odiousgambit
odiousgambit
Joined: Nov 9, 2009
  • Threads: 290
  • Posts: 8078
March 14th, 2019 at 7:27:49 AM permalink
Quote: Ahigh

I have nothing against the DC.  Just against the DC when you already have a don't pass. 

OK got it. 


I sometimes bet only the DC, not the DP at all, which also avoids the hedging, though that's pretty minor hedging in a game with yuge variance if you bet the free odds. Mostly though I do the DC to keep from irritating the rightside bettors, especially the shooters next to me. Sometimes they get irritated anyway. 


Quote:

I love the dealers when I win.  When I lose, sometimes they invite me over for a soda.  If you have a dealer that trusts you enough to invite you to his or her house for hanging out, that's a good thing. 

!!!!!!!!!!! No comment!


Quote:

I will sometimes bet the come with progressively large amounts and will occasionally find the dealers not taking my come-bet on a 12 or aces.

For some reason I'm Honest John on when the Come should have traveled, pointing it out, but a losing Come bet that stays up? Not sure I've been tested on that, which seems remarkable considering your experience with it.


Quote:

  You have to take as much slack as you can get if you want to expect to win.

This can be a little like getting a free draft beer when you've ordered and paid for a good number already. I refuse to tip much in a place where we've run up quite the bill drinking drafts and gotten not a single freebie. I can't say I've had the same attitude with dealers though - just tipping less when I lose. 


this you haven't mentioned: I like to think I can successfully find the situation where you have a pliable darksider who wants to move his DP to the DC, or keep a traveling DC in the DC box, when the point is 6 or 8 - the idea being to buy that action from him.  This has been my only +EV thinking when at the table, with an abysmally unimpressive record of getting such folk to cooperate. They of course tend to be suspicious and unreceptive, after all a darksider is just naturally such a person most of the time. 


The last time I had a shot was about a week ago, kind of an interesting story. I tend to nurse a lot of superstitions that I know have no truth to them , but when it comes to darksiders being bad luck, I usually don't get those vibes at all. So as I am needing to wrap it up, having been a rightsider all game at a more than lukewarm table, here comes this guy with a huge buy-in. He proceeds to place a big DP bet, maybe a couple of hundred, and the shooter rolls an outside number to resolve immediately. The guy puts about 6x down for his odds and up comes the seven-out-pay-the-don't soon enough. This action keeps repeating and the guy is staying lucky, can't lose. So I'm thinking he just might be someone who wants "no action" on the 6 and 8 to resolve and this could be my chance to buy part of it. So I chat him up about being a darksider, and lo and behold he responds OK but guardedly. Good! Usually I get ignored. Before long I ask him about the 6 or 8 and I'll be damned if he doesn't have any idea what I'm talking about - zippo. It's like it's never occurred to him the 4 or 10 might be a sign he is more likely to win. I can see I'm getting nowhere and I need to call it a day. So I color up as he rakes in more chips and I leave. 


I won't give him credit for thinking it doesn't matter 4, 10, 5, 9, 6, or 8 since the payoff adjusts for the chances of winning. No, I guarantee you he's just come up with this scheme without knowing the math at all. 


And, yes, though I know it is only superstition, in fact provably false, I got a strong overpowering feeling that such a heavy betting Don't player was bad luck for us rightsiders. I was happy to be getting the hell out of there!
the next time Dame Fortune toys with your heart, your soul and your wallet, raise your glass and praise her thus: “Thanks for nothing, you cold-hearted, evil, damnable, nefarious, low-life, malicious monster from Hell!” She is, after all, stone deaf. ... Arnold Snyder
ChumpChange
ChumpChange
Joined: Jun 15, 2018
  • Threads: 16
  • Posts: 393
March 14th, 2019 at 9:05:51 AM permalink
I'm starting to see 3-4 players at the table betting $5 Don't Pass and putting triple or more odds on it. The 7-winners don't bother them as much as somebody making their point. When 6 out of 7 shooters never make 2 points, they might be on to something.
LusciousSweet2
LusciousSweet2
Joined: Jan 30, 2019
  • Threads: 7
  • Posts: 44
May 2nd, 2019 at 3:59:30 PM permalink
Ignore.
Here come the Men In Black. They won't let you remember.
LusciousSweet2
LusciousSweet2
Joined: Jan 30, 2019
  • Threads: 7
  • Posts: 44
May 2nd, 2019 at 4:04:45 PM permalink
Quote: Ahigh

First and foremost, don't bet the field when the house edge is 2.78% And definitely don't bet the field when the house edge is 5.56% (paying double on both the twelve and the two as in Caesar's Properties last time I checked).

IE: don't bet the field.

There is a distinct class of players who knows the math and will bet their entire bankroll on the field as their last roll.

I did this myself, and it's quite fun. But again, it's an entire class of players. Not just a few.

But the guys who are betting the field every roll are the same guys who bet the any craps. Same guys that bet the "midnight" and start hooting and hollerin'. Don't be one of those guys. They are trained by the casino personnel and they are not too bright.

I have videos on youtube that tell you how to bet craps the smart way.

It's simply.

You wait for the puck to say "OFF" while it is on the "Don't Come" area of the felt. That's the comeout roll.

Then you bet the don't pass. If the dealer tells you "you can't bet that bet" you can thank me for telling your new-to-craps-playing-self to play the don't because you'd probably be making a 33.33% house advantage bet on the pass line after a four or ten is established. That why I tell you new players to bet the don't pass because they won't ALLOW you to bet it after the comeout roll, and people taking this advice probably have zero clue.

After everyone else at the table tries to tell you how to bet, just tell them, "HEY SHOVE IT BRO. THE BEST CRAPS PLAYER IN THE UNIVERSE TOLD ME TO BET THE DON'T PASS BITCH. EAT SHIT AND DIE." You can clean the language up a little bit, but really, you can say that if you want.

Again, you bet the don't so the dealers will keep you from making a mistake. And if they miss you late-betting the don't pass, you will get a nice little reward in EV for it. Just don't tell them you did it on purpose, or it's a felony. Alright? Ignorance is bliss, sir.

Now you might be thinking, "oh now I bet the DC" or "oh now I bet the ___" .. no you don't.

You lay odds and that's it. You don't bet any other stupid bets, and if you do, you don't ask me any more questions.

Because that's all there is to it.

You always lay a multiple of 6 to your don't pass bet if you can afford it. And if you can't you lay a multiple of $6 starting at an amount to win the table minimum. IE: Lay to win $25/26 on a $25 table ($50 on 4/10, $39 on 5/9, $30 on 6/8). On a five dollar table you lay $10 to win $5 on 4/10 (or some mutiple), $9 to win 6 on 5/9 (or some multiple), $6 to win $5 (or some multiple).

That is IT. Period.

So a $25 table (where you'll play if you are a real man at a real casino), you will play 345x odds at a very classy table at a very classy casino.

You will bet $25 don't pass.

The point is established.

Point 4 or 10: Lay $50, $52, $54, $56 on up to $150 in increments of $2 according to what you wish to risk that you will win 2 out of 3 attempts on average.
Point 5 or 9: Lay $39, $42, $45, $48, $51, $54, $57, $60, up to $150 to win $100 (always lay a multiple of $3 starting at $39 to win $26)
Point 6 or 8: Lay $30, $36, $42, $48, $54, $60, $66, $72, up to $150 to win $125

Notice the maximum lay is $150 in each case? That is 6x your $25 don't pass bet. The smartest gambler concerned with getting the most volatility for his negative EV is going to be 6x on each and every number ($150 on a $25 table).

It's actually very simple.

And do NOT bet the DC.

And do NOT bet the field.

And DO tip the dealer, but only when you color (IMO).

If you lose everything, do NOT tip the dealer. Bet it on a longshot instead.

Use every dollar you have to get it back and only tip the dealers if you win. That's just my damn opinion if you're trying to win, you don't tip along the way because it makes it SO much harder to win.

You DO tip the cocktail waitress for each drink. That insurance that you don't get some infection from the drink.

This information has to be in about 200 different places, including the advice that if you want to bet the pass, the odds aren't as good, but it's pretty much the same on the math if you do it right.

But people asking these questions RARELY DO get it right. That's why I say "bet the don't pass" because if you make a mistake, they'll exclaim "NO BET!!!!" and push your chip back at you.

You learn more quickly this way, friend. And it costs nothing but shame. Shame is free.



Thank you for your in depth and very detailed answer to my question. I learned a lot from your answer.
Here come the Men In Black. They won't let you remember.
LusciousSweet2
LusciousSweet2
Joined: Jan 30, 2019
  • Threads: 7
  • Posts: 44
Thanks for this post from:
Mooseton
May 2nd, 2019 at 4:07:53 PM permalink
Quote: Nathan

I'll confess something else. When I gave you that Craps advice, I was going through a"Trying to look like an AP," thing like I tend to do at times.




Not to be rude, but I found your advice to me incredibly off-putting and like you were being more self serving and looking for attention or something like that. The fact that you actually called attention to yourself like three times when I asked for Craps advice seemed like you were clearly more interested in fishing for attention for yourself than a genuine interest in helping me out in this very thread, which I found disturbing.
Here come the Men In Black. They won't let you remember.
Nathan
Nathan
Joined: Sep 2, 2016
  • Threads: 65
  • Posts: 3430
May 10th, 2019 at 5:38:39 AM permalink
Quote: LusciousSweet2

Not to be rude, but I found your advice to me incredibly off-putting and like you were being more self serving and looking for attention or something like that. The fact that you actually called attention to yourself like three times when I asked for Craps advice seemed like you were clearly more interested in fishing for attention for yourself than a genuine interest in helping me out in this very thread, which I found disturbing.



Since this post is directly asked to me, I don't see how I can be suspended for hijacking by answering it. I was going through a "I want to look like an AP and fit into WOV phase when I answered your question with the "Play rolls that give you the highest payouts." Instead I got scolded and then suspended for like 3 days. I also went through a "Trying to look like an AP and fit into WOV," phase when I told a Newbie that he would have to play $4,000-$8,000 coin in order to get a $15,000 Progressive that looked like it was only about $400 away. I was expecting to get praise for how much of an AP I was coming across but instead got scolded and then suspended for about two weeks. So, keep in mind sometimes my advice is really me trying to come across as an AP and fit into WOV.
In both The Hunger Games and in gambling, may the odds be ever in your favor. :D "Man Babes" #AxelFabulous "Olive oil is processed but it only has one ingredient, olive oil."-Even Bob, March 27/28th. :D The 2 year war is over! Woo-hoo! :D I sometimes speak in metaphors. ;) Remember this. ;) Crack the code. :D 8.9.13.25.14.1.13.5.9.19.14.1.20.8.1.14! :D "For about the 4096th time, let me offer a radical idea to those of you who don't like Nathan -- block her and don't visit Nathan's Corner. What is so complicated about it?" Wizard, August 21st. :D
LusciousSweet2
LusciousSweet2
Joined: Jan 30, 2019
  • Threads: 7
  • Posts: 44
Thanks for this post from:
OnceDear
May 15th, 2019 at 3:42:40 PM permalink
Quote: Nathan

Since this post is directly asked to me, I don't see how I can be suspended for hijacking by answering it. I was going through a "I want to look like an AP and fit into WOV phase when I answered your question with the "Play rolls that give you the highest payouts." Instead I got scolded and then suspended for like 3 days. I also went through a "Trying to look like an AP and fit into WOV," phase when I told a Newbie that he would have to play $4,000-$8,000 coin in order to get a $15,000 Progressive that looked like it was only about $400 away. I was expecting to get praise for how much of an AP I was coming across but instead got scolded and then suspended for about two weeks. So, keep in mind sometimes my advice is really me trying to come across as an AP and fit into WOV.



My advice to you is to stop trying to come across as an Advantage Player if you are not one. It has gotten you suspended more than once, and makes you look like you are making a mockery out of Advantage Players.
Here come the Men In Black. They won't let you remember.
darkoz
darkoz
Joined: Dec 22, 2009
  • Threads: 211
  • Posts: 5332
May 15th, 2019 at 4:51:35 PM permalink
Quote: LusciousSweet2

My advice to you is to stop trying to come across as an Advantage Player if you are not one. It has gotten you suspended more than once, and makes you look like you are making a mockery out of Advantage Players.



Nathan recently posted something about Scarab and has posted a few things on here that to me belie whether she is not a secret AP after all.

Starting to wonder if her cover is an AP pretending to be an annoying Ploppie that is trying to be an unworthy AP
beachbumbabs
Administrator
beachbumbabs
Joined: May 21, 2013
  • Threads: 97
  • Posts: 13599
Thanks for this post from:
odiousgambit
May 16th, 2019 at 12:33:04 AM permalink
Quote: darkoz

Nathan recently posted something about Scarab and has posted a few things on here that to me belie whether she is not a secret AP after all.

Starting to wonder if her cover is an AP pretending to be an annoying Ploppie that is trying to be an unworthy AP



Nope.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
Nathan
Nathan
Joined: Sep 2, 2016
  • Threads: 65
  • Posts: 3430
May 16th, 2019 at 12:19:53 PM permalink
Quote: LusciousSweet2

My advice to you is to stop trying to come across as an Advantage Player if you are not one. It has gotten you suspended more than once, and makes you look like you are making a mockery out of Advantage Players.



I try so hard to come across as an AP because I don't want to come across as a Ploppy. AP's are seen as glamorous, worldly, sophisticated, are highly respected, high class, well liked, revered, wise. Ploppies are seen as the equivalent of the bum asking for a dollar under the Vegas Freeway. Who the heck would want to be considered a Ploppy?
In both The Hunger Games and in gambling, may the odds be ever in your favor. :D "Man Babes" #AxelFabulous "Olive oil is processed but it only has one ingredient, olive oil."-Even Bob, March 27/28th. :D The 2 year war is over! Woo-hoo! :D I sometimes speak in metaphors. ;) Remember this. ;) Crack the code. :D 8.9.13.25.14.1.13.5.9.19.14.1.20.8.1.14! :D "For about the 4096th time, let me offer a radical idea to those of you who don't like Nathan -- block her and don't visit Nathan's Corner. What is so complicated about it?" Wizard, August 21st. :D

  • Jump to: