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bodyforlife
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August 17th, 2014 at 12:28:24 PM permalink
I'm convinced of it, and have observed this for quite some time while playing craps. I call it the Evil Knievel syndrome. People that used to watch him do his daredevil stunts would often comment that they were only watching to see if he could indeed jump over all those buses. But in reality, they wanted to see if he crashed. So how many of you have played craps and noticed that people will watch you as long as you are losing, but more times than not, when you get on a hot streak, they tend to walk away. I had the same thing happen on a trip this weekend. I hit 3 points and knocked out 6-7 come wagers along the way and the guy walked away in disgust. I'm guessing their mentality is if people are losing, it makes them feel better because they're not the dumb schmuck who just lost his bankroll. But if the shooter is winning, it annoys them because they aren't part of the action.
EvenBob
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August 17th, 2014 at 12:56:30 PM permalink
It's called schadenfreude..
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
onenickelmiracle
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August 17th, 2014 at 2:01:23 PM permalink
Your imagination is running overtime and probably contrary to most people watching. People like watching winners and crowds don't build up to watch people losing.
I am a robot.
DeMango
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August 17th, 2014 at 4:10:50 PM permalink
Can't stand people watching me shoot. They get the stink eye, sometimes even before they cause me to seven out! Bastards!
When a rock is thrown into a pack of dogs, the one that yells the loudest is the one who got hit.
Deucekies
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August 17th, 2014 at 4:21:15 PM permalink
I've had someone vulture over me on Pai Gow just because he wanted my seat. Even though I was the only player at the table, I was in "his" seat.
Casinos are not your friends, they want your money. But so does Disneyland. And there is no chance in hell that you will go to Disneyland and come back with more money than you went with. - AxelWolf and Mickeycrimm
spadeknight
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August 17th, 2014 at 4:46:03 PM permalink
How can someone cause you to seven out???? just curious
Winner 7! Pay the line
Nareed
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August 17th, 2014 at 5:03:56 PM permalink
Quote: Deucekies

I've had someone vulture over me on Pai Gow just because he wanted my seat. Even though I was the only player at the table, I was in "his" seat.



Don't give up the seat.

Sell it.
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
bodyforlife
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August 18th, 2014 at 4:17:44 PM permalink
Quote: onenickelmiracle

Your imagination is running overtime and probably contrary to most people watching. People like watching winners and crowds don't build up to watch people losing.



The only time I see people attempt to watch a hot table is when it's already packed and people are screaming because there's a hot shooter (but usually they can't see anything because the table is too packed). Unlike the Temptations song, it is not "just my imagination running away from me"
DeMango
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August 18th, 2014 at 4:53:07 PM permalink
Quote: spadeknight

How can someone cause you to seven out???? just curious


Interrupt the rhythm, just like the tray lizard.
When a rock is thrown into a pack of dogs, the one that yells the loudest is the one who got hit.
ThenWhatHappens
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March 15th, 2017 at 12:23:40 PM permalink
I never notice when people are spectating unless they are right on my flank. There was one on my last trip that insisted we were too quiet for a craps table. He would cheer and clap for every roll and tried to goad me into showing some excitement. (I attract this attention often as I am a very subdued person.) My discomfort was his specific interrest in me. Telling me several times that he was rooting for me, in a voice loud enough for the whole table to hear yet yelling directly in my ear. I get paranoid of pick-pockets in these situations. We made this trip to accompany two friends who were taking a hand to hand combat seminar. I turned to the one who was not playing and said "You may have to gouge his eyes out," Luckily he got bored with us and moved off to bother someone else.

Closer to topic: Has anyone ever wished for the dice to be so cruel that it wipes out some of the hot shot, dealer pumping, prop players that slow the game down? Maybe I'm the only one. I play a long game, a very disciplined pass line and two come bets, all with full odds. I can survive most downturns and do actually wish for a cold streak when the action gets too slow.

On topic: Yes, I notice that I wish for some players to lose, and I feel good when they do. I am also one who feels that some of the bets on the craps table should never be played, so when someone collects on them I refer to it as "Rewarding bad behavior,"
Don't forget, "FREE" is a four letter word.
DeMango
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March 15th, 2017 at 1:15:48 PM permalink
I do prefer a table for one, the only problem is that my shooting usually enriches them. Then pull the plug and do something else, eat breakfast, play 25 cent JOB, so they can lose their money and go back or usually head for another casino.
When a rock is thrown into a pack of dogs, the one that yells the loudest is the one who got hit.
loldongs
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March 28th, 2017 at 9:16:38 PM permalink
Quote: ThenWhatHappens

On topic: Yes, I notice that I wish for some players to lose, and I feel good when they do. I am also one who feels that some of the bets on the craps table should never be played, so when someone collects on them I refer to it as "Rewarding bad behavior,"



they lose more often than they don't, and someone has to keep the lights on for those of us who try not to.

feeling good when anyone loses is kinda dickish imho, except when the casino loses. :)
Daddydoc
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March 31st, 2017 at 7:14:22 PM permalink
Quote: loldongs

...and someone has to keep the lights on for those of us who try not to.



To paraphrase someone here (Babs?): If they weren't making money on it, they wouldn't spread the game.

There is very little money to be made in a game where every bet is a line bet. The house has a small advantage, but out of that must come the dealer salaries, electricity, cost of the table, etc. And consider the opportunity cost to the casino of a bank of 10 slot machines where that craps table sits. Line bets are the price the casino pays to be able to offer the center bets.
If government is the answer, it must have been a very stupid question.
LuckyPhow
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March 31st, 2017 at 7:59:18 PM permalink
Quote: Daddydoc

"Line bets are the price the casino pays to be able to offer the center bets."



That one's a keeper!
onenickelmiracle
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March 31st, 2017 at 8:08:05 PM permalink
Quote: Daddydoc

To paraphrase someone here (Babs?): If they weren't making money on it, they wouldn't spread the game.

There is very little money to be made in a game where every bet is a line bet. The house has a small advantage, but out of that must come the dealer salaries, electricity, cost of the table, etc. And consider the opportunity cost to the casino of a bank of 10 slot machines where that craps table sits. Line bets are the price the casino pays to be able to offer the center bets.

That's true, but for 10 people playing those bets, there are more gambling at higher edges, because the tables are full. There is almost always 10 empty slot machines in a casino, so 10 extra slots won't produce more money necessarily. People might arrive at the casino intending to play craps, but wind up doing something else.
I am a robot.
docsjs
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April 1st, 2017 at 2:12:07 AM permalink
I hate people standing behind me at the dice table. I first politely ask them to move. If this is not successful, I will take a step backward and step on their feet or kick them. I, of course. apologize sincerely. As a last resort, I will ask the pit or boxman to call security to correct the problem.
WatchMeWin
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April 1st, 2017 at 2:30:40 AM permalink
Quote: bodyforlife

I'm convinced of it, and have observed this for quite some time while playing craps. I call it the Evil Knievel syndrome. People that used to watch him do his daredevil stunts would often comment that they were only watching to see if he could indeed jump over all those buses. But in reality, they wanted to see if he crashed. So how many of you have played craps and noticed that people will watch you as long as you are losing, but more times than not, when you get on a hot streak, they tend to walk away. I had the same thing happen on a trip this weekend. I hit 3 points and knocked out 6-7 come wagers along the way and the guy walked away in disgust. I'm guessing their mentality is if people are losing, it makes them feel better because they're not the dumb schmuck who just lost his bankroll. But if the shooter is winning, it annoys them because they aren't part of the action.



Generally, people like to watch people win not lose. They like to see big action and dream that it was their own winnings. The people that like to watch people lose are the insecure miserable lowlifes that don't know how to win and are envious of others.

The guy who shook his head in disgust and walked away while you were winning was either pissed that he wasn't on the roll, or just a miserable guy who had an evil soul.... and maybe didn't like you either.. haha
'Winners hit n run... Losers stick around'
Mission146
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April 1st, 2017 at 7:06:26 PM permalink
Quote: WatchMeWin

Generally, people like to watch people win not lose. They like to see big action and dream that it was their own winnings. The people that like to watch people lose are the insecure miserable lowlifes that don't know how to win and are envious of others.



Not always!

I was staying at a casino hotel one night and playing some Craps for the table minimum (of course), Pass Line with 2x Odds, Placing 6/8 for the minimum. Anyway, some clown comes up to the table talking about rigged decks at Blackjack and cussing out the Craps crew (for whatever reason) even though he had apparently won a good bit at Craps earlier in the night and lost it at Blackjack.

He had a few black chips still with him, though I can't remember the exact amount (I think $400) and I established a Point of 10. He put his remaining chips on the, "Lay Four," and continued to berate the crew for no good reason. My first roll after that was inconsequential, but then my next one was a four, I just looked at the guy, grinned, and said, "Have a good night!"
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
WatchMeWin
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April 2nd, 2017 at 11:07:40 AM permalink
Quote: Mission146

Not always!

I was staying at a casino hotel one night and playing some Craps for the table minimum (of course), Pass Line with 2x Odds, Placing 6/8 for the minimum. Anyway, some clown comes up to the table talking about rigged decks at Blackjack and cussing out the Craps crew (for whatever reason) even though he had apparently won a good bit at Craps earlier in the night and lost it at Blackjack.

He had a few black chips still with him, though I can't remember the exact amount (I think $400) and I established a Point of 10. He put his remaining chips on the, "Lay Four," and continued to berate the crew for no good reason. My first roll after that was inconsequential, but then my next one was a four, I just looked at the guy, grinned, and said, "Have a good night!"



Your case was a matter of circumstance in which an idiot on the table rubs people the wrong way with negative energy or obnoxious behavior... in these cases, it is quite normal and advised to wish ill for the j-offs! But generally speaking, I would argue that most normal people like to see others win, unless as I stated, they have their own issues.
'Winners hit n run... Losers stick around'
Keyser
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April 2nd, 2017 at 3:21:31 PM permalink
Quote:

People Like To See You Lose



Yes, those people are called "dealers, pit, and casino management." They're aren't all evil and dark. There are a few good people there. However, there are many of them that do lead a very cynical life, which is why it's sometimes difficult for casino employees to make a transition back to the real world outside of the casinos. Working in a casino seems to have a profound effect on moral fiber. You can view some of their dark conversations on the casinos dealers forum.
EvenBob
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April 2nd, 2017 at 5:39:40 PM permalink
Quote: Keyser

Working in a casino seems to have a profound effect on moral fiber. You can view some of their dark conversations on the casinos dealers forum.



I read those for years. It's a depressing place,
dealers are always unhappy about something.
They universally dump on their customers,
have no respect for them at all, even when
they tip. A casino player is no better than a
mark in a carnival. He's only there so they can
squeeze money out of him.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
Ibeatyouraces
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April 2nd, 2017 at 5:57:00 PM permalink
And we have no remorse for them when we exploit their sloppiness and take advantage of their mistakes. And if they get fired over it, tough!
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
Mission146
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April 2nd, 2017 at 6:56:19 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

I read those for years. It's a depressing place,
dealers are always unhappy about something.
They universally dump on their customers,
have no respect for them at all, even when
they tip. A casino player is no better than a
mark in a carnival. He's only there so they can
squeeze money out of him.



I don't think that there is anyone in the customer service industry that enjoys the presence of all of their customers, with some jobs being an exception, perhaps. You tend to remember the bad ones, especially when they vastly outnumber the great ones (which I assume they do in the casino industry, but wouldn't personally know) with most customers being neutral.
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
Mission146
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April 2nd, 2017 at 6:57:43 PM permalink
Quote: Ibeatyouraces

And we have no remorse for them when we exploit their sloppiness and take advantage of their mistakes. And if they get fired over it, tough!



You should want for merciful management that wants to give them as many chances as possible, that way they can go on to commit more mistakes that work to your benefit.
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
billryan
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April 2nd, 2017 at 7:09:25 PM permalink
I hate to see sloppy dealers fired. It's work to find them. Why would I want them gone and have to go hunting again?
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
Ibeatyouraces
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April 2nd, 2017 at 7:33:48 PM permalink
Quote: Mission146

You should want for merciful management that wants to give them as many chances as possible, that way they can go on to commit more mistakes that work to your benefit.


The opposite usually happens. The player gets the boot and the game continues. We just send other players in on it.
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
AxelWolf
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April 2nd, 2017 at 8:33:05 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

I read those for years. It's a depressing place,
dealers are always unhappy about something.
They universally dump on their customers,
have no respect for them at all, even when
they tip. A casino player is no better than a
mark in a carnival. He's only there so they can
squeeze money out of him.

You weren't a dealer were you? What made you all curmudgeonly? (-;

I dont know if dealing has more of a dark affect on people than the average job.
Perhaps because people spend so much time with dealers they tend to notice more than one might notice when dealing with employees from other fields.

I dont know think it's the job that turns people dark, I think the people are dark negative people to begin with.

I know a couple who both dealt BJ and other games in Vegas for many years. The Guy is a goodhearted, nice positive person and he always has been. He mostly enjoyed dealing. The lady is the opposite of him.

Most dealers I know personally seem to be happy, positive, up beat and good people.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
EvenBob
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April 2nd, 2017 at 9:28:57 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf



Most dealers I know personally seem to be happy, positive, up beat and good people.



To your face, yeah. They work for tips.
You might find what they say and
think and express to other dealers
to be quite a shock.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
billryan
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April 3rd, 2017 at 1:11:09 AM permalink
I used to have a fireman tend bar for me on some of his days off. Bunch of his coworkers would drop in most shifts. If you ever heard the smack they talked about people they helped, the mess in peoples houses, why do the 500 pound sacks of shite always live on the sixth floor of a walkup and so on, you'd be amazed.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
WatchMeWin
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April 3rd, 2017 at 5:28:42 AM permalink
Actually, I do feel that there are some dealers that like to see people lose... again it originates from their own insecurities, issues, and ineptitudes. Some....just a few that Ive encountered over the years, appear to be miserable with their lives and I felt that they didn't like to see me win. I guess when they see someone come in all the time and hit for a few bucks consistently, they feel envious and start feeling worse about themselves. I tried to stay away from them when I saw them. But for the most part, I love the good dealers who know how to deal and have good attitudes. If I win, they win. I tip a percentage of my winnings typically.

That being said, there was one guy in AC who was a floor person in craps... He never smiled and always made comments like 'the law of averages will catch up with you soon'. WTF! I swear he would stand right at the corner of the table every time I walked up and starred at the dice as if he were hoping for a 7 out. His tables seemed to always be cold. Bastaaaard!
'Winners hit n run... Losers stick around'
Sonny44
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April 3rd, 2017 at 12:58:17 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

To your face, yeah. They work for tips.
You might find what they say and
think and express to other dealers
to be quite a shock.


You can say that, even about your closest friends and family. None of us ever really know what others think of us, and we can't (if we're wise) worry about it. I don't care what table staff think of me, only that they are courteous and competent in servicing my bets.
WatchMeWin
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April 3rd, 2017 at 2:03:34 PM permalink
Too many people want to be the big mahuff and act like the big shot. Dealers see through it. At the end of the day, if you are confident with yourself , you need not give a sh*# what others think. Do what you do for number 1 and dont step in number 2. But note, if your a dick, people will treat you accordingly.
'Winners hit n run... Losers stick around'
RS
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April 4th, 2017 at 2:44:31 AM permalink
Dealers who like to see players lose:

1) "The company man", as some would say. This is the guy who, for whatever reason, wants his casino to make a bunch of money. He is most likely aiming to be a floor person and eventually a pit boss. He wants his table to have the biggest win of the night, so his superiors will see what a great employee he is, and he'll be promoted. He likely sucks at his job, tries to be friends with floor people, pit bossss, and management, but they all hate him anyway. He thinks he's the best dealer in the house and deserves to be promoted and would do a better job than anyone else above him This person is most likely retarded.

2) The dark/envious dealer. This person is just an a**hole and enjoys watching others lose. He thinks he should get paid more for his job, meaning he doesn't receive as much in tips as he thinks he should get. Thus, he enjoys watching players lose money because he views all players as not tipping enough. Even when someone is betting $500 a hand and tipping $25 a hand, if the player (somehow) comes up ahead a few thousand, he thinks the player should tip an extra 20% of his profits.

3) The player is an a**hole. In this case, the player is a complete idiot, typically always complaining about losing or not winning enough, complains about the slow cocktail waitresses, dealers aren't making payouts quickly enough, others messing with the flow of the cards in BJ or "the shooter been doing good then he changed his toss and sevened out, idiot", etc. This is the kind of player that anyone with a soul would like to see him lose, and rightfully so.


Few dealers are #1, because many hate their jobs. Also, floor people tend to make less money than dealers (AFAIK).

A huge number of dealers are #2. I'd say very few are truly appreciative of tips. Even though most will say thanks, you're a good person, etc., it can frequently be an attempt to pressure the non-tippers at the table into tipping.

Almost all are #3. There are a few odd balls who just love dealing and like players too much. Picture the manager dude at the restaurant who's too happy and out going in the movie Office Space.
odiousgambit
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April 4th, 2017 at 3:38:57 AM permalink
To some degree dealer attitude is just 'gallows humor' - always shocking to outsiders. Dealers get to see people hang themselves plenty.
the next time Dame Fortune toys with your heart, your soul and your wallet, raise your glass and praise her thus: “Thanks for nothing, you cold-hearted, evil, damnable, nefarious, low-life, malicious monster from Hell!”   She is, after all, stone deaf. ... Arnold Snyder
mamat
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April 6th, 2017 at 8:31:04 AM permalink
Quote: RS

Dealers who like to see players lose:

1) "The company man", as some would say. This is the guy who, for whatever reason, wants his casino to make a bunch of money. He is most likely aiming to be a floor person and eventually a pit boss. He wants his table to have the biggest win of the night, so his superiors will see what a great employee he is, and he'll be promoted. He likely sucks at his job, tries to be friends with floor people, pit bossss, and management, but they all hate him anyway. He thinks he's the best dealer in the house and deserves to be promoted and would do a better job than anyone else above him This person is most likely retarded.

Asian female BJ dealers - lot of "company men" for some reason...
InTimeForSpace1
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April 6th, 2017 at 12:27:44 PM permalink
What do you call old debauched whining fat men who want to take the world down with them?
Believers are the ones who keep at it long after they've been told it can't be done. On the other hand, the real experts shouldn't care about the crackpots. But, if the wrong answer begs the question, then the wrong question begs the answer.
RogerKint
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April 6th, 2017 at 12:35:01 PM permalink
Quote: InTimeForSpace1

What do you call old debauched whining fat men who want to take the world down with them?



EvenBobs? Jk :)
100% risk of ruin
WatchMeWin
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December 12th, 2017 at 3:48:36 PM permalink
I remember that someone had written about dealers wanting players to lose, so I had to go back and find this thread after my experience this past week. As most would agree, the people that want to see others lose are those insecure losers who are envious and hate seeing others do well when they themselves are miserable and not participating in the win.... ring a bell ax?

Ive been going to a new casino often over the past few weeks. Ive been winning consistently 'in and out'. I always tip and always get the dealers involved in effort to keep up the positive vibe. However at this casino, there is this one dealer that always looks so upset when I color up with my wins and makes remarks like ' the law of averages is going to hit you soon' and 'why would you go off on your bets in the middle of a roll' and 'you're too good for us pal ...and really lucky'. The guy is miserable. He looks like Mr. Heat Miser and I feel sorry for him, but I had smiles all the way to the cashier.

Jealousy + Insecurity = Misery
'Winners hit n run... Losers stick around'
ThenWhatHappens
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December 12th, 2017 at 5:48:14 PM permalink
Quote: Sonny44

…None of us ever really know what others think of us, and we can't (if we're wise) worry about it. I don't care what table staff think of me, only that they are courteous and competent in servicing my bets.


"What you think about me is none of my business," ~ Leslie Jordan
Don't forget, "FREE" is a four letter word.
AxelWolf
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December 12th, 2017 at 8:27:40 PM permalink
Quote: WatchMeWin

I remember that someone had written about dealers wanting players to lose, so I had to go back and find this thread after my experience this past week. As most would agree, the people that want to see others lose are those insecure losers who are envious and hate seeing others do well when they themselves are miserable and not participating in the win.... ring a bell ax?

Ive been going to a new casino often over the past few weeks. Ive been winning consistently 'in and out'. I always tip and always get the dealers involved in effort to keep up the positive vibe. However at this casino, there is this one dealer that always looks so upset when I color up with my wins and makes remarks like ' the law of averages is going to hit you soon' and 'why would you go off on your bets in the middle of a roll' and 'you're too good for us pal ...and really lucky'. The guy is miserable. He looks like Mr. Heat Miser and I feel sorry for him, but I had smiles all the way to the cashier.

Jealousy + Insecurity = Misery

No, it doesn't ring a bell, but I will take that as a premeditated/calculated personal insult that crosses a line and I will ask the mods to act accordingly.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
beachbumbabs
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December 12th, 2017 at 8:46:03 PM permalink
Quote: WatchMeWin


the people that want to see others lose are those insecure losers who are envious and hate seeing others do well when they themselves are miserable and not participating in the win.... ring a bell ax?



Quote: AxelWolf

No, it doesn't ring a bell, but I will take that as a premeditated/calculated personal insult that crosses a line and I will ask the mods to act accordingly.



Yeah, I have to agree. Personal insult. 3 days.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
DeMango
DeMango
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December 12th, 2017 at 8:54:20 PM permalink
The Dark Side of The Force, "The Spirit of Tattletale" is strong here!
When a rock is thrown into a pack of dogs, the one that yells the loudest is the one who got hit.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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December 12th, 2017 at 8:56:04 PM permalink
I just got a big smile on my face watching him lose his forum privileges for 3 days. Does that make me an insecure loser?
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
FreePlay
FreePlay
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December 13th, 2017 at 2:34:22 AM permalink
If you win 500 for the day and bet 300 on sports how is that a free roll? I thought that would just be more money in action but it isn't like your playing on house money like you say you are? I have a lot to learn so maybe I am wrong?
FleaStiff
FleaStiff
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December 13th, 2017 at 7:29:04 AM permalink
Quote: spadeknight

How can someone cause you to seven out???? just curious

Let the dice hit their hands, make an annoying comment, break my concentration, look at me weird .... lots of ways.
FleaStiff
FleaStiff
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December 13th, 2017 at 7:33:16 AM permalink
Those who take the view that there is only some finite amount of money that the players can win, may indeed take the view that any other player they see winning is taking money from them and therefore hate winners and love losers. Strange are the ways of the cheap and penny pinching. Strange are the ways of the rich too.
FleaStiff
FleaStiff
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December 13th, 2017 at 7:40:01 AM permalink
Quote: RS

"The company man", as some would say. This is the guy who, for whatever reason, wants his casino to make a bunch of money. He is most likely aiming to be a floor person and eventually a pit boss.

Its an 'us' versus 'them' attitude. He may hate being a dealer but he does want to move up the ladder and hate being a pit boss. The casinos often foster an attitude of don't let players steal and don't let players win.
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