Income Tax Approvals
Thread Rating:
Somebody please take the idea, modify it, and run with it. In this electronic age it should be no big deal to do and it will eliminate the friggin' spin that our wonderful politicians have to put on everything rather than just tell us the truth.
Quote: steeldcoI'd like to suggest that a citizens' board is established that would approve any income tax changes proposed. Let's get individuals and families, at $5,000 increments in income, to have their tax returns adjusted by whatever changes are proposed by the Congress so they can see how it impacts them and let them vote on it. You'd have a couple of hundred tax payers spread across many layers of income giving a thumbs up, or a thumbs down, to any tax changes.
Somebody please take the idea, modify it, and run with it. In this electronic age it should be no big deal to do and it will eliminate the friggin' spin that our wonderful politicians have to put on everything rather than just tell us the truth.
So who is going to vote for anything that increases their taxes? That has always been the issue, everyone wants everyone else to pay more, just not themselves. And this spans all levels of income.
Quote: BozSo who is going to vote for anything that increases their taxes? That has always been the issue, everyone wants everyone else to pay more, just not themselves. And this spans all levels of income.
A couple of comments:
I don't think that the vote needs to be binding.
It will eliminate the semantics and spin out of the politicians. It will be a true representation of impact.
Quote: BozSo who is going to vote for anything that increases their taxes? That has always been the issue, everyone wants everyone else to pay more, just not themselves. And this spans all levels of income.
That depends on what the money does, doesn't it? I'd pay an extra $XX/yr in taxes if it would go to road improvements that cut my commute by a few minutes/day, increased the lifespan of my car, improved my fuel economy by keeping traffic moving, etc., etc., etc.
1. If the Democrats wrote the bill, only a bill where everybody below the median point of the board members' income paid zero, and the balance came from the top 1% would get approved.
2. If the Republicans wrote the bill, no one with an income above the median point of the board would pay a higher rate than the highest rate of anybody with an income below the median point of the board.
Quote: ThatDonGuyI have a feeling one of two things would happen:
1. If the Democrats wrote the bill, only a bill where everybody below the median point of the board members' income paid zero, and the balance came from the top 1% would get approved.
2. If the Republicans wrote the bill, no one with an income above the median point of the board would pay a higher rate than the highest rate of anybody with an income below the median point of the board.
Again, the vote would not need to be binding. It would supply a much more transparent view of the impact of any change in taxes.
Let's have an educated populace, and not one that politicians feel needs to be lied to.
Let's get a couple of ground rules.
Do you agree or disagree that anyone living below the poverty line shouldn't be asked to pay additional taxes?
Do you agree or disagree that the people with the most disposable income are the ones who can most easily afford to pay additional taxes?
Do you agree or disagree that income derived from labor should be taxed higher than income derived from investment?
If a business pays some of its employees off the books, and is caught, should the owner go to jail?
Quote: billryanSo you want a group of people to represent the rest of us to work on a tax plan that our representatives come up with?
Let's get a couple of ground rules.
Do you agree or disagree that anyone living below the poverty line shouldn't be asked to pay additional taxes?
Do you agree or disagree that the people with the most disposable income are the ones who can most easily afford to pay additional taxes?
Do you agree or disagree that income derived from labor should be taxed higher than income derived from investment?
If a business pays some of its employees off the books, and is caught, should the owner go to jail?
Wow. biilryan, I'm going to call for the KISS principle to be applied here. No paralysis through analysis, or minutiae.
Give people a chance to see first hand what a change would mean to them.
Any company with a tax software product, such as TurboTax, should look into a way to market and monetize this.
Quote: steeldcoAs a matter of fact, now that I think about it, Quicken should incorporate a kind of "new tax law impact" into their software so that anyone using it can see how their tax situation would be impacted with any proposed changes. Give people the data with which to support, or not support, their elected politicians.
I thought Quicken only did loans and whatnot. But assuming they do tax software or do taxes for you (like TurboTax and that other place I always forget the name of).......
For one, it seems like people who would use these services are likely not making as much as those who have their own accountants. I'm not sure if that's true or not, but it definitely seems likely to me. If that's the case, then you'd only be polling people from that demographic.
I also think by and large, people would choose the system where they are taxed less and put the burden on someone else. Sure, I'd be willing to pay an extra $X/year in taxes for services X, Y, and Z to be improved or implemented, but I'd rather someone else pay that amount than me (I?).
Quote: steeldcoWow. biilryan, I'm going to call for the KISS principle to be applied here. No paralysis through analysis, or minutiae.
Give people a chance to see first hand what a change would mean to them.
Any company with a tax software product, such as TurboTax, should look into a way to market and monetize this.
I don't consider that minutia. Trying to get more, or any tax, out of people in poverty should be a non starter.
Get the portion of the economy that is paid off the books onto the tax rolls and Everyone else has less of a burden.
Quote: billryanI don't consider that minutia. Trying to get more, or any tax, out of people in poverty should be a non starter.
Get the portion of the economy that is paid off the books onto the tax rolls and Everyone else has less of a burden.
You hit on a huge problem out there with people working under the table. It hurts the employee so much more than they know unless they are doing it while still collecting UC or other benefits. No employer matching SS taxes, no Workmans Comp and so many more things that they are missing out on to save a few dollars.
YES, employers should be at risk of jail time for doing it. And the employee should also have a liability, including potential jail time if he or she is also collecting benefits.
Others feel a National Sales Tax would get some of that money back but liberals always cry it hurts the so called "poor" because its an equal tax for everyone. The question is who truly is in "poverty"? The guy working a cash job, yet still collecting benefits because he is now in "poverty". Or how about the small business owner who doesn't report his true income? Is he in "poverty"? His tax return says he is.
It's not an easy problem to solve.
Quote: billryanI don't consider that minutia. Trying to get more, or any tax, out of people in poverty should be a non starter.
Get the portion of the economy that is paid off the books onto the tax rolls and Everyone else has less of a burden.
I wonder if "people in poverty" might include people paid off the books? F@(# it...just tax the "rich" whatever that term means...
Quote: BozYou hit on a huge problem out there with people working under the table. It hurts the employee so much more than they know unless they are doing it while still collecting UC or other benefits. No employer matching SS taxes, no Workmans Comp and so many more things that they are missing out on to save a few dollars.
YES, employers should be at risk of jail time for doing it. And the employee should also have a liability, including potential jail time if he or she is also collecting benefits.
Others feel a National Sales Tax would get some of that money back but liberals always cry it hurts the so called "poor" because its an equal tax for everyone. The question is who truly is in "poverty"? The guy working a cash job, yet still collecting benefits because he is now in "poverty". Or how about the small business owner who doesn't report his true income? Is he in "poverty"? His tax return says he is.
It's not an easy problem to solve.
Anyone collecting government benefits they aren't entitled to while working off the books should face jail time. Repeat offenders ,prison time. Employers who employ large numbers of off the books people should face prison time. As should big time tax evaders. The country doesn't have a spending problem, it has an inability to collect the proper taxes problem, thanks to a vocal minority who thinks the IRS is the enemy and has done everything they can to gut its ability to chase down money that is rightfully owed.
Quote: BozSo who is going to vote for anything that increases their taxes? That has always been the issue, everyone wants everyone else to pay more, just not themselves. And this spans all levels of income.
Same issue with infrastructure. Why should I pay for that bridge??? I only drive on it every day and purchase products trucked back and forth on it.
Quote: billryanI don't consider that minutia. Trying to get more, or any tax, out of people in poverty should be a non starter.
Get the portion of the economy that is paid off the books onto the tax rolls and Everyone else has less of a burden.
billryan, with all due respect, you are missing the point here. I propose that we actually give people a tool so that they are better informed and offer an opinion. Nothing more.
Quote: RSI thought Quicken only did loans and whatnot. But assuming they do tax software or do taxes for you (like TurboTax and that other place I always forget the name of).......
For one, it seems like people who would use these services are likely not making as much as those who have their own accountants. I'm not sure if that's true or not, but it definitely seems likely to me. If that's the case, then you'd only be polling people from that demographic.
I also think by and large, people would choose the system where they are taxed less and put the burden on someone else. Sure, I'd be willing to pay an extra $X/year in taxes for services X, Y, and Z to be improved or implemented, but I'd rather someone else pay that amount than me (I?).
RS, Quicken, QuickBooks, TurboTax, and other software are all owned by Intuit. Professional accountants also use tax software of which there are different varieties.
I think people will choose to know the truth, more so than be lied to. Nobody wants to be told that tax change will save them $100 only to find out later that they actually have to pay $500 more than they were paying before reform.
Quote: steeldcobillryan, with all due respect, you are missing the point here. I propose that we actually give people a tool so that they are better informed and offer an opinion. Nothing more.
Who is going to pay to develop such a useful tool?
Quote: ParadigmWho is going to pay to develop such a useful tool?
I think it just may be a nice addition to existing tax software. I don't think that the coding would be too difficult to include a "what if" tax return based upon proposed changes. You've already entered all of your tax information.
Quote: ParadigmIt is ridiculously complex software to be able to handle every possible tax situation that can be input. It would cost a ton and be revised on every version of proposed bills...never going to happen.
Well, we'll have to disagree. Let's see if someone comes up with it.................
Quote: billryanWho would trust it? It would be nothing but an estimate. Until the bill passes and is signed, it would always be subject to reconciliation and edits.
A good group of coders can modify software at a fraction of the time that it takes the numbskulls in Washington DC to propose tax law changes.
