What is the "break even" point for hi-lo counting?

Also what is the "wong out break even" point?

I've been trying to search for the hi-lo equivalent of the KO "key count" with no avail. Does anyone know at what TC does the house edge become exactly 0%?

Another similar question. At what "Wong out" count would make the overall house edge 0%? In other words, if you wong out any count lower than count X, at what TC=X does the overall house edge for the remaining bets become 0%? I'd intuitively expect this to be lower than the answer for first question. Even if this is negative, it probably won't surprise me.

No idea what you're asking. But with HiLo, a TC of +1 will give you a slight player edge....depending on rules & penetration.

As RS pointed out, the answer to your first question depends on rules. If you are not adjusting your bets, I guess it doesn't really depend on pen. It will be close to a TC of +1.

As for your second question, it will be negative, but again it depends on rules. If you don't vary your bets, I can estimate it from Wong's tables.

I have no idea what you are trying to ask for the second part. For the first part a TC of +1 is generally seen as the break even point. If you have good rules then you are making money. If you have bad rules you can be losing money. Each point of TC is worth about .5% advantage. It's not actually linear, but it's a good rule of thumb.

Quote: dwheatley

As RS pointed out, the answer to your first question depends on rules. If you are not adjusting your bets, I guess it doesn't really depend on pen. It will be close to a TC of +1.

As for your second question, it will be negative, but again it depends on rules. If you don't vary your bets, I can estimate it from Wong's tables.

Sure, assume flat betting.

Quote: Neutrino

Also what is the "wong out break even" point?

I've been trying to search for the hi-lo equivalent of the KO "key count" with no avail. Does anyone know at what TC does the house edge become exactly 0%?

Another similar question. At what "Wong out" count would make the overall house edge 0%? In other words, if you wong out any count lower than count X, at what TC=X does the overall house edge for the remaining bets become 0%? I'd intuitively expect this to be lower than the answer for first question. Even if this is negative, it probably won't surprise me.

Assuming you are trying to apply the definition of a key count to hi-lo, then the answer is +1.5. However, this is improper usage as you have probably garnered from the other posts. A TC of +1 is generally accepted as the break-even point, where the house edge is zero.

Wonging out at -2 can give a tiny positive expectation under ideal conditions thru flat-betting, but more realistically, wonging at any negative running count is the only way this could be accomplished.