EvenBob
EvenBob
Joined: Jul 18, 2010
  • Threads: 402
  • Posts: 19872
March 16th, 2017 at 4:06:31 PM permalink
Quote: darkoz

There are legal channels i imagine even in UK to collect from major corporations if ivey pulls out a win



There are also ways of getting around it.
I would make Ivey sue me and present
the case in front of a jury. Even with
the high court ruling, if I prove he cheated,
he won't get the money.
"It's not enough to succeed, your friends must fail." Gore Vidal
darkoz
darkoz
Joined: Dec 22, 2009
  • Threads: 146
  • Posts: 1568
March 16th, 2017 at 5:24:49 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

There are also ways of getting around it.
I would make Ivey sue me and present
the case in front of a jury. Even with
the high court ruling, if I prove he cheated,
he won't get the money.



From what i understand both sides agree on a jury or trial by judge in a civil matter although it may be different in UK. So if thats the case u dont get to refuse paymenf now for a jury to decide.

Legal systems are particularly biased against time wasting and what u suggest would more likely result in fines and contempt charges
DRich
DRich
Joined: Jul 6, 2012
  • Threads: 63
  • Posts: 3225
March 17th, 2017 at 7:59:48 AM permalink
Quote: RS

A deck of cards with uneven backs is inherently "marked" by the court's definition, even without introducing a turn during play. By the court's definition, the casino introduced an inherently marked deck into play and permitted it to be used....and if they ever still or did use that type of card-back in the past, they were using "marked cards" back then or now, too (given their definition of "marked cards/deck").




I think that actually hurts his case because NJ will argue that if the cards were marked the game should be null and void. Participants should be made whole as if the game didn't happen.
darkoz
darkoz
Joined: Dec 22, 2009
  • Threads: 146
  • Posts: 1568
March 17th, 2017 at 8:07:30 AM permalink
Quote: DRich

I think that actually hurts his case because NJ will argue that if the cards were marked the game should be null and void. Participants should be made whole as if the game didn't happen.



No the argument is the cards in normal operations are always marked because they are the same cards with the same printed defects from the manufacturer

Unless borgata wants to argue all gambling over the last decade was needs to be made whole with all their customers

Thats following if u could make such argument in US courts
darkoz
darkoz
Joined: Dec 22, 2009
  • Threads: 146
  • Posts: 1568
March 17th, 2017 at 8:11:19 AM permalink
To phrase it another way. These same cards are used in normal operations at all times. Normally used decks are always marked because they all have these printing anomalies. Therefore marked cards are normal cards. Ivey shouldnt have to return money won using a normal deck of cards
onenickelmiracle
onenickelmiracle
Joined: Jan 26, 2012
  • Threads: 128
  • Posts: 4831
March 17th, 2017 at 8:41:28 AM permalink
Quote: darkoz

No the argument is the cards in normal operations are always marked because they are the same cards with the same printed defects from the manufacturer

Unless borgata wants to argue all gambling over the last decade was needs to be made whole with all their customers

Thats following if u could make such argument in US courts

Yeah right, wishful thinking, but that would be the moral and ethical way. Same way with the lotto rigging case where the employee rigged the drawing, and was never able to claim the jackpot. Of course he gets prosecution, then when the next jackpot winner sues for the extra money never awarded rightfully when reset by illegal activity, the lottery claims everything is as it should be and no extra money is due.

Casinos and lotteries only go backwards when it's in their favor.
Looks like sh!t just got imaginary!
darkoz
darkoz
Joined: Dec 22, 2009
  • Threads: 146
  • Posts: 1568
March 17th, 2017 at 10:44:59 AM permalink
Quote: onenickelmiracle

Yeah right, wishful thinking, but that would be the moral and ethical way. Same way with the lotto rigging case where the employee rigged the drawing, and was never able to claim the jackpot. Of course he gets prosecution, then when the next jackpot winner sues for the extra money never awarded rightfully when reset by illegal activity, the lottery claims everything is as it should be and no extra money is due.

Casinos and lotteries only go backwards when it's in their favor.



I totally agree. It wont happen but it should
Wizard
Administrator
Wizard
Joined: Oct 14, 2009
  • Threads: 972
  • Posts: 16344
March 17th, 2017 at 11:36:14 AM permalink
Quote: beachbumbabs

I'll go 20 that he wins vs. your 30 that he doesn't. Betting on the SCOTUK decision, not on whether he ever sees a dime from it.



Sorry, I'm still holding out for even money.

I confuse the details between the London and AC cases, but which was the one where he judge said edge sorting effectively marked the cards? I think criminal charges were not pursued because the standard of proof to demonstrate is different between a civil and criminal case.
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
darkoz
darkoz
Joined: Dec 22, 2009
  • Threads: 146
  • Posts: 1568
March 17th, 2017 at 12:59:39 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Sorry, I'm still holding out for even money.

I confuse the details between the London and AC cases, but which was the one where he judge said edge sorting effectively marked the cards? I think criminal charges were not pursued because the standard of proof to demonstrate is different between a civil and criminal case.



The marked cards decision was ac

  • Jump to: