Is playing unrated even possible anymore?
So if a casino scans my ID at entry, should I just go ahead and get a player's card? I think it would it would make me less suspicious. I can definitely feel the glares on me when I am up by a $1000. It's so ridiculous. Just because I am winning, they automatically assume I'm a counter. It really is true what the books say, the casinos see you as the enemy. I'm spreading about 1-20, do i really stick out that much? Variance is always a bitch. I'm either ahead 40 units or down 40 units after 1-3 shoes, there's no in between! Why can't I just earn my EV and get out of there!
20 to 1 a little bit less noticeable than a flashing hat that says C O U N T E R . But not much.
Quote: onenickelmiracleAre we sure the information is actually stored first? If so, naturally it would be shared, but I'm not sure it is.
Either way, even if it's not stored, EITS can rewind tape and zoom in on your ID when you hand it to the security guy at entry area.
Try the flashing hat. They might at least laugh !
If you mean "playing anonymous possible?", the answer is definitely NO.
Sounds like a shitty place to play.
Go play, get backed off, and move on to something better. Really doesn't sound like much of a loss to get backed off from this place.
So, put on a white wig and I think you may be able to play anonymously again.
Quote: pokerfaceIn the title you asked "playing unrated possible?", the answer is definitely YES.
If you mean "playing anonymous possible?", the answer is definitely NO.
So in other words, there is no real benefit to playing unrated, I might as well just get a player's card...
Quote: NeutrinoAFAIK casinos scan your ID for reasons of age verification, not card counter identification. They don't scan your ID if you appear to be older than 30.
So, put on a white wig and I think you may be able to play anonymously again.
That's what i would like to believe too! However, you never know with these casinos, they like to play Big Brother.
Quote: sc15If they're sweating you for winning 1K that's a joke.
Sounds like a shitty place to play.
Go play, get backed off, and move on to something better. Really doesn't sound like much of a loss to get backed off from this place.
True, but all these casinos are part of chains these days. If I get backed off at this place, wouldn't I be limiting my opportunities in the future?
Let's say I get backed off from a place like Harrah's, wouldn't that be detrimental to my longevity as a card counter? I wouldn't be able to play at any Harrah's, Caesar's, or Horseshoe casinos anymore.
And let's say I do get backed off from the sweaty place where i won 1K. I don't have to worry about them sharing my info with casinos outside their chain?
Quote: AvincowSo in other words, there is no real benefit to playing unrated, I might as well just get a player's card...
Not necessarily true.
It's harder to track players who play unrated. This doesn't mean they don't track unrated players, but, it makes it harder.
Quote: AvincowTrue, but all these casinos are part of chains these days. If I get backed off at this place, wouldn't I be limiting my opportunities in the future?
Let's say I get backed off from a place like Harrah's, wouldn't that be detrimental to my longevity as a card counter? I wouldn't be able to play at any Harrah's, Caesar's, or Horseshoe casinos anymore.
And let's say I do get backed off from the sweaty place where i won 1K. I don't have to worry about them sharing my info with casinos outside their chain?
Most casinos, if they share info, are only doing it with other casinos in the area. If it's part of a chain, like harrahs, then yes, if they link you to a player's club card account then you might have negative notes added. But if you're playing unrated the odds of them going through lengths to figure out who you are and what accounts you're associated with is slim.
As for your original question. Yes, they CAN back up the cameras to watch you present your ID, but they can't zoom in after the fact to read your name/address. There is a chance they have it stored but it'd be fairly difficult to figure out which one of the 1000s of IDs that machine scanned that day is yours exactly.
Would they figure it out if you murdered someone on the property that day? 99.99% likely they would. For card counting? Not likely.
Quote: PokeraddictEver wonder if competing casinos tell the others that they backed off a whale just to keep him all to themselves? That was a problem among online sports books in the past. It just seems idiotic to me for a casino to take its competitor's word on something like this without seeing it for themselves.
They don't just take their competitor's word on it though.
But it will guarantee that they'll do a full skills check on your play. And if you are indeed "guilty" of APing you will be backed off.
Quote: vendman1There is no point in playing unrated at a green chip level....really no point if you are really spreading 20-1. If you do that consistently they already know you're a counter, if they are playing any attention at all. If you haven't gotten any heat it's probably because of your hit and run approach, they may not be sweating a grand. Or they are clueless. I'd say both are equally likely. However, at any kind of sweat the money joint, playing unrated is in and of itself a red flag. No ploppy would every play unrated...but an AP might. See my point?
Under what conditions would you play unrated/rated? Should I limit my unrated play to touristy areas such as LV and AC?
What if I suspect I have been labeled as a card counter or have been backed off while playing rated? Is my card pretty much toast at any casino within the chain? Do I have to get a new card under a new name at that point?
Quote: AvincowUnder what conditions would you play unrated/rated? Should I limit my unrated play to touristy areas such as LV and AC?
What if I suspect I have been labeled as a card counter or have been backed off while playing rated? Is my card pretty much toast at any casino within the chain? Do I have to get a new card under a new name at that point?
I play unrated when I go to one off casino's in Vegas that I know I only visit once or twice a year maximum. It also depends on your level of play. If you're playing red chips, then I've personally seen sweating/etc, but you're much safer to play rated most places you go. Now if you're playing quarters or higher, then your play will be looked at, eventually, unless you're rat holing enough to have your account barely winning or a losing player.
Since I play red chips I don't mind playing rated every time I play at my local casino. I've been doing so for a couple years and don't believe there's any issues or that I've been flagged in some way. Now if you don't have very many other options near by AND you believe you've been flagged then I might lay low or yes play unrated for a bit. I'd also be sure if I did play rated I rat holed enough to "not win" in their eyes, but more importantly add cover plays to your game. If you have been flagged they will be watching your play and you will need cover. Also, if you have been flagged then yes any casino's in the same chain will have the same information generally. If you've been backed off while playing rated then of course your card is flagged, and probably fairly useless at this point.
Quote: AvincowUnder what conditions would you play unrated/rated? Should I limit my unrated play to touristy areas such as LV and AC?
What if I suspect I have been labeled as a card counter or have been backed off while playing rated? Is my card pretty much toast at any casino within the chain? Do I have to get a new card under a new name at that point?
I play unrated when I go to one off casino's in Vegas that I know I only visit once or twice a year maximum. It also depends on your level of play. If you're playing red chips, then I've personally seen sweating/etc, but you're much safer to play rated most places you go. Now if you're playing quarters or higher, then your play will be looked at, eventually, unless you're rat holing enough to have your account barely winning or a losing player.
Since I play red chips I don't mind playing rated every time I play at my local casino. I've been doing so for a couple years and don't believe there's any issues or that I've been flagged in some way. Now if you don't have very many other options near by AND you believe you've been flagged then I might lay low or yes play unrated for a bit. I'd also be sure if I did play rated I rat holed enough to "not win" in their eyes, but more importantly add cover plays to your game. If you have been flagged they will be watching your play and you will need cover. Also, if you have been flagged then yes any casino's in the same chain will have the same information generally. If you've been backed off while playing rated then of course your card is flagged, and probably fairly useless at this point.
(I'm actually not even worried about them scanning it - it just takes forever and by that point I WANT TO GAMBLE).
Quote: Avincow90% of the casinos in my area scan my driver's license at the door.
I've never had this happen, i.e. being required to show I.D. as I enter a casino.
I've played in Las Vegas, Atlantic City, Connecticutt, and at many tribal casinos in the Pacific NW.
Where are you located that the casinos require I.D. in order to walk through the maw of the casino?
Quote: NeutrinoAFAIK casinos scan your ID for reasons of age verification, not card counter identification. They don't scan your ID if you appear to be older than 30.
So this. You playing at Ameristar St. Charles or River City OP? Lol. In my area, Ameristar is the worst. In the last 50 times I've went there, I might not have had my ID scanned once or twice. I'm 34. One of the guys at river city said they got a $100k fine once, so they don't screw around either.
Illinois casinos are terrible too, if you look under 30ish, they treat you like a criminal and make you stare into the security camera before entering while they scan your license.
But neither of these areas force EVERYONE to have their license scanned.
Quote: MrVI've never had this happen, i.e. being required to show I.D. as I enter a casino.
I've played in Las Vegas, Atlantic City, Connecticutt, and at many tribal casinos in the Pacific NW.
Where are you located that the casinos require I.D. in order to walk through the maw of the casino?
This is only if you're young. Anyone they need to ID (i.e. you look under 30) they 'sometimes' also swipe the ID's. They have a reader that parses out the birth date information and puts your age in big numbers on a small screen so they don't have to look at the small print on the ID... and then convert the date for years.
So if you look "over 30" then you won't even need your ID and you won't ever get it scanned.
Quote: RomesThis is only if you're young. Anyone they need to ID (i.e. you look under 30) they 'sometimes' also swipe the ID's. They have a reader that parses out the birth date information and puts your age in big numbers on a small screen so they don't have to look at the small print on the ID... and then convert the date for years.
So if you look "over 30" then you won't even need your ID and you won't ever get it scanned.
Yea, that's my problem. I don't appear to be over the age of 30...I get ID'd every time
Quote: AvincowYea, that's my problem. I don't appear to be under the age of 30...I get ID'd every time
Grow a beard then. I am thinking you look older than you actually look.
Also, more importantly. Do they scan everyone's IDs? Or anyone else's for that matter? When they do scan others IDs, how old do they look to you?
With these new jurisdictions popping up all over the place, I could see some state anal enough to do it to everyone.
