Utilizing Dealer Mistakes for Positive Expectation

Quote: konceptum

Quote: DJTeddyBear

.... It's because craps is the only game were an audible counts. Therefore, it's a simple thing for a dealer to claim that the player requested something that was not the case. How can Surveillance fight "I thought I heard..."?

That makes a lot of sense. Now we just need to figure out an audible call that sounds vague enough that we can claim it was something that actually won. :)

It's one thing to be tipping the dealer and have the dealer 'tip you back'. It's quite another to try to intentionally confuse the dealer and then use the confusion to your advantage.

The former, when we believe a dealer is cheating on our behalf, can be chalked up to dealer mistakes.

The latter is your own deliberate attempt at cheating. Even if you're tipping a dealer that is known to make these deliberate mistakes, to do anything other than tipping to induce the mistake, would be going too far.

Don't do it.

Quote: odiousgambit

Well, I don't know that we need to turn ourselves into a Cheater's Symposium here. I guess I will not go into details; as the Wizard says often, he doesn't condone cheating, neither do I [in spite of my user name]. But at the same time I can hardly believe no one else has mentioned this, so without those details, I have just found that it is possible in certain circumstances to pick up your line bet once you go to having a point to make. Like I say, did this by accident once and realized, circumstances being very important, there was little chance of being observed, and if observed, you would just expect to be told to put it back [time to make a note to self, no more of that].

I have made myself resist doing this on purpose. I have been tempted when losing, for one thing there is less scrutiny for someone losing. Not being a Saint, I can't quite shake the idea of doing it, but so far temptation has not won out.

if youve been playing the donts and been laying $30 as your odds on a 3x4x5 table, instead of laying your odds to the side of your bet, lay your $30 odds behind your bet on the passline. if the shooter makes the point and you get paid, collect the winning passline wager. if the shooter sevens out, and they go to sweep up your passline bet, stop them and say "wtf thats my odds wager." ive been laying the same amount the whole time. since you have already established a frequency of doing this, your claim will be believable.

a good time to do this is when a cocktail waitress happens to come by and you are ordering/receiving a drink so you also have a reason to claim you were distracted. or light a cigarette. step away to make a phonecall or text. if the dealer at any time asks you if that is supposed to be your odds bet, thank him and set it the right way.

this works best at a 3x4x5 odds table since you lay the same amount every hand. and what you lay is a $25 and $5 chip so two chips instead of a stack of chips so can easily go unnoticed as a passline wager so if the shooter makes the point, you are more likely to get paid.

Quote: rudeboyoi

instead of laying your odds to the side of your bet, lay your $30 odds behind your bet on the passline.

Sounds like you get away with that exactly once.

Quote: odiousgambit

Sounds like you get away with that exactly once.

yep. u can try it on different dealers and different shifts though. the best place to try this is at one of the farends of the table where the dontpass line is smaller.

a lot of these freeroll attempts can only be done once. a good place to try stuff like this though is at the casinos on fremont street so you can just go from one to the next.

another similar situation if you like making place bets, is to make your odds work on the comeout roll. sometimes you will get paid on the placebet. if they dont pay you on the placebet, claim you wanted all your bets working. if your placebet is taken down if a seven comes, say what the heck i just wanted my odds working. if they pay you on the placebet, quit making your bets work on the comeout roll or stop making placebets since now you established a history of making all your bets work.

typically though i recommend not working your odds on the comeout roll. sometimes dealers will forget to take your comebets down if a seven is rolled on the comeout roll. working your odds brings attention to your comebets and its less likely they will forget to take your losing wagers down.

also i recommend playing the dont come instead of the dont pass. when you place your dont come wager, do it to the side closest to the dealer. so out of the corner of his eye, its difficult to see your bet. if an 11 gets rolled, sometimes he wont even notice your bet there.

also dealers will sometimes forget to take your losing dont come wager down if the point is rolled.

all these things work best at a busy table where other peoples wagers can distract dealers from paying attention to yours.

at a baccarat table, a dealer paid me then swept what she paid me to pay another player. pretty messed up. they had to bring the floor over and call survelliance to verify what happened. while i was waiting for this to happen, the dealer dealt another hand. i lost the hand and the dealer goes in to sweep my bet. i claimed im still waiting to be paid on my last wager and the floor ruled in my favor. if i won the wager, i wouldnt have said anything.

rudeboyoi, you are starting to sound like a Casino's Nightmare! You are making no bones about it, I'll say that.

Ever get on a Casino's Blacklist?

Extremely informative.

Past-posting and pinching bets aside, a little psychology evens the score.
A whole book should be written on these maneuvers. Priceless!

never been blacklisted.
nothing i do is illegal.

my bets arent large enough to take notice of.
my bets are small enough that its easier for them to just rule in my favor.

i spread my play out over various casinos in the area depending on what i get in the mail.

the way i act or react is all an act. if im supposed to be "outraged" ill act outraged. if something out of the ordinary happens, ill act like it was supposed to happen like if they forget to take down a losing wager or pay me on a losing waer, i wont act in a way to alert them to that fact.

Quote: rudeboyoi

never been blacklisted.
nothing i do is illegal.

my bets arent large enough to take notice of.
my bets are small enough that its easier for them to just rule in my favor.

i spread my play out over various casinos in the area depending on what i get in the mail.

the way i act or react is all an act. if im supposed to be "outraged" ill act outraged. if something out of the ordinary happens, ill act like it was supposed to happen like if they forget to take down a losing wager or pay me on a losing waer, i wont act in a way to alert them to that fact.

so where do you draw the line?