Soul purchase contract
November 21st, 2010 at 11:42:59 AM
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Earlier this week I put an atheist on this board, who shall remain nameless, to the test. He is the kind of atheist who believes there is no god in the same way a theist believes there is one. The other kind of atheist, like me, does not believe either way, because of a perceived lack of evidence either way.
This all started when I casually offered $10 for his soul, which he almost immediately agreed to. However, he then started to backtrack by asking for specific terms. For example, the option to buy his soul back for $10 after one million years as my slave in the afterlife. To me, that shows his beliefs are not as rock solid as he may have thought. Then it came into doubt about how a year might be defined in the afterlife, and if you can die again in the afterlife, what happens? After a couple days he offered the following contract, which he agreed to let me post here.
Does this contract look fair? I welcome all comments.
This all started when I casually offered $10 for his soul, which he almost immediately agreed to. However, he then started to backtrack by asking for specific terms. For example, the option to buy his soul back for $10 after one million years as my slave in the afterlife. To me, that shows his beliefs are not as rock solid as he may have thought. Then it came into doubt about how a year might be defined in the afterlife, and if you can die again in the afterlife, what happens? After a couple days he offered the following contract, which he agreed to let me post here.
Does this contract look fair? I welcome all comments.
Quote: Soul Contract
As of the ___ day of ______________, in the Christian year ____________, I _________________, hereby sell my soul to Michael Shackleford for the sum of $10, subject to the following terms and conditions:
- This document covers the soul in all possible forms and ideations, covered by any human religion, including those religions that believe there is no soul.
- ___________________ will have the option of repurchasing his soul for the sum of $10 after the lesser of one million human years or one million soul years, but in no event can such sale occur before the human death of __________________.
- The soul of ___________________ cannot be assigned, sold, given or left to any acquaintance, descendent or beneficiary of Michael Shackleford, the estate of Michael Shackleford or any trust in which Michael Shackleford is named. It must remain his sole possession for the duration of this contract.
- This document is not to be communicated in any form, reproduced in any form, or disseminated in any form, without the explicit written permission of ____________________. Any such act constitutes a violation of the terms of this sale and immediately revokes the sale so that the soul of _________________ reverts to his possession.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
November 21st, 2010 at 12:10:57 PM
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If he doesn't believe in an afterlife how can he believe in a soul? Those type people are always of the belief that once you die, everything about you ceases to exist. And that is why they are regularly some of the most unhappy, argumentative, untrustworthy, pessimistic, paranoid people to roam God's good earth.
November 21st, 2010 at 12:12:35 PM
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Quote: JerryLoganIf he doesn't believe in an afterlife how can he believe in a soul? Those type people are always of the belief that once you die, everything about you ceases to exist. And that is why they are regularly some of the most unhappy, argumentative, untrustworthy, pessimistic, paranoid people to roam God's good earth.
You make this assertion/statement/theory again... and again you fail to back it up with any evidence.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
November 21st, 2010 at 12:23:23 PM
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Quote: thecesspitYou make this assertion/statement/theory again... and again you fail to back it up with any evidence.
You're confusing yourself. There's no such thing as evidence when talking about the many shortfalls of atheism. There's experience in DEALING with these poor souls, which translates into the reality of the issue. Every one of them that I've ever met, saw on TV interviews (like that fool Bill Maher) or read what they've written on the Internet has one or more of the traits I've mentioned. And why not? They believe whatever happens here is all there is, and they are almost always the unhappiest people I've ever witnessed. Others, like the Wiz, prefer there be some sort of evidence, and even though we're told from many very reliable sources that evidence abounded 2000 years ago, those who did not witness it seem to have a need to diss what our predecessors said and require more current proof. I don't 100% disagree with that, but I can attest to the fact that I am a much happier person for not requiring such evidence in order to be a believer.
November 21st, 2010 at 12:26:53 PM
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I wouldn't sell my soul.
But I'd rent it for $20 a week. Any takers?
But I'd rent it for $20 a week. Any takers?
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
November 21st, 2010 at 12:37:29 PM
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Quote: JerryLoganYou're confusing yourself. There's no such thing as evidence when talking about the many shortfalls of atheism.
There's no such thing as evidence for the many delusions of religion.
And no matter how many times you say it, no matter how loudly you say it, no matter how many names you call the persons who disagree with you, you have NO BASIS for your claim that atheists are any less happy than the general population. The commonsense, realistic assessment is, of course, that they are no more and no less happy.
Once again, Jerry, you take YOUR personal views and try to project them onto the rest of humanity. You're religious. Fine. (Your god is even better than most--he meets you for dinner and talks to you about his video poker system, which is more than the Christian God does.) But that doesn't mean that everyone SHOULD be, or they must be desperately unhappy.
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality.---George Bernard Shaw
November 21st, 2010 at 12:41:55 PM
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Quote: JerryLoganYou're confusing yourself. There's no such thing as evidence when talking about the many shortfalls of atheism.
No confusion. You make a blanket statement based on nothing but your own jaded experience through the lens of belief. Go ahead. Believe what you like, but belief does not make it so. If you've noticed, there are people who will challenge your views when they are just Jerry Logan says it so. You can go ahead believing atheists are unhappy and miserable. Go ahead. It does not make it so. No more than your belief in God makes him exist.
I'm afraid my experience is anything but what you mention, and I've seen Christians who are among the most hypocritical, sheep-like people who are can be financially and spiritually dishonest, and have all the intellectual depth of a piece of paper. I see TV preachers every day who are so enamored with their cult of personality I am physically repulsed. I've seen the arrogance of belief ruin lives and ruin people. I've seen the Pope's policies reduce people to penury and being social outcast for no fault of their own. I've seen extremists kill people in my own city for their religion, I've seen wars in the name of God (pick one, any one), so don't tell me that belief without skepticism is a good and powerful force for the world.
I'll counter the obvious argument... yes, their is faith and charity. There is comfort in the arms of the church. There is the force for improvement in the world as well from various Christian organisations. I don't say that it doesn't happen, it clearly, and powerfully does. That does not mean God exists or I must believe. It merely means people have a reason to go out and do good. And you can be Christian, Agnostic, Hindu, Atheist, Deist or Muslim... it don't matter as long as you try and leave the world a better place. Because that's how to live on after your death... leave a mark somewhere, somehow, not by going to church on Sunday and singing a song to a god.
That's my belief anyways.
If someone wants $10 for my soul, I'll have the ten bucks please.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
November 21st, 2010 at 12:44:10 PM
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Hmmm. First of all, would he still have the $10 after a million years? Do souls have pockets? Bank accounts?
Presuming your mortal death occurs somewhat sooner than one million years from now, does the soul-only version of you still retain possession?
And making a similar presumption that your seller would have physically died well before the million years is up, and at that time you would own his soul, what entity would be doing the repurchasing? Or are you saying that his soul (which you would own) could manumit itself at that time?
And finally, since you owned that soul, you would also presumably own that $10 it had been saving for a million years, so wouldn't you just confiscate it on F-Day (Freedom Day) minus one? Bwahahahahaaaaa!
EDIT: If you have retained possession of his soul, and thus his $10, for a million years, will you pay him market interest rates on those funds? (And what would that $10 be worth after 1,000,000 years, assuming a money market interest rate of 5%?. Of course, you could charge his soul monthly maintenance fees, just like my bank does, which together with the owns-your-soul vibe, suggests a great analogy...)
Presuming your mortal death occurs somewhat sooner than one million years from now, does the soul-only version of you still retain possession?
And making a similar presumption that your seller would have physically died well before the million years is up, and at that time you would own his soul, what entity would be doing the repurchasing? Or are you saying that his soul (which you would own) could manumit itself at that time?
And finally, since you owned that soul, you would also presumably own that $10 it had been saving for a million years, so wouldn't you just confiscate it on F-Day (Freedom Day) minus one? Bwahahahahaaaaa!
EDIT: If you have retained possession of his soul, and thus his $10, for a million years, will you pay him market interest rates on those funds? (And what would that $10 be worth after 1,000,000 years, assuming a money market interest rate of 5%?. Of course, you could charge his soul monthly maintenance fees, just like my bank does, which together with the owns-your-soul vibe, suggests a great analogy...)
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality.---George Bernard Shaw
November 21st, 2010 at 12:51:46 PM
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Quote: thecesspitI'm afraid my experience is anything but what you mention, and I've seen Christians who are among the most hypocritical, sheep-like people who are can be financially and spiritually dishonest, and have all the intellectual depth of a piece of paper. I see TV preachers every day who are so enamored with their cult of personality I am physically repulsed. I've seen the arrogance of belief ruin lives and ruin people. I've seen the Pope's policies reduce people to penury and being social outcast for no fault of their own. I've seen extremists kill people in my own city for their religion, I've seen wars in the name of God (pick one, any one), so don't tell me that belief without skepticism is a good and powerful force for the world.
I totally agree with the above, but that in itself doesn't counter Jerry's argument--after all, Christians may be miserable delusionists who lead unhappy, fearful, stunted lives, but that doesn't say anything about atheists one way or the other. The mythology behind the "unhappy atheists" argument is that we all somehow NEED God, or a god, or gods, to make ourselves happy. Lacking that, we must necessarily be miserable. Atheists must also live in constant fear of death, since they don't have the comforting illusion of an afterlife that Christians do (and of course, no Christian tells himself that that afterlife will consist of eternity in Cleveland, er, hell). You and I know, of course, that that argument is, well...utter crapola.
Blanket statements, particularly those based on reading the state of mind of millions of people (telepathically?), are almost always incorrect.
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality.---George Bernard Shaw
November 21st, 2010 at 1:51:42 PM
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Posts about the definition of atheism have been moved to Definition of Atheism.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
November 21st, 2010 at 5:03:52 PM
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Wiz -
First of all, thanks. After all the bullshit posts we've seen lately, this one has me totally laughing my ass off.
Second, on some of the DJ sites I participate in, when the subject of contracts come up, the biggest response is to talk to a lawyer. Do you plan on talking to a lawyer? Of course, considering the subject of this contract, and the max $10 value, I'd say a lawyer might not be necessary...
Third, The second condition is redundant. On second thought, maybe not. Sounds like you're protecting yourself from the guy living for a million years. Yeah, you covered your bases there!
What if he dies, and his soul, in the form of a ghost, decides to violate the terms of the contract in some manner?
What if his soul/ghost decides to bite you in your ass, or do some other unpleasant deed to you?
I was gonna make some of these same points:
First of all, thanks. After all the bullshit posts we've seen lately, this one has me totally laughing my ass off.
Second, on some of the DJ sites I participate in, when the subject of contracts come up, the biggest response is to talk to a lawyer. Do you plan on talking to a lawyer? Of course, considering the subject of this contract, and the max $10 value, I'd say a lawyer might not be necessary...
Third, The second condition is redundant. On second thought, maybe not. Sounds like you're protecting yourself from the guy living for a million years. Yeah, you covered your bases there!
What if he dies, and his soul, in the form of a ghost, decides to violate the terms of the contract in some manner?
What if his soul/ghost decides to bite you in your ass, or do some other unpleasant deed to you?
I was gonna make some of these same points:
Define $10. I assume that's American dollars. What sort of currency will be available in the afterlife? And if inflation continues, even slowly, what will $10 be worth in a million years? I foresee the penny biting the dust in my lifetime. In a million years, will the USA exist? And if so, will $10 bills still be printed? Or be considered anything in a cash-less society? Think of the history of the Italian Lira.Quote: mkl654321Hmmm. First of all, would he still have the $10 after a million years? Do souls have pockets? Bank accounts?
Presuming your mortal death occurs somewhat sooner than one million years from now, does the soul-only version of you still retain possession?
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
November 21st, 2010 at 5:08:47 PM
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I rest my case. If it's so very easy to rile non-believers, then they themselves have a constant little voice in the back of their heads telling them of their constant state of misery, confusion, unhappiness, conflict, hate, and even homosexuality. But getting them to admit it is not possible.
November 21st, 2010 at 5:11:20 PM
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Quote: JerryLoganI rest my case. If it's so very easy to rile non-believers, then they themselves have a constant little voice in the back of their heads telling them of their constant state of misery, confusion, unhappiness, conflict, hate, and even homosexuality. But getting them to admit it is not possible.
Yes. Getting people to "admit" something that is totally untrue, and total bullshit, is definitely difficult.
The reason why you've rested your case is that your case is nonexistent.
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality.---George Bernard Shaw
November 21st, 2010 at 5:32:31 PM
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It occurs to me....
Why would an atheist hesitate to sell his soul?
Could it be that he's violating the Wiz' Seventh Commandment?
Why would an atheist hesitate to sell his soul?
Could it be that he's violating the Wiz' Seventh Commandment?
Quote:7. Thou shalt not hedge thy bets.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
November 21st, 2010 at 5:33:54 PM
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Thanks for all the comments so far. I can tell you the seller is taking them seriously into consideration. He seems a little nervous about this, to be honest with you. Here is version 3.0 of the contract. I'm calling version 1.0 the simple soul for $10, and version 2.0 what I originally posted.
About the lawyer, nah. I'm actually having dinner with two lawyers later this evening, but am not sure they have the sense of humor for this. I'll take a printout in my pocket and play it by ear.
There are obviously all kinds of possible contingencies. We'll have to go to the Man in the Sky, I guess, if the contract proves vague. Personally, I would prefer to keep it as simple as possible. Like the contract Homer signed with the devil (played magnificently by Ned Flanders), in which he sold his soul for a donut. Short and to the point.
Also, the seller has requested to sign the contact with a drop of blood, lest I be able to embarrass him with this in the future. Something like this coming out might hurt one's chances to run for high office. I agreed.
By the way, I looked up Xenu. Seems he is a deity of Scientology. Where did they come up with this stuff? I hope that if there is an afterlife Xena Warrior Princess has a place in it.
Quote: Soul contract version 3.0
As of the ___ day of ______________, in the Christian year ____________, I _________________, hereby sell my soul to Michael Shackleford for the sum of $10, subject to the following terms and conditions:
- This document covers the soul in all possible forms and ideations, covered by any human religion, including those religions that believe there is no soul, with the following exceptions:
a. The soul as conceived of by the evil overlord Xenu.
b. The soul as conceived of by the native Umbumbu peoples of Krakatoa.
c. The soul as conceived of by all incarnations of Buddha prior to his incarnation as “The Buddha.”
d. The soul, as sold on the open market by Francisco, in the year B.C.E. 42 in the small market in East Athens between the salt dealer and the donkey peddler.- The soul of ___________________ cannot be assigned, sold, given or left to any acquaintance, descendent or beneficiary of Michael Shackleford, the estate of Michael Shackleford or any trust in which Michael Shackleford is named. The soul of ______________ will remain the sole possession of Michael Shackleford, or transcendent variations and incarnations of his soul, exclusive of iconic demon variations beginning the 44-th Karmic lifetime, for the duration of this contract.
- This document is not to be communicated in any form, reproduced in any form, or disseminated in any form, without the explicit written permission of ____________________. Any such act constitutes a violation of the terms of this sale and immediately revokes the sale so that the soul of _________________ reverts to his possession.
- ___________________ will have the option of repurchasing his soul for the sum of $10 after the greater of one trillion human-years or one million trillion soul-years, but in no event can such sale occur before the human death of __________________ .
- If _______________ declines to repurchase his soul, this contract will continue in effect until the souls of Michael Shackleford and _____________ dissolve into quantum foam, at which time, given that time will cease to exist, this contract shall be deemed null and void.
About the lawyer, nah. I'm actually having dinner with two lawyers later this evening, but am not sure they have the sense of humor for this. I'll take a printout in my pocket and play it by ear.
There are obviously all kinds of possible contingencies. We'll have to go to the Man in the Sky, I guess, if the contract proves vague. Personally, I would prefer to keep it as simple as possible. Like the contract Homer signed with the devil (played magnificently by Ned Flanders), in which he sold his soul for a donut. Short and to the point.
Also, the seller has requested to sign the contact with a drop of blood, lest I be able to embarrass him with this in the future. Something like this coming out might hurt one's chances to run for high office. I agreed.
By the way, I looked up Xenu. Seems he is a deity of Scientology. Where did they come up with this stuff? I hope that if there is an afterlife Xena Warrior Princess has a place in it.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
November 21st, 2010 at 5:41:31 PM
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After you die, how will you maintain complete control of the contract, and prevent its dissemination and communication? You could destroy it on your deathbed, I suppose, but wouldn't that act in itself void the contract? But if you didn't do that, your family, or even worse, your lawyer, would get hold of it (though I would suppose any minion of Satan could serve as custodian of the contract, so a lawyer might be OK).
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality.---George Bernard Shaw
November 21st, 2010 at 5:42:47 PM
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I wasn't paying attention earlier, apparently: why would you offer someone else $10 for something you don't think exists? How is that possibly a good bet? In fact, given my lay understanding of legal theory, "something that doesn't exist" probably doesn't form sufficient consideration to execute a contract.
But for drafting purposes, replace all the blanks except the first with "The Seller", and say "_______________ (hereinafter known as "The Seller")" the first time. There are fewer blanks that way.
But for drafting purposes, replace all the blanks except the first with "The Seller", and say "_______________ (hereinafter known as "The Seller")" the first time. There are fewer blanks that way.
"In my own case, when it seemed to me after a long illness that death was close at hand, I found no little solace in playing constantly at dice."
-- Girolamo Cardano, 1563
November 21st, 2010 at 5:44:41 PM
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Quote: mkl654321After you die, how will you maintain complete control of the contract, and prevent its dissemination and communication?
I assume that I don't need to have physical possession of the contract for it to count. Kind of like how just because you can't produce a contract doesn't mean it is null and void. In my opinion, the essence of the contract is eternal.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
November 21st, 2010 at 5:47:51 PM
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Quote: MathExtremistI wasn't paying attention earlier, apparently: why would you offer someone else $10 for something you don't think exists? How is that possibly a good bet? In fact, given my lay understanding of legal theory, "something that doesn't exist" probably doesn't form sufficient consideration to execute a contract.
Here is how I roughly analyze this bet. Let's say there is a 1 in a million chance that there is a soul and none of the exceptions are met. Then I will have a slave in the afterlife for one million years. So for $10 my expected return is 1 year of indentured servitude. That sounds like a good bet to me.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
November 21st, 2010 at 5:49:48 PM
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Quote: WizardHere is how I roughly analyze this bet. Let's say there is a 1 in a million chance that there is a soul and none of the exceptions are met. Then I will have a slave in the afterlife for one million years. So for $10 my expected return is 1 year of indentured servitude. That sounds like a good bet to me.
I would buy JerryLogan's soul for maybe even $12 or $14 if that would be a possible outcome. I'd make him do girly things for all eternity (not to mention the French maid uniform).
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality.---George Bernard Shaw
November 21st, 2010 at 5:51:18 PM
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If you believe there's no god, how can you believe you have a soul? Because Mike is buying souls, does this make him the Devil?
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
November 21st, 2010 at 6:30:02 PM
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Can you imagine the awkwardness of someday having Him pass judgment on the validity of this contract?Quote: Wizard... There are obviously all kinds of possible contingencies. We'll have to go to the Man in the Sky, I guess, if the contract proves vague. ...
November 21st, 2010 at 8:17:38 PM
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Although the Wiz already gave the 'math' to show why it's a good bet, I would have classified it as "Getting the maximum value for the Earthly entertainment budget."Quote: MathExtremistI wasn't paying attention earlier, apparently: why would you offer someone else $10 for something you don't think exists? How is that possibly a good bet?
You're confusing the terms. Or are you thinking that "soul years" are rather short?Quote:___________________ will have the option of repurchasing his soul for the sum of $10 after the greater of one trillion human-years or one million trillion soul-years, but in no event can such sale occur before the human death of __________________ .
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
November 21st, 2010 at 9:15:47 PM
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Don't be buying up souls, Mike... just not a good market to get involved in.
-----
You want the truth! You can't handle the truth!
November 21st, 2010 at 9:19:15 PM
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Quote: boymimboDon't be buying up souls, Mike... just not a good market to get involved in.
Mike's from the Dark Side, he can't help it. His favorite book is Stephen King's 'Needful Things'..
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
November 21st, 2010 at 9:33:57 PM
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Why would there be a measurement of time (aka, a million years) in the afterlife? You mean we still have to count birthdays then?
I suppose we'll see another silly response from the know-it-all, who coincidentally when I asked how far out space goes and where/how does it end if it actually does, he came up with the fabulous "theory" of chaos claiming it ends in waves or circles or something stupid like that made up on the fly.
I suppose we'll see another silly response from the know-it-all, who coincidentally when I asked how far out space goes and where/how does it end if it actually does, he came up with the fabulous "theory" of chaos claiming it ends in waves or circles or something stupid like that made up on the fly.
November 21st, 2010 at 9:37:04 PM
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Quote: JerryLoganWhy would there be a measurement of time (aka, a million years) in the afterlife? You mean we still have to count birthdays then?
I suppose we'll see another silly response from the know-it-all, who coincidentally when I asked how far out space goes and where/how does it end if it actually does, he came up with the fabulous "theory" of chaos claiming it ends in waves or circles or something stupid like that made up on the fly.
The ignorant often try to mask their ignorance by mocking others' knowledge.
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality.---George Bernard Shaw
November 21st, 2010 at 9:45:20 PM
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Quote: JerryLoganwho coincidentally when I asked how far out space goes and where/how does it end
Thats a no brainer, it ends in the same place the line ends that you draw on a Mobius Strip.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
November 21st, 2010 at 9:48:04 PM
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Quote: EvenBobThats a no brainer, it ends in the same place the line ends that you draw on a Mobius Strip.
Oddly enough, Bob, you've actually stumbled on something akin to the right answer, not that JL could ever possibly understand it.
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality.---George Bernard Shaw
November 21st, 2010 at 10:02:28 PM
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Quote: mkl654321Oddly enough, Bob, you've actually stumbled .
I never stumble, and I sure don't need you to corroborate anything I say.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
November 21st, 2010 at 10:10:14 PM
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No, Bob, you can definately stumble, just like the rest of us, admit it or not. sometimes you get lucky.
Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes - Henry David Thoreau. Like Dealers' uniforms - Dan.
November 21st, 2010 at 10:12:19 PM
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Mike's contract - did he copy it from Scientology's one billion trillion year contract? ;)
Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes - Henry David Thoreau. Like Dealers' uniforms - Dan.
November 21st, 2010 at 10:12:43 PM
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Quote: EvenBobI never stumble, and I sure don't need you to corroborate anything I say.
Well, SOMEBODY needs to, given your track record; you've actually stumbled hundreds of times here, mostly from not carefully reading the posts you react to.
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality.---George Bernard Shaw
November 21st, 2010 at 10:14:08 PM
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Quote: PaigowdanNo, Bob, you can definately stumble.
Will Hunting likes to think he thought of everything and the rest of us just 'stumble' onto what he already knows. Sorry, Will, get over your bad self.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
November 21st, 2010 at 10:36:04 PM
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Quote: EvenBobWill Hunting likes to think he thought of everything and the rest of us just 'stumble' onto what he already knows. Sorry, Will, get over your bad self.
No, Bob. I said that YOU stumble. Confusing me with a fictional movie character is DEFINTELY a stumble. You also fumble and bumble.
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality.---George Bernard Shaw
November 21st, 2010 at 10:52:08 PM
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Quote: mkl654321Confusing me with a fictional movie character is DEFINTELY a stumble.
No, you said you have a 190 IQ, same ballpark as Will Hunting. I would think you'd be proud of the nickname, Will.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
November 21st, 2010 at 10:56:17 PM
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Quote: EvenBobNo, you said you have a 190 IQ, same ballpark as Will Hunting. I would think you'd be proud of the nickname, Will.
Will Hunting is not real. He doesn't exist, Bob. I'm not sure I can get you to understand that. Perhaps if you had a higher IQ...
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality.---George Bernard Shaw
November 22nd, 2010 at 4:31:08 AM
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Quote: mkl654321Oddly enough, Bob, you've actually stumbled on something akin to the right answer, not that JL could ever possibly understand it.
Liberals never notice when they're being mocked because it happens so often (:
November 22nd, 2010 at 7:08:24 AM
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And to think I would have thought a soul would be worth more than a measily $10. LOL Well, just for reference, a "soul" was once auctioned off on Ebay for close to a million dollars before they pulled the auction.
I think that the atheist's desire to repurchase his "soul" in the contract is a fundamental contradiction to him/her being an atheist. Atheists should not believe in the afterlife and hence having or not having a soul is completely inconsequential. A die-hard atheist would make the bet. This person is clearly trying to hedge there bets in case they are wrong.
So what would a soul enslaved to Michael Shackelford be like? Would Michael make that soul do all his acturial work? Scrub his own soul's feet? Anyone remember the episode of the Simpsons when Bart sells his soul to Millhouse and the great scene when they're paddling boats and Bart just goes in a circle before he doesn't have a partner in the boat as Millhouse's soul and Bart's soul pass by.
I think that the atheist's desire to repurchase his "soul" in the contract is a fundamental contradiction to him/her being an atheist. Atheists should not believe in the afterlife and hence having or not having a soul is completely inconsequential. A die-hard atheist would make the bet. This person is clearly trying to hedge there bets in case they are wrong.
So what would a soul enslaved to Michael Shackelford be like? Would Michael make that soul do all his acturial work? Scrub his own soul's feet? Anyone remember the episode of the Simpsons when Bart sells his soul to Millhouse and the great scene when they're paddling boats and Bart just goes in a circle before he doesn't have a partner in the boat as Millhouse's soul and Bart's soul pass by.
November 22nd, 2010 at 7:38:43 AM
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Not necessarily.Quote: AsswhoopermcdaddyI think that the atheist's desire to repurchase his "soul" in the contract is a fundamental contradiction to him/her being an atheist. Atheists should not believe in the afterlife and hence having or not having a soul is completely inconsequential. A die-hard atheist would make the bet.
Souls, spirits and afterlife may exist even in "God" does not.
The belief in / evidence of ghosts is not tied to the belief in / evidence of God.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
November 22nd, 2010 at 10:26:42 AM
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As silly as this topic is, I've been giving this a lot of serious thought.
I don't think a contract for a sale should have a buy-back clause. On the contrary. Most sales contracts that have a buy-back (or refund) clause put it as a short time limit from the purchase date that the clause is active, not a long time delay before the clause can be invoked.
It seems to me that this contract should be more of a rental contract, with the $10 being a security deposit. It should be stipulated that there be no random or scheduled inspection, and that maximum damages that can be claimed should you mishandle the soul to be the $10 security - cause you know you're gonna beat the crap out of that soul while its in your possession.
I don't think a contract for a sale should have a buy-back clause. On the contrary. Most sales contracts that have a buy-back (or refund) clause put it as a short time limit from the purchase date that the clause is active, not a long time delay before the clause can be invoked.
It seems to me that this contract should be more of a rental contract, with the $10 being a security deposit. It should be stipulated that there be no random or scheduled inspection, and that maximum damages that can be claimed should you mishandle the soul to be the $10 security - cause you know you're gonna beat the crap out of that soul while its in your possession.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
November 23rd, 2010 at 4:33:57 PM
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The deal is starting to fall through. There was a version 4.0 I never posted, and now the following 5.0, which I'm told is the final offer. The seller complained when I posted the whole contract, so hopefully he won't object to just the sticking point, clause 8.
Here is a link to a larger image.
So if I accidentally mention the name of the buyer, perhaps if any of you ask about this in person, then the buyer will have my soul. It will be like the Sword of Damocles hanging over my head. I've asked for another penalty but Mr. Seller is holding firm. I have not paid the $10 yet, so the ball is in my court. What do you think I should do?
Here is a link to a larger image.
So if I accidentally mention the name of the buyer, perhaps if any of you ask about this in person, then the buyer will have my soul. It will be like the Sword of Damocles hanging over my head. I've asked for another penalty but Mr. Seller is holding firm. I have not paid the $10 yet, so the ball is in my court. What do you think I should do?
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
November 23rd, 2010 at 5:16:26 PM
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Quote: WizardWhat bothers me is term 8. If I accidentally mention the name of the buyer, perhaps if any of you ask about this in person, then the buyer will have my soul. It will be like the Sword of Damocles hanging over my head. I've asked for another penalty but Mr. Seller is holding firm. I have not paid the $10 yet, so the ball is in my court. What do you think I should do?
That's a ridiculous clause. It's like saying "I'll sell you my house for $250,000, but if the deal falls through then I get *your* house." Mr. Seller has fully reneged on the deal and is just looking for a way to save face. You may as well give it to him.
Also, that last clause has already been violated. It doesn't say that *you* can't communicate or disseminate the SELLER's identity. It just says that his name can't be communicated during his lifetime, which has obviously already happened (e.g. his birth certificate.) My knowledge of contract law is thin, but I'm not sure that clause is even enforceable.
"In my own case, when it seemed to me after a long illness that death was close at hand, I found no little solace in playing constantly at dice."
-- Girolamo Cardano, 1563
November 23rd, 2010 at 5:38:24 PM
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I know who you are now!
Donald Trump!
Only Trump would have the chutzpah to offer only 10 bucks for the immortal soul.
(also, I like the burned contract image -- once you get the deal, you need to put a java app of an active burning flame behind it)
Donald Trump!
Only Trump would have the chutzpah to offer only 10 bucks for the immortal soul.
(also, I like the burned contract image -- once you get the deal, you need to put a java app of an active burning flame behind it)
There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.
November 23rd, 2010 at 5:41:06 PM
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Also, Trump probably is the devil, or one of his regional managers
There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.
November 23rd, 2010 at 5:44:48 PM
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Quote: MathExtremistIt doesn't say that *you* can't communicate or disseminate the SELLER's identity. It just says that his name can't be communicated during his lifetime.
Indeed! All he needs to own your soul forever is to say out loud (or just post here) that he is the seller, named in the contract.
"When two people always agree one of them is unnecessary"
November 23rd, 2010 at 5:50:58 PM
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To pursue this line of thinking, are you suggesting that Trump might be one of the devil's regional managers, or that one of Trump's regional managers is the devil, i.e., The Devil holds a subservient position to The Donald?Quote: rxwineAlso, Trump probably is the devil, or one of his regional managers
November 23rd, 2010 at 7:22:28 PM
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I've said it before and I'll say it again: As silly as this whole thing is, it has generated a lot of serious thought....
Some more serious introspective thinking on my part has brought me to this point:
Define "soul"
Some more serious introspective thinking on my part has brought me to this point:
Define "soul"
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
November 23rd, 2010 at 7:24:13 PM
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That's too much of a penalty for revealing, perhaps inadvertently, the seller's identity. The most that should happen in that case is that you have to refund the $10, and the deal's off.
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality.---George Bernard Shaw
November 23rd, 2010 at 7:27:11 PM
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Quote: DocTo pursue this line of thinking, are you suggesting that Trump might be one of the devil's regional managers, or that one of Trump's regional managers is the devil, i.e., The Devil holds a subservient position to The Donald?
You're fired!
(fire)d <---see fire.
I'm not sure where he is in the hierarchy.
There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.
