Winston Churchill
Paigowdan
Paigowdan
Joined: Apr 28, 2010
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September 19th, 2011 at 3:35:07 AM permalink
Positives:
The play of the bet seems well-incorporated into the game.
Quite often too many side bets are really different games that don't match well to the base game.
Additionally, the higher hit rate and the "hope rate" of the bet are important, too, with the "hope rate" being that the bet is in play a while with the play of the hand, instead of losing quickly right off the bat on some early event. Both of these provide good player involvement and re-inforcement.

The drawbacks are the complexities, not the payout tables but the handling of bets stage's of evolution leading to it take and pay result. Bets that kill hands per hour speed and are hard to process may meet strong resistance.

I wish you luck with it - it is a tight field.
Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes - Henry David Thoreau. Like Dealers' uniforms - Dan.
Lucky
Lucky
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September 19th, 2011 at 9:50:45 AM permalink
Attn: Paigowdan

Thanks, Dan. That's pretty much my assessment, too, on both the positives and negatives.

The key to minimizing complexity and maximizing pace of play, I think, is that the dealer not lose track as to whether the bets in play are based on "low side" or "high side" strategy; although the upcard is right in front of him/her, that is still possible with an inexperienced dealer.

P.S. ... "hope rate:" I like that!
"Success consists of going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." -- Winston Churchill
RoyalBJ
RoyalBJ
Joined: Jul 18, 2011
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September 19th, 2011 at 10:35:32 AM permalink
Shortie Blackjack has a similar concept: rewarding "weak" hands, TWICE, not just once. If player’s 2 initial cards score 9 or lower, a first payout of at least 3 to 1 is made; if the player wins the 21 hand, a 2nd payout of 2 to 1 of the side wager is paid again. In this case, there is a guaranteed bonus payout first, unlike your payout schedule. You may want to consider giving some payouts for a stiff hand first, but be careful with patent infringement.

The newest first payout table for Shortie Blackjack for 6 decks is:
Player Two Aces and Dealer’s upcard Ace all in Diamonds...500 to 1
Player Two Aces and Dealer’s upcard Ace, suited...200 to 1
Player Two Aces and Dealer’s upcard Ace, unsuited...50 to 1
Player Two Aces, suited...10 to 1
Player Two Aces, unsuited...5 to 1
Player has a Shorite...3 to 1

Win the 21 hand, Shortie pays again…2 to 1.

Check this out. Shortie Blackjack. The game is played at WinnaVegas, Sloan..
Paigowdan
Paigowdan
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September 19th, 2011 at 10:46:40 AM permalink
Quote: Lucky


P.S. ... "hope rate:" I like that!



This is an interesting factor in game design - is there a slightly drawn-out journey to get to the final win or lose result - or is it a "slam-bam-lose" or slam-bam-win" result to the game. As strange as this may sound - think of it that a "little foreplay" is required.

Let me give two examples:
1. Craps - there is often a long and drawn-out dice journey leading to the final point winner or 7-out - with lots of interim options and bets to shape your action before you reach that final point. Keeps people involved - even memerized.
2. Casino War - "My card's higher - you lose." Bam! Premature whatever makes for boring action.
Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes - Henry David Thoreau. Like Dealers' uniforms - Dan.
Lucky
Lucky
Joined: Nov 6, 2009
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September 19th, 2011 at 11:31:08 AM permalink
"This is an interesting factor in game design - is there a slightly drawn-out journey to get to the final win or lose result - or is it a "slam-bam-lose" or slam-bam-win" result to the game. As strange as this may sound - think of it that a "little foreplay" is required."

Yes, I understand the importance of the suspense factor in game design, just never heard it called the "hope rate" before. I like it!

Foreplay is a good metaphor too.
"Success consists of going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." -- Winston Churchill
Lucky
Lucky
Joined: Nov 6, 2009
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September 19th, 2011 at 12:09:33 PM permalink
"Shortie Blackjack has a similar concept: rewarding "weak" hands, TWICE, not just once. If player’s 2 initial cards score 9 or lower, a first payout of at least 3 to 1 is made; if the player wins the 21 hand, a 2nd payout of 2 to 1 of the side wager is paid again. In this case, there is a guaranteed bonus payout first, unlike your payout schedule. You may want to consider giving some payouts for a stiff hand first, but be careful with patent infringement."

Thanks, RoyalBJ, for the info on Shortie BJ and the link to the demo. Interesting bet that I haven't seen. The two-stage payout possibility is nice, but as Paigowdan pointed out, there is a trade-off in complexity that must be considered. I do like the 20% hit rate and high variance in this game, though. Do you know what the house edge is for the newest paytable?

P.S. Did you notice the dealer's difficulty in picking up the cards in the demo? Because of the placement of the Shortie betting spot, he had to deal player cards in a rightward fashion rather than the normal leftward way, thus making it awkward to collect the cards after the hands were completed.
"Success consists of going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." -- Winston Churchill
RoyalBJ
RoyalBJ
Joined: Jul 18, 2011
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September 19th, 2011 at 4:28:40 PM permalink
House edge for the new payout is over 4%. The house edges for all other approved tables are in the range of 5-7%. As for the demo, the dealer is the inventor who has no prior dealing experience, and he is not even cute (or clean) enough to show his face - this is what he told me.
Lucky
Lucky
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September 20th, 2011 at 10:20:49 AM permalink
"As for the demo, the dealer is the inventor who has no prior dealing experience, and he is not even cute (or clean) enough to show his face - this is what he told me."

Well, I got the idea nevertheless. So whatever works, I guess. But I do think he'll have to tweak the layout and expect objections to the complexity of the dealing procedures.
"Success consists of going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." -- Winston Churchill
buzzpaff
buzzpaff
Joined: Mar 8, 2011
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September 20th, 2011 at 12:07:50 PM permalink
Negative : People who play blackjack, like to play blackjack, Side bets are a distraction and little more. And one than takes more than 10 second to explain ?
Streak : Bet 1 to 4 hands, see the odds on the felt. Play BH and Streak
Switch : Switch your 2nds cards and then play BJ
Super Match Incorporated as part of Switch 4 card bet!

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