Trump's Final 100 days
June 2nd, 2017 at 8:55:26 AM
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Sick of it.
Nothing is beyond that moronic narcissistic lying bully boy. Except winning.
He can score points but each one comes at a yet greater cost to humanity.
He's still got assassinations and war mongering in his armoury. Indeed he pretty much promised those on the campaign trail so promises yet to fulfil and points still to be scored. And Putin's still got his back and we know that he has no inhibitions and no fear of consequences.
It will get worse before it gets better. We are not there yet.
Nothing is beyond that moronic narcissistic lying bully boy. Except winning.
He can score points but each one comes at a yet greater cost to humanity.
He's still got assassinations and war mongering in his armoury. Indeed he pretty much promised those on the campaign trail so promises yet to fulfil and points still to be scored. And Putin's still got his back and we know that he has no inhibitions and no fear of consequences.
It will get worse before it gets better. We are not there yet.
Psalm 25:16
Turn to me and be gracious to me, for I am lonely and afflicted.
Proverbs 18:2
A fool finds no satisfaction in trying to understand, for he would rather express his own opinion.
June 2nd, 2017 at 10:19:02 AM
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Should be interesting in 10-20 years when Mar-a-Lago becomes the Castle Under the Sea.
The Paris accords were voluntary by each country. No accountability to other signatories. No penalties for missing targets. Just a good - faith effort by each.
325 million people (~4% of population) responsible for 21% of carbon emissions. Now refusing to be responsible citizens for purely political reasons.
Just stupid. Not even ignorance is a useful excuse. Stupid is as stupid does.
The Paris accords were voluntary by each country. No accountability to other signatories. No penalties for missing targets. Just a good - faith effort by each.
325 million people (~4% of population) responsible for 21% of carbon emissions. Now refusing to be responsible citizens for purely political reasons.
Just stupid. Not even ignorance is a useful excuse. Stupid is as stupid does.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
June 2nd, 2017 at 10:40:50 AM
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Quote: MaxPenKathy Griffin doubling down on stupid.
https://mobile.twitter.com/LisaBloom/status/870433580664725504
They roll Lisa Bloom out there when her mother is too busy dying of old age. I wonder what happened to those 2 to hate men as much as Lisa & Gloria do.
June 2nd, 2017 at 10:44:30 AM
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Quote: ams288And yet, the righties were NEVER satisfied with the jobs numbers under Obama. They would always complain about how the job growth was too slow.
But somehow, this year's slightly worse numbers are evidence that Donald is doing a great job.
Makes no sense. Pure hypocrisy from the righties, as usual.
I think we discussed this before but on either side, these numbers are a joke. Anyone who wants to be working, is working. It may not be the job you want or the money you want, but work is out there. I still believe that many of the unemployed or unemployable or simply don't want to work. Some of them don't show up as unemployed because they stopped looking and ran out of UC benefits, but they are either working off the books, or collecting other government benefits.
June 2nd, 2017 at 10:49:56 AM
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Quote: beachbumbabsShould be interesting in 10-20 years when Mar-a-Lago becomes the Castle Under the Sea.
The Paris accords were voluntary by each country. No accountability to other signatories. No penalties for missing targets. Just a good - faith effort by each.
325 million people (~4% of population) responsible for 21% of carbon emissions. Now refusing to be responsible citizens for purely political reasons.
Just stupid. Not even ignorance is a useful excuse. Stupid is as stupid does.
You honestly don't believe that the Florida Coast will be under water in 20 years? And what exactly are we going to do as part of this agreement that would have changed that? What were we going to do that independent business owners cant do on their own IF they feel there is money in "clean" energy? Everyone loves clean energy until it costs them more to live their lives. And there is nothing to show that we can do this cheaper.
June 2nd, 2017 at 12:02:59 PM
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I disagree with President Trump's decision on the Paris Accords (the Accords themselves probably will end up working as well as the Kyoto treaty, which didn't work at all, but that's another topic for another day).
That said, the overheated reaction (pun of course intended), borders on the irrational. Especially since some of the most emotional and vitriolic writings make one wonder if the authors knew what they were saying.
Take "Trump's Stupid and Reckless Climate Decision", a New York Times op-ed piece written by one Bill McKibben, identified as someone who teaches environmental studies at Middlebury College. Mr. McKibben makes it clear he would like Trump drawn and quartered over this decision, and calls for resistance, whatever that might entail.
But buried deep in his screed is a surprising admission. The changes agreed to by all nations under the Paris agreement won't stop global warming, because they're too small. So we're getting all worked up over something that won't work to begin with? By the way, if Mar-a-Lago is to go under within the next 2 decades, the Paris Accords would not stop it, whether the U.S. was in or out.
Second, he points out that the U.S. is well on its way to meeting its obligations because of A) the shift away from coal for generating electricity and B) higher mileage requirements for cars.
The shift away from coal began well before the Paris Accords. With the advent of horizontal hydraulic fracking early this decade, natural gas plummeted in price and it became far cheaper to use gas to generate electricity. Here in Ohio, the cost to consumers for electricity is down about 25% per kilowatt hour over the last 3 years or so. Happily, natural gas is cleaner than coal, too.
Did you read anything online today about utilities going back to coal? No, and you won't next week, next month or next year. You will see more coal fired plants go offline to be replaced or retrofitted with cleaner and cheaper natural gas. So Trump or no Trump, Paris Accords or no Paris Accords, we will continue to cut emissions, and consumers will benefit from less expensive electric power. It's simple economics, not anything to do with dictates under the Paris Accords.
Likewise, higher mileage cars are coming. Maybe not as fast as President Obama wanted, but they're coming. Elon Musk will see to it.
Emissions of C02 from this country will continue to be reduced. It's clear that nothing that was said or done on June 1 will change that. Whether our reductions and those of other countries will do any good is an entirely different question, and even the most fervent supporters of the Paris Accords, Mr. McKibbon front and center among them, think they probably won't.
So let's just take a deep breath. And cool it.
That said, the overheated reaction (pun of course intended), borders on the irrational. Especially since some of the most emotional and vitriolic writings make one wonder if the authors knew what they were saying.
Take "Trump's Stupid and Reckless Climate Decision", a New York Times op-ed piece written by one Bill McKibben, identified as someone who teaches environmental studies at Middlebury College. Mr. McKibben makes it clear he would like Trump drawn and quartered over this decision, and calls for resistance, whatever that might entail.
But buried deep in his screed is a surprising admission. The changes agreed to by all nations under the Paris agreement won't stop global warming, because they're too small. So we're getting all worked up over something that won't work to begin with? By the way, if Mar-a-Lago is to go under within the next 2 decades, the Paris Accords would not stop it, whether the U.S. was in or out.
Second, he points out that the U.S. is well on its way to meeting its obligations because of A) the shift away from coal for generating electricity and B) higher mileage requirements for cars.
The shift away from coal began well before the Paris Accords. With the advent of horizontal hydraulic fracking early this decade, natural gas plummeted in price and it became far cheaper to use gas to generate electricity. Here in Ohio, the cost to consumers for electricity is down about 25% per kilowatt hour over the last 3 years or so. Happily, natural gas is cleaner than coal, too.
Did you read anything online today about utilities going back to coal? No, and you won't next week, next month or next year. You will see more coal fired plants go offline to be replaced or retrofitted with cleaner and cheaper natural gas. So Trump or no Trump, Paris Accords or no Paris Accords, we will continue to cut emissions, and consumers will benefit from less expensive electric power. It's simple economics, not anything to do with dictates under the Paris Accords.
Likewise, higher mileage cars are coming. Maybe not as fast as President Obama wanted, but they're coming. Elon Musk will see to it.
Emissions of C02 from this country will continue to be reduced. It's clear that nothing that was said or done on June 1 will change that. Whether our reductions and those of other countries will do any good is an entirely different question, and even the most fervent supporters of the Paris Accords, Mr. McKibbon front and center among them, think they probably won't.
So let's just take a deep breath. And cool it.
Last edited by: iamnomad on Jun 2, 2017
June 2nd, 2017 at 12:03:25 PM
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WASHINGTON (AP) — Announcing that the U.S. will withdraw from the Paris climate accord, President Donald Trump misplaced the blame for what ails the coal industry and laid a shaky factual foundation for his decision. A look at some of the claims in a Rose Garden speech and an accompanying fact sheet about the deal to curtail emissions responsible for global warming:
WHITE HOUSE: The Paris climate accord "would effectively decapitate our coal industry, which now supplies about one-third of our electric power."
THE FACTS: The U.S. coal industry was in decline long before the Paris accord was signed in 2015. The primary cause has been competition from cleaner-burning natural gas, which has been made cheaper and more abundant by hydraulic fracturing. Electric utilities have been replacing coal plants with gas-fired facilities because they are more efficient and less expensive to operate.
___
TRUMP: Claims "absolutely tremendous economic progress since Election Day," adding "more than a million private-sector jobs."
THE FACTS: That's basically right, but he earns no credit for jobs created in the months before he became president. To rack up that number, the president had to reach back to October. Even then, private-sector job creation from October through April (171,000 private-sector jobs a month) lags just slightly behind the pace of job creation for the previous six months (172,000), entirely under President Barack Obama.
___
TRUMP: "I was elected to represent the citizens of Pittsburgh, not Paris."
THE FACTS: That may be so, but Allegheny County, which includes Pittsburgh, is not Trump country. It voted overwhelmingly for Hillary Clinton in November, favoring her by a margin of 56 percent to Trump's 40 percent. The city has a climate action plan committing to boost the use of renewable energy. Pittsburgh Mayor Bill Peduto, a Democrat, has been an outspoken supporter of the Paris accord, and tweeted after Trump's announcement that "as the Mayor of Pittsburgh, I can assure you that we will follow the guidelines of the Paris Agreement for our people, our economy & future."
___
WHITE HOUSE: "According to a study by NERA Consulting, meeting the Obama administration's requirements in the Paris Accord would cost the U.S. economy nearly $3 trillion over the next several decades. By 2040, our economy would lose 6.5 million industrial sector jobs — including 3.1 million manufacturing sector jobs."
THE FACTS: This study was paid for by two groups that have long opposed environmental regulation, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce and the American Council for Capital Formation. Both get financial backing from those who profit from the continued burning of fossil fuels. The latter group has received money from foundations controlled by the Koch brothers, whose company owns refineries and more than 4,000 miles of oil and gas pipelines.
The study makes worst-case assumptions that may inflate the cost of meeting U.S. targets under the Paris accord while largely ignoring the economic benefits to U.S. businesses from building and operating renewable energy projects.
Academic studies have found that increased environmental regulation doesn't actually have much impact on employment. Jobs lost at polluting companies tend to be offset by new jobs in green technology.
___
WHITE HOUSE, citing a study from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology: "If all member nations met their obligations, the impact on the climate would be negligible," curbing temperature rise by "less than .2 degrees Celsius in 2100."
THE FACTS: The co-founder of the MIT program on climate change says the administration is citing an outdated report, taken out of context. Jake Jacoby said the actual global impact of meeting targets under the Paris accord would be to curb rising temperatures by 1 degree Celsius, or 1.8 degrees Fahrenheit.
"They found a number that made the point they want to make," Jacoby said. "It's kind of a debate trick."
One degree may not sound like much, but Stefan Rahmstorf, a climate scientist at the Potsdam Institute in Germany, says, "Every tenth of a degree increases the number of unprecedented extreme weather events considerably."
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I'm still waiting for anyone to point out the good points our noble ,fearless ,magnetic leader touched on in a speech filled with utter nonsense.
WHITE HOUSE: The Paris climate accord "would effectively decapitate our coal industry, which now supplies about one-third of our electric power."
THE FACTS: The U.S. coal industry was in decline long before the Paris accord was signed in 2015. The primary cause has been competition from cleaner-burning natural gas, which has been made cheaper and more abundant by hydraulic fracturing. Electric utilities have been replacing coal plants with gas-fired facilities because they are more efficient and less expensive to operate.
___
TRUMP: Claims "absolutely tremendous economic progress since Election Day," adding "more than a million private-sector jobs."
THE FACTS: That's basically right, but he earns no credit for jobs created in the months before he became president. To rack up that number, the president had to reach back to October. Even then, private-sector job creation from October through April (171,000 private-sector jobs a month) lags just slightly behind the pace of job creation for the previous six months (172,000), entirely under President Barack Obama.
___
TRUMP: "I was elected to represent the citizens of Pittsburgh, not Paris."
THE FACTS: That may be so, but Allegheny County, which includes Pittsburgh, is not Trump country. It voted overwhelmingly for Hillary Clinton in November, favoring her by a margin of 56 percent to Trump's 40 percent. The city has a climate action plan committing to boost the use of renewable energy. Pittsburgh Mayor Bill Peduto, a Democrat, has been an outspoken supporter of the Paris accord, and tweeted after Trump's announcement that "as the Mayor of Pittsburgh, I can assure you that we will follow the guidelines of the Paris Agreement for our people, our economy & future."
___
WHITE HOUSE: "According to a study by NERA Consulting, meeting the Obama administration's requirements in the Paris Accord would cost the U.S. economy nearly $3 trillion over the next several decades. By 2040, our economy would lose 6.5 million industrial sector jobs — including 3.1 million manufacturing sector jobs."
THE FACTS: This study was paid for by two groups that have long opposed environmental regulation, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce and the American Council for Capital Formation. Both get financial backing from those who profit from the continued burning of fossil fuels. The latter group has received money from foundations controlled by the Koch brothers, whose company owns refineries and more than 4,000 miles of oil and gas pipelines.
The study makes worst-case assumptions that may inflate the cost of meeting U.S. targets under the Paris accord while largely ignoring the economic benefits to U.S. businesses from building and operating renewable energy projects.
Academic studies have found that increased environmental regulation doesn't actually have much impact on employment. Jobs lost at polluting companies tend to be offset by new jobs in green technology.
___
WHITE HOUSE, citing a study from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology: "If all member nations met their obligations, the impact on the climate would be negligible," curbing temperature rise by "less than .2 degrees Celsius in 2100."
THE FACTS: The co-founder of the MIT program on climate change says the administration is citing an outdated report, taken out of context. Jake Jacoby said the actual global impact of meeting targets under the Paris accord would be to curb rising temperatures by 1 degree Celsius, or 1.8 degrees Fahrenheit.
"They found a number that made the point they want to make," Jacoby said. "It's kind of a debate trick."
One degree may not sound like much, but Stefan Rahmstorf, a climate scientist at the Potsdam Institute in Germany, says, "Every tenth of a degree increases the number of unprecedented extreme weather events considerably."
___
I'm still waiting for anyone to point out the good points our noble ,fearless ,magnetic leader touched on in a speech filled with utter nonsense.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
June 2nd, 2017 at 12:05:26 PM
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Quote: OnceDearSick of it.
Nothing is beyond that moronic narcissistic lying bully boy. Except winning.
He can score points but each one comes at a yet greater cost to humanity.
He's still got assassinations and war mongering in his armoury. Indeed he pretty much promised those on the campaign trail so promises yet to fulfil and points still to be scored. And Putin's still got his back and we know that he has no inhibitions and no fear of consequences.
It will get worse before it gets better. We are not there yet.
Excerpt from NY Times' Donald Trump Poisons the World by David Brooks.
This essay explains why Trump gravitates toward leaders like Vladimir Putin, the Saudi princes and various global strongmen: They share his core worldview that life is nakedly a selfish struggle for money and dominance.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/02/opinion/donald-trump-poisons-the-world.html?_r=0
June 2nd, 2017 at 12:06:04 PM
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Quote: BozYou honestly don't believe that the Florida Coast will be under water in 20 years? And what exactly are we going to do as part of this agreement that would have changed that? What were we going to do that independent business owners cant do on their own IF they feel there is money in "clean" energy? Everyone loves clean energy until it costs them more to live their lives. And there is nothing to show that we can do this cheaper.
The accords were designed as a starting point that everyone could agree on. There needed to be further action in a few years to actually reverse the trend.
And, yeah, there are a lot of homes here threatened already by higher seas, even on normal sunny days. The sea is already enough higher in the last 20 years of warming that high tide is washing the foundations out and flooding some streets.
Every 10th of a degree in warming loosens yet more ice. (I don't know the proportions in how that translates to sea level rise in inches; not sure anyone does with certainty ) But they estimate 2 degrees Celsius is enough to flood most of the Florida coast. That amount of warming also translates to increased number and severity of hurricanes, which is a huge concern here.
One of the strongest indications of the likely impact is that most if not all of the big insurers refuse to insure homes on any coastlines and well into the mainland. Our only option is a state run insurance pool, for about the last 10 years. State Farm for example refused to insure my house bought in 2010, even though I'd been their solid multi-policy customer for 35 years, and still had homeowners on my old place. They don't want the long-term widespread exposure. And it's more than 5 miles inland.
All those hundreds of millions of dollars offered in business, and they're all just walking away.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
June 2nd, 2017 at 12:23:43 PM
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I could have guessed that.Quote: ams288I love Kathy Griffin, but even I rolled my eyes when I saw that press release.
Since Boz liked your post, does he Love Kathy too?
If so, I'm a bit more perplexed.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
June 2nd, 2017 at 1:20:24 PM
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Quote: BozWhat were we going to do that independent business owners cant do on their own
Why would you hurt your bottom line while trying to compete with a similar business?
If you don't put everyone in the same boat together, you confer advantages to those who don't bother.
There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.
June 2nd, 2017 at 1:29:36 PM
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Quote: beachbumbabs
And, yeah, there are a lot of homes here threatened already by higher seas, even on normal sunny days. The sea is already enough higher in the last 20 years of warming that high tide is washing the foundations out and flooding some streets.
Trump seems to be worried about one of his golf courses.
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/05/donald-trump-climate-change-golf-course-223436
Quote:Donald Trump says he is “not a big believer in global warming.” He has called it “a total hoax,” “bullshit” and “pseudoscience.”
But he is also trying to build a sea wall designed to protect one of his golf courses from “global warming and its effects.”
June 2nd, 2017 at 3:49:44 PM
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Eisenhower rolled out the highway systems in the 1950s with a tremendous investment which brought about the prosperity of the United States.
Money is where it is because markets are regulated. If the US didn't have any barriers to trade, all of our work that could be offshored would have been offshored. And if I have to pay more for clean energy I am fine with monetizing the value of pollution. We already monetize pretty much everything else. Independent business owners would likely just burn their trash because it's a hell of a lot cheaper than paying for garbage services. Restaurants wouldn't bother with cleanliness standards and provide washrooms to customers because it takes up space and it's free for customers to just pee outside.
I'm providing a ridiculous argument. My point is that business owners have one concern which is profit and sometimes you have to provide regulation to do what is best for society.
In the end, the cost of a hotter planet will seriously outweigh any efforts we do today to prevent that from happening. Monetizing carbon worldwide and pushing the world to clean energy makes sense for the longevity of our species. And what can we do about it? Look at Texas, whose wind farms produce more electricity than its two nuclear reactors.
Trump's decision was not unexpected. He delivered to his electorate, choosing what most government officials do -- cater to their voters and do what's good now and not worry about the future. Trump will be alive for perhaps another 20 - 30 years, probably just long enough to see the east Florida coast invest billions in seawalls to protect from rising sea levels that he could have stopped.
Money is where it is because markets are regulated. If the US didn't have any barriers to trade, all of our work that could be offshored would have been offshored. And if I have to pay more for clean energy I am fine with monetizing the value of pollution. We already monetize pretty much everything else. Independent business owners would likely just burn their trash because it's a hell of a lot cheaper than paying for garbage services. Restaurants wouldn't bother with cleanliness standards and provide washrooms to customers because it takes up space and it's free for customers to just pee outside.
I'm providing a ridiculous argument. My point is that business owners have one concern which is profit and sometimes you have to provide regulation to do what is best for society.
In the end, the cost of a hotter planet will seriously outweigh any efforts we do today to prevent that from happening. Monetizing carbon worldwide and pushing the world to clean energy makes sense for the longevity of our species. And what can we do about it? Look at Texas, whose wind farms produce more electricity than its two nuclear reactors.
Trump's decision was not unexpected. He delivered to his electorate, choosing what most government officials do -- cater to their voters and do what's good now and not worry about the future. Trump will be alive for perhaps another 20 - 30 years, probably just long enough to see the east Florida coast invest billions in seawalls to protect from rising sea levels that he could have stopped.
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You want the truth! You can't handle the truth!
June 2nd, 2017 at 10:14:38 PM
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Quote: billryanShow of hands.
Who is tired of all this winning ?
June 2nd, 2017 at 10:26:10 PM
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World leaders were duped out of billions of dollars by suspect data provided by NOAA. Trump is not easily duped. Another win for all.
June 2nd, 2017 at 10:32:29 PM
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At least we know how to combat global cooling.Quote: MaxPenWorld leaders were duped out of billions of dollars by suspect data provided by NOAA. Trump is not easily duped. Another win for all.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
June 3rd, 2017 at 1:09:06 AM
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Betting against climate scientists is about as smart as betting against any group of experts in a field of study. You might get lucky and be right but don't call yourself smart, unless you've got a similar background and know the research. You're acting like ploppies really .
Even Trump would probably acknowledge a person with little real estate knowledge betting against experience of many developers is a bad bet and not smart.
Same idea.
And oh yeah, there would never be 100 percent consensus, that's just unrealistic.
Even Trump would probably acknowledge a person with little real estate knowledge betting against experience of many developers is a bad bet and not smart.
Same idea.
And oh yeah, there would never be 100 percent consensus, that's just unrealistic.
There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.
June 3rd, 2017 at 1:38:58 AM
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I'm nearly 50 years old. For the past 30 years climate scientists have been warning me that there's only 5 years to react. Think about that for a minute.
The best was when those global warming scientists travelled to Antartica and got stuck for weeks in the ice on their research vessel. If nothing else it sure is entertaining.
The best was when those global warming scientists travelled to Antartica and got stuck for weeks in the ice on their research vessel. If nothing else it sure is entertaining.
Last edited by: MaxPen on Jun 3, 2017
June 3rd, 2017 at 4:29:56 AM
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Quote: MaxPen
The popular vote, son.
Ding Dong the Witch is Dead
June 3rd, 2017 at 5:46:51 AM
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Sometimes I think it's a sin
When I feel like I'm winnin' when I'm losin' again
G. Lightfoot.
When I feel like I'm winnin' when I'm losin' again
G. Lightfoot.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
June 3rd, 2017 at 7:49:42 AM
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Quote: ams288Quote: MaxPen
The popular vote, son.
The majority of voters voted for electors who represented Hillary. Trump won the majority of electors. Thank goodness for the Constitution, otherwise we would be like lemmings. Blame it on the Russians, yeah that's the ticket. It's like you're trying to argue that the loser of the SuperBowl won because they got more yards. Good luck with all that.
June 3rd, 2017 at 8:10:40 AM
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Since we are falling back to memes and comics to try and prove a point, this is a great read:
June 3rd, 2017 at 8:50:51 AM
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With something like climate change, I generally trust the experts, since I don't have the knowledge or skills to completely evaluate it myself.
You can look for logical incoherence in their positions, though you have to be very careful. It's extremely easy to manufacture this when you want it to be there. If you only believed things that were 100% logical, you wouldn't believe much beyond "if all cats are animals and Sylvester is a cat, Sylvester is an animal."
You can examine the legitimacy of their expertise, and it's power to to accurately make statements of that type. For example, economists have not proven to be very good at predicting the future of the economy.
You can look for ideological biases and so on.
For me, climate scientists pass all these tests fairly easily. Of course, their findings are not at the level of certainty of 2+2=4. But it also seems rather silly to believe they are all part of some big conspiracy because they are all secretly Marxists or something. They seem to be the most intelligent and skilled people working in the area, reaching the most plausible conclusions.
We won't stop what we're doing though, so hopefully either they are wrong or technological solutions come more quickly than expected.
You can look for logical incoherence in their positions, though you have to be very careful. It's extremely easy to manufacture this when you want it to be there. If you only believed things that were 100% logical, you wouldn't believe much beyond "if all cats are animals and Sylvester is a cat, Sylvester is an animal."
You can examine the legitimacy of their expertise, and it's power to to accurately make statements of that type. For example, economists have not proven to be very good at predicting the future of the economy.
You can look for ideological biases and so on.
For me, climate scientists pass all these tests fairly easily. Of course, their findings are not at the level of certainty of 2+2=4. But it also seems rather silly to believe they are all part of some big conspiracy because they are all secretly Marxists or something. They seem to be the most intelligent and skilled people working in the area, reaching the most plausible conclusions.
We won't stop what we're doing though, so hopefully either they are wrong or technological solutions come more quickly than expected.
June 3rd, 2017 at 9:08:43 AM
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Quote: ams288
You are correct that absolutely nothing would have gotten done under HRC. And the 2018 midterms would have been a bloodbath for Dems... but thanks to Trump, Dems will do much better than they would have in 2018 under Hillary. It's the silver lining in this mess, for me at least.
You are probably right. But if the economy and stock market are still vibrant and we are not at war it is possible the Repubs hang on to both houses. It would be fun to see a Repub Senate, Dem House, and Trump as prez for 2 years. Possible that not a single piece of legislation would be signed into law.
June 3rd, 2017 at 9:19:44 AM
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For the record, I don't mind a little bit of "global warming", as it's been too darn cold here in LV lately. Let's not fight the good, but embrace it.
That is, if it exists.
June 3rd, 2017 at 9:21:09 AM
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Sometimes natural changes happen quickly. One day you're a woolly mammoth grazing and the next your instantly frozen in ice with dinner still in your mouth.
June 3rd, 2017 at 10:06:18 AM
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Quote: SOOPOOYou are probably right. But if the economy and stock market are still vibrant and we are not at war it is possible the Repubs hang on to both houses. It would be fun to see a Repub Senate, Dem House, and Trump as prez for 2 years. Possible that not a single piece of legislation would be signed into law.
Maybe I missed something, but has Trump signed anything into law? He and his cronies celebrated the House passing the ACA as if they had won the Super bowl, only to discover it was barely even half-time.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
June 3rd, 2017 at 10:16:59 AM
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Quote: SOOPOOIt would be fun to see a Repub Senate, Dem House, and Trump as prez for 2 years. Possible that not a single piece of legislation would be signed into law.
Trump will immediately flip and side with whoever has the majority. Guarantee it. That's what he does. If Democrats somehow get control of the House AND the Senate, you will see Trump abandon the GOP in all but name within weeks, if not days. In that scenario, I would honestly not be surprised if Trump switched parties and ran as a Democrat in 2020. I don't think that's out of the realm of plausibility at all.
June 3rd, 2017 at 10:18:23 AM
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Quote: MaxPenQuote: ams288Quote: MaxPen
The popular vote, son.
The majority of voters voted for electors who represented Hillary.
I am thankful that you can admit that and didn't pull the idiotic "3-5 million people voted illegally" BS that Donald always does cause his fragile ego can't handle knowing he lost bigly to Hillary.
Ding Dong the Witch is Dead
June 3rd, 2017 at 12:39:39 PM
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Quote: gamerfreakSince we are falling back to memes and comics to try and prove a point, this is a great read:
Nice chart gamerfreak. (Think you might also win the prize for longest graphic ever posted here. If we had a prize.)
There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.
June 3rd, 2017 at 3:44:19 PM
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Even though Trump called it a hoax a few years back, I think his reason for pulling out of Paris was economical and to appease his voters in the swing states. States have come to the realization that renewables have become cheaper than fossils/nuclear as economies of scale have taken place and these states will take their own initiatives even without the Feds to back them up.
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You want the truth! You can't handle the truth!
June 3rd, 2017 at 4:21:37 PM
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When Trump " renegotiates" the accord, getting the most minor of concessions, he will be proclaimed as the MAN who saved the earth.
Does anyone really think he gives a shit about coal miners? Or his voters? This is his chance to seal his legacy as the Universal Savior.
Does anyone really think he gives a shit about coal miners? Or his voters? This is his chance to seal his legacy as the Universal Savior.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
June 3rd, 2017 at 4:47:46 PM
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Quote: billryanWhen Trump " renegotiates" the accord, getting the most minor of concessions, he will be proclaimed as the MAN who saved the earth.
Does anyone really think he gives a shit about coal miners? Or his voters? This is his chance to seal his legacy as the Universal Savior.
The accord was totally open ended and very casual. There was never any need to negotiate anything and now the other partiies to it will tell him to f*** off with any negotiation.
He can claim as many brownie points as he likes. History will remember him for what he is. I hope he lives to see how valuable his contribution was to humanity. Through bars.
Psalm 25:16
Turn to me and be gracious to me, for I am lonely and afflicted.
Proverbs 18:2
A fool finds no satisfaction in trying to understand, for he would rather express his own opinion.
June 3rd, 2017 at 4:59:57 PM
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Agreed. Not going out on a limb very far on this one, but history will remember trump as the Worst President in US history.Quote: OnceDearHistory will remember him for what he is. I hope he lives to see how valuable his contribution was to humanity. Through bars.
Last edited by: JohnnyQ on Jun 3, 2017
There's emptiness behind their eyes
There's dust in all their hearts
They just want to steal us all and take us all apart
June 3rd, 2017 at 5:01:07 PM
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Quote: JohnnyQNot going out on a limb very far on this one, but history will remember trump as the Worst President in US history.
The whole of history. Past present and future. And not just the US.
Psalm 25:16
Turn to me and be gracious to me, for I am lonely and afflicted.
Proverbs 18:2
A fool finds no satisfaction in trying to understand, for he would rather express his own opinion.
June 3rd, 2017 at 5:06:09 PM
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Quote: OnceDearThe accord was totally open ended and very casual. There was never any need to negotiate anything and now the other partiies to it will tell him to f*** off with any negotiation.
He can claim as many brownie points as he likes. History will remember him for what he is. I hope he lives to see how valuable his contribution was to humanity. Through bars.
You know that, and I know that, but I'll wager fifty cents that Donnie doesn't know that. He worries so much about supposed sovereignty while doing everything he can to impede investigations into a real Russian attempt to destroy it. History will not be kind to him, but he will just proclaim it to be fake news.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
June 3rd, 2017 at 8:35:47 PM
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LOL! What a funny thread, I just saw this for the
first time. 100 last days, such a cathartic thought
for the bitterness after Nov 8th. Hillary lurched
out of her wine cellar this week (she says white
wine helped her a get thru the months after the
election) and went on her 'Why I Lost' tour. So
far she has listed 24 reasons why she's not
president, and not one of them is she was the
worst candidate in US history. Nobody on
her staff dares tell her.
Trump's last 100 days, I'll take the odds on
Nov Dec and Jan of 2024 and '25.
first time. 100 last days, such a cathartic thought
for the bitterness after Nov 8th. Hillary lurched
out of her wine cellar this week (she says white
wine helped her a get thru the months after the
election) and went on her 'Why I Lost' tour. So
far she has listed 24 reasons why she's not
president, and not one of them is she was the
worst candidate in US history. Nobody on
her staff dares tell her.
Trump's last 100 days, I'll take the odds on
Nov Dec and Jan of 2024 and '25.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 3rd, 2017 at 8:41:37 PM
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Quote: EvenBobLOL! What a funny thread, I just saw this for the
first time. 100 last days, such a cathartic thought
for the bitterness after Nov 8th. Hillary lurched
out of her wine cellar this week (she says white
wine helped her a get thru the months after the
election) and went on her 'Why I Lost' tour. So
far she has listed 24 reasons why she's not
president, and not one of them is she was the
worst candidate in US history. Nobody on
her staff dares tell her.
Trump's last 100 days, I'll take the odds on
Nov Dec and Jan of 2024 and '25.
I'll put up $10,000 that he doesn't last until January 2025.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
June 3rd, 2017 at 9:17:56 PM
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Quote: billryanI'll put up $10,000 that he doesn't last until January 2025.
In escrow?
June 3rd, 2017 at 9:34:16 PM
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Quote: billryanI'll put up $10,000 that he doesn't last until January 2025.
Why? You should be celebrating that anybody
but Her is in office, not railing against the
person who beat Her. Did you listen to Her
talk this week? She's deranged, she's off
Her rocker, and we barely dodged that bullet.
You should be thrilled.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 3rd, 2017 at 10:39:24 PM
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Quote: MaxPenIn escrow?
We can work something out.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
June 4th, 2017 at 4:00:44 AM
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Warning: Video contains swearing.
This is why Trump won and people are so fed up with all the liberal BS. The annoying Mexican chick is what almost every whiny liberal sounds like to me, "Waaah, racism!!"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4L-fk1dWhs
This is why Trump won and people are so fed up with all the liberal BS. The annoying Mexican chick is what almost every whiny liberal sounds like to me, "Waaah, racism!!"
"every whiny liberal" not to be confused with democrats who just have a different opinion/position than I and don't shout "racist/homophobe/xenophobe/etc." any chance they get
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4L-fk1dWhs
June 4th, 2017 at 4:44:40 AM
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Quote: EvenBobHillary lurched
out of her wine cellar this week (she says white
wine helped her a get thru the months after the
election) and went on her 'Why I Lost' tour.
ROTFL
the subject is Trump
Yet
EB allways turns to Clinton whenever Trumps approval ratings are tanking.
Hey EB, Clinton cant help Trump, he is tanking on his own
:-)
Its just a forum. Nothing here to get obsessed about.
June 4th, 2017 at 5:16:59 AM
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Quote: billryanI'll put up $10,000 that he doesn't last until January 2025.
The righties always seem to forget that Donald is an obese 70 year old with rage issues.
Even if he doesn't get impeached, arrested, voted out of office, etc. there is still a very high chance he will pull a Scalia by 2025.
Ding Dong the Witch is Dead
June 4th, 2017 at 5:38:48 AM
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Quote: EvenBobWhy? You should be celebrating that anybody
but Her is in office, not railing against the
person who beat Her. Did you listen to Her
talk this week? She's deranged, she's off
Her rocker, and we barely dodged that bullet.
You should be thrilled.
Nobody gives a crap about Hillary. Feel free to lock her up.
DO NOT blindly accept what has been spoken.
DO NOT blindly accept what has been written.
Think. Assess. Lead. DO NOT blindly follow.
June 4th, 2017 at 5:42:28 AM
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....and all this winning out of Trump continues....
From "Trading Economics":
"The goods and services deficit in the United States widened to USD 47.6 billion in April of 2017 from an upwardly revised USD 45.6 billion gap a month earlier and higher than market expectations of a USD 46.1 billion shortfall. Exports fell 0.3 percent to USD 190.98 billion, driven by lower sales of consumer goods and vehicles. Imports rose 0.8 percent to USD 238.6 billion, boosted by cellphones and capital goods."
From "Trading Economics":
"The goods and services deficit in the United States widened to USD 47.6 billion in April of 2017 from an upwardly revised USD 45.6 billion gap a month earlier and higher than market expectations of a USD 46.1 billion shortfall. Exports fell 0.3 percent to USD 190.98 billion, driven by lower sales of consumer goods and vehicles. Imports rose 0.8 percent to USD 238.6 billion, boosted by cellphones and capital goods."
DO NOT blindly accept what has been spoken.
DO NOT blindly accept what has been written.
Think. Assess. Lead. DO NOT blindly follow.
June 4th, 2017 at 6:01:54 AM
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Oh yea....and with all of the whining out of Trump and the Gullibles about the United States subsidizing green initiatives, they seem to overlook the fact that our competitors don't do things any differently. But that's OK, I'm sure that Trumpy will find some other reason to blame our future lost business in the rapidly growing area of green products and services. Yep....the Gullibles will tell you that he's a veritable genius.
"'Solar manufacturers in China have received considerable government and financial support and, together with their low manufacturing costs, have become price leaders within the industry. While the U.S. and other Western industrial economies are beneficiaries of rapidly declining installation costs of solar, we expect the U.S. will continue to be at a disadvantage from a manufacturing standpoint,' said Evergreen Solar president and CEO Michael El-Hillow."
"'Solar manufacturers in China have received considerable government and financial support and, together with their low manufacturing costs, have become price leaders within the industry. While the U.S. and other Western industrial economies are beneficiaries of rapidly declining installation costs of solar, we expect the U.S. will continue to be at a disadvantage from a manufacturing standpoint,' said Evergreen Solar president and CEO Michael El-Hillow."
DO NOT blindly accept what has been spoken.
DO NOT blindly accept what has been written.
Think. Assess. Lead. DO NOT blindly follow.
June 4th, 2017 at 6:53:34 AM
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Quote: ams288Donald is an obese 70 year old
there is still a very high chance he will pull a Scalia by 2025.
It is NOT a VERY HIGH chance. I would guess that the average man DJT's age and general condition has a better than 70% chance to make it to 2025. My guess is PacoMartin can find an actuarial table somewhere to get a better guess.
June 4th, 2017 at 7:01:18 AM
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Quote: SOOPOOIt is NOT a VERY HIGH chance. I would guess that the average man DJT's age and general condition has a better than 70% chance to make it to 2025. My guess is PacoMartin can find an actuarial table somewhere to get a better guess.
How do we even know what Donald's general condition really is?
You really believe anything this guy says?
Ding Dong the Witch is Dead
